Things that would have made HL2 BETTER! BUGGS??!

[She]

First of all.. My english suck.. Dont bother me about that..
Happy reading everyone..

The things i think/know half-life 2 will lack of:

Mass-Engine = Water & particle engine>>
If you shoot a container with water.. the water should naturally fall..
( or dripp / if the hole is small )
If you push a very hot object into water.. the object will create bubbles..
( & making the water warmer)
The waters temperature is programmable = you can make the water into
ice if you change values of temperature in the engine.. ( not in the game )
[[ this offcourse is a benifit for MODDERS ]]

Mass-Engine = Ground Control>>
Shure.. the gound and poly-matrix is moveable ( as seen in e3 video ).
But i noticed that when you shoot down a (alien helicopter ) with a rocket
launcher [ in the E3 video ].. the helicopter just lands and bounces on the ground ( not breaking it up and making a hole in the gound. )
This is VERY frustrating for me..
And i want too shot down Bridges & stuff with my rocket-launcher.. killing
the foes that are under it.. Or driving a car into a wall.. the wall gets a scar..

THE QUESTION IS:: would you be able to cut down a tree with you crowbar if you stand and ttackt in 4 10 minutes?? or fire a rocket.. and the tree breakes.. leaves fall & some are carried away by the wind..

Light&World-Engine = Fire >>
Fire shall create distortions in the air.. ( viewing objects that are behind the fire get bent beacuse the air is so hot ) And offcourse.. the fire shall cast a shadow.. ( e3 video with a human with water skin & fire behind him ).. the
fire doesnt cast any shadows.. & there are no destortions in the air..
i hope this is fixed though..

Light&World-Engine = Shadows >>
This is the Worst thing in HL2..
As noticed on Pictures & Videos, there is no accurate shadow engine..
That means, there is only a 2d-pixel engine.. & some buggs i hope the Valve team will fix beore realese...
In some pictures the sun cast a shadow on houses & statues to the west..
But moveable objects like Humans.. their shadows direction is east..
(seen in a official picture from valve)

In Another pic, i noticed that there are 2 suns.. that means.. You see the flare of the sun.. but on some houses & objects.. the light comes from another direction..! ( shadow is on the wrong place )

>in E3 showcase BINK VIDEO (high dynamic rendering)> light from the broken rooftop is cast under a piece of wood.. the wood isn't affected by the light.. ( is ignored by the light engine ) beacuse it is a moveable object..

Later in the video.. When viewing 2 ball objects. ( 1 water & another metall)
You see that the ground has a Specular-Mapping on it.. and reflects light.. this is good!.. but a Chimny doesn't cast a shadow, and the specular ( reflection ) is where the shadow is supposed to be....


>>>> MY WISH...

Well.. Think about this sceniaro..
You are with a rebellion-group in city-17.. Fighting striders..
And the time goes by.. Suddenly you notice that the shadow that you were hiding in is no longer there.. why?? >>
Beacuse the sun has moved.. and it is getting darker!!
And you wait.. wait.. until it gets dark.. and stars are showing in the sky... Now you have more curage and attack the strider..
I realy hope this (time-engine) is in the game!

Think about it.. a wet/foggy morning.. birds in city-17.. the sun i low. and suddenly a strider..
you dont see it, only hear it.. Then it appears.. And you fire off a rocket onto his leg.. his leg breakes, and the strider falls on the ground.. still trying to walk.. fires in all directions.. breaking and making holes in the gound & stuff..

GO GO GO!! a rebellion group attacks the fallen strider.. And a raindrop falls infront of you.. suddenly there is thunder! clouds block the suns light..

AHHH.. the realizm in that! now...
you could aim at me and fire..

 

[Ames]

You could do it in a mod.

 

[Big Fat Duck]

yes a lot of hl2 engine really sucks (escpecially the shadows), but at least it is better then hl1 and I will play all my favorite mods on it

terrain is not dynamicly desctructable, only predefined pieces that can break apart can be specified by mappers on certain areas that they think someone will shoot a destructive weapon

 

[FoB_Ed]

This is the Worst thing in HL2..
As noticed on Pictures & Videos, there is no accurate shadow engine..
That means, there is only a 2d-pixel engine.. & some buggs i hope the Valve team will fix beore realese...
In some pictures the sun cast a shadow on houses & statues to the west..
But moveable objects like Humans.. their shadows direction is east..
(seen in a official picture from valve)

Those photos are over a year old, valve said the bug was fixed.


