Use your heads, THINK about it for a second

[poseyjmac]

I didn't trust Irrational Games with Tribes Vengeance. That game is practicallly Fisher-Price material.

were you into tribes1?

 

[JimmyPage]

I wonder.. if Valve make enough money from this next generation of source based games - including licensing - would their next move be to set up a publishing company of their own?

They already seem intent on cutting out the middle man with steam. Re-acquiring the IP for the Half-Life series would make sense from this perspective too.

Once their contract with VU runs out they'd be free to do whatever they wanted really, and there would be no shortage of willing investors for such a plan both outside and within the company. I think if I were in their position this is the route I would prefer to go down.

This make sense to anyone else?

 

[Gray Fox]

But if their wasn't a gta: san andreas comming out, a lot of people would have forgotten about it, not so with hl, after six years its still popular because of the people who do know that valve made the games, if those people were not important why would valve go to all that trouble to pleas them, besides you didn't pay attention to my commnet about steam, because you have to have steam to play cs or hl, everyone ewho has it knows about valve, and about you're comment about the movies, well thats true, exept you foret about the fact that there are people like Steven Spielberg, and you can compare Valve to him or george lucas, do yoy think anybody would be that much interested in starwars if George Lucas wouldn't be invloved in it or if the ip was taken from him, I don't think so. Casual gamer do get there info from theru nerd friend and game mags wich would dis HL3 if it wasn't mad by Valve , and especially if the ip was taken from them by VUG. The mags would critizes the move to death. You think theri are not much people whio know that shit, well then how do you explain hl and cs popularity after six years, its not so popular becaus of Avrage Joe Player but because of the fans, and wht you say could maybe work if HL3 was realised a year from hL2 when all the ordinary people would remember it still, but it would take them a lot more time to make quality game and by that time all the people whi made hl2 fansites would be making fansites for another of Valves, HL2 just needs Valve, games are not like movies especially pc games, for consoles you might be right but pc is dominated by people who actually know how to install a game and not Avrage Joe Gamor, and besides VUG knows that the mods made hl so popular and do you think there would be more mods for hl3 if it was done by another team than for another game then developed by Valve,

In short Valve is to HL, wat George Lucas is for Starwars.
( and BTW I'm a Trekkie not a SW fan, if anybody wants to know, never really understod what was so special about SW, I only like sw: attak of the clones.)

 

[poseyjmac]

But if their wasn't a gta: san andreas comming out, a lot of people would have forgotten about it, not so with hl, after six years its still popular because of the people who do know that valve made the games, if those people were not important why would valve go to all that trouble to pleas them, besides you didn't pay attention to my commnet about steam, because you have to have steam to play cs or hl, everyone ewho has it knows about valve, and about you're comment about the movies, well thats true, exept you foret about the fact that there are people like Steven Spielberg, and you can compare Valve to him or george lucas, do yoy think anybody would be that much interested in starwars if George Lucas wouldn't be invloved in it or if the ip was taken from him, I don't think so. Casual gamer do get there info from theru nerd friend and game mags wich would dis HL3 if it wasn't mad by Valve , and especially if the ip was taken from them by VUG. The mags would critizes the move to death. You think theri are not much people whio know that shit, well then how do you explain hl and cs popularity after six years, its not so popular becaus of Avrage Joe Player but because of the fans, and wht you say could maybe work if HL3 was realised a year from hL2 when all the ordinary people would remember it still, but it would take them a lot more time to make quality game and by that time all the people whi made hl2 fansites would be making fansites for another of Valves, HL2 just needs Valve, games are not like movies especially pc games, for consoles you might be right but pc is dominated by people who actually know how to install a game and not Avrage Joe Gamor, and besides VUG knows that the mods made hl so popular and do you think there would be more mods for hl3 if it was done by another team than for another game then developed by Valve,

In short Valve is to HL, wat George Lucas is for Starwars.
( and BTW I'm a Trekkie not a SW fan, if anybody wants to know, never really understod what was so special about SW, I only like sw: attak of the clones.)

people are into hl six years from now because it was easily moddable, and counter-strike. and the game was a cool game. valve isn't the only company that could have done this.

and that last part is funny actually. many star wars fans don't want george lucas to work on the 3rd because people say he butchered 1 and 2. yet they will see it anyways because its star wars.

 

[[[LuCkY]]]

You guys are going nuts over a stupid legal clause dug up and spread like wildfire. Relax and think about the situation.

