The meaning of accountability and why Valve doesn't get it.

spencerjrus

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accountability

n : responsibility to someone or for some activity


I'm not sure what kind of corporate world we live in today where making quality products (debatable when we are talking about HL2) justifies lying to customers. I don't care how many polygons your models have or how realistic your physics engine is, lying to customers is unacceptable, even moreso when it is done repeatedley and without apology or remorse of any kind.

For a game that came out well over a year after the Original release date, (that Gabe conciously lied about several times when he knew September 30th was a joke.) having fatal bugs that make the game unplayable for a large percentage of players is ridiculous.

But it gets worse, not only do they release the game with fatal bugs, they then deny that they are responsible for the problems and blame it on 3rd parties. After they realize that isnt going to work as a long term solution, they do a half-as* job of taking responsibility for the problems, then promise dates for a fix.

Of course no one at Valve cares about ethics, morals, or corporate accountability, not to mention the loyal fan base that has patiently waited over a year longer than they were told they would have to, and still bought the game. Frankly I'm suprised there isnt more outrage.

Before I ramble on for too long, I'd like to do a quick summary of actions taken by Valve regarding HL2, both pro and con.

Pro:

-Delivered the game.

-Excellent graphics/physics and gameplay.

-Counter Strike: Source comes with the game.

Con:

-Over a year late.

-Huge amounts of content that was shown in videos and promised by Valve is missing from the game.

-Much of the AI slated to be in the game is missing, and it turns out the awesome BINK videos Valve made were actually a farce, most of them were scripted and not an accurate representation of what the game reallly is.

-Fatal memory errors, horrible loading times, massive amounts of audio stuttering that makes the game unplayable for many customers.

-Requirement to authenticate the game through Steam, and requirement to use Steam to play the game, even though Steam directly hurts game performance.

-Failure to apologize for any of the massive amount of shortcomings in game content,bugs/errors, release dates, patches, inaccurate documentation, problems with having Steam authenticate the game, etc. etc. etc.


To summarize: Valve, please stop lying to your customers and deliver the game as promised.
 
You'd think the release of the damn game would put an end to this shit, but no..
 
I dont care,Im a customer,I bought the game and yet I dont care now that the game was a year late,or that It doesnt have groundbreaking AI.
The Steam Requirement means that they cant shaft warez users and stop pirates.I see it as a small price to pay.Also if it wasnt for people like you bleting for the game to be out NOW!! Valve may have been able to put in more content.And as for the lies again I dont care,read the Gamespy "Final Hours".

Finally,Try a "Hello there!" for your first post,It generally builds up a sense of good will before you attack the company of the product of which this site is dedicated to.
 
BillyJoBob said:
You showed em! Ya hear that valve!?

:|

sarcasm

Of course you are right, Internet Forums would be a much better place if no one ever expressed opinions of any kind. Please grow up, if I actually thought Valve cared about what their customers think I would have emailed them, this is merely my opinion, as I would like to hear what others have to think.
 
Voodoo_Chile said:
I dont care,Im a customer,I bought the game and yet I dont care now that the game was a year late,or that It doesnt have groundbreaking AI.
The Steam Requirement means that they cant shaft warez users and stop pirates.I see it as a small price to pay.Also if it wasnt for people like you bleting for the game to be out NOW!! Valve may have been able to put in more content.And as for the lies again I dont care,read the Gamespy "Final Hours".

Finally,Try a "Hello there!" for your first post,It generally builds up a sense of good will before you attack the company of the product of which this site is dedicated to.


I did read Gamespy's "Final Hours", I didn't see anything other than Gabe Newell trying to make excuses for why he lied publicly. (i.e. Gabe's position of "Well I did lie, but the game is out now, so you can't blame me.")
 
spencerjrus said:
Of course you are right, Internet Forums would be a much better place if no one ever expressed opinions of any kind. Please grow up, if I actually thought Valve cared about what their customers think I would have emailed them, this is merely my opinion, as I would like to hear what others have to think.

I think I speak for most that the 'others' are thinking: enough of this shit.
 
Is this national cry like a spoiled brat week or something?
 
I forgive them because they're one of the , if not the only developer who is not being raped and driven by a publisher to churn out Half-Life clones every year.

Imaging EA contracted them. We'd be up to Half-Life 19:Kill guys, not unlike Medal Of Honor games. Unoriginality year after year. Money making pointless bullshit year after year. There's a level of creativity in Half-Life 2 that i have not seen in an FPS game in a long long time. Why does Valve receive so much criticism when they AT LEAST TRYING to give players something new and interesting. And the fact is you'll get Half-Life 2 support/patches for a long time to come. Most companies only release a few patches because the publisher won't pay them to make them, if they're not being paid where's the incentive? Community support? I think feeding their families is more important than keeping a virtual community satisfied.

