Peace at Last!

[seinfeldrules]

Or at least it is what is being reported.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,146626,00.html

JERUSALEM — The Israeli and Palestinian leaders will declare a formal end to more than four years of fighting at Tuesday's Mideast summit, both sides said Monday.

Israeli and Palestinian negotiators finalized the agreement during last-minute preparations Monday.

"The most important thing at the summit will be a mutual declaration of cessation of violence against each other," said Saeb Erekat (search), a Palestinian negotiator.

An Israeli government official, speaking on condition of anonymity, confirmed the cease-fire agreement, adding that the deal would also include an end to Palestinian incitement.

For those of you who dont believe FOXNews

I think we all know how it will turn out, but its something to be happy about while it lasts :cheers:

 

[No Limit]

I am looking forward to this working out; I just hope the people don't ruin it by attacking eachother.

 

[Absinthe]

This is actually something I'm optimistic about.

Fingers crossed.

 

[CptStern]

there have been countless cease fire in over 50 years of conflict ...just look at it as a temporary lull till the inevitable shite hits the fan ...btw the Palestinian Authority holds absolutely no sway with the radical fundamentalists who are behind the suicide bombings

 

[The Monkey]

I belive there is hope in the ME, now that Arafat has met his maker. Let's just hope that Israel, Palestine and the US play their cards right, and that those terrorists stay out of this. (Not likely)

 

[burner69]

Best of luck I say. I'm pessimistic, but if there's a solution to be had, I'll be very happy about it.

I belive there is hope in the ME, now that Arafat has met his maker. Let's just hope that Israel, Palestine and the US play their cards right, and that those terrorists stay out of this. (Not likely)

If terrorists can't get involved, why should the US?

 

[The Monkey]

If terrorists can't get involved, why should the US?

Bewacouse all the terrorists want is to destroy the state of Israel, and you wont get long in a peace progress with that attitude, would you?

 

[Sainku]

This treaty willl last about as long as it takes a jackass to strap a bomb to his son.

 

[Nofuture]

US is not neutral, because of supporting Israel. Regarding this, is it a good idea US to be involved?

 

[Gray Fox]

God I hope this atleast last long enough for both side to get a taste what it is to live in peacetime.

 

[burner69]

US is not neutral, because of supporting Israel. Regarding this, is it a good idea US to be involved?

Q.F.E.

 

[KoreBolteR]

this isnt going to work, one guy is gonna kill another(from the other side) and then there will be a massive feud again

 

[Tr0n]

It won't last more than a year at max.

 

[satch919]

I'll give it a month and a half tops. This war has been going for centuries and all the sudden its supposed to stop? Not likely. These people have never known peace, nor will they ever. But i suppose how ever long it lasts, they should be thankful.

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

there have been countless cease fire in over 50 years of conflict ...just look at it as a temporary lull till the inevitable shite hits the fan ...btw the Palestinian Authority holds absolutely no sway with the radical fundamentalists who are behind the suicide bombings

He he... I totally agree but any ceasefire, no matter how short lived is a good thing. In the end they're gonna have to settle this the old fashioned way though.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Here's hoping that the cease to one of the stupidest conflicts in history finally sticks.

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

Here's hoping that the cease to one of the stupidest conflicts in history finally sticks.

Cheers :smoking:

 

[Tr0n]

*grabs his drink*

Cheers!

 

[CptStern]

He he... I totally agree but any ceasefire, no matter how short lived is a good thing. In the end they're gonna have to settle this the old fashioned way though.

the only way this will ever end is the complete eradication of the other side ...no amount of concessions will appease everybody on both sides ..there are many jews who want nothing to do with a palestinian state and are prepared to do whatever it takes for it to remain in jewish hands. some israelis are not strangers to using terrorism to gain the upper hand ..same goes for some palestinians.

I hope this will lead to something more permanent, but I've lived through countless ceasefires to make me a little jaded

 

[Sgt_Shellback]

the only way this will ever end is the complete eradication of the other side ...no amount of concessions will appease everybody on both sides ..there are many jews who want nothing to do with a palestinian state and are prepared to do whatever it takes for it to remain in jewish hands. some israelis are not strangers to using terrorism to gain the upper hand ..same goes for some palestinians.

I hope this will lead to something more permanent, but I've lived through countless ceasefires to make me a little jaded

Wow.. 2 posts and I still agree with ya... War only ends in defeat of one side.

Many (Not some) Palistinians have wrote the book on that.

 

[clarky003]

so wont this just pull the peoples into a false sense of security? if tension begins to build up again , who knows

 

[Bodacious]

Did you know that the person who creates peace between the arabs and jews is supposed to be the anti-christ?