Why would VUG purposely withhold the game? Just to "piss Valve off"? No, this isn't high school, this is business. It all boils down to the dollar. I guarantee you VUG wants to release this game ASAP so they can earn their money just like Valve will. The ONLY thing that would be keeping VUG from releasing ASAP is problems/negotiations over distribution methods. If there are problems with the contracts outlining distribution over Steam and it's pricing, THEN there may be a delay. And if there is, this delay would be nowhere near 6 months. VUG is smarter than that.

Also, VUG, which isn't doing so hot right now (They only have Valve and Blizzard as guaranteed income games), would be committing corporate suicide if they pettily refused to release this game. Shareholders would be pissed, sell their stocks, and re-invest with a different company. And 95% of their shareholders probably have no interest in when we get to play HL2, they just want to see their stock prices rise.

Relax

 

[Mountain Man]

Well it appears they have held back games in the past, CS:CZ went gold but wasn't released in stores until months later, the copies of it just sat idle in the warehouse.

Not quite the same. CZ was never going to be a big seller. From a business standpoint, it would be a huge mistake to miss out on releasing a guarenteed blockbuster like Half-Life 2 during the lucrative holiday season.

 

[killahsin-[CE]]

VUg has done it 3 times publically, and who knows how many times privately to its titles, this is why people are worried.

I somehow doubt they willd elay it for 6 months though. But i do think they will delay as far into the holiday rush as they can.

 

[Gray Fox]

people are into hl six years from now because it was easily moddable, and counter-strike. and the game was a cool game. valve isn't the only company that could have done this.

and that last part is funny actually. many star wars fans don't want george lucas to work on the 3rd because people say he butchered 1 and 2. yet they will see it anyways because its star wars.

Still do you think if VUG handed hl3 to another company and Valve went on to make another game, this site and all the hl fansites would exist, probably not, they would be about the new game Valve would make, even if people don't know about Valve, wich I doubt because of steam and the fact that now a lot of people can buygames via it and most of them because of it know what Valve is, further more hl3 would probably be unfairly critisized from the beginning even if it tourned out to be pretty good, and it wouldn't enjoy the support of so many modmakers, remeber this is not GTA, MGS, Mario, this game is aimed at the nerds, geeks, and anyone who knows how to install a game, I mean the ordinanry gamer gets even confused about steam, hell even the pro does, so I still remain convinced that on the ip of hl isn't much money to be made without HL3.

Secondly I also think George Lucas sucks, he directed SW: epsode 4 and episode 1 and they both sucked, the other ones he let real directors dorect, and are you sure that the fans are saying he shouldn't be involved, because this sounds more to me the critizism of critics than of fans, cause they pretty much worship him like I do Hideo Kojima.

( hehe :imu: :imu: this is pretty funny, I found somebody i can infinetly disagree on with about everything, we should hang out :cheers: )

 

[Feath]

Not quite the same. CZ was never going to be a big seller. From a business standpoint, it would be a huge mistake to miss out on releasing a guarenteed blockbuster like Half-Life 2 during the lucrative holiday season.

I disagree totally. Counter-Strike is the most succesive online game ever. I don't know how many copies it would've sold but it's probably going to be surprisingly high. It won't have sold as much as The Sims or Half-Life, but the it would've outsold a number of "successful" games.

Anyway, I think the amount of copies that Half-Life 2 will sell will be staggering. The amount it will sell because of Christmas will be negligable compared. It'll be average games with less brand reconition that would benefit more from the Christmas period.

Not that I think that Vivendi are going to delay it till next year.

 

[poseyjmac]

Still do you think if VUG handed hl3 to another company and Valve went on to make another game, this site and all the hl fansites would exist, probably not,

this is irrelevant as we aren't the biggest % of gamers. and STILL its a long shot to think that hl fansites would disappear.

if a commercial for the new halflife came on TV/ad on the internet/etc, 1. a certain large percentage would see it, and say that looks like fun for me or someone i know, and buy it. 2. another large percentage would say hmmm, according to previous games this theoeretically should be good, and buy it. then trickling down to smaller, smarter percentages, 3. those who look up reviews, ask about it on forums, look at screenshots. if its not a total failure, they will buy it as well, because...its halflife, all its history has been magnificent. 4. then theres the hardcore halflife community that just loves the storyline/universe/characters and dont care how butchered it ever gets. they will automatically buy it.

THEN you get to the small percentage of people you are describing. the ones who are unsure of halflife in the hands of someone other than valve. this would include me as well. these guys would be split into another sub-group. those who are blindly devoted to valve and will not buy halflife no matter how good it is, and those who are actually intelligent and like games based on how good they are. so theoretically if the new halflife game that wasn't developed by valve was good, id buy it, and that would of course trickle down to all those percentages i mentioned resulting in many sales.

which is a lot more than 'nobody'. and 'nobody' is the amount of people you said would be interested in it.

