UK Identity Cards

UK Identity Cards

  • Total voters
    51
The whole idea kicks so much ass.

No more fines for serving underage kids @ work :bang:
 
it smacks of invasion of privacy type thing, but the benefits far outweigh the disadvantages.
 
I don't really mind having the ID card, I'd just rather not pay for one. No biggie really though. As long as you have nothing to hide, it's not much of a problem.
 
I've already got so many cards, that I might loss the ID card

Uni Card
Accomadation ID Card
Three Bank Cards
My GAME Card
My Bus Pass
Students Railcard
Ni Card

more, more, and more....?
 
I wouldn't carry all those around with you, what if your wallet got stolen/lost??

I just carry the cards i'm gonna use for a given trip. Usually only 1 or 2. That way if i get mugged or something i loose bugger all.

EDIT: Sorry, just realised you didn't say you did carry them around with you.
 
I really can't see what's so "Big Brother" about it anyway... it'll just be an ID card that everyone has to accept as proof of identiy. No more idiots thinking the photo on my driving license isn't me... no more people thinking I'm half my age :LOL:

As for them contemplating whether or not to put a DNA profile on it, I don't see the problem with that either. You're not marking people down as criminals or anything- hell, I'm in favour of taking genetic samples at birth. That way, everyone in the country is on the national database, and victims/perpetrators can be identified far more effectively.
 
There has been much objection to this on the grounds of privacy, but I find two problems with this argument.

1/. What are you doing that you want to keep it private from the government?

2/. These are cards. They are not GPS trackers. They are not cameras to let the police see you at all times. They are mearly a way for you to reliably prove who you are, and thats it. If we had to swipe them everytime you entered a shop or something of that nature then I would object as well. However, the only real point is that police can identify you from your card rather than some other form of id, which you are obliged to provide anyway.
 
Link said:
There has been much objection to this on the grounds of privacy, but I find two problems with this argument.

1/. What are you doing that you want to keep it private from the government?

2/. These are cards. They are not GPS trackers. They are not cameras to let the police see you at all times. They are mearly a way for you to reliably prove who you are, and thats it. If we had to swipe them everytime you entered a shop or something of that nature then I would object as well. However, the only real point is that police can identify you from your card rather than some other form of id, which you are obliged to provide anyway.
Click to expand...

1) if i tell you, id have to kill you..
 
well I suppose so but I can imagine forgetting to bring the around with me.
 
I'm not for it.

Well, kinda. I guess having your age and a few basic details (photo, some kind of access code for your address and phone number) isn't too bad, and a fair few people have one to prove their age anyway, but having fingerprints and such on government record really doesn't sound to favourable to me.

As for Link's point, that's kinda like bargining into someone's (closed) bedroom without knocking, and them not liking it, but you saying they shouldn't be doing anything they don't want to see.

I don't even see why we need ti
 
<3 onions.

Sechs?

(me not being british, I won't vote).
 
If they thought Identity theft + fraud is big problem now, wait till they bring in this, the shit will hit the fan big time for the goverment. Believe me I know what im talking about.
 
I'm torn on the subject.


I think they are generally a good idea.


But it would mean I couldnt get drunk every other night of the week! :p


Heheh... so yeah...



Allthough... I will be 18 in feb... so I don't spose it affects me all that much lol..

But it would be a shame to stop the underage binge drinking culture in britain.



jking..... kinda. :p
 
A problem I have with this is something they don't often talk about...

Compulsary possesion of the card. You have to have one. They would also like it to be the law for you to ahve to carry it at all times, and if you are accosted by the police and they find out you are not carrying the card, you could be fined and even impressoned (depending ont he circumstances). Its a case of, 'if they don't have the card then we can assume they are trying to hide something'

Also, on the matter of privacy...I may not necessarily have anything to hide from the goverment, but that is not the point. Simply not having the option is basically not good enough. This is supposedly a free country...There are times when you are suspected of something, not because you have done something wrong, but because you have done something someone happens not to like.

Honestly sometimes I wonder if those gloomy images of a future world where its a police state where the populace have no control over their lives, are closer.

I don't like David Blunkett...Sometimes it feels like he wants to spite the rest of the world because he can't see; so he wants to know everything else about a person. Hes a complete control freak.
 