Don't quote that as fact, I am not sure, but any hardcore bible thumper ought to be able to attest to that.

 

[Javert]

Wow, have the two crybabies finally grew up and started to communicate like actual adults? Pray tell! Best of luck to them.

 

[MarcoPollo]

now that the main cause of all this violence (arafatass) is roting 7 ft under maybe this ceasefire will become something more??

 

[GhostFox]

War only ends in defeat of one side.

Agreed, but in this instance it can be the defeat of an idea, not an army. If a ceasfire can be maintained long enough for Palistine to be modernized, maybe Palistinian kids will stop believing that their only purpose in life is to kill Jews. Once they would rather play DDR at the arcade and get Starbucks after school rather than blow themselves up, there will be no more worries about violence.

 

[Nofuture]

Agreed, but in this instance it can be the defeat of an idea, not an army. If a ceasfire can be maintained long enough for Palistine to be modernized, maybe Palistinian kids will stop believing that their only purpose in life is to kill Jews. Once they would rather play DDR at the arcade and get Starbucks after school rather than blow themselves up, there will be no more worries about violence.

Where is your objectiveness? You display it, if it would be only Palestinians fault.

Remember that the Jews are who have occupied the territory which doen´t belong to them.

Arafat is gone, but Sharon is still there. People see in him a war criminal.

Sharon is a controversial figure both inside and outside Israel, attracting diverse and often polar views. Many Israelis and supporters of Israel regard Sharon as a strong leader battling terrorism. However, critics, particularly in the Arab world, refer to him as "the Butcher of Beirut" and have sought his prosecution as a war criminal.

Why Sharon is a War Criminal

"Intissar cries out for justice. 2000 innocent people cry out for justice. It would give satisfaction, if Sharon – on a visit to Europe - would be arrested and transferred to Scheveningen prison. Am I being too cynical when I say that Europe is failing when it comes to putting Israeli war criminals on trial? And am I too pessimistic when I say that ‘Sabra and Shatila’ was neither the first, nor the last war crime committed by Ariel Sharon?"


The man who would testify against Sharon is blown up

"Who on earth would want to murder the key witness for the prosecution in a war crimes indictment against the Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon?

Why would anyone want to car-bomb the former Lebanese Phalangist militia leader and government minister Elie Hobeika in Beirut – less than two days after he agreed to give evidence against Mr Sharon in a Belgian court, which may try the Israeli leader for the murder of up to 1,700 Palestinian civilians in the Sabra and Chatila refugee camps in September, 1982?

Elie Hobeika, of course, will not be giving evidence against Mr Sharon. His body – in bits, some bones blackened by fire – were all that remained of Lebanon's most hated man yesterday, scattered 50 metres from his burning Range Rover.

Call it a "targeted killing"; which, by chance, is how the Israelis describe their death squad execution of Palestinian militants in the West Bank and Gaza."



Shame on A World Where Sharon is A Free Man

"However, until the world gathers its courage to tell Sharon: "enough is enough," and "you have no business occupying, assassinating and starving Palestinians," until that happens, Palestinians are destined to collect and bury their dead, alone with desperate chants for revenge and others for freedom.

Today, as I gazed at the flow of photos and TV images of Palestinian civilians, or what has remained of them killed in the Israeli raid on Gaza, an angry question daunting me: Why does Sharon, a healthy man with a million-dollar farming industry keep chasing behind an oppressed population, living in cage-like towns and villages, desperately poor, while all they seek is freedom.

Hasn't Sharon killed enough? Will his endless list of Palestinians to kill and places to bomb ever run out? Isn't a 52-year-long career in murder plenty to satisfy the man's thirst for Palestinian blood? How many more massacres would Sharon need to check out from his list before he dies, or quits politics for good?"

 

[X|Rolando]

You might want to note that Sharon was bullied by palestinians when he was a lil' kid (if you care for any psycho insight )

 

[CptStern]

As Nofuture pointed out Sharon is far more than just that ..he may also be guilty of crimes against humanity for the civilian deaths in Sabra, Shatila and Jenin refugee camps

 

[Raziaar]

There will never be lasting peace in the middle east, unfortunately. Just too much ingrained hatred.

 

[satch919]

Whoa whoa whoa!!! CptStern and Sgt. Shellback actually agree on something not once but twice in the same thread??!? Im gonna pass out. :x

 

[CptStern]

hmmm he agrees with me ..there's a difference

 

[Raziaar]

hmmm he agrees with me ..there's a difference

It means his wallet is better lined now.

:cheers:

 

[el Chi]

I'll give it a month and a half tops. This war has been going for centuries and all the sudden its supposed to stop? Not likely. These people have never known peace, nor will they ever.

