So what WAS Valve going to release last year?

[Kadayi]

A what if thread? How quaint. :dozey:

Would the game of made Sept 30th? Unlikely tbh. It was a mistake on Valves part to be so specific about the release date, and certainly it was a mistake of Dougs to be so insistent about it even when it must of been ****ing obvious internally that the game was going to slip.

Was the 30th a date set in stone by ATI? The truth will never be known on that one, but I think both ATI and Valve would of been a lot happier to announce the game going gold on that date. ATI would of sold more cards as a result of it going gold than they did on sales made prior to the release. Also lets not forget that the 9800 pro series had already been pounding the Nvidia FX range in the ass for several months prior to the 30th.

The hacker got all what Valve had at the time? Utter bullshit I'm afraid conspiracy fans. The 'beta' build was nowhere near as advanced as the version illustrated in the E3 2003 footage, or the screenshots available of the game. The build had no prison levels, yet ingame screens of the prison levels had been made available publically some time before E3.

Personally I think that Valve opted for a year delay partly because the source code theft had demotivated them (and was going to require some work), but principally because overall they weren't happy with the final product. They famously delayed the first game because they didn't feel that it was firing on all cylinders. I think the present delay is based upon a similiar decision.

They've had a year in which to playtest and polish the main product fully, stabilise the steam network (the back bone of their content delivery) and they have also given themselves the time to develop elements that wouldn't of been feasible at 30th Sept 2003 (CS:S for a start). It's a pisser that the game got delayed, but it will all be for the good in the end.

 

[Cole]

The Truth is.. on 9/30/2003, valve relized they wern't making HL2 but Barney and Friends 2. So then the thought, Aww shit! So then they had to start deleting all the Barney and Friend 2 files and start designing HL2 things and then the source code got leaked! And valves like.. Aww shit!
So then they sat down for 6 months with barney and decided what to do. Then they decided to finish HL2 and redo the netcode. Then they relize that there in 2004 are are like
Aww shit!
So then they start making everything. Then they relize they made it on the HL1 engine! So there like
Aww shit!
Then they started transfering everything to the HL2 engine! Then they relized they accidentally made Barney: Source. So there like
Aww shit!
So then they made HL2 quickly and then Cs:S quickly. Then there like, ok now we gotta test it...
So they start a in-house test and they relized that the Cs:S's CT's models were Barneys (although they did have fun being T's and owning the Barneys), so there lime
Aww shit!
then they made 1 Ct Model quickly, and then lowered the T models to 1 for the beta test.
So then there playing dust and one of them says.
Lets play Aztec!
so they go on aztec but then they relize, its full of rainbow colors and barney textures on everything.
so there like
Aww shit!
So then they decide to only include dust in the beta test.
Then its time for Preloading and they relized they din't have the preloading set up.
So there like
Aww shit!
so they got the preloading up.
And i can only think that gabe just said..
Aww shit!

 

[jet jaguar]

The delay probably wouldn't be looked upon with so much suspicion if Valve and ATI hadn't been promoting HL2 as if it was going to be released in the fall of 2003. I would be seriously pissed if I bought a 9600XT back in 2003 just for HL2 and when HL2 finally got released I was only able to run it at medium detail...at 800x600...with simple shadows...

 

[oldagerocker]

The Truth is.. on 9/30/2003, valve relized they wern't making HL2 but Barney and Friends 2. So then the thought, Aww shit! So then they had to start deleting all the Barney and Friend 2 files and start designing HL2 things and then the source code got leaked! And valves like.. Aww shit!
So then they sat down for 6 months with barney and decided what to do. Then they decided to finish HL2 and redo the netcode. Then they relize that there in 2004 are are like
Aww shit!
So then they start making everything. Then they relize they made it on the HL1 engine! So there like
Aww shit!
Then they started transfering everything to the HL2 engine! Then they relized they accidentally made Barney: Source. So there like
Aww shit!
So then they made HL2 quickly and then Cs:S quickly. Then there like, ok now we gotta test it...
So they start a in-house test and they relized that the Cs:S's CT's models were Barneys (although they did have fun being T's and owning the Barneys), so there lime
Aww shit!
then they made 1 Ct Model quickly, and then lowered the T models to 1 for the beta test.
So then there playing dust and one of them says.
Lets play Aztec!
so they go on aztec but then they relize, its full of rainbow colors and barney textures on everything.
so there like
Aww shit!
So then they decide to only include dust in the beta test.
Then its time for Preloading and they relized they din't have the preloading set up.
So there like
Aww shit!
so they got the preloading up.
And i can only think that gabe just said..
Aww shit!