KagePrototype said:
I don't really mind having the ID card, I'd just rather not pay for one. No biggie really though. As long as you have nothing to hide, it's not much of a problem.
Click to expand...
I think the "Big Brother is watching you" idea that comes with them - almost inherently - is particularly objectionable. It almost has a "guilty until proven innocent" feel to it; you carry this and if you don't then we're going to assume that yes you do have something to hide.

If passports, etc. can be forged, then so can ID cards, one way or another. And, Mr. Blunkett, I fail to see how ID cards would help solve terrorism. "Excuse me sir - interesting bomb you've got there. May I see your ID? Hmmm. Okay that all seems to be in order. Carry on." Illegal immigration and employment therein; yes it could go some way to lower the problem, but as I said, they won't be forge-proof and I'm sure there will always be many unscrupulous employers willing to turn a blind eye for dodgy ID, if any. It might be able to go some way to lower crime, but I really don't see it helping that much.

David Blunkett is an awful Home Secretary, who is constantly and consciously contributing to the idea that we are under constant and dire threat from terrorism and all the world's many wondrous evils every single minute of every single hour of every single day. He's the most Conservative-esque member of the Labour party by far and that's saying something.
 
i dont mind now im 18, but i have enough ID already, passport, driving lisence, Uni card, and you can get (but they aren't garanteed to get you anywhere in pubs etc) other ID cards already, schools and colleges have 'Connexion cards' and ID cards are already voluntary and run by counties for school children to prove their age, for example to get an under-sixteen bus ticket.

And i agree, David Blunkett is a joke Home Secretary.
 
Far be it from me to resurrect old threads, but:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4577087.stm
The Tories are opposing it now which is quite a turn-around, but then it's the Tories, so who knows what they're thinking (I'm resisting making a joke about their slogan). It wouldn't surprise me if they were simply acting in direct opposite to any of Labour's actions. Although that means that the bill could still be stopped, which is interesting.
The cost of the scheme sounds extraordinary - £93 per person per year.

Thoughts?
 
I didn't buy the whole "ethical" side of the argument, and I still don't. I'm the sort of person that thinks every citizen in the country needs to have their DNA on file.

But when considering its economic/practical viability, I just don't see it working. We're having enough trouble trying to bring biometric passports into play, and when you take this ID scheme's costs and processing times into account it sounds near-impossible to implement.

So yay to the concept, nay to the reality. I'm just a shallow, self-serving individual and considering how much money successive governments have sucked out of my wallet (eeugh, not a nice image) I'm not happy with the idea of further payouts for something that'll either crash and burn or be boycotted for whatever reason.
 
oldagerocker said:
i dont mind now im 18, but i have enough ID already, passport, driving lisence, Uni card, and you can get (but they aren't garanteed to get you anywhere in pubs etc) other ID cards already, schools and colleges have 'Connexion cards' and ID cards are already voluntary and run by counties for school children to prove their age, for example to get an under-sixteen bus ticket.

And i agree, David Blunkett is a joke Home Secretary.
Click to expand...

I've got a whole load of jokes about Blunkers...but they're not for here.

Anyway I can kind of agree with the compulsary carrying a card...in a theoretical way (it'd halt those trouble making thugs easily - the ones that usually give fake addresses)

On the other hand you could be caught out if you were in a rush to go out somewhere - it assumes everyone always carries their wallet on them. And it is one step towards a police state.
Not to mention the costs.
 
It's a shite idea. Barcode the back of my ****ing head, why don't you. At least that would be harder to mislay.

They didn't stop the Madrid bombing, let's note.

Charles Clark and David Blunkett are a duo of demons summoned from the Mystical Plane of Far-Right Policies by Blair. Hopefully they will turn on him and rend his flesh.
 
Doppelgofer said:
identity cards? nice
Click to expand...

eh? i didn't write that......god i'm sure i black out at times and i morph into a giant stream of bullshit
 
I heard how many things would now be illegal and you could be arrested for if they bring this in.

~ Not having your card on you
~ Not supplying information asked for by the Home Secretary
~ Not getting a card
~ Giving false information

it goes on...and on... and ariston?
 
