Steam will kill pc gaming

[ScRaTcH-A-HoLiC]

The idea itself is rotten.

One thing, and that should about sum it up:
People who stole the game can play it without problems.

People who bought it can't. At least some. And some is too much.

- Gil

thats not rue because there are alot of people claiming there stuck and most of the time its because they have the hacked version.

 

[^Ben]

Without problems you say? That's blatant BS.

If you actually read up behind the concepts of steam and what it can do for the games industry...... Ah theres no point arguing, it happens every major steam release.

Lots of new people who have a problem with steam come and flame.
Steam improves.
They leave.

 

[Gilthanaz]

Yes... Of course... steam improves, your chains tighten, i guess.

Do you get paid by them for the crap you are spilling?

Whatever, iam out of here. This is a joke; its actually a blamage. It is a pain to only read that someone even thinks about to support a monopoly platform like this; or even the idea. There is no sense in wasting any thoughts on people who are narrow minded.

Have a nice life, with your ... steam.

I will avoid it on all costs, and i sure am not alone. Those who are smart get the idea.

- Gil

 

[^Ben]

Yah bye, bye,

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Obviously, people who disagree with you are wrong. I mean, you said so, so it must be true.

What was that expression you just used? "Narrow-minded"....ah, yes.

...

 

[dragonflyr]

hey ben....

steam sucks, okay.

i had to haul in my gaming machine to work so i could get MY PAID game authenticated and running. I CANNOT get broadband and I refuse to spend HOURS trying via dialup.

it works now.

but steam still sucks.

simply, as a PAYING consumer I/we should not have to jump thru all these STEAMing hoops. It is a strangle hold. it sucks, whether it works or not.

so ben ... what's yer deal??

 

[dogboy73]

I got to thinking earlier about how many sales Valve have probably lost due to HL2's need for an internet connection. Coupled with the stories of the game running like s**t that are popping up on just about every HL2 related site, or other PC gaming site, that could put off potential buyers. I don't think it's inconceivable to speculate that the number of sales lost is probably as high as (if not more) than those normally associated with piracy. I mean, Is game piracy really such a big problem? I don't think so. The gaming industry is worth more than the Hollywood movie industry these days so somebody is doing all right out of it.

 

[^Ben]

Whats my deal?

I have a freind who has AOL dialup he connected to steam, it authenticated he now keeps steam in offline mode.

Thats his deal.

My deal is broadband, and an understanding where a system like steam could take us.

 

[Gilthanaz]

Oh my.

As i said, ... narrow-minded. Steam is not a step to the future, it is a step back. To stoneage.

 

[^Ben]

I thought you where leaving?

Begone Troll.

 

[Gilthanaz]

still trying to get HL2 working - which of course does not work, because Steam sucks so much.

 

[kensan]

and yet it runs fine on my XP2800, 768Mb, Radeon 9700 Pro system.

It's nothing to do with system specs

So saying it's frustratingly slow loading and poorly running* is purely subjective - it obviously isn't that way for everyone. Whatever the issue actually is, Valve are looking at it and working on a fix. If nothing else, they have a damn good reputation for supporting their products.

*poorly configurable is pretty accurate. I'd like to be able to install the individual games in different locations

I was posting my specs to show that I have an adequate computer to run the game. More my point is that you can buy my exact computer configuration from sony, or even more accessibly from best buy. And I would have thought a standard testing procedure on valve's part would be to grab a couple computers from dell, sony, hp, whoever and just see if the game runs adequately, sans stuttering for example. Or even the 5.1 sound not working, despite their configuration detection selecting the 5.1 setting. This is what Microsoft does when testing, I know from first hand experience. Which brings me to my next point:

You're right, whether it runs adequately is subjective. On your computer, and I know this is another subjective question, does hl2 run about on par with doom3 as far as load times of the game, startup of the game, etc.? For me, doom3 boots up just fine, and the load time between levels is alright. I reckon, if hl2 was within a few percentage points of doom3, I would have no problem with it. (For reference between level loads in hl2 I once took a piss and through out the garbage, and returned just in time for the level loading completion. And I wasn't rushing or running either. I would not bother to do this in doom3.) I know they are separate beasts, but it could give them something to shoot for as far as performance. Doom3 is silky smooth, and I have zero bitchings concerning it.

