Shrek 2 outed by christian fundys

[CptStern]

k this is bordering on the rediculous ..dont these guys have anything better to do?


"Uh oh! That other jolly green giant could be in trouble. Shrek 2 is the latest animated film title to be "outed'' by Christian fundamentalists in the U.S.

On its website the Traditional Values Coalition is warning parents about the cross-dressing and transgender themes contained in the hit DreamWorks feature, now on DVD.

"Shrek 2 is billed as harmless entertainment but contains subtle sexual messages,'' says the coalition, which describes itself as a grassroots inter-denominational lobby with more than 43,000 member churches."

"Recently, PBS was upbraided by the group Focus on the Family -- and supported by the U.S. secretary of education no less -- for an episode of the cartoon series Postcards From Buster, in which Buster the rabbit encounters a couple of kids with lesbian parents.

Christian activists have also targeted SpongeBob SquarePants, Barney the dinosaur and Sesame Street's Bert & Ernie as children's characters who are conduits for a soft-on-gays message."


it's really becoming a nation of intolerance ...what's going on down there?

 

[Icarusintel]

i love christian activists, they're so over-the-top, as long as they;re around we'll always have someone to laugh at

 

[GhostFox]

it's really becoming a nation of intolerance ...what's going on down there?

Clearly a tiny group of wacko fundementalists represent the whole nation.

By your logic every muslim should be wiped out becuase a small percentage of them are extremist terrorists.

Your hypocrisy continues to amaze me.

 

[CptStern]

that "tiny group" is 43,000 members strong. it's not just this one incident as I've already cited: spongebob, Ernie and Bert, Teletubbies, even the secretary of education got involved in it with the Postcards From Buster episode ban

 

[No Limit]

Clearly a tiny group of wacko fundementalists represent the whole nation.

By your logic every muslim should be wiped out becuase a small percentage of them are extremist terrorists.

Your hypocrisy continues to amaze me.

A tiny group? Almost every Republican defends these people.

 

[PvtRyan]

"Shrek 2 is billed as harmless entertainment but contains subtle sexual messages,''

Oh? :stare:

MPAA: Rated PG for some crude humor, a brief substance reference and some suggestive content.

Maybe, just maybe they should start to shut the f*ck up, get their facts straight and take responsibilities into their own hands whether or not they want their kids to see this. Stop pushing the problem away onto others.

 

[GhostFox]

that "tiny group" is 43,000 members strong

So 1/7,000th of a country localized in a small area is represenative of the whole now?

Again with your logic, if we can find at least 1 out of every 7,000 muslims in say Palestine to support Islamic fundementalism we should wipe them all out.

So you are either:

A) Promoting the genocide of all people of muslim faith

or

B) A huge hypocrite

I certainly hope it is at least B.

 

[GhostFox]

A tiny group? Almost every Republican defends these people.

I'd love to see you back that up.

 

[baxter]

Christian Fundys with tradition values, don't make me laugh.

I am not stagging off christianty in general but please......would anybody be surprised how few christians knew that the word "crucifix" the very symbol of Christianity comes from the Latin word cruciare.....to torture !

Maybe, just maybe they should start to shut the f*ck up, get their facts straight and take responsibilities into their own hands whether or not they want their kids to see this. Stop pushing the problem away onto others.

QFE

 

[CptStern]

I'd love to see you back that up.

you just proved his point

 

[CptStern]

So 1/7,000th of a country localized in a small area is represenative of the whole now?

Again with your logic, if we can find at least 1 out of every 7,000 muslims in say Palestine to support Islamic fundementalism we should wipe them all out.

So you are either:

A) Promoting the genocide of all people of muslim faith

or

B) A huge hypocrite

I certainly hope it is at least B.

that's one group out of hundreds

btw you wanna try to stay on topic instead brow beating me with your twisting of meanings

 

[GhostFox]

btw you wanna try to stay on topic instead brow beating me with your twisting of meanings

This is the topic. There is no point to this thread other then you taking a tiny group of crazies and trying to promote it as average america. If you could let go of your anti-american agenda for two seconds people might actually be able to discuss things with you.

 

[GhostFox]

you just proved his point

I am neither a conservative, nor religious, nor do I defend these wack-jobs. I defend the right of an entire country not to be maligned based off a tiny group by your anti-american agenda.

 

[CptStern]

where did i say it was "an average american"? and why do you care?

 

[^Ben]

"43,000 member churches."

