Stalin-era references?

TheSomeone

TheSomeone

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Obviously City 17 is in Russia (russian propaganda poster, etc...) but since I we just studied Stalin again in school I noticed a lot of this stuff reminds me of his fascist reign over communist russia. Gestapo police, questionings, teaching people that breen is a great leader, etc...

Comments?
 
TheSomeone said:
Obviously City 17 is in Russia (russian propaganda poster, etc...) but since I we just studied Stalin again in school I noticed a lot of this stuff reminds me of his fascist reign over communist russia. Gestapo police, questionings, teaching people that breen is a great leader, etc...

Comments?
Click to expand...

it only reminds me of Pyeongyang...
 
It's not necessarily Russia, it's just got Cyrillic letters. And it's not reminiscent of Stalin in particular, but rather any oppressive, facist government.
 
HL2 is similar to 1984 in some aspects. Orwell wasnt fond of Stalin, so you've got books like Animal Farm, 1984, etc... drawing pictures of what these societies were really and what they could become.
 
"his fascist reign over communist russia."

That might me the most oxymoronic thing I've ever heard :p

You do realize that fascism and communism are diametrically opposed ideologies right? :p

Just yankin' ya chain!
 
Ennui said:
It's not necessarily Russia, it's just got Cyrillic letters. And it's not reminiscent of Stalin in particular, but rather any oppressive, facist government.
Click to expand...

cyrillic letters and why then there is some things like gas station and hotel and they all are in russia and those houses ecxist really.
sorry my english is bad
 
Stalin, communist russia and Gestapo? Liiiiittle more research needed there I think...
But yes, it is slightly like Stalin's russia, Hitler's Germany, Big Brother's Oceania and many other regimes. Also, regarding the location of City 17, there are swedish signs, polish signs, Baltic Café, english signs and various other indicators pointing to eastern Europe but not to any specific country.
 
Half-Life's atmosphere is based on 1984 which was a spoof on Stalin's USSR. So you're right to some extent.
 
City-17 was designed around Eastern Europe, war torn and crippled. The regime is a very facist goverment, towards the Combine. Communism and Facism are at completely different ends of the political spectrum.
 
I think it would be better to say very overbearing Communism, than facist communism.

Facism involves the government having absolute power over everything, however there is still free enterprise to an extent.

Communism involves absolute power in the hands of the government as well, however there is no free enterprise, and also they try to bridge the gap between rich and poor.

Facism is doomed to fail because no one likes overlords.
Communism is almost always doomed to fail because it is based on idealogical concepts rather than human behavior. china seems to be the exeption, but it barely qualifies as communism anymore. Just a bunch of asshole beaurocrats running everything.
 
I'm fairly sure that Half-Life 2 is not actually set in any country - I believe they just wanted that facist Eastern Europe feel, and Cyrillic letters certainly evoke memories of Russian oppression.

Because if you'll recall, a lot of it resembled Belgium, I think it was, there were some threads about that a while back and it seems plausible.
 
Whichever country it is set in probably no longer exists.
Stupid Combine.
But seriously, the references could be to most any oppressive regime ever.
 
Flyingdebris said:
I think it would be better to say very overbearing Communism, than facist communism.
Click to expand...

Stalin was a fascist dictator, end of story.
 
you can have a facist dictator, you cannot have facist communism. Facism and communism are at different ends of the spectrum, they just share the fact that they are oppressive
 
Facism and communism are at different ends of the spectrum but its same evil !
 
Actually when you think about it fascism and communism actually come fulll circle in that in one sense they are poles apart but on the other hand they are so similiar that those 2 poles meet.
I challenge anyone to point out any viable differences between the 2 other than their internal market system
 
well i'm from Bulgaria ( an ex-communist country) and there in most towns there are the same buildings. Also interesting fact is that the registration of the cars is the same as in bulgaria. I mean the first two letters are CO which is the registration code for our capital region. And the other interesting thing i found is that the train station looks exactly as the one in the second big town in Bulgaria.
Unfortunatly the only thing that proves it is not bulgaria is the church. It is exactly russian ortodox style, not the bulgarian ortodox style church.
That is all i can say about that
 
The only widely accepted (though still somewhat debated) definition of Facism is palin-genetic ultra-nationalism. Essentially a party that advocates the re-birth of a nation through ultra-nationalism. This is why Mussolinies (can't spell, lol) and Hitlers Germany are the only two 'true facist' states in history. Other goverments/regimes have facist elements to them but it is the advocation of the re-birth of the nation that is intrinsically linked with a true facist party.
 
