Remember that thing on planethalflife.com
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The Mullinator
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You do realize that magazine reviewers try to beat these games as fast as they possibly can to get their review out as quickly as possible. On top of that they are also usually better than the average consumer in FPS games meaning they can get through it faster.rrm said:
20 hours of gameplay for someone going as fast as they can who is also a very experienced FPS player is actually extremelly good and could equal around 30-40 hours for someone who isn't as experienced who doesn't want to just speed through everything.
I doubt Doug was lying.
A
~}A{~TF2
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rrm said:
LOL
Nice made up quote there... I hope you don't believe that that would actually be true... especially since if he ever DID say something like that, and have it quoted, that would be the end of his tenure at VALVe.
:cheers:
AngstyTeen
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Just blame me its quite a lot easier then trying to find proof to your claims.
Yeah boohoo for him, we had to wait just as much as he did, but did we quit operating a website over it? Did munro drop hl2.net after all the lies? No, he didn't. Fragmaster was just another disappointed HL2 fan and decided to make a big scene. Hey I was dissapointed too, but what he did was completely unneccesary if he only quit because of the delays.
EDIT- I'm not insulting fragmaster, or saying that he was wrong for being mad about the delays, but to quit operating planethalflife was just ridiculous, come on fragmaster.
EDIT- I'm not insulting fragmaster, or saying that he was wrong for being mad about the delays, but to quit operating planethalflife was just ridiculous, come on fragmaster.
i dont think he was mad over delays, he was dissapointed to find out that valve is just another lying bullshit corperation, compared to the upstart hard working game making group they were in the 1990's... (and that 90% of the people here think, note the assumtion by most that the lawsuit = evil greedy publisher vs poor innocent valve)
Lanthanide
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He could have reasonably just said a couple of times "I have inside information and I know for a fact that the game will not be out on September 30th. I don't expect anyone to believe me, but I -am- telling the truth".
Then if he didn't go slagging off at everyone else who disagreed and kept bringing it up over and over again, things would have been a lot different.
As for being a baby for quitting a site when others didn't - he was more involved with Valve than others, and he saw what they were doing, and it made him feel betrayed and apathetic to the whole situation. It's no fun working on a website for a game if you no longer particularly care about the game due to the excessively bad management of PR by the game's developer. Particularly when you are doing the website as a -hobby-, something which is supposed to be relaxing and fun.
So I don't blame him for quitting, I think anyone would in his situation - clearly no other fansite operaters were (ie, they still enjoyed following the game).
Then if he didn't go slagging off at everyone else who disagreed and kept bringing it up over and over again, things would have been a lot different.
As for being a baby for quitting a site when others didn't - he was more involved with Valve than others, and he saw what they were doing, and it made him feel betrayed and apathetic to the whole situation. It's no fun working on a website for a game if you no longer particularly care about the game due to the excessively bad management of PR by the game's developer. Particularly when you are doing the website as a -hobby-, something which is supposed to be relaxing and fun.
So I don't blame him for quitting, I think anyone would in his situation - clearly no other fansite operaters were (ie, they still enjoyed following the game).
Homer
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Fragmaster was right about EVERYTHING. He quit because the reward he got for being right was a community that hated him. He called the missed september 30th release date way before anyone else, and he was flamed to hell and back for it.
Soundwave
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Exactly Homer. If I were running a community for the kind of fanatics I see sometimes on these boards, I'd quit too. He had a good reason, simply put he was sick of the bullshit and didn't want to worry about it anymore. And who the hell could blame him.
Lanthanide said:
Someone over on steampowered posted some links for this a while back and he actually said exactly that on several occasions and got attacked by the fanboys who claimed he was just a drama queen and pissed off at valve etc.
The fact is he was right about just about everything he said and I would dearly love to see those morons who attacked him apologise for acting like such a bunch of pricks when he told them their beloved HL2 wouldn't be out on time.
And I know some of those people are here now.
killahsin-[CE]
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The problem is content is ALWAYS cut from games. The whole cabal process is TO cut content that just doesn't fit the mold of the game. Fragmaster let his own issues, cloud his understandings. HAd he known his history he would know that HL2 was designed the EXACT same way as HL one. They have a process they follow. Which is why even a month before the game could be shipped the game could look like its in tons of pieces and totally unfinished.
Valve makes multiple games at the same time, and than puts them all together. Thats the issue I had w/ fragmaster. Is for as much as he knew or acted like he knew. He never put that knowledge to use. He's running supposedly the biggest HL fansite. Yet, lacks the knowledge of how valve designs and builds their games? Even if they had scrapped the WHOLE content of the game last year, it would be nothing new to their design process. Frag's job is to relay this to the fans. Because THATS the truth. But what frag decided to do was the 'no your lying' and I'm going to tell the world route. Let me see all of Fragmasters hard work get leaked onto the internet in a very bad way, and a very ugly build of it, along with the primary source code itself of very copywritten IP, and see how he reacts to it. Just getting people to even WORK again must have been a pain in the ***.