I personally think it is a waste of time, money and effort.
Most law abiding citizens will carry these ID card if they are introduced. The people that won't are the very people these cards are aimed at.
Thinking that forcing ID cards on everybody is in anyway going to address criminal behavior is pie in the sky.
 
kirovman said:
it'd halt those trouble making thugs easily - the ones that usually give fake addresses
Click to expand...
You mean like Comrade "123 Fake Street" Badger?
 
I don't see it as neccesary. All the information the goverment needs to know about me is on my passport. Why should information such as my fingerprints be on a card?

I don't see why people should be forced to buy a £90 card either. While I agree that the Big Brother idea is a little over stated, I can't see any use other than to have information which the goverment really doesn't have to right to keep.

I'm made all the more sceptical by the way Labour keeps changing the reason for the cards. First it was to stop terrorism. I don't see how these cards will help at all, they will simply be faked in the same way passports and any other form of identification are. Then it was to stop illegal asylum seekers, which I don't buy this either; the asylum issue seems to be about punishing immigrants who aren't rich, rather than helping the needy and keeping out the abusers. Now it's to stop identity theft, which has pretty much the same pitfalls as stopping terrorism. If people are proffessional enough to fake their identity, they will be perfectly able to fake an ID card.

To sum up, it is a very expensive move and I fail to see any honest and legitimate reason why we should have it.
 
I don't see a problem with id cards as long as they can be guarenteed to make Britain a safer place and prove to be a worthwhile cost.
 
Lobotomy Lobster said:
I'm made all the more sceptical by the way Labour keeps changing the reason for the cards. First it was to stop terrorism. I don't see how these cards will help at all, they will simply be faked in the same way passports and any other form of identification are. Then it was to stop illegal asylum seekers, which I don't buy this either; the asylum issue seems to be about punishing immigrants who aren't rich, rather than helping the needy and keeping out the abusers. Now it's to stop identity theft, which has pretty much the same pitfalls as stopping terrorism. If people are proffessional enough to fake their identity, they will be perfectly able to fake an ID card.
Click to expand...
My thoughts exactly. I see no way whatsoever that this could help combat the ever-present (or so the government would have us believe) terrorist threat. That's just a flimsy excuse playing on the buzz-word of a culture of fear.

I can see that, initially at least, it might prevent some illegal immigration, but no system is infallible and these cards will not be any different. They WILL be forged, and very well, eventually - it's just the way these things go.

...and let's not forget that all this "tackling illegal immigration" business always seems to side-step one of the most crucial issues; their employers. These immigrants can't "steal our jobs" if no-one's prepared to give them jobs, but no-one ever seems to go "These are the people most at fault." Surely they are?

No employers for illegal immigrants = No jobs for illegal immigrants = No motive for illegal immigrants to illegally immigrate.

It really is THAT simple, but people rarely if ever point that out. No, I wouldn't want to say that it's entirely a racial/nationalistic factor with that, but that's gotta be part of it. It's much easier to rail against this kind of thing harming our country when we don't have to blame our fellow countrymen.
 
The strange thing is, i can understand the American's being so petrified of all of this terrorist activity and threats of bombings in America as they aren't used to it, the strange thing is, Britain on the other hand has been under pretty much constant attack from one of the most well organised terrorist organisations in the world, they have bombed civilian areas, attacked military personnel and military bases and also gone after politicians, yet we never needed such measures against the ira.

The ira posed a far greater threat to Britain then Al Quada could ever dream of doing.
 
Our government have created the terrorist threat. In reality it is minimal. Not worth restricting our freedoms over.
 
Razor said:
The strange thing is, i can understand the American's being so petrified of all of this terrorist activity and threats of bombings in America as they aren't used to it, the strange thing is, Britain on the other hand has been under pretty much constant attack from one of the most well organised terrorist organisations in the world, they have bombed civilian areas, attacked military personnel and military bases and also gone after politicians, yet we never needed such measures against the ira.

The ira posed a far greater threat to Britain then Al Quada could ever dream of doing.
Click to expand...
Precisely. I have all respect for how awful 9/11 was, but it pissed me off when someone from the US military or high-ranking government personell (in my irritation, I forgot whom) harped on about how it was the worst single act of terrorism in history. This may be, but in Britain, we've lost more than that and over thirty odd years thanks to the IRA, and a comment like that makes it sound as if they've had the worst onslaught from terrorism of all time and makes other countries' "experiences" of terrorism sound like a stroll in the park. Grrr, that annoyed me.
 
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