What are you on?! :naughty:
I suppose Valve went into Silent mode, came up to the week of release date and they panicked. Who knows.

 

[sup2069]

Exactly.

Lesson to be learnt? If you're buying hardware for a specific game wait till the game has gone gold. I bought my new PC for Doom 3 only when it went gold. I ar teh samart.

rofl

 

[razorblade kiss]

Why should valve make a marketing scheme for ATi when they already earned the contract, and the money?

I do agree that there's something fishy about the 30th september 2003 date, but i can't see why valve should go out on a marketing scandal just to make ATi happy about they spended some million dollars.

About the leak. There were basicly two timelines, E3 and after E3. The game were pretty quickly identified to be containing the same they had at E3. Which according to what they showed us was impossible, unless they of course took steps backwards in the programming.

The market scheme was to sell more graphics cards, and the HL2 voucher was the enticing lure. Just because Valve and ATI agreed to a partnership and signed the dotted lines on a contract doesnt mean it ends there. ATI provides an amount of graphics cards they feel should be sold as a result of the partnership. Valves way of ensuring that amount to be reached, was to not tell us the game wasn't coming out on September 30th, until the very last last LAST (and I mean LAAST) minute. But by then the cards we're already sold, sitting in the computers of eager HL2 fans.

THe gamers who purchased those cards, simply thought "ok, a minor delay" no big deal right? But here we are almost a year later, down the road and ATI has already released a whole new line of cards. A new line of cards that MORE HL2 fans are going to be buying, because OH MY GOD WHODA THUNK IT, HL2 is supposed to come out this September too YAY!! The trend is blatantly obvious and I find a tad insulting.

Valve will release the game in November, around thanksgiving when the Christmas shopping season is in full swing. Valve makes money. There damn good .THey milked HL1 for as much as they could, and god damn its still selling. NOW, well.... now there making money on HL2 before it has even come out.

 

[evil^milk]

The Truth is.. on 9/30/2003, valve relized they wern't making HL2 but Barney and Friends 2. So then the thought, Aww shit! So then they had to start deleting all the Barney and Friend 2 files and start designing HL2 things and then the source code got leaked! And valves like.. Aww shit!
So then they sat down for 6 months with barney and decided what to do. Then they decided to finish HL2 and redo the netcode. Then they relize that there in 2004 are are like
Aww shit!
So then they start making everything. Then they relize they made it on the HL1 engine! So there like
Aww shit!
Then they started transfering everything to the HL2 engine! Then they relized they accidentally made Barney: Source. So there like
Aww shit!
So then they made HL2 quickly and then Cs:S quickly. Then there like, ok now we gotta test it...
So they start a in-house test and they relized that the Cs:S's CT's models were Barneys (although they did have fun being T's and owning the Barneys), so there lime
Aww shit!
then they made 1 Ct Model quickly, and then lowered the T models to 1 for the beta test.
So then there playing dust and one of them says.
Lets play Aztec!

[...]

What an illuminating post.

 

[hunteraz]

Pi Mu Rho thinks he knows all, with his one sentence factual-written-in-stone-from-valve posts.

 

[UKchaos2]

Those who bought a HL2 coupon ATI card might have been 'had' but they got the last laugh by getting to play the CS:S beta.

