The Marijuana CONPIRACY!

Nemesis6 said:
There are two reasons why I oppose it. #1 - Drugs are dangerous. #2 - They create gangs
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Lets just assume you specifically mean Marijuana when you say light drugs. Id like to hear your explanation as to why marijuana is physically dangerous, then compare that to cigarettes.

As for the gang thing......thats just plain stupid
 
Generally speaking, smoke in your lungs is never going to be a healthy or benign thing. But then neither is a Big Mac in your stomach. So the question is: Why care?
 
There is no evidence that big macs are unhea.....

oh wait...Texas...
 
Well to be fair anything that gives money to the arabs nemesis will oppose.

Nemesis, do you understand why those people get these drugs? I don't know why Im starting another debate with you since all you will do is plug your ears while I end up banging my head against the wall.

The reasons these gangs are formed from drugs is because of one reason and one reason only, that drugs are illegal. You will not end addiction in this country with our current system, these drugs are way too powerful. So as long as there is demand there has to be supply. I was watching the history channel last night and they had that special about cocaine again, the guy on there said it best. As long as you can produce something that costs you $1 to make, and you can easily turn around and sell it for $17,000 no government will be able to stop you.

So if you want to stop these muslims from getting all that money you would have to make these drugs legal. This is something I oppose but I just wanted to point out the flaw in your argument.

One new immigrant came in there to sell pot at a prize that was apparently too low, so he was chased by a mob with baseball bats. They chased him down an open street and beat him to death when they caught up with him HERE:
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Dangerous pot dealers, baseball bats, and aerial satellite photos. Sounds like a great movie but I will bet $100 this never really happened, did it?
 
You really are pathetic, No Limit. You accuse me of plugging my ears, and then you do it yourself. Walking by that man's memorial, you might feel a little different, you ****ing ghoul! Time to rebut: Before the police cleared the open drug dealing, the Rockers had a monopoly on it, and the locals were threatened into silence, so whomever spoke out -- and remember, this went on from the start of the 60s -- well, if you know what Rockers are and what they do, you could imagine, so don't you dare insinuate that turning a blind eye or legalizing it would help, it only allows the criminals to consolidate their power or, if you are indeed right, move on to harder drugs.

Anyway, Tyguy, have you seen how people on it act? You know that in most cases they're just gonna be far out. But one thing people ignore is that it can also have two other effects: 1 - Fry your brain and make you a permanent veggie. 2 - Make you go into a psychosis, and we all know the deal with people who are psychotic; they're dangerous and unreliable.
 
If the story you posted is real I'm dying for a link. For some reason I am sensing that you are misrepresenting it. They put a memorial up for a drug dealer?

Anyway, did you read what I posted? I guess not.

Are you disputing the fact that these drug lords only exist because these drugs are illegal? Remember, your entire argument for why these drugs should be kept illegal is that it helps drug lords. So again, if these drugs were legal there would be no drug lords. Pretty simple, no?
 
Nemesis6 said:
Anyway, Tyguy, have you seen how people on it act? You know that in most cases they're just gonna be far out. But one thing people ignore is that it can also have two other effects: 1 - Fry your brain and make you a permanent veggie. 2 - Make you go into a psychosis, and we all know the deal with people who are psychotic; they're dangerous and unreliable.
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Yes, I smoke pot a few times a week to ease anxiety and help relax. A. It has been scientifically proven not to "fry your brain". It does not kill active brain cells. Also, it does not make you go into psychosis, haha. Learn a little about it from that link I posted.
 
Nemesis6 said:
well, if you know what Rockers are and what they do, you could imagine
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rockers are teh awesome

Twenty four hours to go I wanna be sedated
Nothin' to do and no where to go I wanna be sedated
Just get me to the airport put me on a plane
Hurry hurry hurry before I go insane
I can't control my fingers I can't control my brain
Oh no no no no no

Twenty-twenty-twenty four hours to go....
Just put me in a wheelchair, get me on a plane
Hurry hurry hurry before I go insane
I can't control my fingers I can't control my brain
Oh no no no no no





you are square /me draws imaginary square


Up in smoke
Thats where my money goes
In my lungs
and sometimes up my nose
When troubled times
Begin to bother me
I take a toke
and all my cares
Go up in smoke

