Some tips on starting your mod & getting help

[The Dark Elf]

Some tips on starting your mod

Originally posted by OCybrManO​

If it is your idea you need to know exactly what you want or you won't be able to express what you want from your recruits. A bunch of people with different styles working on something that is left up to interpretation will not produce a cohesive atmosphere. Productivity will suffer because they will be more likely to do something that isn't the way you want it and will be forced to waste time starting over. You don't need a web site if you already have a good way to recruit people, communicate with team members, and keep everyone posted on updates/changes. I would recommend that you have a web site for your mod because it makes it look more professional, but it is not a requirement.

1. Have a very clear idea (making a detailed design document helps a great deal) of what you want the mod to be (preferrably something that you think will be fun).

2. Find a good concept artist (if you can't draw) or two to make drawings of all aspects of the mod (work closely with him/her during this process) before you start on the actual development. This will allow you to create an overall style that is consistant throughout the mod (which will help later on).

3. Once you have the style you want, find people that can map/model/skin that style very well. Don't just take "anything [you] can get". You need people that do specifically what you want.

4. Try to keep the team close (not necessarily geographically close) and communicating frequently.

5. Make realistic deadlines but use them more as guidelines. Don't say stuff like "I need a finished map in a week or you're fired". People have lives. There will be problems that get in the way of their work.

6. If the team starts to get bored tried to make an alpha (or something) to show them what has been accomplished, where the mod is going, what still needs to be done, and that the idea is fun.

That brings me to another important point. If you think the mod might be fun to you but you're not confident that other people will like it or you just plain hate the idea... you have two choices (other than just giving up on modding completely): Finish the mod for experience and hope that other people have similar tastes... or scrap it and start on something you think will be fun for everyone. Though, before making a decision like that it is best to consult the entire team to see what they think about it. You might be the only one having doubts.

 

[PinFX]

The author has no introduction and we have no idea who he is. The only thing contributing to his ethos is the fact that HL2.net made his tips a sticky thread. Is he the former leader of a successful mod? Or just some random guy giving advice? At the same time as a mod leader who has gone through a lot getting his project off the ground, I have to say this advice really wouldn't help at all. These tips make modding sound like some kind of 6-step process when in fact its an ongoing effort to balance various elements of development while at the same time maintaining a consistency in the team and constructing a system that works for your team (not to mention getting the team together in the first place).

 

[The Dark Elf]

12 people don't agree with you

Aren't you the leader of a mod where people are quitting because of your behavior? hmm, makes ya wonder don't it

 

[Shinobi]

to supplement the first tip,,, head over to www.gamedev.net,, they have a great section with articles from famous game desigers on how to create design docs

 

[PinFX]

Fenric, I'm sure your reply held good intent and came off the wrong way, since a great moderator such as yourself in a great community such as this would want to show respect to those trying to contribute by speaking from their own experience.

To clear things up: The "people" you mention are in fact, one individual, by the name of Ichi. I'm sure everyone here recognizes his name.

Our team at the moment is actually quite productive and moving forward at a great speed. Talent is of course important in a member, but the most important thing to look for when recruiting members is an ability to work cooperatively and efficiently with your team.

 

[The Dark Elf]

So you don't actually have anything useful to contribute then?

 

[PinFX]

First of all, I've already agreed to contribute to .dev
Secondly, I get your point, I'll trash his advice in a proper manner.

1. Have a very clear idea (making a detailed design document helps a great deal) of what you want the mod to be (preferrably something that you think will be fun).

_Preferrably_ something that you think will be fun? Come on... Also, as an amateur game designer you probably have no idea how to make a real design doc, I know that I had to redesign my design doc about 5 times before it got to the level of detail and readability it needed to be at. Also, unless you are a very VERY hardcore gamer, you probably don't pay attention to a lot of the minor details that make the difference between a good game and a bad game. (for instance focus on death, minor tweaks in aiming accuracy or running speeds) A lot of people think "oh, a game with all these cool guns and all these cool vehicles will be awesome", but unless you put it together properly (which might actually be easier to do with source), you'll end up with a chaotic deathmatch game (Neoshock UT). If you seriously want to learn about game design, do some reading online, join IGDA, buy "Rules of Play". Otherwise, the only way you could possibly make a design doc thats both appealing as a recruiting device and solid as a conceptual work is TRIAL AND ERROR.

2. Find a good concept artist (if you can't draw) or two to make drawings of all aspects of the mod (work closely with him/her during this process) before you start on the actual development. This will allow you to create an overall style that is consistant throughout the mod (which will help later on).