If all this stuff was added to the game it wouldn't be out for another 2 years

 

[theotherguy]

none of these things will happen in HL2. Water physics like that are not currentley possible, fully destructable enviroments are cool, but an unnessescary waste of power (as proved by red faction) but yes, It would be nice to see a better shadow system. There is no passage of time in HL2.

but with all of these, we can use the valve catch phrase:

"No, but you could mod it in."TM

 

[GuNzABlaZiN]

Wait for HL3.

 

[ManHacks]

the only thing of those i really care about would be the shadows, and thats only if im in a small area where it would matter. I wont care if a building is casted differently then the sun, i wont look that close. But if some light is shining through a pipe in a small tunnel, i would like that to be close to correct. Its good news that its fixed though

 

[Anthraxxx]

Konichiwa! Welcome to the Forums!

 

[P43.2/1Gig/X800P]

in five years from now you will see a big difference in games. arent you glad you are this generation.

 

[CrazyHarij]

You could do it in a mod.

Valve answer deluxe

 

[Citizen 1150421]

the unreal 3.0 engine handles shadows beautifully....
the source is good for material effects.. metal . wood. etc.

shadows some how are programmed weakly cause they tax heavy on the cpu..
hl2 would look AWSOme with unreal 3.0 shadow and blooming engine.. (see the part with the fridge and some flimsy stuffs)


BUt hl2 brings in game skeleton systems. face posing. acting. dynamic scripting for AI and NPC idle behaviour....


this game brings more to the table and shadows weakness can be over looked.

however the dynamic landscape changing will hopefully be tweaked cause its there in the engine so i hope they use it..

by the way shadows aren't what they are cracked up to be. look at doom 3 its all shadows and its still stale.

 

[Platinum]

omg ... you're too demanding

 

[brink's]

Many of the things you pointed out have either isn't possible or has been fixed. Fluid physics will not be possible for a lloooongg time and you would go out of the level design if terrain was a destrctabel as you wish( not to mention lag the crap out of your comp).

I'm kinda getting tiredof how everyone focuses on the lows of what could be a great great game.

 

[CerebrEcl]

Don't ask for too much at once. If all you've got to say about the cutting edge games of today is "I want it to be the cutting edge game of tomorrow" then why bother playing games at all? You'll especially want to refrain from demanding features for which the technology doesn't even exist yet, or which would make the game unplayable on anything less than the best system.

 

[Big Fat Duck]

hl2 map geometery/textures looks too much like halflife1 engine

 

[FoB_Ed]

hl2 map geometery/textures looks too much like halflife1 engine

Then why are you here if you don't like it?

 

[She]

I still want a "Time" engine..
day / night / dawn ect..
I know it is possible..
and not demanding so much comp power either..

 

[Vegeta897]

Okay.. FINALLY. A person that is smart! You gotta love the Japanese.

As said, a dynamic liquid engine is far off, don't expect it be in games for alteast 5 years.

Valve chose not to have a day/night system, because in some levels it would take away the atmosphere. Zombie ridden Traptown NEEDS to be dark to enhance the scary feeling. It would be no fun during the day.

I am sure Valve has sorted out the shadow issues.

Ehmm. Thats about all I have to say.

Welcome to the forums! You are truly a valuable member. Your smart and inventive...

Can I marry you?

 

[CerebrEcl]

As was said, the time engine would be out of place since HL2 still has a linear, pre-defined storyline. The developers chose not to have the weather change "by itself", but you can expect day/night or weather changes to be imposed for dramatic effect, etc.

If you don't already know about the other upcoming game "S.t.a.l.k.e.r. : shadow of Chernobyl", you should look it up now- and be pleasantly surprised.

 

[NormalSim12]

hl2 map geometery/textures looks too much like halflife1 engine

wanna buy a new comptuer to handle more geometry? Many people can't grasp the fact that tradeoffs and sacrifices must be made when adding elements to games. Valve must look at what the average home PC is like. You probably have a better than average one, but most people obviously don't. Halflife 2 is a product and therefore must be marketed to a large consumer base. Valve therefore made Source able to perform well on average PCs. Source has great materal effects, character effects, and physics effects, all of which take a toll on the average PC. Valve could have added in more complex geometry to the game, but it simply woudlnt perform as well for most people, so it was a tradeoff. The average PC has improved since the geometry of HL 1, but this new power, Valve decided, was best used to render effects and materials and AI more effectively.

