Reviewer blames HL2 of "not showing their bad features in E3"

[Rico]

Behold people... I bring you some of the stupidest remarks ever said by a reviewer about HL2.

http://www.firingsquad.com/features/e3_2004_part_3/page4.asp



Now what I find funny and stupid about this article is that he goes off about Valve "showing the stuff you can do in HL2" on purpose. MY oh my, I guess they should have just let a toddler play around with the mouse and hope he showed the gameplay of the HL2 engine. Not only that but he accusses them of not showing the true gameplay of the game because they "didn't have a playable demo" even though gamespy and a lot of other gamesites were invited to play 3 levels of HL2 for their reviews. Even if the reviewer were lacking this info (which he should not, this is his job after all) any reasonable person would know that in-engine footage cannot be faked.

He even argues about how they made it so "...the car crashed through the fence on purpose so the wood would break..." and even claimed that they didn't crash it into the house because it wouldn't break. Do I even need to go on?

Comments?

PS: They have a comments section, maybe a few people should go comment on his "review".

 

[Beserker]

That is just simply sad from him. I bet he was protesting outside their booth(s) so he could get in. What a bastard...all lies.

 

[Mr.Reak]

The thing is, we can’t prove him wrong, because he has a point, HL2 wasn’t playable during E3. We can only wait for final product and judge ourselves for what it is, then we can spam that guy to death. While his article is aggressive and biased against HL2, he has some point in it, too bad he expressed his opinion in such way that people won’t take it seriously.

 

[Sparta]

Lord thats ridiculous.

 

[Ames]

Probably just some crazy HL2 fan gone mad over the delay.

 

[Beserker]

But there have been preview -plays of the game and one is by my homes countrys biggest and definetly truth talking magazine. The reviewer played the game and it actually had the same things as in the demo.


He's just bullshitting and is stupid ass.

 

[wayne white]

well the game was a canned video,i dont find the review biased at all.

 

[Apos]

This guy said the same exact sort of stuff last year.

 

[beat]

What he said is true though. They reherse and plan every move to make it look cool.

I bet there were a couple things scripted for the demo to get the desired effect. For one im pretty sure i saw the combine actually running underneath the metal box before he dropped it. And i bet the combine throwing that grenade so he could pick it up with the manipulator was scripted so that they could be sure it would happen when they wanted it too. things like that.

 

[ASnogarD]

I can see some validity to the reviewers claim, especially in the light that last years E3 there was a non-playable demo showing off HL 2 , and now a year later theres still only a non-playable demo.

Valve did say it was thier policy not to use playable demos at shows, they felt it would be more intresting for the viewers to watch a rolling demo than to watch a new player trying to muddle through the initial stages of the game.

All in all it sounds like the reviewer was anticipating getting a go with the game, and left being a spectator ... again

 

[Ames]

I'm pretty sure some other movies were scripted too. Can't Half-Life 2 have scripted sequences?

The other highly anticipated games at E3 have them and in larger quantities....

 

[Apos]

well the game was a canned video,i dont find the review biased at all.

Man, you know, knowing you, that's a huge surprise.

 

[Triggerhappy41]

He does have a point, but the reason they do that is to show a lot of what you CAN do. Id personally rather have a vid with 20 possible cool things than one with 2. If the game sucks for some bizzare reason, few will buy it, and i guess that this guy has already decided.

 

[Apos]

For one im pretty sure i saw the combine actually running underneath the metal box before he dropped it.

The question is, why would they BOTHER scripting that? Who cares? Is it really part of your conspiracy theory that Valve hasn't written in even the most basic "move around and attack" code that would allow enemies to, I dunno, move somewhere? And the player moves the crane TO the combine: who CARES where they were standing?

And i bet the combine throwing that grenade so he could pick it up with the manipulator was scripted so that they could be sure it would happen when they wanted it too.

Combines threw grenades throughout the demos, whenever they were fighting. Again: why would they BOTHER scripting any of that when those things happen normally?