I have to say the concept artist is important, in terms of visual creativity your concept artist should be more than someone who can make drawings. If you look at most of the mods around (with the exception of incoporated and a few others) the so called "concepts" are just drawings of humans with equipment on. If you are making a mod without a lot of special content (like Neoshock), but more like a realistic shooter, you might want to just use photographs for reference. On the other hand, if you are doing a futuristic, sci-fi or fantasy mod, then the concept artist is extremely important (unless your mod is based off an existing fictional world). I was lucky enough to know a talented and enthusiastic artist in person, but its not practical for everyone to just know someone. You can try the usual HL2.net forums for recruiting (hard a 2D artist unless you already have something going for your mod), or you could try other forums such as www.conceptart.org or www.cgtalk.com

3. Once you have the style you want, find people that can map/model/skin that style very well. Don't just take "anything [you] can get". You need people that do specifically what you want.

I think that if you achieve the style you are going for, then this would defintely be preferable. But the exact people you want don't just grow on trees, you will have to make compromises, as with every aspect of your game in the long run (big lesson).

4. Try to keep the team close (not necessarily geographically close) and communicating frequently.

Good advice, on many different levels, and should be elaborated on more. Your team should feel like a team, they should be talking with each other and not just you. Communication is key to the success of your project, and this comes from pretty much any reference you could find for advice on working with an international team. Good communication is a requisite for the project leader (you) as well. If you have a lot of ideas in your head and haven't put them all in writing, you really should do so. I know that I personally had a lot of problems with this, but once you put your ideas forth in a professional and organized manner, the team can see your vision more clearly and can really become excited and inspired by them.

5. Make realistic deadlines but use them more as guidelines. Don't say stuff like "I need a finished map in a week or you're fired". People have lives. There will be problems that get in the way of their work.

This is a huge issue, and also a decision you need to make. Are you serious about this? Is this a fun happy project on the side or are you really trying to get some experience in terms of game development. Everyone, including you, is putting their own time in voluntarily, and just because one member "has a life", that doesn't mean he can compromise all the work put in by the entire team just because he would rather go out and drink every night than put in SOME work in to the project. There is a project to do, whether you get paid for it or not does not change that fact. I have made it abundantly clear to the members of my team that this is not "something on the side", that it is in fact a real project with real expectations. Your mod will not be successfull unless you and every member of your team is dedicated and trying very hard (this comes from me, a full time student who works two jobs).

6. If the team starts to get bored tried to make an alpha (or something) to show them what has been accomplished, where the mod is going, what still needs to be done, and that the idea is fun.

I don't know what he means by "if the team starts to get bored", because they should always have things to do, and should always be inspired by the work of other members. You'd think that you'd start off by making an Alpha anyways, but I guess since you are going to HAVE to do it, it might be a good idea to go ahead with it if your team gets BORED... COME ON! A better solution would be to make it clear to your team your goals for the project as a whole and the timeline you believe it will run on. I don't know about boredom, but if your team is lazy, and nothing gets done for a while, then noone will do anything. You have to push your team in order to make progress, and show them that you are willing to work hard as well by putting in triple the amount of time than they do.

That brings me to another important point. If you think the mod might be fun to you but you're not confident that other people will like it or you just plain hate the idea... you have two choices (other than just giving up on modding completely): Finish the mod for experience and hope that other people have similar tastes... or scrap it and start on something you think will be fun for everyone. Though, before making a decision like that it is best to consult the entire team to see what they think about it. You might be the only one having doubts.

This is not only bad advice for mod development, its bad advice for life. If you are going to do something, do your damn best. Even if not everyone likes the style of your game, you can at least make it a damn good game for those who do like it. If you are already in development, then you are thinking about these issues at the wrong time.

 

[OCybrManO]

I have never been an official member of a mod team because I like to work by myself for my own experience... if someone likes some of my work they can have it, but I don't want to be on a team right now. That doesn't mean I know nothing about making a mod. I have been in close contact with dozens of mod teams (not including HL2 mods, yet) and a few professional game developers. I've seen where a lot of them go wrong. I've learned from other people's mistakes.

Now, about your complaints.

On the deadline issue:
This is a mod we are talking about. No one is getting paid for their work. They are doing the work in their spare time... for experience. No one likes getting bossed around even at their real jobs so going the Nazi route with your mod team is not the best idea if you plan on keeping your team members. There should be some semblance of order and discipline, but a mod team should be more laid back than a professional game developer simply because there is no profit. If they aren't depending on you for their pay check they can leave at any time. You need to work with your team to find the perfect balance between order and casualness for your team, because not all people respond well to the same kind of work environment.

On concept art:
Yes, not every mod needs a talented concept artist. I was directing the statement to mods that are a little more original than having everything based 100% on real life. If there are no pictures of what you want the models to look like and the team leader is not the same person that is doing all of the work it is a good idea to have someone that can help you put your ideas on paper before you waste your modelers time on a 5000-7000 triangle player model.

On styles:
What I meant by that statement is that you don't want to hire someone that specializes in realism if you are making an anime-themed mod or vice versa. You don't want to hire someone specializing in car models if you don't need car models. You need to have people that can do what you want to do. There is no question about that. I'm not saying you have to get people that work as professional modelers in the field you are looking for but their portfolio should show what they are best at.