Up in smoke
Donde todos es mi rey
There are no signs
Que dice no fumer
So I roll un "bomber"
Y me doy, un buen toke-ay
Y despues I choke
Y todos mis cares
Go up in smoke
Come on let's go get high



oh noes my brain is fried ..vegetative state commencing in 10 ..9 ..8..7 ...6 .....15...21...% ..2?

funny but from your rediculous knee jerkist reactionary posts you make I would think you must be a chronic pot smoker ..cuz from where I'm sitting you sure do sound like your brain is in a vegetative state
 
Nemesis6 said:
Anyway, Tyguy, have you seen how people on it act? You know that in most cases they're just gonna be far out. But one thing people ignore is that it can also have two other effects: 1 - Fry your brain and make you a permanent veggie. 2 - Make you go into a psychosis, and we all know the deal with people who are psychotic; they're dangerous and unreliable.
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You have no idea what you are talking about.
 
Haha, honestly the ignorance of such a statement leads me to believe that you are correct, or that he was heavily influenced by someone who shares the ideals presented in that film.

I'd like to see one case where marijuana has made someone a permanent veggie/go crazy. Such a ridiculous statement has to be backed up.
 
well, there was that time the mentally psychotic patients smoked marijuana.....:)
 
Oh yea, i forgot that weed minutely increases ones chances of getting schizophrenia, my bad on that one.
 
brink's said:
Oh yea, i forgot that weed minutely increases ones chances of getting schizophrenia, my bad on that one.
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It's not even that. The only cases where smoking weed will result in a schizophrenic breakout is with those who are already predisposed to it. It doesn't effect anybody else. And the people predisposed could be triggered by hundreds of things, not just weed.

So really, you can't blame the drug at all.
 
i plan on attempting schizophrenia later today :)
 
ah, sorry to hear that man. Theres always 2 hours from now :p
 
Even if marijuana is bad for you, how exactly is that an argument for banning it?
I really don't get people who think they have some kind of right to dictate how others live their lives.
 
Absolutely.

Also, everything that Nemesis has said in this thread makes me cringe.
 
everything he says makes me cringe ..actually no ..he makes me want to punch kittens
 
Absinthe said:
It's not even that. The only cases where smoking weed will result in a schizophrenic breakout is with those who are already predisposed to it. It doesn't effect anybody else. And the people predisposed could be triggered by hundreds of things, not just weed.

So really, you can't blame the drug at all.
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Has that been proven? I think there is still a debate out there about wether it causes it or just makes it worse.

http://www.schizophrenia.com/sznews/archives/005180.html
 
No Limit said:
Has that been proven? I think there is still a debate out there about wether it causes it or just makes it worse.

http://www.schizophrenia.com/sznews/archives/005180.html
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I dont trust studies like that. THey are always run by people with an agenda, rather than people wanting to find the truth.

Found this:
http://utteroutrage.blogspot.com/2007/05/marijuana-duck-duck-goose-same-old.html

I have no idea how credible it is, but I have done a good amount of research myself and have seen ALOT more credible info suggesting it has nothing to do with schizophrenia.
 
But that link you posted seems to pretty much say "Since we don't know much about the brain don't trust these studies".

If weed causes Schizophrenia so be it. Maybe it does maybe it doesnt. A lot of other legal drugs have medical side effects too. But I don't like how so many people try to claim weed is not harmful to you and they discount legitimate scientific studies that could show negative health/mental effects, in my opinion they are simply in denial. So if you are going to smoke pot then smoke it, just be aware of all the potential harm you are doing to your own body.
 
but thats the thing, there are plenty of credible studies that show the complete opposite...either way.....doesn't change the fact that it should be legal :)
 
Ennui said:
Absolutely.

Also, everything that Nemesis has said in this thread makes me cringe.
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Ennui, every time I see you post in these topics, you set my heart aflutter. <3

No Limit said:
Has that been proven? I think there is still a debate out there about wether it causes it or just makes it worse.

http://www.schizophrenia.com/sznews/archives/005180.html
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I'll be honest in that I do not know its concrete(ness) status, but as far as I do know: I've seen many credible studies that deny marijuana causing it. I've seen few next to none claiming the contrary. If you know a good source contradicting my stance, I'd like to read it. I try to be honest about the dangers of drugs.
 
I say when it comes to drugs for pleasure, Marijuana and other natural drugs that don't have medium to high risks of becoming lethal should be legalized.
 