This will prove to be a good decision becuase one can only do so much by pumping his map full of polygons. When HL2 comes out, you should make your own mini mod. Get rid of all the effects and fancy shmancy things HL2 offers, so you will have something like HL1, except in source. Now recreate some levels from HL2, and see which looks better, your little mod, or HL2.

People also loose sight of something else: practicality. It is neither practical nor necessary to have more complex geometry. The same goes for a day/night realtime cycle, super perfect shadows, deformable terrain, water physics, and heat physics. You get very little bang for your buck from heat physics if you are playing a game like HL2 where you dont need to melt blocks of ice keep your feet from burning on the beach. It's just a waste of time and money and processing power. I know a time engine would not require all that much CPU, but it still woudl take time to program, test, and perfect it, and, at least in THIS halflife game (who knows for HL3) a day/night cycle isn't part of the strategy.

I dont post here much, but i read here everyday, and it's just irritating to see these deamnds or complaints. However, things like heat, time, light, terrain, are moddable, as has been mentioned. Things like this are what great games are based on. I dare a modder to pick one of these things and then just run with it in their HL2 mod. Make a mod where day/night DOES matter. Make a mod where heat DOES effect gameplay. HL2 didn't do it, they are just leaving the door open for you...

edit: allirght, sorry, I see that some people pointed these things out while i was writing this...

 

[Eon Blue]

Your computer can't handle fluid dynamics, so anything having to do with your first 'want' is pretty much not gonna happen.

 

[me2you1]

I love seeing nerdy duels over stupid things. I can't believe how mad people get over a video game.

"I want my game to be GOD"
"Well you can't dickweed no one likes you leave"
"dude I was just saying what I want"
"well...so , my computer can beat up your computer"

A game people, GAME.

/end rant

 

[xani]

are you some kind of water orb thats obsessed with water?

 

[She]

hmm.. i hope the shadow thingy is fixed due to realese..

Half-Life 2 Screenshot

look at this pic ( somewhat new )..
As you can see, the shadow is only cast by the human in the picture.. not the table & Chair he is sitting on..
The entire room seems to be shadowless... hmm

 

[A.I.]

hl2 map geometery/textures looks too much like halflife1 engine

Oh, shuddup you... you... BIG FAT DUCK!!!!1!!!11!!

 

[A.I.]

hmm.. i hope the shadow thingy is fixed due to realese..

Half-Life 2 Screenshot

look at this pic ( somewhat new )..
As you can see, the shadow is only cast by the human in the picture.. not the table & Chair he is sitting on..
The entire room seems to be shadowless... hmm

I'm afraid it will not be so. Maps are probably already compiled. On the other hand someone could e-mail VALVe and warn them about this minor problem :dozey:

 

[lans]

hmm.. i hope the shadow thingy is fixed due to realese..

Half-Life 2 Screenshot

look at this pic ( somewhat new )..
As you can see, the shadow is only cast by the human in the picture.. not the table & Chair he is sitting on..
The entire room seems to be shadowless... hmm

Best thing to do is email gabe. He should answer this question, as it's very vital.

 

[Vegeta897]

I'm afraid it will not be so. Maps are probably already compiled. On the other hand someone could e-mail VALVe and warn them about this minor problem :dozey:

Ehh... Didn't Valve say there was an option to turn on shadows for models (static or otherwise). Must just be not turned on.

 

[Sicton]

You've just got to look at all the amazing new technological advancements in the game rather than pointing out the things that could be improved.

I think we've all waited so long, we've resorted to thinking how the game could be made better by now. I'm more looking forward to the promise shown by the game play than the technicalities really, especially since there have been quite a few new games come along since HL2 was first unveiled which have made it look less impressive.

 

[lans]

Ehh... Didn't Valve say there was an option to turn on shadows for models (static or otherwise). Must just be not turned on.

Hopefully.

It is believeable, I mean Rick confirmed that he forgot to choose the "all reflections" choice when he took that new airboat pic and the naysayers who ranted all day long saying "where are the reflections?...HL2 SuXorZ e.t.c. e.t.c." were made quite. I'm pretty sure that the shadows were turned off - and valve wouldn't be dumb enough to miss this kind of serious bug anyway.

 

[B.Calhoun]

Do you think in real life if a helcopter fell on to a concrete street the street would explode? i think not.