 

[Cybernoid]

Valve -was- going to release something last year before the code theft: they were sure enough of a release that they partnered with ATI and ATI scheduled a major product launch around 9/20 HL-2 release date. It's also obvious the code-theft was real, conspiracy theories aside (or Valve is clever enough to have rooked both Interpol and the FBI into playing along with the gag), and it's obvious after the Alcatraz ATI product launch that Valve at least had something in the pipe. Furthermore, ATI didn't sue Valve after the 9/20 date was missed, something that assuredly would have happend if ATI discovered Valve was at least a year from a real product launch.

The code theft contributed to the delay, but wasn't the main cause. Valve has stated that HL2 wasn't ready anyway.

 

[FISKER_Q]

The market scheme was to sell more graphics cards, and the HL2 voucher was the enticing lure. Just because Valve and ATI agreed to a partnership and signed the dotted lines on a contract doesnt mean it ends there. ATI provides an amount of graphics cards they feel should be sold as a result of the partnership. Valves way of ensuring that amount to be reached, was to not tell us the game wasn't coming out on September 30th, until the very last last LAST (and I mean LAAST) minute. But by then the cards we're already sold, sitting in the computers of eager HL2 fans.

THe gamers who purchased those cards, simply thought "ok, a minor delay" no big deal right? But here we are almost a year later, down the road and ATI has already released a whole new line of cards. A new line of cards that MORE HL2 fans are going to be buying, because OH MY GOD WHODA THUNK IT, HL2 is supposed to come out this September too YAY!! The trend is blatantly obvious and I find a tad insulting.

Valve will release the game in November, around thanksgiving when the Christmas shopping season is in full swing. Valve makes money. There damn good .THey milked HL1 for as much as they could, and god damn its still selling. NOW, well.... now there making money on HL2 before it has even come out.

It might not end for ATi at the dotted line, but for Valve it sure as hell would.

I could see ATi making a stir, but Valve, that doesn't make sense. Unless it's part of a even greater contract with even more money involved.

But then again that's all speculation.

There is no point for Valve to give ATi an advantage on the graphics market, the money has already been paid. At that point it would be ATi's problem not Valve's problem.

 

[bJARKE]

I bought my new PC for Doom 3 only when it went gold. I ar teh samart.

Except: Doom3 sucks

 

[NeptuneUK]

[SARCASM]Valve was going to release a headcrab tetris game, duh![/SARCASM]

im still certian about this

 

[Guga_x]

What if Valve have let the source slip so that it could be stolen, when they realised they had nothing to release. With ATI contract signed that would be a good way not to break contract. And everyone knows how easy it would be to let code slip to some wancker.
Just another theory...

 

[CR0M]

It might not end for ATi at the dotted line, but for Valve it sure as hell would.

Had to come out of posting retirement to say Razorblade could be on the mark. Fisker, if a contract had been signed with ATI to release HL2 by a certain time, VALVe would have to keep up the pretence of an on-target release or forfeit all moneys due / run the risk of a lawsuit.

Then, to keep from turning the whole thing into a scandal, VALVe could keep it's potential consumer-base on side by making out they are 'da man' by standing by them so loyally and catching those nasty software robbers for them. There's nothing like a little dick sucking flattery to get what you want from people.

Even though a shady deal seems so blatantly obvious the majority of the fanbase still supports them unquestioningly - the perfect crime (?)

 

[Kadayi]

Had to come out of posting retirement to say Razorblade could be on the mark. Fisker, if a contract had been signed with ATI to release HL2 by a certain time, VALVe would have to keep up the pretence of an on-target release or forfeit all moneys due / run the risk of a lawsuit.

Then, to keep from turning the whole thing into a scandal, VALVe could keep it's potential consumer-base on side by making out they are 'da man' by standing by them so loyally and catching those nasty software robbers for them. There's nothing like a little dick sucking flattery to get what you want from people.

Even though a shady deal seems so blatantly obvious the majority of the fanbase still supports them unquestioningly - the perfect crime (?)