Got to go, welcome back Kotter is on.

 

[Shuzer]

What he said is true though. They reherse and plan every move to make it look cool.

I bet there were a couple things scripted for the demo to get the desired effect. For one im pretty sure i saw the combine actually running underneath the metal box before he dropped it. And i bet the combine throwing that grenade so he could pick it up with the manipulator was scripted so that they could be sure it would happen when they wanted it too. things like that.

A combine running under a crate via a script makes absolutely zero sense.
As for the grenade part, I can't see how that'd be scripted either, other than telling the combine to throw a grenade at Gordon in that area

Edit: Too slow tonight

 

[brettt]

That is absurd. Sounds like some kids at school. Bastards. I bitch slapped all of them

 

[BoS]

The guy only stated opinions mixed with facts. While reading it, I didn't consider it to be a Valve bash in any way. He was merely saying, that after an extra year of development time, there still was no public demo. Although we did get to see some pretty damn cool new stuff, we still don't know that it was authentic gameplay footage. He's right though, as well as many of you that said this already: people were told how to play the levels. I'm sure the testers were told to make use of every weapon at least once, use the manipulator as much as possible, interact with the environent as much as possible, and pretty much don't run around with the crowbar skipping all the action. I'm sure there's people that could beat the zombie level without blowing up canisters and throwing sawblades. But, if I was waiting in line for over an hour to watch that video, I'd be pretty pissed if that's what I got to see.
People need to not be so angry at people that don't bow down to Valve and HL2. I know this is a fan site, but, you have to be open to others' opinions, as long as they're backed with facts, not just people going "this game sucks."

 

[ASnogarD]

AFAIK the demo was not scripted...it is a collection of demos taken from playtesters. In one of the e-mails in the e-mails from Valve thread, I think Rick said one of the playtesters accidently run off the narow road but ingenously used the grav gun (?) to get the vehicle back on the road...he also specifically mentioned the scene where the guy pushed the vehicle into a combine.

So basically the demo is a set of playdemos chosen for the E3 demo, thus no scripting.

ALSO

Valve did say it was thier policy not to use playable demos at shows, they felt it would be more intresting for the viewers to watch a rolling demo than to watch a new player trying to muddle through the initial stages of the game.


All in all it sounds like the reviewer was anticipating getting a go with the game, and left being a spectator ... again

 

[Apos]

Yeah: at least if you believe Valve, they picked their favorite moments from playtester sessions, not carefully planned out the action for each scene.

 

[Peks]

i saw a rocket hit one of the trees in the movie and the tree showed no damage.

not everything is breakable for gameplay purposes.

 

[Apos]

Of course not. Nor did they ever claim that everything was.

 

[qckbeam]

Well of course Valve is going to want to show off the coolest parts of their game. That is the purpose of E3. What is he talking about with limits? Honestly, anyone that thought every single object in the game would be breakable was just kidding themselves. Let's be realistic. Valve has said that they give hints to their AI. So yeah, whoever designed the strider fight scene level probably hinted to the striders that it would be pretty cool if they took a shot at those pillars and destroyed them, and yes, if the player had crashed his buggy into the concrete building I highly doubt it would have broken, so what? I mean, that combine soldier was just screaming to be hit, I would of smashed him as well, and I'm sure that's what Valve had in mind when they placed him in front of a wooden fence. They probably thought "Well, the player is going to be speeding down the road at 80MPH, let's put some guys in front of him so he can run some baddies down. Better yet, why not put a wooden fence behind one of them so that when he's hit he'll go crashing through! That'd be pretty cool!". They design these scenarios with cool gameplay in mind. Why do people get so worked up? So the AI doesn't take care of every single thing on it's own and the level designers can place hints in their levels. Valve openly admits to giving the AI hints. They do that because it allows for cool gameplay, and that's the whole damn point. Who cares how it's done, look at the end result! Certainly one cannot dispute the fact that those were in engine videos of gameplay scenarios.

