Vortigaunts getting more powerful?

[orzhovslodier]

In Hl1, vortigaunts were fairly weak, your average video game enemy. Not too hard, a couple of bullets will work out fine. IN HL 2 they didn't really have much of a combat presence, but if you spawn them they'll attack things and they seem to do a fair amount of damage. They teleport in ep1 and save Alyx, and stop the gman, who seems pretty powerful, what with the keeping you in stasis for a couple of decades. I haven't bothered to try and spawn them ingame.

However, in ep2, not only do they change appearance (why I don't know) they turn into these unstoppable, lightning shooting, shockwaving, unstoppable as-kickers, who can bring Alyx back from the brink of death. I'm not sure how to gauge what that vortigaunt says right after you get the car, about killing advisors in their pods, but considering how even the damaged, immature advisor you meet in the barn is almost unstoppable (I still wonder how those advisors at the end of ep2 didn't sense dog coming), that would imply that vortigaunts are very, very powerful. So, how do you reconcile their depiction in hl1 with their depiction in the other games?

Sorry for any typos, if this is in the wrong section, or if this is a dead horse or something.

 

[jet_porkins]

I'm not sure how to gauge what that vortigaunt says right after you get the car, about killing advisors in their pods, but considering how even the damaged, immature advisor you meet in the barn is almost unstoppable ... that would imply that vortigaunts are very, very powerful. So, how do you reconcile their depiction in hl1 with their depiction in the other games?

I'm not sure I understand your logic. Could you please clarify your point about advisers being really powerful, which means that Vorts are that much more powerful?

So, how do you reconcile their depiction in hl1 with their depiction in the other games?

Game developing in 1998 versus game developing in 2004. That's how.

 

[flamingdts]

I'm not sure I understand your logic. Could you please clarify your point about advisers being really powerful, which means that Vorts are that much more powerful?

I think he is trying to imply that since the Vortigaunts are going Adviser hunting, and a single injured Adviser itself is already extremely powerful, then vortigaunts themselves must be really strong to hunt for them.

Even if that is what he meant, he is still not entirely correct. The Vortigaunts don't hunt for fully functional advisers, they hunt for those still in hibernation.

 

[orzhovslodier]

I think he is trying to imply that since the Vortigaunts are going Adviser hunting, and a single injured Adviser itself is already extremely powerful, then vortigaunts themselves must be really strong to hunt for them.

Even if that is what he meant, he is still not entirely correct. The Vortigaunts don't hunt for fully functional advisers, they hunt for those still in hibernation.

True, but the advisor in the barn was also still in hibernation.

 

[Darkside55]

You have to imagine, if the vortigaunts you fought in HL1 were on the same level as the vortigaunts in Episode 2, then every encounter with them would have been a long, difficult fight. They would have gone from standard cannon fodder to miniboss-level badguys.

Also, whenever you have an NPC partner in a game it's no fun to have to constantly watch them to make sure they're alright; i.e. not on the brink of death or doing something stupid. You don't want a partner who can't hold their own, and on top of that if you have to travel with an NPC for awhile it's much more interesting visually if they can do more than one thing. (Shoot lightning)

So gameplay-wise, that's the reason.

If you want an in-game story reason just assume that all the vortigaunts in HL1 were scared out of their wits after being teleported to an unknown location and met with hostile humans, and they couldn't summon up their full battle potential. They were disorganized, disjointed, and didn't want to fight in the first place.

 

[Headcrab Pie]

My explanation for their weakness in HL1 is that the arm/neck bands reduced their power, in order to make a uprising among the structure (Nathilith-Controller-Alien Grunt-Vort) less likely.

 

[flamingdts]

True, but the advisor in the barn was also still in hibernation.

That was an independent case. It just so happens that either Alyx failed to properly shut off it's life support system or the advisor was already preparing to exit hibernation.

Either way, Vortigaunts don't stand a chance against Advisors. In fact, they don't even stand a chance against a combine strike team that invades homes. There may be a few vortigaunts that are exceptionally powerful, but most of them are probably only able to kill several combines before being taken down themselves. They are only strong and weak for gameplay reasons only.

