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Tork
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Some great storys but its gonna take more then that for me to believe it, however I do believe in life on other planets but not intelligent life, stuff like small animal or something probably.
99% proof of extraterrestrial life.
- Thread starter Xenome
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Neutrino said:Note: All quotes come from their website.
These things are all the same and sadly, it's pretty apparent that this fits the usual pattern of these things from what they say on their website. Read on....
Funny, how they can talk freely about it then.
Ok, so first they introduce some unknown factor (Aliens/UFO's in this case, thus providing the mystical/unexplainable ingredient they need), then go on to promise a technological utopia that promises to provide free energy, solve world hunger, and fix the environment (Thus providing the bait to get people interested.). Though of course they don't bother to explain any technical details about these amazing perfect devices that will fix everything. Hence the reason for the UFO crap in the first place. It allows them to make claims without any proof or evidence since it's from an "Alien civilization" and thus probably far to complex to explain to us.
Sheesh, give me a break.
Oh, and it's nice and convenient that in the last 50 years or so we've come to completely understand this Alien technology so completely that they are confident of replicating it and mass producing it for the world at large. Let's ignore little facts that mankind, which barely had a working computer 50 years ago somehow has managed to completely understand and build alien technology hundreds of years in advance of our own capability.
And let's not forget something that they nicely gloss over in their brave talk of a new world. Seriously, what do you think would be the result of these kind of technologies becoming available? World peace like they claim? Or do you think that every government on Earth might just want to get their hands on this for military and defense purposes. In today's world climate it would most likely result in an arms race and the technology would be milked for all it was worth by every military on the planet. No one would want to fall behind since that sort of technological edge could spell disaster for a government left behind. I'd say we'd be lucky if we survived the introduction of these devices let alone go right into achieving some sort of world utopia. Heck they even admit the possible devestation such technology could wreck:
And what is there plan to prevent such a thing from happening? Well rest assured they have a good one:
Oh, I see. I'm sure we all agree how mature the international community is right now. I mean just look at the reasonable and peaceful way we've all dealt with the Iraq situation. I'm sure once everyone realizes how silly they've been for the past several hundred years all the countries will pull together, have a nice group hug, and decide to get along in light of what these technological wonders have to offer. Yep. Sure.
And then we have this:
Wait a minute. So the president isn't in on it, congress isn't in on it, the UN isn't in on it. So who are these mysterious people, who apparently don't answer to anyone in the government, that control access to these UFO's. Oh, it's a "secret" organization" I'm sure. You know, the one that sends black helicopters out to spy on your movements when you drive to work. Let's see if we can't get some more information on this group of dastardly people hellbent on keeping the world from it's rightful utopia. Ah, here's a better description of them:
Ooh, it's getting more mysterious now. Queue X-files music......
Anywho:
Well, I'm not sure where spirtuality came into play in all this, but they sure do play for keep don't they? Heh, makes me feel all tingly inside knowing the "destiny of the human race hangs in the balance." It's like reading a newspaper add in a late night B-movie flick.
Well, I could probably go on and on, but I'm sure I've bored you enough if you bothered to read any of that. If you want to skip over my ramblings I'll put the most important part here:
Life is complicated. When you put 6 billions lives on one planet it get's really complicated. We have a lot of very complex problems, which will require matching complex solutions. Nothing is ever simple in a world like ours. Human nature practically dictates that it cannot be. So what I'm trying to say is that when someone offers simple, sweeping solutions that promise to fix all our problems with very little effort or work involved it's practically always lies (even if they have good intentions).
If it's too good to be true it invariably is.
In the beginning of this post I said these things are all the same. What I meant is that no matter if it's the promise of some magical form of "free" energy, a secret carborator that does 200 miles per gallon, a religious cult that promises you everlasting happiness, or a conspired alien coverup that will solve all the worlds woes, they're all the same. They're all people grasping desperately at simple solutions to complex problems. Sadly, in the real world if a solution is actually worthwhile it's going to need a lot of hard work to implement. Such simple, wonderful solutions promised by some are not to be had. So in the end, I'm saying be wary of a free lunch, for if it's really worth eating it's probably worth paying for it.