And big fat duck, why would you rip on hl2. The engine doesnt suck and is amazing.

 

[iamg30hd3]

Every single game engine out there has something they can improve on.. however we're limited by technology...

 

[Dead-Inside]

First of all.. My english suck.. Dont bother me about that..
Happy reading everyone..

The things i think/know half-life 2 will lack of:

Mass-Engine = Water & particle engine>>
If you shoot a container with water.. the water should naturally fall..
( or dripp / if the hole is small )
Home computers today couldn't handle the power needed for that. It'll be at least 2 years before you see accurate, realitic, water. Probably more.
If you push a very hot object into water.. the object will create bubbles..
( & making the water warmer)
I don't get it, why do you need this? As said above, you could always mod it in, it's probably not that hard to do if you can code.
The waters temperature is programmable = you can make the water into
ice if you change values of temperature in the engine.. ( not in the game )
[[ this offcourse is a benifit for MODDERS ]]
ROFL. If it's not in-game, then why would you need a parameter to change this? Why not just model the ice itself? Hah, damn man that's just dumb -- sorry

Mass-Engine = Ground Control>>
Shure.. the gound and poly-matrix is moveable ( as seen in e3 video ).
But i noticed that when you shoot down a (alien helicopter ) with a rocket
launcher [ in the E3 video ].. the helicopter just lands and bounces on the ground ( not breaking it up and making a hole in the gound. )
This is VERY frustrating for me..
Again, too much power (Maybe not for stateoftheart computers, but it's not worth doing if it's not avavible at minimum-req). Besides, if it broke up the ground, worst case it'd stop you from continuing your journey, which would lead to EXCESSIVE save/load, which sucks.
And i want too shot down Bridges & stuff with my rocket-launcher.. killing
the foes that are under it.. Or driving a car into a wall.. the wall gets a scar..
Depends on what wall you'll drive in to. I admit these would be nice features, but the Rocket Launcher stuff is probably too CPU intensive unless it's a preprogrammed explosion (Or a destructible wall, like wood or alike)

THE QUESTION IS:: would you be able to cut down a tree with you crowbar if you stand and ttackt in 4 10 minutes?? or fire a rocket.. and the tree breakes.. leaves fall & some are carried away by the wind..
If you're meant to be able to do so, you will. If not, it's just waste of processor power, thus making it extremly stupid, it doesn't add to the game. (You're not Gordon Freeman the forced lumberjack)

Light&World-Engine = Fire >>
Fire shall create distortions in the air.. ( viewing objects that are behind the fire get bent beacuse the air is so hot ) And offcourse.. the fire shall cast a shadow.. ( e3 video with a human with water skin & fire behind him ).. the
fire doesnt cast any shadows.. & there are no destortions in the air..
i hope this is fixed though..
We'll know if it's fixed when the game is out, won't we?

Light&World-Engine = Shadows >>
This is the Worst thing in HL2..
As noticed on Pictures & Videos, there is no accurate shadow engine..
That means, there is only a 2d-pixel engine.. & some buggs i hope the Valve team will fix beore realese...
In some pictures the sun cast a shadow on houses & statues to the west..
But moveable objects like Humans.. their shadows direction is east..
(seen in a official picture from valve)
You've looked at old pictures and stuff haven't you? I assure you these things are fixed. Why do you think the game is delayed at all?

In Another pic, i noticed that there are 2 suns.. that means.. You see the flare of the sun.. but on some houses & objects.. the light comes from another direction..! ( shadow is on the wrong place )
... Are you sure there wasn't another lightsource present? ... Screenshots aren't 360degrees.

>in E3 showcase BINK VIDEO (high dynamic rendering)> light from the broken rooftop is cast under a piece of wood.. the wood isn't affected by the light.. ( is ignored by the light engine ) beacuse it is a moveable object..
Probably fixed, if not, I doubt you'll notice it while playing. (You won't be looking at tiny errors unless you're some kind of moron who only bought the game for that and not for a gaming experience with Mr.Freeman)

Later in the video.. When viewing 2 ball objects. ( 1 water & another metall)
You see that the ground has a Specular-Mapping on it.. and reflects light.. this is good!.. but a Chimny doesn't cast a shadow, and the specular ( reflection ) is where the shadow is supposed to be....
This must be very very old. Still, same thing.

>>>> MY WISH...