I think the question you should be asking is "how damn powerful is dog?", because you can visually see from scripted events (intended events) that he can easily take out combine vehicles and large groups of combines without sustaining any damage.

 

[Saturos]

Don't forget that they also broke the "spell" that G-man put on Gordon that made him his bitch at the beginning of EP1.

 

[jet_porkins]

I think the question you should be asking is "how damn powerful is dog?", because you can visually see from scripted events (intended events) that he can easily take out combine vehicles and large groups of combines without sustaining any damage.

I have a feeling that will prove to be a fluke. The advisers can evidently bend and control solid materials (fire, wind, water, and heart are yet to be seen). It's only a matter of time until an adviser matures enough to the point that it can lift a tank and crush it like a soda can.

If that "maturity" theory is correct, then even Dog won't stand a chance, and fate will then lay with the gravity gun.

 

[Darkside55]

The advisers can evidently bend and control solid materials (fire, wind, water, and heart are yet to be seen).

Dude. If you think about it, everything the Combine has done on Earth has been part of summoning Captain Pollution: deforestation, smog, toxics, super radiation, and hate.

 

[Ennui]

My explanation for their weakness in HL1 is that the arm/neck bands reduced their power, in order to make a uprising among the structure (Nathilith-Controller-Alien Grunt-Vort) less likely.

This seems like the most reasonable explanation for the discrepancy between HL and HL2 vortigaunts to me.

It is also worth noting that usually when the vorts do something really intense, it's when many vorts do it together (such as blocking the G-Man and healing Alyx).

 

[Darkside55]

And don't forget that it's always after imbibing the extraaaaaaact

 

[Dr0ndeh]

And don't forget that it's always after imbibing the extraaaaaaact

that whole shtick and the entire antlion tunnels section completely ruins ep2 for me. whenever i want a wee blast of hl2 i always load ep2, get to that bit and think '**** it i cant be bothered.'

true it has a good payoff with the cool gman speech but cmon valve mustve realised that whole section was terrible.

 

[Ennui]

Whaaaat?

I thought that was one of the best parts of Ep2.

 

[Absinthe]

I did too, but... I still miss the old HL1 vortigaunts. I've never really come to accept the way they talk now.

 

[Asknoone]

I think the antlion tunnels were definitely the weakest part of Episode 2.

 

[Barnz]

I thought that was one of the best parts of Ep2.

same, they remind me tunnels in hl1

 

[Bob Saget]

It's been a while since I played Episode 2, but the giant antlion that chases you was really, really awesome. The rest of the tunnels? Not so awesome at all.

 

[Shem]

It's been a while since I played Episode 2, but the giant antlion that chases you was really, really awesome. The rest of the tunnels? Not so awesome at all.

Indeed, I found those moments to be fun when the Antlion Guardian is chasing you. They move quickly and can easily fling you a long distance away with their heads - which could be an advantage for you if you land near a cave opening.

 

[jet_porkins]

It's been a while since I played Episode 2, but the giant antlion that chases you was really, really awesome. The rest of the tunnels? Not so awesome at all.

Oh man.

Nothing makes me more tense than when a big effin thing is rampaging at me from behind, and I can only guess how close it is until it inevitably tramples me.

Oh man.

Spoiler

that's what she said

 

[Darkside55]

I still wish we would've seen the antlion king.

 

[Absinthe]

I would have been both terrified and amused in equal measure.

 

[Botolf]

The Antlion caves were awesome, defense room, dead bodies, chase scene and all.

 

[GiRoX]

I think that the Vorts in Hl1 were weaker because

a) They were being controlled and I like to pretend they were more like zombies, just roaming around killing everything.

b) They were fighting you Gordon Freeman. Everything seems weak to Gordon Freeman.

But even though they couldnt take much damage, their electricity attack did a lot of damage on higher difficulties.

As for the tunnels in Ep2, I liked the part because the tunnels were sweet, there were some cool puzzles, zombies, and that scary antilion Guard chase. The only thing I hated was the Acid Antlions, they were annoying.