Fascism is the state above all else. An extreme patriotism. In Germany it was "the fatherland" that had the most rights and the person's rights were subservient. Also economically Fascism allies with big businesses. In Germany in the late '30's and '40's all labor unions were abolished and you lost the right to not work or to change jobs. The company owned the worker. The state owned the citizen.

In Communism the individual has all the rights. Economically Communism allies with the worker. The worker owns the company. The citizen owns the state. There is no higher right than that of the person.

So you can see there is no such thing as a Communist Fascist. It's impossible. What you are referring to is a dictatorship-like environment with heavy state oppression. This you can have in all government types. Fascism and Communism are extreme econo-political forms which often employed extreme tactics. That is where the similarity lies.

However you can have all sorts of state oppression and it doesn't take Fascism, Communism or Fundamentalism to make an oppressive state. All oppression has in common is oppressing.
 
I feel that the main differences between STALIN's Communist Russia and Hitler's Nazi Germany were economical, they both were brutal oppressive states with a lot of activity from the Gestapo and the NKVD(KGB predecessors). However Lenin's Russia was as i see it different from Stalin's, imo Lenin followed Marx more closely then Stalin ever did.

Back on topic HL-2 is set in an Eastern European State imo, we have no solid evidence about any specific country
 
Evo said:
Back on topic HL-2 is set in an Eastern European State imo, we have no solid evidence about any specific country
Click to expand...

Indeed, but there is another thing. There are already two points:
1. Russian orthodox church (and then I mean real Russian style)
2. The Bulgarian license plates.

Number three is this: In the game you'll have to go to New Little Odessa and if I recall my topography lessons, the city of Odessa is in the Ukraine. So there are 3 different countries, but in the game everything can be changed, I mean, Americans in a Eastern Europe environment...it's not the same as now.
 
Yeah so it could be any one of those countires you mentioned or even some others
 
Evo said:
Yeah so it could be any one of those countires you mentioned or even some others
Click to expand...

No, I don't think you understand. Not all countries use cyrilic letters and russian architecture. Of course it could be any country, but my point is that by choosing russia as its location, they are making a reference to one of the most famous and most recent example of totalitarian rule.

If you're going to say that it ISN'T a reference to stalin era, please provide COUNTER-SUPPORT and ARGUMENTS.
 
Okay, i think i misread you there sorry mate.

I'm not saying it is/isn't a reference to the Stalin era, imo it most probably is based on the Stalin era or a post-Stalin Communist Russian leader, it may not be based in Russia but very highly likely an ex-Eastern-bloc country
 
I think its just a referance to any famouse Totalitarian leader. The combine would have scrapped all borders and cultural boundries, right? So whether it be Eastern-Bloc, Western province, it wouldn't matter, because now that the Combine rule the Earth, they rule in the manner that all Totalitarians follow. Stalinism isn't a different kind of Totalitarianism, hes just famous because he created a big power doing it, but then, so did Hitler.
 
I don't think that it's a reference, but rather just the fact that the combine are very cruel, and end up seeming like countless earthly government bodies in the past.

About the location of City 17, one would think that it would be Moscow, or something, since all of the citadels were made in large cities, and when you think of big cities, and Russia, that's what it'd be. However, it probably doesn't reference a real city or country at all. Although Odessa is on the coast (I believe), such as in the game (if I remember correctly), the distance between it and whatever large city is too far anyway.

Personally, I think that you can find parralels between cities and people, and HL2 cities and people, but if the game was designed on a general principle rather than actual locations, it's impossible to pinpoint exactly.
 
Ok firstly the opposite of communism is capitalism. Fascism is a general term that encompasses autocratic rule as opposed to democratic rule. You can have a fascist capitalist. You can have a democratic communist. Believe me I am a communist. For instance the Communist Party Australia believes strongly in democracy.

Ok, in Half-Life 2. It is interesting that it is set in clearly an eastern European city. Judging from the architecture I would say more Latvia or Lithuania. Not Russia defiantly Baltic roots. I don't think the game is having a stab at Stalin. Certainly at oppressive governments.

PS: I love the telescreens
 
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