The fallacy of modding for Half-Life 2

[Phallic Thunder]

There are currently 853 Half-Life 2 mods listed under the mod database, pretty much all of which are still in concept/development stage, (10 have been released, and these are very small mods):

http://games.moddb.com/61/

Let's say that each team has an average size of 12 members. That makes about 10,200 people around the world working on HL2 mods.

Now for every game, there's only space for one type of mod. Compare Half-Life, it has only a handful of popular multiplayer mods, each one fitting into one of the types:

- A modern themed shooter (Counter-Strike)
- A WWII themed shooter (Day of Defeat)
- A sci-fi themed shooter (Natural Selection)

So out of the 850 or so HL2 mods being worked on, how many do you think would actually be successful? In my opinion, to predict that even 10 mods becoming as popular as the ones mentioned above is unrealistic.

Fanbases would simply be too stretched out. Not to mention the overlap of ideas - why play a beta version of a WWII shooter when there's already a more fun, more stable, more popular one out there?

Currently it looks like CS:Source will take the spot for modern shooter, and the spot for Sci-fi shooter is rapidly being filled by the likes of Hull Breach...

I was on a mod team before for a sci-fi mod, writing the story. We couldn't decide on anything to do with gameplay concepts, and we were already behind much of the bigger, more talented mod teams with fancy websites and screenshots and models to show off how far ahead they already were. We disbanded, deciding it would be a futile effort to try and compete.

Now if you're modding for the sake of gaining experience and knowledge in programming, mapping, modelling, texturing or whatever, then modding Half-Life 2 is a worthwhile effort. But most modders dream of releasing their mod to the public, and becoming as famous as maybe John Carmack, or Peter Molyneux, or Sid Meier, or those guys who made Counter-Strike.

I like Half-Life 2, and am trying to be optimisitic about what the community can produce (the creators of CS thought no one would play it!) but it seems thousands of people will be disappointed when hundreds of tactical shooters are released, but everyone else is playing CS:Source.

 

[WhiteZero]

Actually, most of those listed on MODdb have a "team base" of 1-3. Maybe 10% of them have an actuall dev team working on it. However, there are quite a few that I see being successful:
Eternal Silence 2
Valadill
Return to Mana
Perfect Dark
Insect Infestation
Sven-Coop 2
Fire War
Warriors of the Apocolypse

 

[Dracarys]

Also, there are MANY more than 3 'slots' available; look on the steam stats page to see how many people are playing the various popular mods.

 

[Phallic Thunder]

Not to mention that many will have to be canned or severely changed because they'd violate copyright... such as Matrix, Warhammer, or other mods based on movies/TV/books/other games.

Sven Co-Op for HL2 will be popular, that's a given, though it's not the type of multiplayer I am referring to... and the Source engine will be able to support RPG-style games, that's another slot.

Ok looking at the Steam stats, there's about 10ish HL mods with more than 100 players on... seeing as I live in New Zealand, only the really popular ones have servers for them here, which means I can't play them down here without super high ping.

 

[MarcoPollo]

dont forget rouge threat

 

[Mr-Fusion]

Phallic we already saw what happened with half-life1. This isn't exactly a new discovery.

Obviously there's loads of mods and less than 1% will actually be successful. Anyway, i have no idea why so many mod teams think they can give us a new/interesting/unique/original experience mod that is tactical-themed! But either way they have a lot of fun making the mods! It isn't all about getting player numbers you know, these aren't massive gaming companies desperate to rake in profits. It's just a few guys having some fun.

It seems like your investing a lot of time thinking about how successful they'll be , just treat it as a little hobby by a several groups of people and if something really good comes from it then great.

 

[WhiteZero]

Actually, I think many more MODs for HL2 will get out compared to HL1, due to HL2's SDK.

 

[SidewinderX]

Well, speaking from a completley objective standpoint ( ), I'm am rather positive that Cold War: Melting Point will at least make it to a final release.