I'll admit that a healthy dose of pessimism wouldn't go amiss here but to say that they will never know peace is too far, I think.

 

[CptStern]

It means his wallet is better lined now.

:cheers:

I'm not in the habit of paying out judas money to malcontents and yesmen







heheh it just sounded good in my head

 

[burner69]

I'll admit that a healthy dose of pessimism wouldn't go amiss here but to say that they will never know peace is too far, I think.

No, really. It's so sad, frustrating, and bloody evil that religion can lock an entire group of people into all this BS.

Maybe that 'gay bomb' the US was devising might help - make love, not war, if you follow.

 

[GhostFox]

Where is your objectiveness? You display it, if it would be only Palestinians fault.

It is the Palestinians fault. Isreal acted in self-defense against Egypt in the 6 day way. Result was capturing of the Siani Pen. and Gaza Strip. Jordan attacks Isreal. Result is capture of West Bank. Syria attacks Isreal. Result is capture of Golan Heights.

Do you see a pattern here?

Remember that the Jews are who have occupied the territory which doen´t belong to them.

That territory does belong to them. The arab nations lost it during the 6-day war. And don't say it belongs to the palestinians because they no longer exist. In 1947 Palestinians we offered full and equal stateship with Israel.

Isreal actually said "In the midst of wanton aggression, we yet call upon the Arab inhabitants of the State of Israel to preserve the ways of peace and play their part in the development of the State, on the basis of full and equal citizenship and due representation in all its bodies and institutions....We extend our hand in peace and neighborliness to all the neighboring states and their peoples, and invite them to cooperate with the independent Jewish nation for the common good of all."

The palestinians however all left their homes and Isreal/Palestine voluntarily, at behest of the invading arab armies. After the end of the war, Arab nations decided they didn't like refugees, so they started kicking them out. One of those you can go where you want, but you can't stay here type of situations. So they ended up back in Isreal, but many of them weren't even Palestinian to begin with. Isreal was flooded with millitant anit-semites with the express purpose of being down the Israeli state.

So maybe it isn't the "Palestinians" fault, because they have not been in Isreal since 1948. However it is the fault of Arab leaders in the area.

And I do support a Palestinian state. I think they deserve the right to their own country. However for that to happen the brainwashing needs to stop. I don't think that you realize that in Palestinian elementary schools a good portion of their day is spent discussing the glory of exterminating the Jewish race. These kids have no chance, and for that I feel sorry. But the only hope is for the next generation, the one that hasn't been indoctrinated yet.

 

[Nofuture]

No, you definitely aren´t objective.


Let the history speak.

Where to begin? At pre-biblical, biblical times?

In 19th century 95 percent inhabitants in Palestine were Arabian.
In 1917, the British captured the region from the Ottoman Empire. In 1917 they promised to Jews in case of Ottoman defeat a homeland in Palestine. But in earlier agreement in 1915/1916 they promised to Arabs the independency, if they revolted against the Ottomans.

After the capitulation of the Ottoman Empire France occupied Lebanon and Syria; Great Britain occupied Palestine and Iraq. GB got an official Mandate for Palestine from war powers.

Competition between Arabs and Jewish Zionist came to a head immediately after World War II, when Zionist claims gained greater urgency after the murder of almost six million Jews in the Holocaust. The Zionists demanded an independent homeland to absorb the Jewish refugees from Europe; the local Palestinian Arab population, today known as just Palestinians, argued that they played no role in the Holocaust, so the refugee problem should not be resolved at their expense. But the Jews artificial colonisation in Palestine, which has been started years ago, continued.

In exchange for the Great Arab Revolt the Arabs had to get their independency, but this undertaking was violated by the region's subsequent partition into British and French Mandates.

Should we stop? Or go on?

The broken undertaking regarding the independency drove up to then Anti-Ottoman Arabs against the Mandate powers. The increasing figure of Jewish immigrants in connection to Balfour-Declaration (British promise to Jews in 1917) was understood by Arabs as helper to new colonization (British). There came to anti-British and anti-Jews, as their helpers, rebellions.

The United Nations was created after World War II and in order to bring the British occupation of Palestine to an end, issued the 1947 UN Partition Plan seeking a "two-state solution" by creating both a new Jewish state and an Arab state. Palestinian Arabs and the surrounding Arab states rejected the United Nations and Great Britain's plan.

In 1948, the Jewish population declared its independence as the state of Israel. Israel was promptly invaded by the armies of Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria. Large numbers of Palestinian Arabs fled or were expelled from their homes during the fighting, in what is called in Arabic the Naqba, or "Tragedy", and to this day have not been able to return. Israel managed to maintain its independence and even expand its borders, but a new refugee problem, this one of Palestinian Arabs, was created.