Of course no one at Valve cares about ethics, morals, or corporate accountability, not to mention the loyal fan base that has patiently waited over a year longer than they were told they would have to, and still bought the game. Frankly I'm suprised there isnt more outrage.
The outrage was at it's maximum for about 5 months after September 30th. We're all kind sick of it now. Hey even i used to be a Valve rager.
 
Mr-Fusion said:
The outrage was at it's maximum for about 5 months after September 30th. We're all kind sick of it now. Hey even i used to be a Valve rager.


Except that the game still doesn't work...
 
spencerjrus said:
Of course you are right, Internet Forums would be a much better place if no one ever expressed opinions of any kind. Please grow up, if I actually thought Valve cared about what their customers think I would have emailed them, this is merely my opinion, as I would like to hear what others have to think.

Well I speak for the majority when I say no one on these boards really cares about your opinion.

Take it some where els whiner ass!
 
Hmmm... Actually I think Gabe admitted making a mistake and not dealing with it correctly. Until you have huge companies like VUG and ATi breathing down your neck and a RABID community following your every move I am not sure we can put ourselves in his shoes.

Fact: Games get delayed. It happens quite often.
Fact: Gabe messed up.
Fact: Valve missing a release date to produce a better product was better for gamers.

Personally, I am glad Valve released the game "When it was done" instead of September 30th, 2004. I am tired of developers/publishers pushing half done games out the door and expecting us to buy expansions and sequals to resolve gameplay issues.

As for patches, same applies. They can have a working patch that they plan to release the next day, but if during EXTENSIVE testing they find more issues they MUST delay. If you do not like patches and delays I suggest becoming a Console gamer and only getting yearly franchises like Madden and NBA 2k series like games. Because everyones PC is different and the hardware limitations it is not easy. I am surprised HL2 is as polished as it is personally.
 
spencerjrus said:
i.e. Gabe's position of "Well I did lie, but the game is out now, so you can't blame me."

You obiously didnt read GameSpot's article that well if you think that.

Steam directly hurts game performance
Steam uses ~16 MB of memory and no CPU, that wont hurt your game's performance.

Huge amounts of content that was shown in videos and promised by Valve is missing from the game.
Like what? Other than the hydra.

Failure to apologize for any of the massive amount of shortcomings in game content,bugs/errors, release dates, patches, inaccurate documentation, problems with having Steam authenticate the game, etc. etc. etc.
That'll help fix the problems... how?
They may not nessisarily apologise, but they countlessly thank users for their patience in waiting for the problem to be resolved. Good enough for me.
 
Mr-Fusion said:
Opinion and personal experience, not fact.


-3376 posts
http://www.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=176237


-1127 posts
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=51480



11/22/04 06:03:33 PM GMT Erik Johnson (Valve)
"We've found a fix for this problem, and we're planning on shipping it no later than tomorrow."

11/24/04 12:56:45 PM GMT Gary McTaggart (Valve)
We're working on it. The stuttering is actually three different bugs. Two of them are fixed and should (hopefully) be out tomorrow. Still working on the third one which only happens on NVidia cards/drivers.



Why do you even bother posting?
 
spencerjrus said:
-3376 posts
http://www.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=176237


-1127 posts
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=51480



11/22/04 06:03:33 PM GMT Erik Johnson (Valve)
"We've found a fix for this problem, and we're planning on shipping it no later than tomorrow."

11/24/04 12:56:45 PM GMT Gary McTaggart (Valve)
We're working on it. The stuttering is actually three different bugs. Two of them are fixed and should (hopefully) be out tomorrow. Still working on the third one which only happens on NVidia cards/drivers.



Why do you even bother posting?
I thought you said Valve needed to be accountable for their game, and they weren't doing that.

But right here you've just posted evidence to the contrary of what you said.

Besides VU do the bug-testing for the game, they are the ones that give it the green light to be shipped with the bugs. If anything its both Valve and VU's fault for this.

This happens with alot of games man, you don't get how the industry works at all
 
WhiteZero said:
Like what? Other than the hydra.


Half-Life 2 actually runs 7-8fps higher on average with the De-Steamed cracked version than the normal version according to many.

Tunnel levels with Alyx, coast level shown in the BINK, several weapons, City 17 fighting with Barney in your squad, Strider ducking under the bridge, Traptown, Combine kicking down doors, table in front of doors, the Icebreaker etc.
 
spencerjrus said:
-3376 posts
http://www.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=176237


-1127 posts
http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=51480



11/22/04 06:03:33 PM GMT Erik Johnson (Valve)
"We've found a fix for this problem, and we're planning on shipping it no later than tomorrow."