Alright, that's as philisophical as I'll get today. I promise. I just wanted to add that I meant no offense to anyone by the somewhat saracastic and contemptuos tone I took when discussing this organization. It was not directed at anyone who believes what they say or disagrees with me. It was only directed at the organization itself, since these things always annoy me to no end. So sorry if I seemed rude in ridiculing their ideas. I didn't not mean offense at all.
(Hmm, wonder if anyone will actually read all that.)
AS THEY SAY IN THE VIDEO, WICH YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE NOT SEEN: They won't go in the technical detail, because it's a press conference, and they won't even understand it.
You also wouldn't, if they explained it to you now.
They do however have documents ( wich they do show )
WICH PROVE what they say. Earlier, i gave a site wich shows how the alien reproduction vehicle works, in techical detail.
Don't understand it tough
On understanding alien technology:
If they can studie it, when the vehicle is lying in front of them, of course they can learn how to understand it, in 50 years.
They STARTED TO STUDY IT IN 1950, they didn't already understood it back then.
And no, they don't understand 'all alien technology', they only understand this part.
Furthermore, you're acting like "they're all the same', and all theories of extraterrestrial life are pure bullshit.
This simply means your not being open-minded.
OF COURSE the usa goverment can have classified 'divisions', wich only few people know of.
It's possible, so don't rule it out if you don't have proof of it's non-existence.
Of course it can be that you are totally right.
It can also be that they are speaking the truth.
What would they have to gain?
Spending alot of money on a campaign, for nothing? just lying?
They have to gain something with this, and I think that those 400 people finnally want to speak out the truth.
They saw it, you didn't.
Also look at my post earlier, about the mexican sighting, of wich mexican goverment released video material. You call that 'all the same', with the actual pilot telling us his story?
As i said earlier, the only proof for 'people like you'
P) is a living headcrab on your monitor.--
This is my final reply to this thread for now..
It amazes me how ignorant people can be when it comes to subjects like this.
400 people from intelligence, cia, military high class positions, want to finnally disclose this subject and come out with their stories, willing to testify in congress.
That's pure proof to me, also concidering all the other sightnings.
Dr.Greer wrote a memo about it to president Bush.
And still some people keep on believing that it's "all the same".
You will never accept the truth, unless you see an alien yourself, am I right?
Remember, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
CptStern
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Neutrino said:
this is exactly what this group says
he even has a fancy spacesuit to prove he's met aliens
Neutrino
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Xenome said:
I doubt it. Starting without computer support and only have fifty years to jump hundreds of years ahead in technology. Highly unlikely.
Xenome said:
What? They claim that it is going to solve all the world problems so they obviously are saying they understand a hell of a lot, including the concepts behind it.
Xenome said:
I'm not really talking about alien theories here. I'm talking about groups who promise everything conveniently on a silver platter with no strings attached. They seem to all go about it the same way. I'm not even really concerned about their alien theories with this. Their website amply demonstrates what kind of group they are to me.
Xenome said:
Oh, a secret "classified" division that "only a few people know of" and that is controlling all these things. Yet this group apparently knows all about them somehow. How odd....yet convenient. I guess this classified division is not very good at being a secret organization after all. They manage to hide from every government in the world only to fall prey to the wily ways of a non-profit organization. Shameful really.
Xenome said:Of course it can be that you are totally right.
It can also be that they are speaking the truth.
What would they have to gain?
Spending alot of money on a campaign, for nothing? just lying?
They have to gain something with this, and I think that those 400 people finnally want to speak out the truth.
They saw it, you didn't.
Also look at my post earlier, about the mexican sighting, of wich mexican goverment released video material. You call that 'all the same', with the actual pilot telling us his story?
As i said earlier, the only proof for 'people like you'
I'm not even really concerned with whatever "evidence" they are throwing around. Nothing on their website makes any logical sense. I don't pretend to know about the authenticity of their witnesses or videos or such without a lot more investigation. But the fact that they website is full of propaganda, logical inconsistancies, and outright lies I don't put much faith in any evidence they care to present. If they really had the "truth" in their hands then I would think it would be advisable for them to put up a more legitimate and believable front.