Absinthe said:
I'll be honest in that I do not know its concrete(ness) status, but as far as I do know: I've seen many credible studies that deny marijuana causing it. I've seen few next to none claiming the contrary. If you know a good source contradicting my stance, I'd like to read it. I try to be honest about the dangers of drugs.
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I have no clue, that's why I was asking you. :cheers:

I'm just not sure it can be completely ruled out. And I have no clue if the link I pointed to is accurate or not, just the first result that came up when I did a search for it.
 
Ok, here's a general question for you guys: Will you be all uppity about pot having to be legal when some guy does freak out and kills or injures people? Stating what you've been told doesn't make you an expert on it, and you have no way of determining whether or not it's safe. And it's pretty naive to believe that making it legal will remove all crime associated with it. Naive and arrogant. Perhaps it would be better if it was legalized, but I'm not stupid enough to turn a blind eye to a drug that is, afterall, dangerous. Another thing you guys ignore is that there are different kinds of it, some containing acid as the actual main ingredient. Wikipedia is a lovely thing:

Side effects include:

* Forgetfulness
* Laziness
* Distorted perception
* Trouble with concentration
* Paranoia
* Increased heart rate
* Dry mouth and throat[53]
* Increased appetite[52]
* Sensory confusion (random bad tastes, smells, sensations)

Now, in your opinions, how should it be made legal? It would be rather impractical to do while driving a car for example, so what's the deal gonna be? Let's check wikipedia again, this time on the health issues:

Although there are many conflicting studies involving health issues and the effects of cannabis, certain physical and mental health effects conclusions have been reached. Today, there is still a substantial amount of propaganda and misinformation from both cannabis advocates and opponents due to the legal issues of cannabis, including legal and political constraints on cannabis research.

Cannabis is currently recognized as a psychologically addictive drug. There is no cannabis withdrawal disorder in the DSM-IV, but studies have demonstrated that cannabis use can induce withdrawal symptoms similar to other drugs with recognized physical dependence. Cannabis withdrawal symptoms are similar in magnitude and time-course to the well-established tobacco withdrawal syndrome.[58]

The most obvious confounding factor in cannabis research is the prevalent usage of other recreational drugs, including alcohol and tobacco.[59] Such complications demonstrate the need for studies on cannabis that have stronger controls, and investigations into the symptoms of cannabis use that may also be caused by tobacco. Most cannabis research within the USA is funded by government agencies who in turn publish position papers citing research studies that spotlight the negative consequences of cannabis use.[60][61] In light of this, some people question whether these agencies make an honest effort to present an accurate, unbiased summary of the evidence, or whether they "cherry-pick" their data, and others caution that the raw data, and not the final conclusions, are what should be examined.[62]

Some studies have purported that cannabis has not been shown to cause emphysema, lung cancer, or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.[63][64][65] However, contrasting studies have linked the smoking of cannabis to lung cancer and the growth of cancerous tumors.[66][67][68][69] A 2002 report by the British Lung Foundation estimated that three to four cannabis cigarettes a day were associated with the same amount of damage to the lungs as 20 or more tobacco cigarettes a day.[70] Other studies have suggested that cannabis use by expectant mothers does not appear to cause birth defects or developmental delays in their newborn children.[71][72] According to a United Kingdom government report, using cannabis is less dangerous than tobacco, prescription drugs, and alcohol in social harms, physical harm and addiction.[73]

Cannabis is known to act on the hippocampus (an area of the brain associated with memory and learning), and impair short term memory and attention for the duration of its effects and in some cases for the next day. In the long term, some studies point to enhancement of particular types of memory.[74] Cannabis was found to be neuroprotective against excitotoxicity and is therefore beneficial for the prevention of progressive degenerative diseases like Alzheimer's disease.[75] A 1998 report commissioned in France by Health Secretary of State Bernard Kouchner and directed by Dr. Pierre-Bernard Roques determined that, "former results suggesting anatomic changes in the brain of chronic cannabis users, measured by tomography, were not confirmed by the accurate modern neuro-imaging techniques," (like MRI). "Moreover, morphological impairment of the hippocampus [which plays a part in memory and navigation] of rat after administration of very high doses of THC (Langfield et al., 1988) was not shown (Slikker et al., 1992)" (translated). He concluded that cannabis does not have any neurotoxicity as defined in the report, unlike alcohol and cocaine.[76][77][78]

Research between the use of cannabis and mental illness has also brought significant results. Cannabis use is generally higher among sufferers of schizophrenia, but the causality between the two has not been established.[79][80] Another study concluded that sustained early-adolescent cannabis use among genetically predisposed individuals has been associated with a variety of mental illness outcomes, ranging from psychotic episodes to clinical schizophrenia.[81][82]
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Now, have any of you seen a person who's really into pot like a person into smokes? It DOES have effects on you, and in time, they will become apparent. Think Cheech & Chong, but imagine a person actually being like that. Living next to this stuff, I might, and I say MIGHT just have a little more experience on with this.