I hope you're right about how well they support their product. However imho I don't appreciate the fact that they released this product in the current state it is in. imho it should not have been released as it currently stands.

 

[PHATXUIQ]

Whats up with everyone with steam!!!! My friend had problem playing with his game with steam because he had pirated cd key. Everyone who bought authentic game with real cd key, had no problem with steam.

If you had problems and still having this same problems, plz don't come here flaming about it. Find out exactly what it is, and go to support. Most out most likey you will always fix the problem.

 

[PHATXUIQ]

If you can't find the problem in support you are looking for, then plz state exactly what are the problems. Plz stop saying half ass remarks that don't help you and others with problem(s).

 

[dragonflyr]

phat ...

that is the point of this particular thread ... to vent our frustration with steam.

There are PLENTY of people who have troubletickets in with valve/steam and are getting ZERO replies.

but .. whatever the end result is ... the fact that a game is
1-released in this buggy state , and
2-forces us to use steam, and
3-after we PAID for it and STILL have to unlock via huge downloads...

is a bunch of bull. It's just not treating your well PAYING customers very nicely.

sorry.. but it just ain't right.

I finally got my game working. we'll see if it is buggy when i get into it.

but .. in the end ... the fact is that a LOT of people hate steam and are just pissed off about it. thats what this thread was/is about.

 

[Gilthanaz]

@PHATXUIQ : Get a brain.

@the rest:
Steam still sucks. I got it to at least start up, and iam able to start a new game (or chapter in a new game), but trying to get to the "load games" screen leads to a total crash to desktop..

Come on. This is a joke, right? I didn't pay for this, eh? Someone pinch me (not too hard!) and make me wake up. I so much thought valve was a cool company. Well, they lost 100 of 100 possible points.

- Fsck this

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

and when you learn the difference between a problem that affects you, and a problem that affects everyone, then maybe some kind of reasoned discussion can be had.

I guarantee that if you didn't have this problem but other people did, you wouldn't actually give a shit.

 

[CR0M]

and when you learn the difference between a problem that affects you, and a problem that affects everyone, then maybe some kind of reasoned discussion can be had.
I guarantee that if you didn't have this problem but other people did, you wouldn't actually give a shit.

A bit like you then.

*sigh*
Again, failure to address a single point. Begone, troll.

I thought you where leaving?
Begone Troll.

In fact it's becoming apparent that it's you two who are the trolls in this thread. Not under the bridge, but blocking it with baseball bats and flick knives to anyone who wishes to cross your path.
Pi Mu Rho, you are moderator, as such supposedly responsible, and yet appear again and again to be the one deliberately fuelling the fire instead of accepting that people have a problem with Steam, not just in this thread but also here. In fact, anywhere that posters express the slightest grievance about Steam, chances are you are there with the riot gear on. Fancy that.

^Ben, you are just a yappy little lapdog humping the leg of a moderator as he stamps on people, because that's all that can give you a boner.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Really?

You obviously haven't been reading my posts then. I'm well aware that there are problems with Steam, and have never denied it.

What I do deny, and what you have so far failed to provide any evidence of, is a widespread and fundamental flaw with Steam itself.

Your "proof" that Steam is broken consists of the fact that you've seen people posting about problems with it. Any point I've made that shows this to be an utterly unbalanced viewpoint has gone completely unrebutted by you. In fact, every time I show your argument for the house of cards that it is, you tend to resort to infantile and stupid remarks.

People have issues with Steam. I don't have, and never have had a problem with that. However, these people are in the minority - a fact that you refuse to even see, let alone accept.

This is a support forum - not an anti-Steam/anti-Valve forum. Use it as such. I tolerate the existence of this thread because, for the most part, it it contains well-reasoned and though-out arguments. There's always a few trolls (yourself and Gilthanaz spring to mind) that seem to think they have the One True Opinion that manifests itself as fact in their universe and refuse to even admit that there is an opposing viewpoint.

 

[CR0M]

What I do deny, and what you have so far failed to provide any evidence of, is a widespread and fundamental flaw with Steam itself.