Churches usually have more than 1 member.

 

[GhostFox]

where did i say it was "an average american"? and why do you care?

I care because I would like to see a thread on here not based on biased rhetoric.

Be honest. You created this thread so you could insinuate that the US is a bunch of religious fundementalists. Your intention from the start was to misrepresent people. Why do you feel the need to promote an agenda so much?

 

[CptStern]

where did i say it was "an average american"?


this constant nitpicking and petty arguing is exactly the reason why older members dont post here anymore

 

[GhostFox]

where did i say it was "an average american"?

Your first post:

it's really becoming a nation of intolerance ...what's going on down there?

Your insinuation is perfectly clear. Instead of the truth about how this is a small radical fringe group, you attempt to paint the picture that the whole country supports it. You can back out now and try to deny it, but it is clear to everyone your intentions.

I'd be more then happy to have reasonable conversations with you, if you are willing to drop your agenda.

 

[Cole]

This is why I'm glad I am not christian in any way or any form even if this is still a small group of christians.

 

[baxter]

this constant nitpicking and petty arguing is exactly the reason why older members dont post here anymore
__________________

And its getting tirersome, why don't you just stay with the thread,

Night.

 

[CptStern]

Your first post:



Your insinuation is perfectly clear. Instead of the truth about how this is a small radical fringe group, you attempt to paint the picture that the whole country supports it. You can back out now and try to deny it, but it is clear to everyone your intentions.

I'd be more then happy to have reasonable conversations with you, if you are willing to drop your agenda.

:upstare: part of me wants to answer your baseless accusations, another part of me wants to say ..stfu ..but mostly I just want to ignore you for the good of the thread :E

 

[Mechagodzilla]

"43,000 member churches."

Churches usually have more than 1 member.

QFE.

This isn't a tiny group, and there are hundreds, possibly thousands more like it, all pushing for the same thing.

Apparently their goal is to try and trick kids into thinking sexuality in general, and homosexuality in particular doesn't exist.
"Buster bunny" as an example, just showed two women in the same room, and suddenly there's tremendous outrage, a man getting fired and all sorts of other brouhaha.

It's just incorrect to deem this as a minor thing that will go away. These groups are nearly as ubiquitous as the popular culture they're attempting to censor. Just look at the whole Janet Jackson thing. Massive fines, a total shift in how networks portray media, etc.

These groups are strongarming the media into being more "christian', and they're surprisingly successful in that regard.

 

[Pesmerga]

I'm afraid that "43,000" is being spoken for. Unless you get 43,000 signatures on a peice of paper that says "Shrek 2 contains suggestive sexual content and kids shouldn't watch it", you've got a couple guys who think their opinion means something.

 

[seinfeldrules]

Just because people are a member of this organization doesnt mean they agree with every decision the organization makes. Are they supposed to leave their churches because it is somehow related to a group which wishes to condemn Shrek 2? I'm sure many of you work for companies which are affilitated with another company which does something wacky once in awhile, should you quit?

These groups are strongarming the media into being more "christian', and they're surprisingly successful in that regard.

And there are plenty of other groups which move to remove all symbols of Christianity from public light. If I remember right, they recently tried to remove a Cross from the Seal of LA. Furthermore, it isnt polite to say Merry Christmas anymore, its Happy Holidays. Next Xmass season, look at all the signs for proof of this.

 

[kmack]

I am sick to my stomach with these people. They are paranoid and overbearing. They force their beliefs on every facit of modern day life. Is nothing sacred?

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Just because people are a member of this organization doesnt mean they agree with every decision the organization makes. Are they supposed to leave their churches because it is somehow related to a group which wishes to condemn Shrek 2? I'm sure many of you work for companies which are affilitated with another company which does something wacky once in awhile, should you quit?

Of course, there's also the possibility that the church's members were the ones who pushed for this membership.

At the very least, 43 000 is the absolute unreasonable minimum number of people. And this is just one such group. It's not small.

And there are plenty of other groups which move to remove all symbols of Christianity from public light. If I remember right, they recently tried to remove a Cross from the Seal of LA. Furthermore, it isnt polite to say Merry Christmas anymore, its Happy Holidays. Next Xmass season, look at all the signs for proof of this.

Yes, but christianity actually has no place the United State's secular government. Imagine the outrage if folks had to swear to one nation under Allah. Secularism is in place so that even the slightest sign of such religious favoritism is kept out of government. Although these groups are pushing for relatively minor things, they are completely in the right.

