Piracy: The Problem

[DEATHMASTER]

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/2653-Piracy

Ok so The Escapist has this other series called Extra Credits. And it's pretty good. Just a bit more on the issue of piracy here that may be educational for many.

 

[Raziaar]

Did he just tell Blackbeard not to be a dick?

IT WAS THE DAMN ROYAL MARINES THAT DID HIM IN!

 

[Ennui]

Blackbeard is original gangsta North Carolina.

I met the founder / lead editor of the Escapist last year and talked to him for a while, he's a really smart and interesting guy. I've heard good things about Extra Credits, never watched it.

 

[Ravioli]

He makes good videos but its important not to automatically assume everything he says is right without a bit of criticism. His logic is sometimes quite flawed and arguments can be weak at times. But i do enjoy his videos.

 

[Warbie]

I hadn't seen Extra Credits either - was worth a watch.

 

[Raziaar]

He makes good videos but its important not to automatically assume everything he says is right without a bit of criticism. His logic is sometimes quite flawed and arguments can be weak at times. But i do enjoy his videos.

Yeah I was watching the Diversity one and when he was talking about gay/bisexual characters not being represented well at all in really any game. He didn't really play Fallout New Vegas I guess.

 

[Sheepo]

Uh, I think I quoted myself. Not sure, but delete this I guess.

 

[Sheepo]

I watch Extra Credits regularly. It's generally a pretty insightful, interesting, intelligent, and accessible look into video games.

Edit: You think, because there is one recent example of sexual diversity in a video game, that the assertion, "Video games do not generally make an effort to represent sexual diversity" is wrong?

 

[kupocake]

Yeah I was watching the Diversity one and when he was talking about gay/bisexual characters not being represented well at all in really any game. He didn't really play Fallout New Vegas I guess.

Oh good, that's done with now then.

 

[Raziaar]

I watch Extra Credits regularly. It's generally a pretty insightful, interesting, intelligent, and accessible look into video games.

Edit: You think, because there is one recent example of sexual diversity in a video game, that the assertion, "Video games do not generally make an effort to represent sexual diversity" is wrong?

Oh good, that's done with now then.

I didn't say the issue was done with. I was basically pointing out that if he's wrong on one game, perhaps there are a whole slew of other games he simply hasn't really noticed homosexual or bisexual characters in. The thing that makes the Fallout Vegas characters so well done is that beyond a few choice comments there's really no way to distinguish their sexuality, often how it is in real life when you're not dealing with flamboyantly homosexual people. Same goes for the one(non flamboyant) lesbian companion character in Vegas.

Why is it that because I'm pointing out a completely missed over game as an example you guys somehow seem to think that I'm saying the issue is wrong or solved because of that one scenario.

Did I ever make any sort of declaration of either?

 

[Sheepo]

Well I don't think he ever really declared that there are literally no games in existence that represent sexual diversity, so it seemed to us you were attacking his point about the entire industry based on one game. Given that he spent a great deal of that video elaborating on a video game he thought did represent sexual diversity well, I can't really think he said that.

 

[Raziaar]

Well I don't think he ever really declared that there are literally no games in existence that represent sexual diversity, so it seemed to us you were attacking his point about the entire industry based on one game. Given that he spent a great deal of that video elaborating on a video game he thought did represent sexual diversity well, I can't really think he said that.

From what I heard in the video, he wasn't satisfied with any of the game characters he mentioned. Even the one he singled out he didn't seem to happy with.

But anyway this is about piracy, not diversity and his other videos so I'll shut up now.

 

[kupocake]

The thing with a Fallout game as well, is that the game basically gives players everything they need to completely circumvent the issue altogether. It's a kind of gaming 'Don't ask, don't tell' that just leaves the issue untangled with altogether, especially when combined with 'silent' gay characters. More to the point of my kind of facile post above, I don't think the 'few choice comments' characterisation is really what the video was getting at. There's the element of it being positive to have the characters present and normalised, but the video went to great pains to suggest that actually exploring sexuality in the frame of the narrative and even design was something that games should be reaching for.

What you read as 'positive' is... but it hardly sounds like anything beyond tokenism. You haven't created a deep character just because you've made it not something else. And more to the point, 'flamboyant' characterisations aren't disqualified from being deep, just because they're stereotypical.

 

[Raziaar]

The thing with a Fallout game as well, is that the game basically gives players everything they need to completely circumvent the issue altogether. It's a kind of gaming 'Don't ask, don't tell' that just leaves the issue untangled with altogether, especially when combined with 'silent' gay characters. More to the point of my kind of facile post above, I don't think the 'few choice comments' characterisation is really what the video was getting at. There's the element of it being positive to have the characters present and normalised, but the video went to great pains to suggest that actually exploring sexuality in the frame of the narrative and even design was something that games should be reaching for.

What you read as 'positive' is... but it hardly sounds like anything beyond tokenism. You haven't created a deep character just because you've made it not something else. And more to the point, 'flamboyant' characterisations aren't disqualified from being deep, just because they're stereotypical.

The entirety of Fallout New Vegas is chock full of homosexual and bisexual characters and script. It's pervasive to the point that it's a pretty much normal lifestyle in the Fallout Vegas landscape. It's not at all a "Don't ask don't tell" sort of thing.

Have you played New Vegas? It's not tokenism at all. The military is loaded with homosexual or bisexual personnel, and it's basically how our military should be and how most modern militaries are... where sexuality isn't an issue and doesn't get in the way of a combat force. They even touch on homosexuality heavily when discussing Caesar's Legion and how the way they basically treat the women as breeders and slaves and not companions sexually or emotionally. And again, that's just a tiny facade of the game when delving into that whole issue.