Your "proof" that Steam is broken consists of the fact that you've seen people posting about problems with it. Any point I've made that shows this to be an utterly unbalanced viewpoint has gone completely unrebutted by you. In fact, every time I show your argument for the house of cards that it is, you tend to resort to infantile and stupid remarks.

There you go again with that tunnel visioned obsession with providing evidence that Steam is broken.

Show me where I have said it is broken. Show me where I have said it is fundamentally flawed in it's programming.

Try READING posts instead of making constant assumptions and then demanding answers to questions you have conjured out of thin air. To quote Sharpfish, stop playing one-upmanship and concentrate on the issue at hand - that issue being MY grievance that you saw fit to denounce straight away, which is STEAM IS UNFAIR, UNNECESSARY, and a GENUINE PROBLEM to a lot of people, whether it's to a minority or not is irrelevant, as that is something you or I can neither prove nor disprove without facts and figures. Is that clear enough to you now or do I have to draw pictures?
If you want to continue being a smug, self important bigot, please carry on - I won't get in your way.

 

[^Ben]

Pi, wheres my bone?

Actually CROM i have been trouble shooting alot of peoples problems i've only been "flaming back" when people come in here and are like "OMG WTFVALVESUZ""""STEAMSUXX"!!!" You see the vast majority of my posts here are actually helpfull.

 

[CR0M]

well there's a good boy. *pat*

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

There you go again with that tunnel visioned obsession with providing evidence that Steam is broken.

Show me where I have said it is broken. Show me where I have said it is fundamentally flawed in it's programming.

Try READING posts instead of making constant assumptions and then demanding answers to questions you have conjured out of thin air. To quote Sharpfish, stop playing one-upmanship and concentrate on the issue at hand - that issue being MY grievance that you saw fit to denounce straight away, which is STEAM IS UNFAIR, UNNECESSARY, and a GENUINE PROBLEM to a lot of people, whether it's to a minority or not is irrelevant, as that is something you or I can neither prove nor disprove without facts and figures. Is that clear enough to you now or do I have to draw pictures?
If you want to continue being a smug, self important bigot, please carry on - I won't get in your way.

I wish you'd make your mind up. How about you accepting the fact that Steam is not unfair, unnecessary or a genuine problem to lots of people?
It is relevant that it's to a minority. That's the whole damn point - it's not possible to:
a) please everyone
b) create software that works for everyone flawlessly

so the fact that Steam works for the majority of users and that they have no issues with it as a concept strongly suggests that Valve are on the right track.
Are they supposed to just ditch Steam because a vocal minority think it's unfair and unnecessary? Hardly.

As for the rest - I don't do one-upmanship. I do, however, believe in discussion and reasoned argument. If you can't keep your end of the conversation up, that's hardly my fault.

Oh yes - provide evidence of my bigotry, or withdraw the insult.

 

[HellBoy]

The way I see it, Steam will actually save PC gaming, as it's been proven quite hard to crack (a proper warez-release was released two days ago, most games useally get released a couple of days before it's official release) and, if a game gets sold from stores before it's official release, people still won't be able to play. This will mean more money for the developer, which makes it more attractive to make PC games.

And well, consoles have always been plug'n'play, PC takes a tad more skills to enjoy, but it got so much more to offer than a console.

 

[WickedSick]

How about you accepting the fact that Steam is not unfair, unnecessary or a genuine problem to lots of people?

Well, I'm quite convinced that if you would ask all the people who have acquired HL2 (through Steam or retail), at least 80% disagree with Steam and that for both people with/without problems.
People who accept a system like Steam could well live in a dictatorship. Who knows what Steam collects? Steam controls your habits, when you play, how long you play, what you play .... (naturally it's an assumption, but can you be sure they don't collect data ?????). I really don't trust them and don't want it on my system especially not if I just want to play a game. What if for some reason your account is banned by mistake. You think you would get it up again or get them convinced they made a mistake? I think they wouldn't care about a single customer and would treat you like a pirate.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

At least 80%? If you're going to claim figures, then provide some evidence for them.

Look at it this way - we have over 24000 active members on these forums. It's pretty safe to say that the overwhelming majority of them will have Steam. Now, what's the total amount of those users that have posted in this forum about how much they disagree with Steam? A hundred? Two hundred? Three (and that's being generous)? That's not 80%.