 

[beat]

you just dont get it. im not saying everything is scripted im just saying that everyone knows they reherse and plan the action to make everything as cool as possible.

they scripted the combine to run under the box because they wanted to show them getting crushed. if they didnt script it then the combine would have been running in all sorts of directions and the effect would have been ruined. to make sure they crushed the combine to make it look cool they prolly scripted the combine to be under the crate.

and i know combine can throw grenades im just saying that they prolly scripted it at that time because they wanted to be sure the combine would throw it at that time so the developer could pick it up and throw it back. im sure they planned on doing it at that time so they scripted the combine to throw it at that time to be sure they would get that effect.

im not saying everything in the game is scripted im just saying its obvious they script alot of the things in the demos to be able to get the effect they want when they want it. grow up geez.

 

[Peks]

if only they could combine UE3 and that engine that had breakable walls...forget the couple games they made from it. Geo something was the name of the engine.


if they would perfect UE3's technologies with havok's physics and breakable walls....there would be no need for another engine.








edit: oh and this engine could also scale for flight simulators and mmogs.

 

[KurtCobain]

Every game developers at E3 make the majority of there videos look interesting, whats the problem with that lol, if they showed sum BS scenes reveiwers wuld flame the presentation even more.

And as for that guys review, well....it wos.....bollox.....was just a biased review by sum1 too lazy to wait for a game, probly a Doom3,FC,Halo2 fanboy..

 

[blahblahblah]

He does bring up some good points. For example...We have seen in multiple demos having the strider's vortex weapon to destroy various pillars and buildings. I wonder how destructible stuff will be in the game.

However, I think he is being overcritical in some areas. Like the area involving AI. Its an E3 demo. The game is a work-in-progress, not a complete game. Anyways, its not unusual for game to be fake AI during demo's.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

they scripted the combine to run under the box because they wanted to show them getting crushed. i

Where else could they run to? The warehouse door opens onto that platform. And even if the positioning of the Combine was deliberate, so what? That's what Level Design is all about.

if they would perfect UE3's technologies with havok's physics and breakable walls....there would be no need for another engine.

Why is everyone holding Unreal 3.0's engine technology as some kind of new Messiah? The hardware to run it properly won't be around until 2005/2006, by which time every other engine developer will have exactly the same features. It's just an evolution of current technology, not a giant revolutionary step.

 

[x84D80Yx]

i dont care what anybody says, fireingsquad.com is one of the best sites for videocard/game reviews. but i gotta admit that lil article about hl2 has a very negative feeling

 

[mbrithoms]

AFAIK the demo was not scripted...it is a collection of demos taken from playtesters.

dont be an freaking idiot! you think they recorded all the playtesters footage at every moment they were playing, your even more stupid then most fanboys

 

[Mechagodzilla]

dont be an freaking idiot! you think they recorded all the playtesters footage at every moment they were playing, your even more stupid then most fanboys

I'm just going to quote this and let the grammar speak for itself.

dont be an freaking idiot! [If?] you think [that?] they recorded all the playtesters footage at every moment they were playing, [then?] your even more stupid then most fanboys[.]

Yow.

Anyways, I think that the reviewer was really struggling to find bad points in the presentation. Non-conformist?

 

[Apos]

Oh, I get it. Believe me. :wink:

The fact is, while I'm sure some things were scripted to happen (like the roadblock, which it's a GOOD sort of script) you picked about the two dumbest examples possible to claim were scripted to happen.

Again, why in the heck would they "script" combine to run under a crate, when the crate can obviously be lifted and dropped anywhere they go? The place they were running to wasn't "under the crate" the crate moved to them. They may have been scripted to emerge out of the building when you get into the crane, but again, that's a good sort of script: the kind that reacts to what you do by throwing interesting puzzles and events your way. I see no reason to have them "script" anything to have them ONLY run in a particular place.