So while fragmaster may have had some inside info he never actually put it to use. Nor understood anything pertaining to what he did learn. As educated and above the community as he tried to play, he himself had a severe lack of understanding the process itself.
Valve makes multiple games at the same time, and than puts them all together. Thats the issue I had w/ fragmaster. Is for as much as he knew or acted like he knew. He never put that knowledge to use. He's running supposedly the biggest HL fansite. Yet, lacks the knowledge of how valve designs and builds their games? Even if they had scrapped the WHOLE content of the game last year, it would be nothing new to their design process. Frag's job is to relay this to the fans. Because THATS the truth. But what frag decided to do was the 'no your lying' and I'm going to tell the world route. Let me see all of Fragmasters hard work get leaked onto the internet in a very bad way, and a very ugly build of it, along with the primary source code itself of very copywritten IP, and see how he reacts to it. Just getting people to even WORK again must have been a pain in the ***.
So while fragmaster may have had some inside info he never actually put it to use. Nor understood anything pertaining to what he did learn. As educated and above the community as he tried to play, he himself had a severe lack of understanding the process itself.
Ghost Freeman
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Homer said:
Quoted for ****ing emphasis.
Fragmaster was right all along.
smsKONG
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Absinthe said:
It's more about, HOW you go about being right..
And he was wrong about CZ, he blames the massive delay between gold and shipping squarely on valves shoulders, when surely it was VUGs decision to hold the game back (something we are seeing shades of at the mo).
Yes Doug Slimebardi is a lying git, but that doesn't mean valve are scum and their every action has been aimed at narking the fanbase. Software development is notoriously unreliable, YES valve did lie up to the last minute about the 30th sept release date(more than likely at scumbardis request), however the other stuff fragmaster mentions is not valve lying, more likely just them dealing with the problems of development while juggling the issues of the legal wranglings. Fragmaster seemed to be taking it all too personally imo and came accross as an arrogant git in the process.
Oh and while on the subject of valves legal dealings with VUG- yes alot of people have jumped to valves defense, myself included. However I'm sure no one believes valve are squeaky clean in all this, but come on, who are you gonna stand up for; the developer who gave you the best game in the world...OR...the publisher from hell who just suck artists of all kinds dry.. I'm sorry but I know whos corner I'm in.
So valve had to be a bit decieptful and use strongarm tactics to get what they wanted in regards to online distribution and IP rights. Good on `em I say, it's about time publishers were stood up to more, and as for VUGs claims of being decieved over the online distribution factor- I mean, come on is it valves fault that sierra was nieve and stupid for actually thinking valve wouldn't or couldn't disribute online. All Newell said was that he 'could not understand how one can make money online today.' And this was said in september 2000....News flash it's 2004 and now it is possible, in 2000 even if steam had been up and running it still wouldn't have been possible to deliver large quantities of data direct to peoples homes, the bandwidth constraints are not the same these days, broadband is commonplace, steam is viable....so VUG is bringing legal action against valve because of their own lack of foresight.
Feath
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smsKONG said:
I'd like to mention that a lot of people seem to think that Valve were constantly saying that the game the game was on track until the 29th of September. They didn't do that. (I'm not saying you believe that, but some people do).
The last time Valve said that the game was coming out on the 30th of September was at ECTS last year. This was around the end of August/beginning of September. Then a week before the 30th, Valve announced the game was delayed. This is far different from Valve saying every day "the game is perfectly on track" and then suddenly saying "Nope, it's going to be delayed"
Even at ECTS Valve weren't completely dead set that the game would be out. Greg Coomer said "It'll be close". We should've taken this as an indication that the game could be delayed but we were dead set against it being delayed.
One of the reasons that the community wasn't very receptive of a delay is because Fragmaster made it so hard to be. A lot of us wanted him to be wrong just because of the way he was acting. It admit he was right was to admit that the way he acted was a correct way to act.
I'd even go to far to say as the leak actually may not have happened if Fragmaster acted in a different way. Part of Anon's motive was to prove that Valve wasn't as far ahead as expected. He may not have been driven to get the Source code to proove that Valve were lying. This is just speculation on my part. But if Fragmaster didn't create this "Valve are liars" mentality that some of the community had (and still have), Anon would've had nothing to proove.
It's got far more to do with whether he was right or not. It's the way he acted that many of us have issues with.
And I agree completely with Killahsin. Content is cut all the time from games, for many different reasons. I don't think Fragmaster had as much access to Valve as he'd lead you to believe. He makes out that he was completely writing the Making of book, but it's recently come to light that he was just helping out with it.
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PHL was very good when he was around, now some dumb-ass is runing the site, their forums suck, specially with their "great" mod, Beagle, what a dumb-ass I sware, if you read this, yes, you suck, your forums suck and your crappy music band also sucks.