 

[orzhovslodier]

My explanation for their weakness in HL1 is that the arm/neck bands reduced their power, in order to make a uprising among the structure (Nathilith-Controller-Alien Grunt-Vort) less likely.

That actually makes a lot of sense. Problem solved I guess.

 

[Otto-Grainer]

You hadn't thought of that? Aren't their differences the first thing you think of? The whole idea that they were suppressed and controled by their more powerful, race related masters is striking.

 

[13LACKBISHOP]

Like humans some vorts could be more powerful than others in the same way that mike tyson is a tougher than a school teacher or perhaps some are more developed/experienced than others. Both could explain why some could access the g-mans realm and others could not. Besides we dont know for sure whether they were that much tougher or not becouse we never fought them. Maybe they just had more abilities in number 2 becouse they did not think of putting them in the first one or perhaps did not want to. Plus they were probably beefed up when they were on your side in the same way the rebels were against the cybernetic combine. As for the healing thing how do know they could not do that in the first one?

 

[Xoidanor]

There's a much more simple explanation then what you guys are proposing.

Lets look at the facts. In episode 2 we see them kicking ass and chewing bubblegum against antlions.

In HL1 we seem them being massacred by a scientist in a HEV suit with a shotgun.

Do you note the most glaring difference? Antlions do not use firearms, Gordon does.
I can't imagine their sleek skin stopping bullets that well anytime soon

 

[Noodle]

There's a much more simple explanation then what you guys are proposing.

Lets look at the facts. In episode 2 we see them kicking ass and chewing bubblegum against antlions.

In HL1 we seem them being massacred by a scientist in a HEV suit with a shotgun.

Do you note the most glaring difference? Antlions do not use firearms, Gordon does.
I can't imagine their sleek skin stopping bullets that well anytime soon

Then how do they go around killing advisors?

 

[Xoidanor]

Then how do they go around killing advisors?

1. You do realize the advisors are using psychic powers as well, not conventional firearms.
(that and they we're hunting the ones who hadn't developed yet)

2. THEY CAN SHOOT LIGHTING WITH THEIR HANDS! HOW ABOUT SOME ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF THIS MIRACLE?!



Any questions?

 

[kittypurry]

The only thing I hated was the Acid Antlions, they were annoying.

Same - and that noise they make drove me insane. especially when the little ****s hid behind the green pillars of antlion cum.:angry:

the guard made it all worth it in the end. they were epic!

 

[kittypurry]

and as for the vortigaunts, they had little necklaces around their necks that inhibited their more special abilities, i think (dont quote me on this) It says something about that in Raising The Bar?
then there is the more glaringly obvious fact of storyline development - their promotion from entry level baddie to resistance fighter was inspired, but probably not canon when half life was first released, no?

 

[orzhovslodier]

Or maybe its just the HEV suit. Man, I feel like an idiot.

 

[13LACKBISHOP]

Or maybe its just the HEV suit. Man, I feel like an idiot.

Whaaaa?

 

[Noodle]

If I recall correctly, wasn't there a slave Vortigaunt sweeping the train station in the beginning of HL2? Complete with neck-brace and such.

 

[orzhovslodier]

Whaaaa?

The HEV suit is providing protection....you don't get killed in one hit by a vortigaunt blast for the same reason you can withstand more gunfire than those dumb-ass rebels.

 

[ranmafan]

Also: The vortigaunt did particularly well against the Antlions because they have been the natural keepers (like beekeepers) of such creatures for generations. They WOULD know how to handle themselves around Antlions, if nothing else.

Although push come to shove, the Vorts would probably do pretty well against most foes if given the right advantages, such as personal protection. (Vorts seem to do far better than humans in that regard at least) Ultimately everything's mortal, so it's unreasonable to expect a vort to be a one-alien army unlike Freeman. (unless you gave one of them an HEV suit???) =P

And yes, Vorts seem to gain strength in numbers, especially if they focus around certain beings/units (such as Freeman, or a sort of enclave or tribal/family group), so it could be the recent liberation of so many vorts is having a positive effect on their overall selves.