 

[seinfeldrules]

Yes, but christianity actually has no place the United State's secular government. Imagine the outrage if folks had to swear to one nation under Allah. Secularism is in place so that even the slightest sign of such religious favoritism is kept out of government. Although these groups are pushing for relatively minor things, they are completely in the right.

Its a symbol in the Seal. Are you denying the historical role Christianity had in some parts of the country? Removing the cross from a Seal is doing just that.

At the very least, 43 000 is the absolute unreasonable minimum number of people. And this is just one such group. It's not small.

Nobody ever points out what group we are talking about. I'm sure the Church has plenty of reasons to sponsor a group called "Focus on Family" (if this is the group in question). Again, who knows if it is a minor association that isnt really important to the Church's members.

 

[CptStern]

I'm sure the Church has plenty of reasons to sponsor a group called "Focus on Family" (if this is the group in question). Again, who knows if it is a minor association that isnt really important to the Church's members.

from the Traditional Values Coalition:

some headlines:

TVC Asks Justice Department To Investigate Report That Homosexual Attorneys In Justice Department Advised Philadelphia Police

Ministry and Counseling Resources
For Those Struggling With Same-Sex Attractions
And Other Gender Identity Disorders


their Traditional Values Guide:


Homosexuality, Bi-Sexuality, Transgenderism, And Other Deviant Sexual Behaviors: The Bible clearly condemns all sexual behaviors outside of marriage between one man and one woman. Homosexual behavior is explicitly condemned in both the Old and New Testaments as an abomination and a violation of God’s standards for sexuality. We oppose the normalization of sodomy as well as cross-dressing and other deviant sexual behaviors in our culture.


Discrimination And Tolerance: We are not tolerant of behaviors that destroy individuals, families, and our culture. Individuals may be free to pursue such behaviors as sodomy, but we will not and cannot tolerate these behaviors. They frequently lead to death. We do not believe it is loving to permit someone to kill themselves by engaging in a self-destructive behavior. We believe in “discrimination” in the good sense: choosing between good and evil, right and wrong, the better and the best.



The Bible teaches us that we are to love our enemies and do good to those who persecute us. We believe it is a loving response to oppose behaviors that destroy individuals and families. It is not loving to allow someone to kill themselves or other individuals. It is not “hate” to fight against such cultural forces as pornography, drugs, abortion, and sodomy.



plain ol' hate rhetoric

 

[seinfeldrules]

plain ol' hate rhetoric

Nobody is disputing that the Church as a whole is very against homosexuality, I am disputing that many who attend church feel the same way. I wasnt even talking about homosexuality in the first place, I was talking about the objections to Shrek.

If you had to vote in the 2004 USA elections, who would you have voted for?

 

[CptStern]

Church as a whole is very against homosexuality

that's not entirely true:


"In August 2000, the 37th General Council affirmed that human sexual orientations, whether heterosexual or homosexual, are a gift from God and part of the marvellous diversity of creation. The Council further resolved to advocate for the civil recognition of same-sex partnerships. In August 2003, the 38th General Council decided "to call upon the Government of Canada to recognize same-sex marriages in marriage legislation."

 

[seinfeldrules]

that's not entirely true:


"In August 2000, the 37th General Council affirmed that human sexual orientations, whether heterosexual or homosexual, are a gift from God and part of the marvellous diversity of creation. The Council further resolved to advocate for the civil recognition of same-sex partnerships. In August 2003, the 38th General Council decided "to call upon the Government of Canada to recognize same-sex marriages in marriage legislation."

What has this got to do with Shrek? Again, my point wasnt about the broad matter of homosexuality, it was with this specific instance of Shrek. I'm sure you'd find that 99.9% of all people who attend Church have no problem with the movie.

 

[CptStern]

What has this got to do with Shrek?

nothing really, you made a statement, I answered it

Again, my point wasnt about the broad matter of homosexuality, it was with this specific instance of Shrek.

ummm no I think with titles like these they're going after homosexuality as a whole:

A Gender Identity Disorder Goes Mainstream Cross-dressers, Transvestites, And Transgenders Become Militants In The Homosexual Revolution.

"Normalizing The Abnormal: Each of these cases is an example of the efforts of the homosexual and transgender movements to normalize socalled sex-change operations and to deconstruct the reality of male and female in our culture."