 

[kupocake]

Well, this is where my ability to actually comment on examples in the game in question runs out prematurely, so I'll have to take your word for it. Ultimately though, it's not a scenario element that would outweigh everything I hated about my Fallout 3 experience

Oh, and considering the Zero Punctuation thread is basically a HL2.net RSS feed, I don't think we should be worried about discussing the wider Extra Credits series, or of having a continuous thread on the series. I thought for all its 'oohhh shiittt' fearmongering at the beginning of the Piracy episode, the content was pretty tame. Or perhaps I'm just unrealistically assuming that the conclusions they drew were too bleeding obvious. Hell, the most controversial thing they said was about the legitimacy of abandonware.

 

[Raziaar]

Well, this is where my ability to actually comment on examples in the game in question runs out prematurely, so I'll have to take your word for it. Ultimately though, it's not a scenario element that would outweigh everything I hated about my Fallout 3 experience

Oh, and considering the Zero Punctuation thread is basically a HL2.net RSS feed, I don't think we should be worried about discussing the wider Extra Credits series, or of having a continuous thread on the series. I thought for all its 'oohhh shiittt' fearmongering at the beginning of the Piracy episode, the content was pretty tame. Or perhaps I'm just unrealistically assuming that the conclusions they drew were too bleeding obvious. Hell, the most controversial thing they said was about the legitimacy of abandonware.

Well... Fallout III is a terrible game and you should never pirate it. Fallout New Vegas is quite a different experience and you should Piruhhlay it to death! But yeah, getting back to Piracy.

 

[Sheepo]

I honestly don't recall there being that much homosexuality in New Vegas. Perhaps we should change the title of the zero punctuation thread to include extra credits?

 

[Raziaar]

I honestly don't recall there being that much homosexuality in New Vegas. Perhaps we should change the title of the zero punctuation thread to include extra credits?

Really? Did you just blaze through the game or did you do what I did and talk to pretty much as many npcs and such as you could? Because there was a ****ing lot of it.

 

[Sheepo]

No, I didn't blaze through. I mean, I didn't really stay with Arcade very long before the game ended, and I remember a ghoul prostitute or something. Really didn't see much, and there was very little I didn't do.

 

[Raziaar]

No, I didn't blaze through. I mean, I didn't really stay with Arcade very long before the game ended, and I remember a ghoul prostitute or something. Really didn't see much, and there was very little I didn't do.

I actually didn't even do anything with Arcade besides talk with him and store him in my room with all the others. And if all you remember were the painfully obvious things like the ghoul prostitute then well... can't really help you there. Many, MANY of the NPCs especially with the NCR both with quests and with no quests were lesbian and bisexuals.

I think your pipboy gaydar module was just malfunctioning. I mean that both literally and figuratively. I did have the confirmed bachelor trait as well as the ladykiller. I wasn't thinking at the time that confirmed bachelor was a euphemism for gay person back in the 50's. I simply wanted my character to be the best at survival and being able to talk himself out of all situations.

 

[taviow]

Yeah Confirmed Bachelor is the perk that identifies you as a gay character.

And yeah, about New Vegas being substantially better than Fallout 3, which was indeed really bad, seconded.

 

[Shem]

So, if you choose both the Confirmed Bachelor and Lady Killer perk, you're bisexual.

In the game, of course.

 

[PriNcE oF SpAcE]

animation and mickey mouse voice is ****ing annoying.

also nothing new being said.

 

[YROC]

I thought this thread was about piracy.

 

[Krynn72]

you missunderstood. Its about butt pirates.

 

[YROC]

OOOOOOOOOoooooooohhh, I see.

Spoiler

 

[Krynn72]

Related: PC Game Piracy Examined

Was posted here before, but its relevant enough.

A very small snippit

The Culture of Piracy

In researching this article I read literally hundreds of articles, studies, forum posts, blog posts and general comments from a wide range of people. What disturbed me more than the blatant misinformation and falsehoods regarding various aspects of the debate was the unashamed 'Culture of Piracy' which now appears to be prevalent around the Internet. Not only are the people who are pirating games openly bragging about it, they're flowering it up with a range of excuses, even suggesting that it's their right to do so. Back in the 1980s when my friends and I swapped copies of Amiga games, we didn't blame the copy protection for forcing us to do it, we didn't blame copyright laws, or assume it was our right to copy any game we want in the name of 'freedom', we didn't even make a point of openly advertising that we did it. We copied games for one simple reason: because we could.

Fast forward to the 21st century, and piracy has apparently somehow become a political struggle, a fight against greedy corporations and evil copy protection, and in some cases, I've even seen some people refer to the rise of piracy as a "revolution". What an absolute farce. Truth be told I have the greatest respect for the people who simply come out and just say that they pirate because they can, no more, no less. At least then I know I'm dealing with someone who's being honest and has got their head screwed on straight.

Piracy is the result of human nature: when faced with the option of getting something for free or paying for it, and in the absence of any significant risks, you don't need complex economic studies to show you that most people will opt for the free route. However to back this up, the data presented in this article shows quite clearly that DRM or no DRM, good game or bad game, demo or no demo, available via Steam or not, cheap or expensive, whether sold by an independent or a major publisher - all games are being pirated on a massive scale. The most significant determinant of which games will get pirated more is how desirable they are. No surprises there.

The purely self-serving nature of the arguments people use to justify piracy has become quite galling, and frankly is an insult to the collective intelligence of all internet users. Whether you pirate games or not is ultimately none of my business, but at least have the decency to be honest with yourself and everyone else about the real reasons why you're doing it.