And I think you're right about the mods that dream of being super sucessful. Of course all mod teams would *like* that to happen, but if that's the motivation for the mod teams, then I think they're likley to fail. At CW:MP the premise is making a fun mod that is unique and original to give those who are involved experience in developing in some role or another. That's one reason why we don't have a "PR Guy" or spend alot of time on PR.

Although I think you're wrong about only a handful of mods becoming popular. I'd say a handful for each genre.
1-5 modern shooters
1-5 WW2 shooters
1-5 future shooters
1-5 misc. shooters
1-5 strategy games
1-5 RPGs
etc.


Honestly, to me anyway, your post sounds like you're someone who was on a mod team that was motivated by popularity, and when that fell through you took an overly cynical view of modding because if your mod failed, of course almost everyone else will have to fail.

I'm sure that only 10-20 or so full TCs will make it to a major release of some sort, but why count anyone at at this stage?

anyway, my $.02


(and moved the General Editing)

 

[Kebean PFC]

I am honestly suprised though, at the limit of ideas. I mean, yes, these "new" modern shooters may be fun, but there is alot of open space for ideas left.

If anyone has played the SP/MP game, Descent 1-3 you will know what i am talking about. I wanted to make a mod with Descent theme, not a copy of the game, but a general idea of it. At the time all the coders and modelers were taken up in thier own "tactical FPS" mods, and so my calls for a team went unheard. I think we will see a flood of mods at first, but with the really excellent ones coming later. Kinda like with HL-1

 

[Teddy]

I wanted to make a mod with Descent theme, not a copy of the game, but a general idea of it.

Although not in spaceships, the physics in dystopia's cyberspace are very similar, but with more twisting and turning. It's a hoot

 

[crackhead]

matrix mods an warhammer etc shouldnt be "canned" because of copyright should they? its not like there selling the mod.

 

[Pesmerga]

Well there was a Duke Nukem mod that was shut down for copyright infringement. I don't know much about the legal system, but companies like to wave their lawyer stick around potential 'targets'. Tbh, if Dawn of the Dead sued me for making a zombie mod, I'd tell em to **** off. Although, Warhammer is a very broad concept; just change the names of pretty much everything and tweak the models so they don't look too much exactly like it, you'll have the same thing with a) more originality and b) a position to back up your non-copyright infringement idea.

Creativity is an illusion.

 

[Argyll]

I'm trying to decipher what exactly your point is here...

You state that only one mod can be successful under a certain 'types.' You then only define three. I think you could be a little more specific here and include other different genres (which I assume is what you're using 'type' as):

> Team-Based Action
> Deathmatch
> Horror
> War
> Sci-Fi
> Fantasy
> Strategy
> RPG

Even within these genres, you can have much more specific types. Essentially, having more than one mod within be considered a 'success' (by whomever's standards).

For example, I would classify Counter-Strike under 'Team-Based Action.' Why? Well, I wouldn't exactly call it a 'war' themed game. It also doesn't exactly fit under the other categories either.

Day of Defeat would be considered as a 'War' based mod/game. I would say that Firearms was fairly successful as well and classify it as war (even though there were generic teams). Now, like you said though, you considered DoD to be a 'WWII themed' game, which is absolutely correct.

Within each genre, you can have different kinds of mods. I believe that within those there is really room for one 'major' and 'successful' mod, but there are always exceptions.

When we look at the 'Team-Based Action' genre, we can divide it down even further. Two examples would be:

> Military Oriented
> Movie Style

CS would fall under 'Military Oriented.' I can think of multiple that would fall under 'Movie Style' such as The Specialists, Action Half-Life, and The Opera. The latter three all make it seem that you're fighting within a high-paced Action movie. All three though, weren't entirely popular at the same time. The Specialists would be the most recent popular mod in the genre.