LOL, ok a couple of questions:-

1) Why would Valve remotely agree to a date with ATI that they knew they would never ever be ready by? They needed the money (6 million) perhaps? It's a possibility, but I find it hard to believe that valve wazzed their way through their entire cut from the sales of HL and CS. 13 million copies (+) x £30 (-Vivendi and the retailers cut) still equals a lot of cream cakes if you do the math. Also with a sure fire hit unveiled at E3 2003 I doubt if there was a bank in the world unwilling to give gabe and co a generous overdraft facility if they required it, no strings attached.

2) Real people are right now getting ass rammed in prisons all over the globe for the source code theft. How much money would you need to be paid to suffer that for the next 5 years of your life? A lot more than 6 million I'd imagine

 

[smetho]

Well, as we all know a large portion of the game was stolen. This is a disaster for game developers, especially for one of the most anticipated games ever. What would you have done if you where Valve?

Valve (obviously) want to do things right. They have spent the last 5-6 years, and millions of dollars making this game, not to mention their own "feeling" for the game. It`s like a child to them I would imagine. We (or Valve) could also see this as an opertunity to make an even better and more polished game.

So, here is a few steps/decisions I would have made (and I think is logical for Valve to have made) knowing the deadline needed to be pushed back a reasonable amount of time:


-Bugsquashing! (damn them bugs).

-Rewrite netcode (clearly, the online community is meant to be as important (if not more) than HL2 itself in the long run.

-Rewrite Source for a later release, that means optimizing modules for better graphics, sound, physics, performance and other possible parts that could use a polish. Some minor changes, some bigger.

-Going over story/level-design and polish, making minor changes. Nothing big on the storyline itself unless they for some other reason felt they needed to.

-Refining AI.

-Going over textures and models, once again.

-Possibly adding a few new (minor) features for our gaming pleassure.

-Steam, imagine realeasing the game on Steam a year ago. UNSTABLE! They have done a lot of good work in this area.

-.....more bugsquashing

-Converting CS and HL1 to source and possibly realeasing HL1:S around the same time as HL2 instead of some time after.

-The possiblilty of having a "public" CS:S beta test to find and squash even more bugs.

-+++ (I most likely have forgotten something)


I have written quite a few softwareprograms myself, and i know for a fact that there is ALWAYS something more to do! Hopefully their getting close to realease now, but that they don`t rush it. We want a stable game!

I have faith in Valve, and I don`t want a rushed game. Hopefully they have some control internally conserning project and itaration estimates.

PS. (sorry for any bad language in this far to long post)

 

[razorblade kiss]

LOL, ok a couple of questions:-

1) Why would Valve remotely agree to a date with ATI that they knew they would never ever be ready by? They needed the money (6 million) perhaps? It's a possibility, but I find it hard to believe that valve wazzed their way through their entire cut from the sales of HL and CS. 13 million copies (+) x £30 (-Vivendi and the retailers cut) still equals a lot of cream cakes if you do the math. Also with a sure fire hit unveiled at E3 2003 I doubt if there was a bank in the world unwilling to give gabe and co a generous overdraft facility if they required it, no strings attached.

2) Real people are right now getting ass rammed in prisons all over the globe for the source code theft. How much money would you need to be paid to suffer that for the next 5 years of your life? A lot more than 6 million I'd imagine

1)Valve never agreed to any date with ATI man. ATI and Valve worked together to come up with a fake date, to make gamers believe it would come out that day (Sept 30th). Both Valve and ATI knew the game wasn't going to be out. They knew it wouldn't be out for a whole year. Don't you see? That date was (made up) to entice gamers to go out and buy new video cards, and get the game for free! It was a mad rush to buy 9600XT's and 9800XT's. Those cards sold like hot cakes. Valve doesn't only make games, they make money. Christ, Gabe is from MS. One of the most succesful companies ever launched. He knows exactly what hes doing.

2) Your letting your imagination get the best of you.