On internal alphas:
By the team getting "bored" I meant that the team is starting to get despondent and they don't feel motivated anymore... not for lack of work to do, but just because they are no longer interested by the mod. It's hard to keep people interested if you have nothing coherent to show for all of your work. If they don't feel like their work is worth the effort they are going to quit. Why? You aren't paying them, so if they aren't interested they no longer have any reason to stay with the mod. The only real way to get their attention back is to try to show them that they have made a lot of progress and that the mod will be fun. If the work is far enough along the easiest way to do that is to tell them that if they still aren't interested after you put together a playable version of the game they can leave if they want to. Internal alphas serve mutliple purposes. They are used primarily to test the code and look for errors in the models, maps, etc... but they also help to motivate the team. If you have been doing them all along and team members still become disinterested there isn't much you can do about it (assuming that everyone has been doing their work).

On quitting:
By my last point, I was referring to a mod team that gets half-way through the development and realizes that the idea sucks. If you reach that point you can complete it for the experience and because you think that quitting is bad (which is a stupid idea... knowing when to quit is very important)... or you can think of a better idea and start working on it instead of wasting your time on something you hate. There is a reason why companies get 80% finished with a game and cancel it. They were wasting their resources that could be spent on a more promising game.

 

[PinFX]

PENDRAGON: I wrote an article for Majestic already, and when .dev opens I'll be writing a column which should be published weekly. Agree with your points.

CYBERMAN: You see, this is better. You are backing up your assertions with rationality, so now if people want to know what you "meant" they can simply scroll down and see. I'm not being the antagonist on purpose here either, I just happen to disagree.

And unfortunately, I feel you are still missing the major point i'm trying to make about mod development.

There are two kinds of mods: mods that are played and mods that aren't.

If you are doing your mod "just for fun" and are doing it in a "laid back manner", you are wasting your time (for instance deciding your idea sucks half way through? that should never happen). Go get a job instead because 90% of the time your mod will never produce a playable version. Cyberman, probably the only thing in your advice that I actually disagree with is how you automatically assume that since its volunteer work then all the expectations have to be lowered. I think that because you aren't getting paid to do it you should try even harder. Do you think the guys on Counter-Strike, Day of Defeat or The Specialists were created by teams with low expectations because noone was paid? No, and if its possible for you to make a counter-strike or DoD, why aim to make a Vampire Slayers or PVK instead?

Members will get "bored" because you are aiming to make a second rate mod which will be released long after HL2, because although there is "some semblance of order", mod development is still game development, and its not something that can be accomplished "on the side" in a working environment that is laid back. Everything you say about design docs, communication and style is valid. It is important to have a solid idea which involves a fun end result. However, it all means absolutely nothing unless the project leader and each member understand that you do not arrive at the result you want without substantial commitment and work.

As someone who has never actually been on or wanted to be on a mod team, I can see why you would miss this. The details you discuss are important, but the key to the success of your mod is not in the details, its in the commitment of you and your team. I know for a fact that if the Neoshock team did not have high expectations of each other and of the project as a whole, we would have NEVER reached the point we are at now.

Your tips are good advice, but I don't think they are what the amateur modder needs to know about. Almost noone goes in to a mod development aiming to achieve a total community of under 1000 players. Everyone has big plans, and I think its important for starters to know that if you really want your plans to become a reality, then you have to act accordingly.

 

[OCybrManO]

... and I feel you are missing my point. I may not work on a mod team but I know what employment is like... and they rely on the same principles.

I never said you shouldn't put anything less than your best efforts into the mod or that you should expect less quality from your team mates. Commitment and quality work doesn't necesarrily come from an extremely organized team. Though, it can help... depending on the type of people on the team (which is why I said you have to find the perfect balance for your team). Some people thrive on order... others thrive on freedom. With mods you also have to account for the team members getting swamped with stuff from school and/or work... so there has to be a little more leeway than if the same group of people were a professional team.

The successful companies are the ones that have an appropriate working environment for their employees... they are places where people want to work. Take Microsoft as an example. They were just a bunch of talented young software developers that got together and became one of the most influential companies in the world. How did they start? They were very casual (as most young programmers I know are), yet they were all committed to their work because they liked their jobs.

If you go into a mod expecting to be the next Counter-Strike you aren't making a mod for the right reasons. The people that made the mods that turned out to be hugely popular did not go into the project expecting to be grabbed up by Valve and make a lot of money. The most popular mods came from groups of people with similar interests working on a project because they thought it would be a fun game. You don't have to have a slave driver whipping people into shape if they feel like their work is going toward something that people (including themselves) will enjoy.

You can produce good results in a bad work environment... but it is not as likely. When people hate their job they don't work as hard unless they are getting a lot out of it (usually in the form of money). The easiest way to get people to work hard is to let them do something that they enjoy. Self-motivation works better than trying to motivate them by punishing them unless they work hard for no reason (at least, in their eyes there is no reason if they don't think the mod will be fun).

Besides, if you don't make a mod "for fun" then what are you making it for? Experience?