Well.. Think about this sceniaro..
You are with a rebellion-group in city-17.. Fighting striders..
And the time goes by.. Suddenly you notice that the shadow that you were hiding in is no longer there.. why?? >>
Beacuse the sun has moved.. and it is getting darker!!
And you wait.. wait.. until it gets dark.. and stars are showing in the sky... Now you have more curage and attack the strider..
I realy hope this (time-engine) is in the game!
Ye, cuz, everyone loves to be standing there waiting for the sun to go down so you can assault the Strider-base. *rofl* -- Seriously though, HL2 is played out during 3 days, and those days don't go by if you just stand there because that'd SERIOUSLY mess the game up. It's not a good idea in such a game either, btw.

Think about it.. a wet/foggy morning.. birds in city-17.. the sun i low. and suddenly a strider..
you dont see it, only hear it.. Then it appears.. And you fire off a rocket onto his leg.. his leg breakes, and the strider falls on the ground.. still trying to walk.. fires in all directions.. breaking and making holes in the gound & stuff..
Going to happen no doubt.
GO GO GO!! a rebellion group attacks the fallen strider.. And a raindrop falls infront of you.. suddenly there is thunder! clouds block the suns light..
And... No. Not unless it's scripted to be (It might still happen though!)

Breaking it down to bits...

Regards
Dead-Inside

 

[MultiVaC]

I want to be able to split atoms, swim across the pacific ocean, have an entire world filled with sentient human-level AI, explore the uncharted depths of space in a fully physically simulated starship and sit down and play HL2 in HL2!

Come on. This isn't a holodeck. We have limitations you know.

 

[She]

Do you think in real life if a helcopter fell on to a concrete street the street would explode? i think not.

If a Huge Alien Chopper Falls and slides into ground.. the ground would defenitly get a scar.. Watch the Showcase E3 VIDEO... the chopper just bounces..

Dont get me wrong.. i think HL2 will be awesome.. or at least a good game..

 

[EVIL]

fpr the water into ice thing.. there might be some material transition thing, the water is just one plane anyway,, so you only would to change the material from water to ice., Not so hard I think

And one of the video's demons demontrated a cutdown tree on fire (I think it was the strider one in the 2004 vid's), So I assume you can cut down tree's if you want to

The shadow on the wrong place thing has been fixed, It was one ONE! very old screenshot, and since then, we havent seen wierd bugs like that so don't worry

The movable oject light cast thingy is prolly fixed by now, It was from a bink so that would mean its from the 2003 demonstration.

And weather and sun things must be scripted, the story, (as already said) takes place within 3 days. and the shadows on the ground are lightmaps, (the shadows that are casted by buildings and the sort) so it would not be possible to have them move dynamicly according to the postion of the sun

This isnt a "real life world simulator" so get over it. You have to wait atleasst 10 years before you can dig a hole trough individual stones of sand and build your sandcastel on the beach

 

[lans]

If a Huge Alien Chopper Falls and slides into ground.. the ground would defenitly get a scar.. Watch the Showcase E3 VIDEO... the chopper just bounces..

Dont get me wrong.. i think HL2 will be awesome.. or at least a good game..

That was an year old footage - a lot has been changed.

Also, you should know that real-time destructible environments are very CPU intensive - no game currently has them - even the best graphically looking game so far (Doom 3) hardly had any sort of deformable terrain after explosions (other than black spots) unless shown otherwise in scripted sequences, or even proper decals for that matter (bullets left a black mark on the walls).

I can assure you that HL2 at least has a very good material system - the decals do look more realistic than any other game currently (play cs:s) and wood will break realistically when shot (but only the wood that the level designer has tagged".

 

[EVIL]

I had this conversation about breaking up roads with rick I think, atleast I send him a mail if it would be possible

The third effect is the ball and the tank crashing into the ground. It should make a big crater... How would we do this?
*** Use deformable terrain for this.

so there yah go

 

[She]

Also, you should know that real-time destructible environments are very CPU intensive - no game currently has them

Then why dont they just CREATE some bricks & Stones from the ground that looks like the ground is trashed.. & create a Decal at the place the Chopper landed & bounced on....

 

[EVIL]

Then why dont they just CREATE some bricks & Stones from the ground that looks like the ground is trashed.. & create a Decal at the place the Chopper landed & bounced on....

Why dont you ask valve.. We don't know everything!, we are only humble fans