Same with the grenade. The combine are always throwing grenades. In this case, the player grabbed one and threw it back. What's so odd about that that it would require a special script to happen? Are you claiming that after you kill those combine, a grenade would still get thrown out of nowhere? Or that one combine stays in that place just so he can throw his grenade in that direction whether or not the player is actually there? Does that make ANY sense?

There is no reason at all to think that those two things are anything but playtesters exploring the world and doing cool stuff when they get a chance in the ways that make sense. Valve said that they picked some of the most interesting stuff from these sessions and there is little reason to doubt that. Obviously they picked the best stuff to show. THAT doesn't require some nonsense conspiracy theory.

 

[Apos]

dont be an freaking idiot! you think they recorded all the playtesters footage at every moment they were playing, your even more stupid then most fanboys

Boy, yeah he must be pretty stupid that he thinks that game developers would actually, like, want to record and analyze what happened in playtesting. I mean, the playtesting is just a pointless activity that developers just have to do by law, right?

Good grief.

 

[KurtCobain]

Bah u beat me to it, just just gonna say why they wuldnt bother scripting lame things such as 'walking under crates'

One thing i didnt like out of the review wos near the beggining, he says why did the person playing at the time drive into the wood making it fragment rather then driving into a wall [edit] that wuld do no damage to the wall etc [edit}

Pretty f**ked up point imho, the reveiwer is just knit picking about un-important and quite frankly worthless things.

 

[umop]

dont be an freaking idiot! you think they recorded all the playtesters footage at every moment they were playing, your even more stupid then most fanboys

lol... please explain why Valve wouldn't simply start recording a demo (assuming that feature is already complete) and stop when the playtesting is done? dont be an freaking idiot!

 

[kider]

This guy said the same exact sort of stuff last year.

dont you find this quote odd. its like we went back in time.

 

[|Star Runner|]

Ok can we get some clarity here
Personally i think the guy sounds a little biased and bitter about the whole thing.
But anyway to my point
With the whole scripted deal, well some of you who are bitching about it please read the info from valve thread in its entirity and then maybe go back and watch all the videos and LISTEN to what is being said. I know we have already established that not everything is unscripted or scripted for that matter. So please try and find out all you can on what you are talking about before making comments.

 

[Dead-Inside]

What he said is true though. They reherse and plan every move to make it look cool.

I bet there were a couple things scripted for the demo to get the desired effect. For one im pretty sure i saw the combine actually running underneath the metal box before he dropped it. And i bet the combine throwing that grenade so he could pick it up with the manipulator was scripted so that they could be sure it would happen when they wanted it too. things like that.

Rofl... THOSE weren't scripted, however the scene with the STRIDER might be. The dudes under the container would probably do the same in the game itself (How cool is it to crush those bitches? You know you want to, thus you will get the chance to do so). The granade is pure and simple smart gameplay, you would have done the same if you were a soldier.

 

[Varsity]

"I'm guessing I could probably
get it faster from the warez scene than I could
legitimately d/l it from Steam. Isn't that a
@#$&!@$ shame?"

 

[Sparta]

Oh lord im sick of all those pissed off players who didn't get the game at Sept 30th and f*ckin cracked it at Valve saying their liars and all that sh*t. And then you get people like Fragmaster and this guy saying "Everything is just so convenient it must be a conspiracy". Christ its a game, who cares that much about it getting delayed that they cry and whine and bitch about it over the internet. Sheesh

 

[Dougy]

He has a point.

we realy dont know how great the AI is or the limitations of the game.

And i dont think Fanboys screaming at him is going to make him feel otherwise.

Rofl... THOSE weren't scripted, however the scene with the STRIDER might be. The dudes under the container would probably do the same in the game itself (How cool is it to crush those bitches? You know you want to, thus you will get the chance to do so). The granade is pure and simple smart gameplay, you would have done the same if you were a soldier.

The crane and box effect is scripted.

Gabe/doug/rick.... said last year that when a large object falls due to the player the AI is hinted to run under it to create the cinematic hollywood death scene.

Of course that was in reference to last years E3 and the traptown video but i belive from this years video the AI still recieves hints to die.