THE REAL DEAL with the HL2 source

Well, I'm also a non-programmer who joined just to respond to this thread.

I've read not quite half of it. 19 pages is really too much. :) I did find the first post interesting and informative.

And I do know enough about computer security that I'm shocked as well, about the fact that it was an outside hacker who got the info. The source code should have been kept on machines that weren't even connected to machines with internet connections. Be that as it may, it's too late to deal with that now. I just hope they and other companies learn from it.

This really does kind of put them in a "d***ed if you do, d***ed if you don't" position. If they rush it out now, there's definite possibilites of computers being compromised via security holes, on the other hand, if they wait, there's definite possibilites of other games based on the source being released first.

I also like the example about Linux being open source and secure, but one important thing to realize is that Linux code is created and released with the assumption that it will be open. The HL2 code on the other hand was created with the assumption that it would not be open. Again, I'm no programmer so I son't know what all that might mean, but I'd think that difference would mean they deal differently with security issues.
 
Originally posted by beka
I'm surprised they *still* use only C++ for everything. Large parts of the AI for "Crash Bandicoot" were written in LISP. I guess they don't read Gamasutra alot.

(registration needed)

http://www.gamasutra.com/features/19991112/GavinWhite_03.htm
Click to expand...
Maybe because it is cheaper to use C++ than to learn new coding? Half Life 2 was an expensive project already. Spending extra money on new coding lessons that you do not actually need is burning moolah.
 
what im still wondering is where all the maps and moedels came from? i thought it was purely source code that was stolen?
 
who the h3ll unstickied this post?

oh well, still an interresting read.
I must say valve screwed up real good with saving on a roll of cat5 UTP to seperate their network from the M$-Internet (c).
I hate the current situation, i just would like to get started with this game. wicked singleplayer and TF2 as multiplayer FFS!! If valve made the sep30th release I would be non-stop behind my pc for 8 days now!

=( gotta wait it out now, hope valve makes a goodanti-cheat protection for once.

I still wonder if the hacker really only got 1/3 of the sorce... I'm affraid its not.
Oh well, switching to positive mode again, just like a few days ago (thinking" there is no beta")

*KILCK*

The sorce is a fake ppl, ALL WILL BE OK!!!!!
 
I'm also a programmer + Mathematician + 3D modeler. If 3D models leak and people duplicate them, its obvious. You cant learn much from 3D models, textures or sounds. If your source code leaks, you can easily extract any bit of prrogramming you like, rework it so it's unrecognisable, then redistribute it. Source like Half Life 2 is too tempting for ANY game production company to resist...at least getting a copy of the source. Valve would probably not give a shi* if it was a mere partially workign version that was floating around hte web. They only really care about the source.
 
This needs to be made a sticky again.

Valve lied to us, the beta is nowhere near complete, how could they have been ready for september 30th?

Games are built modularly, you don't want to compile the whole lot every time you adjust one thing. The AI team has the AI parts, the graphics team have the graphics part etc. on individual machines of whatever individual members are working on. This includes modelers and mappers, people don't all work from the same source on a project this big, that would be insane.

The source code stolen from valve does not represent this, it a copy where everything has been gathered togeather, combined and run at a key stage. It could easily be some months old regardless of when it was last changed or compiled.

Valve lied, there's a scripted event.

Games need scripts to tell stories, Gabe's point was that the AI was currently working out everything in real time on the street scene. The door kick was probably scripted because of a physics bug, the AI in HL1 is easily capable of that by itself.
 
Valve have clearly rigged HL2 to favour ATI, as the beta shows little performace difference. It also uses OpenGL.

The difference between ATI and nVidia is shader performance, as the beta graphics engine does not contain the final shader code implementation the difference won't be that much. In the benchmark the graphics will be fully functional and will reflect the difference, as a result the game will be much better looking.

Valve have spent over 5 times the budget allocated for improving performance on nVidia cards. Also see my post earlier in the thread about shaders in more detail.

The beta uses DirectX regardless of which API you choose.
 
Well, I find this whole reaction by Valve to be a little awkward... I mean, the whole point of them announcing HL2's development right before it was released was a great marketting tool, as well as a great competitive move. While all of the other developers were bragging about their games and their features, Valve sat back and did their homework, bettering HL2 the whole time. And then, out of nowhere, HL2. It totally took the community by storm and I'm sure it worried ID and got them second guessing their upcoming Doom3.

So here's Valve, just hitting the gaming industry point blank with "yes, we have HL2, yes, its release is upon us." But, all of a sudden with this leak incident, Valve is somehow way behind in their game? Why would they add the pressure to themselves if the game was only partially complete and unstable? It would have been in their best interest to keep their mouthes shut and finish what needed to be done.

For that reason, I do NOT think that what is circulating around the internet is the complete version of HL2. It just doesn't make any sense, Valve would be further along than that...

And to push back the release to Q1 of '04 is just rediculous, they'd lose their momentum. SURELY it wouldnt take that long for their programming team to scramble and work overtime to get HL2 out the door.

Either HL2 is delayed for other reasons that aren't related to its development (like steam etc) or HL2 is still pushing for the "holidays."

I think something they could do is release an SP version. And with steam being reliable by then, they could easily update the game with teh MP conent (which is orignally what steam was made to do, to provide easy update access for ALL aspects of HL2).

What do you guys think?
 
Valve is not behind on the game..as I've compared screenshots of hte beta to those of the E3 video.

I'm most worried that other developers will steal the source code and use it for their own games. As a programmer, I would not hessitate for a second to get the HL2 source if it was intended to be open source.

Think of all the physics and graphics algorithims I could study for my own advatnages. I could probably release a sweet looking game on my own but studying the source and investing 2 years of work...it wouldn't be better than HL2, but....

What I'm saying is the source is litterally over 100x more valuable than the game itself. Valve would probably rather pass out free copies of the game than risk other developers using the source.
 
Hey guys,

Now that the beta is out, this thread is redundant, as is the source code. Probably best to start new topics, and leave this one for anyone who wants to read the posts already done on game development issues. :)

Gloryofbach.
 
People will still buy it. The biggest loss to Valve is know-how. Other programmers will eventually see the source and say, "Cool! So that's how they did that!" They'll use the ideas and make their games better and we will benefit from that. But there will still be only one Half-Life.

Heck, maybe Valve should have shared the source with everybody right from the beginning.
 
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