11/24/04 12:56:45 PM GMT Gary McTaggart (Valve)
We're working on it. The stuttering is actually three different bugs. Two of them are fixed and should (hopefully) be out tomorrow. Still working on the third one which only happens on NVidia cards/drivers.



Why do you even bother posting?


Sorry to burst your bubble, but the MAJORITY of the people is playing the game just fine. The ones that can't play is a small majority. Why do YOU even bother posting? Begone troll, your not wanted here.
 
spencerjrus said:
accountability

n : responsibility to someone or for some activity


I'm not sure what kind of corporate world we live in today where making quality products (debatable when we are talking about HL2) justifies lying to customers. I don't care how many polygons your models have or how realistic your physics engine is, lying to customers is unacceptable, even moreso when it is done repeatedley and without apology or remorse of any kind.

For a game that came out well over a year after the Original release date, (that Gabe conciously lied about several times when he knew September 30th was a joke.) having fatal bugs that make the game unplayable for a large percentage of players is ridiculous.

But it gets worse, not only do they release the game with fatal bugs, they then deny that they are responsible for the problems and blame it on 3rd parties. After they realize that isnt going to work as a long term solution, they do a half-as* job of taking responsibility for the problems, then promise dates for a fix.

Of course no one at Valve cares about ethics, morals, or corporate accountability, not to mention the loyal fan base that has patiently waited over a year longer than they were told they would have to, and still bought the game. Frankly I'm suprised there isnt more outrage.

Before I ramble on for too long, I'd like to do a quick summary of actions taken by Valve regarding HL2, both pro and con.

Pro:

-Delivered the game.

-Excellent graphics/physics and gameplay.

-Counter Strike: Source comes with the game.

Con:

-Over a year late.

-Huge amounts of content that was shown in videos and promised by Valve is missing from the game.

-Much of the AI slated to be in the game is missing, and it turns out the awesome BINK videos Valve made were actually a farce, most of them were scripted and not an accurate representation of what the game reallly is.

-Fatal memory errors, horrible loading times, massive amounts of audio stuttering that makes the game unplayable for many customers.

-Requirement to authenticate the game through Steam, and requirement to use Steam to play the game, even though Steam directly hurts game performance.

-Failure to apologize for any of the massive amount of shortcomings in game content,bugs/errors, release dates, patches, inaccurate documentation, problems with having Steam authenticate the game, etc. etc. etc.


To summarize: Valve, please stop lying to your customers and deliver the game as promised.


........stfu
 
Bought the game and loved it, but I´m still pissed off of not being able to use the M-29.
There isn´t enough weapons on this game, and why the hell is an east european city full H&K weapons and no AK, or other former soviet piece of weaponry?

PS: the game is too short
 
Sparta said:
I thought you said Valve needed to be accountable for their game, and they weren't doing that.

But right here you've just posted evidence to the contrary of what you said.

Besides VU do the bug-testing for the game, they are the ones that give it the green light to be shipped with the bugs. If anything its both Valve and VU's fault for this.

This happens with alot of games man, you don't get how the industry works at all


I'm sorry I assumed you were capable of reading, notice the date on the first promise of the fix, 11/22. Now I understand this is complicated, but if today were 11/22, and someone said I'm giving you something tomorrow, what date would that be? (Hint 22+1), Now after you have figured that part out, find out what the date is today.
 
spencerjrus said:
Tunnel levels with Alyx, coast level shown in the BINK, several weapons, City 17 fighting with Barney in your squad, Strider ducking under the bridge, Traptown, Combine kicking down doors, table in front of doors, the Icebreaker etc.
All made specifically for E3 as stated in the Gamespot article.

Most games do this now-a-days. Doom 3's 2003 E3 demo wasn't in the game at all, neither was Halo 2's.

Some stuff such as the Icebreaker level and the hydra were cut because of design problems (Hydra AI apparently wasn't any good, and the Icebreaker level was apart of one of the very early design stages of the game, the stage where it was Captain Vance, instead of Eli Vance)
 
spencerjrus said:
Half-Life 2 actually runs 7-8fps higher on average with the De-Steamed cracked version than the normal version according to many.

Tunnel levels with Alyx, coast level shown in the BINK, several weapons, City 17 fighting with Barney in your squad, Strider ducking under the bridge, Traptown, Combine kicking down doors, table in front of doors, the Icebreaker etc.
Ohhh :(

Here you go little boy http://www.zworld2.com/MRSZWORLD/Supplies/KLEENEX.gif
 
spencerjrus said:
I'm sorry I assumed you were capable of reading, notice the date on the first promise of the fix, 11/22. Now I understand this is complicated, but if today were 11/22, and someone said I'm giving you something tomorrow, what date would that be? (Hint 22+1), Now after you have figured that part out, find out what the date is today.
Oh lord, they miss out by one day because of some unforseen consequences, dear god no, why god why must this happen to my game.