 

[CR0M]

LOL, ok a couple of questions:-
1) Why would Valve remotely agree to a date with ATI that they knew they would never ever be ready by?

Because they knew they could get around it. Far fetched? maybe. But plausible. More likely though is what has already been mentioned, it was a perfectly legal though underhand revenue gaining collaboration between VALVe and ATI.

2) Real people are right now getting ass rammed in prisons all over the globe for the source code theft. How much money would you need to be paid to suffer that for the next 5 years of your life? A lot more than 6 million I'd imagine

I didn't even hint at the idea of the code thieves being paid off by anyone so I don't know where you got that idea. I suggested that the incident, shatty as it was, was used to VALVe's advantage in gaining support from the community.

 

[Lavrik]

The Truth is.. on 9/30/2003, valve relized they wern't making HL2 but Barney and Friends 2. So then the thought, Aww shit! So then they had to start deleting all the Barney and Friend 2 files and start designing HL2 things and then the source code got leaked! And valves like.. Aww shit!
So then they sat down for 6 months with barney and decided what to do. Then they decided to finish HL2 and redo the netcode. Then they relize that there in 2004 are are like
Aww shit!
So then they start making everything. Then they relize they made it on the HL1 engine! So there like
Aww shit!
Then they started transfering everything to the HL2 engine! Then they relized they accidentally made Barney: Source. So there like
Aww shit!
So then they made HL2 quickly and then Cs:S quickly. Then there like, ok now we gotta test it...
So they start a in-house test and they relized that the Cs:S's CT's models were Barneys (although they did have fun being T's and owning the Barneys), so there lime
Aww shit!
then they made 1 Ct Model quickly, and then lowered the T models to 1 for the beta test.
So then there playing dust and one of them says.
Lets play Aztec!
so they go on aztec but then they relize, its full of rainbow colors and barney textures on everything.
so there like
Aww shit!
So then they decide to only include dust in the beta test.
Then its time for Preloading and they relized they din't have the preloading set up.
So there like
Aww shit!
so they got the preloading up.
And i can only think that gabe just said..
Aww shit!

Im just wondering, how much weed did you smoke to type that? :-P

 

[Cole]

Umm.....
I just got really bored...

 

[matthewryanc]

I think Valve is planning on releasing for the XBOX or for the PS2 around the same time as the PC release. Why?

Because Valve has spent SOOO much time fixing bugs, and trying to get the game 'perfect'. Do you want to know why I own a gaming PC? So I can patch games! Yay, and advantage of the platform! Consoles... not patchable... well maybe on the XBOX, or the PS2 w/hard drive. Anyways, I am not retarded enough to believe that Valve should take their time to release a perfect bug free game. Why?
Because Valve will fail. A bug free game is impolssible. So why not release a great game, with a good engine (good, only because of a few bugs, otherwise would be excellent), and make the general public happy. You will end up with maybe 20% pissed off because of bugs/ game quality, and 80% happy that it came out within the latest promised release date. Or you can wait till november, when Halo2 comes out, along with a load of other games. 50% upset that game came out late but happy with the game, 35% happy, 15% upset because of bugs/game quality. Some people only have a small budget to spend on games. Small buget + Lot of games you want = pirating/not playing -> not much money for valve.
small budget + only one good game available = lots of money to valve.

How does releasing in september make selling in november impossible. They can still launch a marketing campaign then and make alot of sales.

The sooner they release, the sooner they make money, which means the larger marketing campaign that they can push around the holidays. Seems like a win-win to me.


BTW: I would not like to play the beta, but I think we should have the option to play the RC. HL2: RC anyone?

 

[NeptuneUK]

ahahaaha
the Ps2?!?!!? running HL2?? bwahahahaha

sorry...
its just... the ps2 struggled running a high-def HL1.

the specs for the ps2.. kind of... *searches for the right word....* suck...

people who think the ps2 is so much more powerful than the xbox make me laugh. ignorance is bliss i suppose