Steam doesn't control when I play, how long I play or what I play. If you're concerned about them collecting data (which they don't do), then play offline. How do you know MSN isn't collecting data? Or Windows itself? Or any of the other programs you have running in the background. There's a point where paranoia merely becomes a tool for the paranoid.

When Valve have banned accounts by mistake, they have been reinstated.

 

[WickedSick]

Hmm. That's true. Windows is already collecting data (guess I have to live with that, if I want to play games, for working and programming, I'm on a Linux box anyway), so we don't need anymore programs doing so. And where money can be made and important data can be gathered, I don't trust anybody even if you call me paranoia (no problem with that because I know we are not free and under permanent surveillance )

Let's put it the other way around. Imagine you had 2 choices of installation: a) with Steam and automatic patches, install, authenticate over Steam ... or b) without Steam and you can manually patch/upgrade, chose your installation folder, manually, authenticate via game ....

What would you have chosen, honestly?

Why not put a poll on halflife2.net and ask visitors if they agree with Steam or not? But the result might be too scary....
I can tell you, that all of my colleagues (work) and friends disagree with Steam and say it's BS (about 10 I know who have purchased HL2 and they don't come to forums complaining. Also, there are a lot of users who don't come to forums but ask friends for help. Also not everybody gives his opinion in a forum even if he reads something. Often I'm lazy too and tell myself that it's no use if I express my opinion or not. Guess I lost hope in human sense sometimes).

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

I would have chosen the Steam installation.

I won't start a poll, because they don't work. They're not accurate - people will be signing up multiple accounts to vote multiple times, getting friends to vote etc, and the whole thing would turn into a huge flame-fest.

 

[WickedSick]

Well I understand that in your position you have to spread the word of Jesus :E

 

[CR0M]

Oh yes - provide evidence of my bigotry, or withdraw the insult.

Good grief you really are taking this all far too seriously.
Provide you with actual evidence of a human trait? I don't think that's possible as it's a non substantial entity that can't be recorded in any way, only observed. But I can provide a definition, if you're not sure what it means:

bigot - A person who is religiously attached to a particular computer, language, operating system, editor, or other tool (see religious issues). Usually found with a specifier; thus, "Cray bigot", "ITS bigot", "APL bigot", "VMS bigot", "Berkeley bigot". Real bigots can be distinguished from mere partisans or zealots by the fact that they refuse to learn alternatives even when the march of time and/or technology is threatening to obsolete the favoured tool. It is truly said "You can tell a bigot, but you can't tell him much."

I think that pretty much sums you up with regard to Steam. If observations of human traits count as insults to you, then it's no wonder you are the way you are.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

I find the term "bigot" insulting. You are unable to say anything about "the way I am", because you have precisely zero knowledge about me except what I choose to present via this forum. So let's end the (very) amateur psychology charade, shall we?

What's really funny is that, at the same time you present me as being religiously attached to Steam, you are being the exact opposite - religiously against it. You act as if you're trying to teach me the One True Path and that I refuse to see it. No, I just disagree with you.
I have said, several times, that Steam isn't perfect, that it has problems, that people have problems with it. I have never, ever denied it.
I just support the general idea of Steam. You seem to consider that to be horribly, horribly wrong because you dislike Steam. Therefore, by your own definition, you are an anti-Steam bigot. Any description that you attempt to apply to me, I can equally apply to you coming from the other direction.

So I shall say it again, in the vain hope that you finally understand:

I support Steam. I like the idea of Steam, and I have not personally had any problems with it. I fully acknowledge and accept (as I always have) that Steam is not a perfect system, that some people dislike it, and that some people have problems with it. That doesn't make me wrong.
So, the very fact that I acknowledge Steam's shortcomings breaks your definition of my bigotry.

Next.

 

[Kirock7]

The love in this thread is overwhelming (not).

I for one will never buy anything again from Steam or purchase any software from any invasive system that may be developed and deployed in the future.
I prefer to install, run, and update my programs as I feel fit.
HL2 is personally not worth this awful creepy feeling I get everytime I go online with Steam.