The neighbouring Arab states did not establish a Palestinian state following the 1948 war with Israel. They concentrated on the fate of Palestinian refugees. In their view, Israel was now occupying Palestinian (Arab) land that they felt the UN and the British had no right to give away.

What remained of the territories allotted to the Arab state in Palestine was occupied by Jordan (the West Bank) and Egypt (the Gaza Strip) from 1948 to 1967, when Israel occupied those areas in the Six Day War. Israel took control of the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights, and the Sinai Peninsula bringing them under military rule.
The United Nation's Security Council passed Resolution 242, the "land for peace" formula, which called for Israeli withdrawal from territories occupied in 1967 in return for the end of all states of belligerency.

Since that time, the Palestinians have struggled to assert their own independence, either in all the territories of Palestine or in the West Bank and Gaza Strip particularly. To date, efforts to resolve the conflict have ended in deadlock (lets hope, it will change now), and the people of Palestine, Jews and Arabs, are engaged in a bloody conflict.

The UN General Assembly and Security Council have repeatedly denounce Israel's position and activites as being in violation of various international standards.


A question (not concerning Palestinian-Israel conflict): What are the reasons, that Jews in generally have been so extremely disliked for many years? Does anybody here knows it?

 

[GhostFox]

issued the 1947 UN Partition Plan seeking a "two-state solution" by creating both a new Jewish state and an Arab state.

So you agree that Isreal does belong to the jewish people then?

They concentrated on the fate of Palestinian refugees.

Ah, you mean using them as a tool to try and destroy Jews. They cared so much for them, didn't them. Kicked them out of their homes, made them refugees, then used them for their own devices. Good people I tell you.

Since that time, the Palestinians have struggled to assert their own independence

Is killing Jews what you consider struggling to assert your independance? Palestinians could have had their own equal state at any time. Instead they devoted their energy to killing people.

To date, efforts to resolve the conflict

Arafat's only resolution to the conflict was the destruction of Israel. Strangely enough, the Israeli's had no desire to be exterminated.

What are the reasons, that Jews in generally have been so extremely disliked for many years? Does anybody here knows it?

Because anti-sematism is unfortunately considered the acceptable form of racism.

 

[CptStern]

this pretty much says it all

before jewish state

after jewish state

 

[Nofuture]

I´ve said not less what I´ve said. If you, GhostFox, interpret it that way, it´s your problem, not mine.


The Jews have been artificialy performing immigration into and settlements in Palestine for many years before 1947 and after then.

Actually, some of them were considering to create the Jewish state not focusing on a particular area, e.g. Argentine was a possible territory (what a joy for Argentinians, that the Jews hadn´t done that! )
But finally they chose (unfortunately?) Palestine.


After the 1967 Six Day War, Israel built Jewish communities (typically referred to as settlements) in areas captured from Jordan, Egypt, and Syria (West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights). The United Nations Security Council and General Assembly have several times condemned Israel for constructing and expanding these settlements.
In spite of UN and internal condemnation of these settlements, Israel contends that the construction is legal under international law.


Could it be? Even US condemned Israel?:

The settlements have on several occasions been a source of tension between Israel and the US. In 1991 there was a clash between US and Israel, where the US delayed a subsidized loan in order to pressure Israel not to proceed with the establishment of settlements for instance in the Jerusalem-Bethlehem corridor. Jimmy Carter has said that the settlements consitute a major obstacle to peace. The Bush administration, while generally being very supportive of Israel, has said that settlements are "unhelpful" to the peace process.

Jan 31, 2005 IRNA -- The Zionist regime said Monday it will re-examine its decision, made secretly last summer, to seize land and real estate in Jerusalem owned by Palestinians.
According to the Israeli newspaper Ha`aretz, the American administration has expressed its concern in this regard and asked the Zionist regime to reconsider the decision.
The manifestly racist decision has been condemned by Palestinian leaders as "Nazi-like" and resembling the series of anti-Jewish laws made by Nazi Germany prior to the Second World War.
Seeking to evade possible American pressure on the issue, Zionist officials said they understood the sensitivity of the matter and promised to take another look at the decision. According to Israeli sources, the issue will be raised by the new US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice during her meeting Monday with Israeli envoys Dov Weisglass and Shalom Turegeman.
Some Israeli sources intimated that the Zionist regime will seek to reach a compromise with the Americans on the confiscation issue, which means Israel will go ahead with the planned seizure of Palestinian properties in Jerusalem.