I'm sure you'd find that 99.9% of all people who attend Church have no problem with the movie.

this group has bigger ambitions than Shrek 2:

"According to Kuehl, in a letter dated December 18, 2002, to all California school superintendents, this law, “added a provision that all students and staff in public education facilities have the same right to a safe learning environment, regardless of their sexual orientation or gender identity/expression.” In essence, this law gives sexually disturbed students the “right” to self-identify their gender despite the biological reality of male and female. Under California state law, a boy who thinks he’s really a girl, is now protected from alleged “discrimination.” And, if he wishes to wear a dress to school, educators must “respect” his self identification as a girl.

In 2004, three courageous Westminster, California, school board members decided to challenge this state law. Board members Judy Ahrens, Blossie Marquez-Woodstock, and Helena Rutkowski refused to implement a state-mandated definition of gender that permitted students to self-define themselves. They were ridiculed by a columnist for the Los Angeles Times, but stood their ground. According to Ahrens, a committed Christian, “It’s amazing how much we’ve eroded our society. Everyone always wants to fix things tomorrow. Well, I’m saying the time is ripe now. I might take a lot of heat for it, but the rewards are going to be great in heaven.”


nutjobs and hatemongers

 

[seinfeldrules]

nutjobs and hatemongers

Want to name who you are specifically referring to?

nothing really, you made a statement, I answered it

My statements were all in reference to Shrek, you apparently just enjoy grasping onto nothing in order to make some sort of attack against Christians.

 

[Raziaar]

Nice to see people like stern still attacking whole religions based on isolated cases of warped minorities of the practitioners. I'm surprised he wasn't on the pro war bandwagon for Iraq!

Heh.

 

[Lemonking]

I have a Shotgun and 70 Slugs for it whosr coming with me?
seriously I hate these guys dont they have anything better to do?
I mean I bet Muslim groups dont complain about Sponge Bob or Shrek jeez
the Americans have to take care of those groups they make the US look bad in foreign Countrys.

 

[Lemonking]

again I have to ask u? why not let the gays be gay?

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Nice to see people like stern still attacking whole religions based on isolated cases of warped minorities of the practitioners.

It's not 'whole' religions that are doing this, but the numbers are still far from insignifigant.
In all the states that voted on the gay marriage issue in 2004, around 60% of the populace voted against it, despite the fact that there is no logical reason to ban gay marriage outside of the realm of the superstitious.
60% of all americans is not an 'isolated case'. Certainly not 'warped minorities'.
And they were passing laws against real people.

In a way, it's almost a miracle that these fundamentalist groups are focussed mostly on eliminating fictional gays.

 

[Raziaar]

I have a Shotgun and 70 Slugs for it whosr coming with me?
seriously I hate these guys dont they have anything better to do?
I mean I bet Muslim groups dont complain about Sponge Bob or Shrek jeez
the Americans have to take care of those groups they make the US look bad in foreign Countrys.

No, they don't complain about sponge bob or Shrek. But the extremist muslims complain and enforce upon death the fact that women can't reveal their faces to other men among many other things people see as crazy. So, you have these fanatic types in every religion.

EDIT: at least I think in some groups its enforced upon death.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Its a symbol in the Seal. Are you denying the historical role Christianity had in some parts of the country? Removing the cross from a Seal is doing just that.

Historically, lots of things change. Especially superficial things like flags and whatnot. These groups simply wish that the symbol of their government be changed to something more secular, to reflect their (hopefully) secular government.
Like I said, it's a minor change, but there is nothing immoral or unprecedented about it.

Canada's flag, before 1960, had a small british flag in the corner. When it changed to the current maple leaf, people didn't just suddenly forget our ties to britian. History did not rewrite itself.
But the fact is,
Canada grew more independant over time, and the flag changed to reflect that.
Just as the government of the US is meant to be independant from christianity.

If I were to follow your logic that changing anything old is a state of denial, then I would have to drive a horse-drawn carriage or risk destroying my heritage.

Nobody ever points out what group we are talking about. I'm sure the Church has plenty of reasons to sponsor a group called "Focus on Family" (if this is the group in question).

I think stern has pointed out plainly enough that "Focus on Family" or whatever this group is called, is based all but entirely on being anti-homosexual.

And why exactly haven't the good non-fundamentalist people of these 43 000 churches spoken out against their being signed up to this hate-group?

 

[CREMATOR666]

Here we go again....:dozey: Jeez