Here's hoping that software conglomerates wise up and discontinue this totalitarian method of distribution in the future.
If they don't... well I guess I'm off to buy an X-Box.

 

[destrukt]

I prefer to install, run, and update my programs as I feel fit.

Exactly. VALVe is trying to have too much control to circumvent warez, which obviously isn't working very well.

 

[Freem3n]

oops wrong topic

 

[CR0M]

I support Steam. I like the idea of Steam, and I have not personally had any problems with it. I fully acknowledge and accept (as I always have) that Steam is not a perfect system, that some people dislike it, and that some people have problems with it. That doesn't make me wrong.
So, the very fact that I acknowledge Steam's shortcomings breaks your definition of my bigotry.

You may understand, but you, and other Steam fans like you, don't actually acknowledge that YOU GIVE A SHIT, is, and has always been, my point in this thread and the difference between us.
We're all right jack, we're the majority, majority rule, we're not listening, stfu troll. THAT attitude makes you a bigot.

You are what you are and I am what I am, live with it.

Next.

"I don't do one-upmanship"
yeah, right.


lol@ freem3n

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

You may understand, but you, and other Steam fans like you, don't actually acknowledge that YOU GIVE A SHIT, is, and has always been, my point in this thread and the difference between us.

Heh, wonderful. In case you were sleeping in class, this whole thing is a discussion about how Steam will kill PC gaming, how much Steam sucks, invades privacy etc. While I acknowledge those points of view, I certainly don't subscribe to them, so how exactly would you like me to look like I "give a shit"?
I am entirely sympathetic to people's technical issues with Steam and I defy you to say otherwise.

We're all right jack, we're the majority, majority rule, we're not listening,
stfu troll. THAT attitude makes you a bigot.

Thanks for making that up. That really....makes you look stupid.
I've said (several times) that Steam users with no problems were in the majority, yes. In no way does that equate to "majority rule", I used it to point out that Steam is not inherently broken or hated. Obviously, I have no control over how you may infer meaning in the world inside your head.

You are what you are and I am what I am, live with it.

I do, and I am very comfortable with what I am. I'm even slightly smug about the fact that you have no idea what that is.

"I don't do one-upmanship"
yeah, right.

You consider that one-upmanship? Um....ok

 

[dragonflyr]

played the game all night ..... but ..

steam still sucks.

I had to bring my gaming PC into work so I could authenticate via a "big pipe". At my home I ONLY have dialup ... AND before you fools go.. "well, get broadband you idiot" ... there is NO broadband available in my area. I made sure I had EVERYTHING going well (offline mode, updates, etc..) before taking my machine home. SO ....

I played the game all night .... awesome game.

BUT STILL .... Steam is bullcrap. I never should have had to deal with all that garbage. I BOUGHT the game, sorry ... i should be able to install it and play. If they wanna make me jump thru a few hoops to authenticate by keys, webpages, email, whatever .. fine. No prob. But PLEASE don't make me still have to download MEG's of data to unlock. That is not right. It is still the MINORITY that have broadband.

And even though there is a workaround ... just the idea that Steam/Valve wants you to login even to play offline is BS! That is not cool.

Games in the future utilizing Steam ... no go here. I will not buy. Steam (and developers looking to utilize Steam) needs to MAJORLY reconsider their methods.

 

[CR0M]

I am entirely sympathetic to people's technical issues with Steam and I defy you to say otherwise.

In response to a poster having 'problems' with Steam:

I guarantee that if you didn't have this problem but other people did, you wouldn't actually give a shit.

Guaranteeing that if the roles were reversed and he had your attitude of not giving a shit could almost be taken as you not... giving... a shit. How rare.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

In response to a poster having 'problems' with Steam:



Guaranteeing that if the roles were reversed and he had your attitude of not giving a shit could almost be taken as you not... giving... a shit. How rare.

There we go with the (very)amateur psychology thing again. Please, explain how me saying that someone else wouldn't give a shit if they had no problems equates to me saying that I don't. I'd love to know, seriously.

 

[CR0M]

By saying that you could guarantee it, denial boy.
Your attitude is in plain view for everyone to see all through this thread, shame the only one who can't acknowledge it is you.