Dude its a game, and its also a 1 day wait. I think you should really settle down and chill out because you're coming off as a spoiled brat.
 
Dsty2001 said:
Sorry to burst your bubble, but the MAJORITY of the people is playing the game just fine. The ones that can't play is a small majority. Why do YOU even bother posting? Begone troll, your not wanted here.

The word you were looking for is minority.(small majority = no no.) Nice to know that the only people who seem to have a problem with my opinion are the ones who can't compose sentences even resembling the English language.
 
Sparta said:
Oh lord, they miss out by one day because of some unforseen consequences, dear god no, why god why must this happen to my game.

Dude its a game, and its also a 1 day wait. I think you should really settle down and chill out because you're coming off as a spoiled brat.


It's not going to be released today though, so it's not a 1 day wait, and seeing as how tomorrow is Thanksgiving and then we have the weekend, it's very likely the patch wont come out until Monday. Meaning that many people will have been unable to play the game for almost 2 weeks after purchase.
 
spencerjrus said:
Half-Life 2 actually runs 7-8fps higher on average with the De-Steamed cracked version than the normal version according to many.
ZOMG!! 7-8FPS!!!! Oh noes!!! I'm very sorry, but that litte of a difference is nothing to cry about. 7-8 FPS is barly even noticeable, if at all.

Tunnel levels with Alyx, coast level shown in the BINK, several weapons, City 17 fighting with Barney in your squad, Strider ducking under the bridge, Traptown, Combine kicking down doors, table in front of doors, the Icebreaker etc.
None of that was ever "promised" by VALVe. Traptown was there to show off physics and some of the stuff you could do with it to mess up your enemies (which you can in the final version). And thats funny, I remember driving along the coast for awhile in the buggy... why don't you? Sure you didnt fight the airship, but oh well, no big deal. "Strider ducking under the bridge"... please tell me you don't consider that "content". I wouldent consider any of that "huge".
 
I think you would have found a problem with the game no matter what valve did.

"Of course no one at Valve cares about ethics, morals, or corporate accountability, not to mention the loyal fan base that has patiently waited over a year longer than they were told they would have to, and still bought the game. Frankly I'm suprised there isnt more outrage."

Do you work there? Because if you dont, then you have no idea what goes on inside valve.

"Failure to apologize for any of the massive amount of shortcomings in game content,bugs/errors, release dates, patches, inaccurate documentation, problems with having Steam authenticate the game, etc. etc. etc."

And your point is.....? What do you want them to come on over to your house and have them bow down a beg forgivness?

"Valve, please stop lying to your customers and deliver the game as promised."

Where? Where have they lied? Please give real prof instead of jumping to conclusions.
 
Rent-A-Hero said:
"Valve, please stop lying to your customers and deliver the game as promised."

Where? Where have they lied? Please give real prof instead of jumping to conclusions.

Please stop talking... your not helping at all.
 
Go back to the VN boards and be the umbos, mistwraith, and lagged again fanboy follower you have been for the past 2 years.
 
Rent-A-Hero said:
Are you? You must be.

javascript:launchGSL("/live/streamer_new2.html?title=Half-Life+2+Developer+Interview+2&path=hl2_401devint2.asx&pid=914642&ppath=pc%2Faction%2Fhalflife2&ksubmoid=f7300d59-92b2-1fd6-dbf3-fde441c58a35&urdate=1100592000", "", 718, 500)


copy and paste that into your browser or go to this link and click on Developer Interview 2.

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/action/halflife2/index.html?q=half+life+2
 
Of course no one at Valve cares about ethics, morals, or corporate accountability
I would love to see you take a trip to VALVe and tell that to them in person. :rolling:

Or even write them an eMail about it for that matter.
 
Janet Reno said:
Go back to the VN boards and be the umbos, mistwraith, and lagged again fanboy follower you have been for the past 2 years.
I too love Mr-Fusion.

Anyway if you're THAT concerned about the patch which sounds like you are (but since you've been blabbing on so much about it i dunno if you're just flaming Valve or genuinely have one of these bugs as i do, the audio stutter) email them
 
Janet Reno said:
Go back to the VN boards and be the umbos, mistwraith, and lagged again fanboy follower you have been for the past 2 years.


You win at life.

P.S. Making stuff up makes you look cool.
 
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