 

[johngloid]

Well it appears they have held back games in the past, CS:CZ went gold but wasn't released in stores until months later, the copies of it just sat idle in the warehouse.

So yes it appears Vivendi has withheld games in the past to put pressure on Valve or as it is often put, to "piss Valve off". Whether they do it again with HL2 is another matter of course but it is still something to worry about.

No, Valve kept CZ out of Vivendi's hands because they wanted to release it on Steam, not just in stores.

 

[Gray Fox]

this is irrelevant as we aren't the biggest % of gamers. and STILL its a long shot to think that hl fansites would disappear.

if a commercial for the new halflife came on TV/ad on the internet/etc, 1. a certain large percentage would see it, and say that looks like fun for me or someone i know, and buy it. 2. another large percentage would say hmmm, according to previous games this theoeretically should be good, and buy it. then trickling down to smaller, smarter percentages, 3. those who look up reviews, ask about it on forums, look at screenshots. if its not a total failure, they will buy it as well, because...its halflife, all its history has been magnificent. 4. then theres the hardcore halflife community that just loves the storyline/universe/characters and dont care how butchered it ever gets. they will automatically buy it.

THEN you get to the small percentage of people you are describing. the ones who are unsure of halflife in the hands of someone other than valve. this would include me as well. these guys would be split into another sub-group. those who are blindly devoted to valve and will not buy halflife no matter how good it is, and those who are actually intelligent and like games based on how good they are. so theoretically if the new halflife game that wasn't developed by valve was good, id buy it, and that would of course trickle down to all those percentages i mentioned resulting in many sales.

which is a lot more than 'nobody'. and 'nobody' is the amount of people you said would be interested in it.

Well ok, no sense in arguing on a forum, like a wise man said once:
Arguing on a forum is a bit like racing in the Special Olympics..... even if you win, you're still retarded.

But now for a question:
Do you or anybody else here for that matter think that VUG would get more money if Valve made the game and it was sold trough steam and trough retail, or would they make more money if they let another team do it and it was sold only trough VUG( I know its dependent on the quality and all, but i don't need a prediction just an gues of what you think, just say what pops up the first on you're mind about this). Simply put is is financially better to stick with Valve and steam or not?

 

[Yellonet]

Well ok, no sense in arguing on a forum, like a wise man said once:
Arguing on a forum is a bit like racing in the Special Olympics..... even if you win, you're still retarded.

If you mean Paralympics; the participants are not retarded.

 

[DrEvil]

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, so I'll answer. No, they can't. They would most certainly be sued into the ground and cease to exist. Six months is their maximum according to contract.

They would lose the contract for sure, not sure about getting sued. Besides, there is one more thing, the 6 months time limit is starting from when an acceptable final RC that meets the contract criteria is delivered to VUG. They could keep rejecting RCs for minor issues and delay the 6 month timer itself.

 

[Feath]

No, Valve kept CZ out of Vivendi's hands because they wanted to release it on Steam, not just in stores.

Well, then Valve's court case isn't going to go well.

Valve: Vivendi have breeched our contract because they delayed CZ out of the holiday season.
Judge: No they didn't, that was you.
Valve: Oh yeah. DAMN!

 

[exoeight]

Valve: Vivendi have breeched our contract because they delayed CZ out of the holiday season.
Judge: No they didn't, that was you.
Valve: Oh yeah. DAMN!

lol, that's a funny quote, nice.

rollplay rocks.

 

[Gray Fox]

If you mean Paralympics; the participants are not retarded.

:afro: Sorry is that was insulting, I just quoted it because i tought it was funny, and I know its wrong to make this kind of jokes, but the inside me just couldn't resist.

:afro: just so you know, I don't think handicapt people are retarded and I admire the olympist who participate in the Paralypics :cheese:

 

[poseyjmac]

Well ok.

glad you understand!

 

[Gray Fox]

So how about anyone awnsering my question?

 

[Wilco]

Its probably about the same, the people who buy it through steam would be the people who know about Valve the developer, and who wouldn't buy it if it was made by someone else. However that's immaterial if Valve own the Intellectual property.

P.S. Counter Strike retail sales were about 1.2million, not a small amount by any means, so CZ probably sold pretty well.

 

[Reaktor4]

Why would that guy from vug have even mentioned them being able to delay it for 6 months after gold for no reason, if they werent planning on doing it?
Also, why the **** did valve sign a contract allowing them to do this?