"Open up the door, it's Dave!" - "Who?" - "Dave!" - "...Dave's not here!" Gotta admit, it has generated some funny people, though! Some funny, hackysack-playing people! :D
 
Nemesis6 said:
Ok, here's a general question for you guys: Will you be all uppity about pot having to be legal when some guy does freak out and kill people?
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Sure, why not? If your entire argument against marijuana is that it might, maybe, possibly make somebody crazy (even though you don't know for sure), then I think I'm well off.

Thank you, Captain Morality. But I think most people are aware of the side effects that come with marijuana. You accuse others of arrogance (I'm not sure on what grounds), but then treat us like idiots.
Pot makes me hungry? Seriously?! I HAD NO ****ING IDEA, MAN. Thanks for the wiki list!

Not only that, but then you go right ahead and prop up a straw man. Who in this topic has proposed legalizing smoking pot while driving? Who, Nemesis? I want the ability to smoke in my own privacy, just the same as with alcohol. Can somebody please tell me what is so hard to understand about this? How do people keep coming to the same retard tangents like "BUT SMOKING AND DRIVING IS BAD" over and over and over again?
 
So how should it be legalized? In special areas designed for it? It's way more potent than a cigarette. And if so, how are you gonna enforce it? That'll be hard as hell.

So what's your response to the health issues of it? Are they discardable?
 
Nemesis6 said:
So how should it be legalized? In special areas designed for it? It's way more potent than a cigarette. And if so, how are you gonna enforce it? That'll be hard as hell.

So what's your response to the health issues of it? Are they discardable?
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Can you currently drink a beer while driving a car? Same way.

And the health issues are extremely minor. Marijuana is better for you than alcohol and cigarettes. Since you like Wikipedia so much, search for the amount of alcohol and cigarette related deaths last year alone. Then search ANYWHERE for a single death from pure marijuana.....
 
This is how it is arguing with nemesis. You aren't going to get anywhere in the end.

First it was that drugs create gangs. Blew a hole through that his argument changes to "I'm worried about your health". Blow a hole through that he will go back to the gangs thing as if it was never disputed. And on and on it will go.
 
Nemesis6 said:
So how should it be legalized? In special areas designed for it? It's way more potent than a cigarette. And if so, how are you gonna enforce it? That'll be hard as hell.
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Weed bars? They work perfectly in Holland. Or how about my own house and property? It's not like people will walk their dogs by and suddenly develop the munchies.

How do we enforce responsible use of alcohol? You're asking the most inane questions with the most obvious answers. There's nothing fundamental to marijuana that makes it harder to regulate that any other legal drug.

So what's your response to the health issues of it? Are they discardable?
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Who said they were discardable? I said there's no reason to bring up symptoms everybody knows about. It's like going into a topic about whiskey and saying "Well, did you know that alcohol impairs your judgment? Hmmm?". It assumes that everybody is so horribly clueless as to what they're drinking, and that is arrogant.

The health issues associated with marijuana are valid (barring certain wild allegations). But they are far less severe than those of cigarettes or alcohol. Regardless, if people want to smoke cannabis, then they accept the risks that come with it. I take responsibility for whatever potential negative effects my manifest.

It's not like legalizing cannabis entails forcing smoke brigades and forcing space cakes down the throats of pregnant woman. Stop panicking.
 
I'm pretty sure Nemesis had a bit part in the movie the Poseidon Adventure. He played the part of "Panicky Idiot #2"




obscure simpsons reference ftw
 
Did that offend or bother you in some way? Sorry Brinks, wont happen again.......
 
heh no man he was making a snide remark that the simpsons have slipped in quality over the years (I agree) ..it still doesnt deminish my love for the simpsons though
 
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