One category that would be very diverse and probably confusing to most is War. This is what I'm most into and so will explain how I see it. Within the category of War, you will see multiple themes and even themes within each. What determines these themes are mainly the era or conflict being simulated along with the weaponry in use. Examples are:

> First World War (WWI)
> Second World War (WWII)
> Cold-War Era (1945 - 1989)
> Vietnam War (1965 - 1975)
> Modern (Post-1970, but not in a traditional Cold War setting)
> Fictional War
> Other

I mentioned before Firearms; I believe that they would fall under the 'Fictional War' theme. There could be more than one successful mod in this category - for example Global Warfare was fairly popular in its day, although it could be classified as 'Modern.'

Another hot debate topic for 'War' based mods/games would be the degree of realism. I think that this would be another factor to be associated to mainly war-based mods. There are different kinds of 'realism' though and I don't think any one can be considered to be 'realistic.' I know, it's confusing, but coming from a soldier and a gamer, I don't like seeing mods associate themselves with false phrasing. War mods/games could be considered one of the three degrees of 'realism': Tactical, Simulation, or Arcade. I can't really think of a better word than Arcade for a non-realistic type game. 'Tactical' would be realism in terms of gameplay (i.e. players operating in a realistic manner and achieving victory over those playing casually). 'Simulation' could be considered for those that are looking for authenticity above other factors. Finally, 'Arcade' are those that take place in war, but do not have a heavy influence on being tactical or a simulation.

I could go on, but you probably get the idea.

If you're too lazy to read all of the above, I'll sum it up here. What I'm saying is that there are several 'genres' for a mod. Within those genres though, are different themes. These themes can even be further classified as being a degree of another influence. For example, in war-based games, degrees of realism (tactical, simulation, arcade).

In association with the first post, I believe that there can be multiple mods successful in each genre, but really only one for each theme. There can ultimately be multiple successes, but come at different times (i.e. The Opera, Action Half-Life, and The Specialists).

There really needs to be a sorted list of Half-Life 2 mods into different genres and further into specific themes and other classifications. Then people can go saying how mods are similar or unique. I would be up to the effort of creating a 'War' genre categorizing.

 

[Ennui]

matrix mods an warhammer etc shouldnt be "canned" because of copyright should they? its not like there selling the mod.

No, Games Workshop gives permission for Warhammer to be in a mod as long as it's total conversion and ONLY warhammer (no headcrabs fighting Eldar).

I know this because I run (or rather ran, its dying from lack of attention) a DoW site and it was essential knowledge. http://dow40k.com

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Lawyers can apply beatdowns on mods that infringe on IP, no matter how you interpret the 'fair use' act and stuff, and no matter how hard you cover your tracks. Lawyer's are good at it. Trust me. They know.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Pesmerga]

Yeah but Angry, I think people over estimate the system. I'm sure if you make a Warhammer mod and give credit + logo (heck, you could even advertise them in the mod) you'd have a good chance at getting away with it. Although getting their permission probably isn't too difficult if you show premise.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

A good chance? The chance of getting Lawyerized increases exponentially with mod popularity.
With popularity on the X axis, and Lawyers on the Y...

|                       _LAWYERIZED!
|                    /
|                __/
|              / 
|        ____/
| ______/
|/_________________________

Just ask for permission. It's better to know at the start, than lose all your work near release.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Solver]

Moddb is depressing. It's a shame to see that nothing good has come out for HL2 yet. I know good mods take time, but where are simple singleplayer maps (except Roboss)? There's nothing to download for HL2 really at the moment. It's also obvious that most mods never make it to release, actually, most mods die at the stage of having an idea and a little bit of material.

 

[ooghijmiqtxxa]

Everyone has an idea and maybe one skill to work with when trying to create a mod. Someone who can model and has an idea for a mod can put things up on Moddb. It's hard to get people together, keep them interested and on the same page as everyone else. Modding has got to a point where it's no longer just something you can do when you're bored. I think all of the succesful mods will come from people who have the interest into getting into their skill field or people who want to be in the industry.