Fragmaster, made Valve look like some Goverment empire, HL2 is a game, not some corporation.
Fragmaster, made Valve look like some Goverment empire, HL2 is a game, not some corporation.
CB | Para said:How did this turn into "let's flame Fragmaster" thread?
Because instead of looking like a baby in front of the world by walking out on his site, he could have still been supporting it now.
Yeah valve delayed, lied and misled their fans, I was extremely angry, but did I throw a temper tantrum and look like a whiner in front of the whole internet? No, and neither did anyone else, except fragmaster. There were millions of dissapointed fans, yet only one that we know of quit operating his HL2 site because of the lies and delays.
Yes, fragmaster was right about 9/30 delays, we were all starting to get skeptical considering by mid-september of last year, we hadn't seen any MP info, barely any game footage, and a door that kicks itself in in traptown while claiming to have AI that can do this sort of thing on its own with no script. Do I feel sorry for him for getting flamed nonstop by hl2 fanboys defending their precious valve, of course I do, but do I condone the way he left planethl behind, no I don't.
And that's my final answer.
smsKONG
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Feath said:
Sorry my bad :/
was me doing a fragmaster there (read- being a dramaqueen
)It wasn't the 29th > it was the 23rd wasn't it :E
Personally I didn't see too much of a problem with this, I've seen countless games that I've been eagerly awaiting pushed back in this kind of manner. That is the nature of software development and it's never unexpected - especially when things go really quiet....
Fragmaster really played up something rotten and I suspect you are right about him inflaming the situation and maybe encouraging the hacker.
So to re-iterate, I didn't really mean 'up to the last minute' literally, was just pointing out in a fragmastery way that yes fragmaster was right about 1 thing- but that he was still a tw4t
razorblade kiss
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Ghost Freeman said:
The point is theres a difference between being right.
And
Being an asshole whos right.
razorblade kiss said:
I dont think so. He was right, and the way he acted does not give us the right to judge him. We all have our "specialities" Fragmaster was annoyed, angry and so on. So he acted it out. So what? This is not US(!), on the internet you do actually have a right to free speech. :dozey: So, IF you see a offending post on the net, dont take it so damn Seriously!!
Actually it's more the other way around.jayte said:
On the internet the admins decide whats right and wrong, there's no such thing as free speech.
And i would believe that Gamespy do have some requirements for being a webmaster for a site like that. And i'm pretty sure he broke them.
FISKER_Q said:
First of all he was the admin, so he had that right.
(Sure you cant post EVERYTHING on THIS forum, but there
are forums on the net where the admins are not as
"conservative" as here.)
Secondly the rules he broke and any grudge between him and gamespy is his business.
Yes he had his right, now that doesn't make it less wrong now does it?jayte said:
Would it be right if an admin banned you without reason? Of course he can choose so since it's his site, but that doesn't change the fact that it was wrong.
Soundwave
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razorblade kiss said:
Sort of like how there's a difference between being wrong, and being an asshole who's wrong, which is what 99% of the dumbass HL2 fanatics did.
People seem to think Frag only quit because of Valve's shit, but it was also because of you guys, who even now talk shit about him. God...like I said earlier, who the hell could blame him?
Feath
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Soundwave said:
We have good reason to not like him. Accept that. It doesn't matter how right he turned out to be (and it's still doubtful if his evidence was as solid as he made out), he still acted in a way that wasn't helpful to anyone.
Feath
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Soundwave said:
Well, sorry if disagreeing with him made us "Fanatics". I didn't like the way he did things, and neither did a lot of people. He turned people against him. He wasn't a poor soul who's only crime was tell us that the game was delayed. He was arrogant, insulting, slanderous and annoying.
FISKER_Q said:
"Would it be right if an admin banned you without reason?"
- Well it is called "right" is it not? They have that rigth,
even if it is wrong. However they cant stop me from flaming
them on MY website.
"I may not agree with you sir, but I will die for your right
to express opinion" -Voltaire (Even if in some ways he was
wrong too, the idea is golden.)
You do excersice your right to read what FM wrote on PHL,
but you DONT HAVE TO, thats the beauty of it. So if
anything/anyone upsets you on that site, you only have your
self to blaim for reading it.
Ignorance is bliss.
jayte said:
The right to express his opinion has nothing to do with it.
He's a journalist, journalists DO NOT post their opinion in news. They post the news. Gamespy have guidelines for this, and i doubt that the community is the only reason he left. This was not his personal playground.
I had no chance of controlling what i wanted to read, other than boycotting the news totally. And how would i be able to read that he would be acting like he did before i actually read it?
After that my general outrage for it saw it as a cause for the community.
He was right, and that's great. But if he had really been a journalist and had known what he tried to claim he did, then he would've found the proper proof, and he would've written it.
How do you think the community would've reacted if he began digging in the cases with Valve vs. Vivendi? If he could've used that knowledge for making news like that, then we could've just as well nominated him for a pullitzer.
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