Xenome said:
Very true. But that is a somewhat tricky saying. You can use it to say that anything might be true based soley on lack of evidence. Yet there is a limit to such things. After all the same argument could be used for things like the tooth ferry, the easter bunny and santa clause. I'm not saying that it's invalid by any means. But there are severe limits to how far a lack of evidence can go in providing evidence of existence.
Mechagodzilla
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CptStern said:
Oh man, it's Rael!
He inspired me to start my own half-assed cult.
Join the Techrims everybody!
We believe that earth is important, so our theology is really just basic ecology!
Neutrino said:
"I doubt it. Starting without computer support and only have fifty years to jump hundreds of years ahead in technology. Highly unlikely"
They could make a nuclear bomb at that time without computers, why couldn't they do this? Who said you need a computer for this? It's something with electricity, is what i read at that site i gave earlier about dr.greer's book.
( time is an illusion btw -- nothing to do with this, but still )
"Oh, a secret "classified" division that "only a few people know of" and that is controlling all these things. Yet this group apparently knows all about them somehow. How odd....yet convenient. I guess this classified division is not very good at being a secret organization after all. They manage to hide from every government in the world only to fall prey to the wily ways of a non-profit organization. Shameful really."
Well, the witnesses worked in the government, and got 'glimpses' of those projects. They don't know the details, they only know what they have been told, or saw.
Of course I don't know about all that, I just know that 400 witnesses are willing to share these stories. Why would they want to testify in court?
In the video, these witnesses are sincere, and really want to get the truth out.
But besides all this: Are you implying that all these 400 witnesses, who worked at the government,intelligence ,military, etc, sometimes high class jobs, are you implying that they are lying?
And what would they have to gain by doing so, including dr.greer?
Why would he spend his money on a campaign in order to get the truth out?
Please watch the video.
--
You make some good points, and you seem like an intelligent guy, but still, try to see this from an other angle , starting with watching that video
Earlier you said:
"Life is complicated. When you put 6 billions lives on one planet it get's really complicated. We have a lot of very complex problems, which will require matching complex solutions. Nothing is ever simple in a world like ours. Human nature practically dictates that it cannot be. So what I'm trying to say is that when someone offers simple, sweeping solutions that promise to fix all our problems with very little effort or work involved it's practically always lies (even if they have good intentions). "
If they DID have a replacement for recources we are using now, what you're saying is untrue.
We need to look for something like this anyway, since recources on earth are depleting..
You need to stop calling it 'all the same' ;p
I believe there IS a solution to all wars and poverty in the world.
Read the books of neale donald walsch. (www.cwg.org)
And no I'm not someone who believes everything he sees, without studying throrougly first
Neutrino
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Ok, I'll try and watch the video later and consider what it has to say if you'll look over their website and see how ridiculous it is. Just spend some time really thinking about what they say and the consequences and ramifications of it. In the end it basically all boils down in vague promises and even more vague ideas. Nothing truly concrete is ever said. It's all kept slightly hazy and mysterious, because otherwise the whole thing falls apart at the seams. I'll probably have more to say on all this once I watch the vid later.
But I will make one more point now.
Then build something with it. Wouldn't that be simple?
You say they understand all this technology and have documents which prove it and such. You see this just goes right back to my original point that all these things follow a similar pattern.
If they understand the technology, have all these documents than why don't they go to an engineering firm and build some alien devices that will easily prove that they are right. See, it would only take the tiniest thing to prove that they are legitimate. Just build one small component of this alien technology and everyone would have to take them seriously. It would be easy. Just like every crackpot theory is essentionally easy to prove at it's core. Oh and just to get it out of the way the most obvious argument is that they only have documents and diagrams but the full design specs and understanding of the technology are being held by their "secret organization" so they can't actually build one right now. Well, if that's true than how do they know any of those documents and diagrams are more than fancy words and pretty pictures. If they can't build one themselves they of course can have no idea if it can infact be built, or even ever existed. Just wanted to cut that line of reasoning off to start with....
But you know what? They never will build anything. There will always be excuses followed by more excuses.
"Oh it turned out to be too complex for us to understand after all. Of course it's still all true, but unfortunately we can't actually produce hard evidence by building anything."
or
"We would love to build a device to prove we aren't lying, but information necessary to do so is being suppressed by a secret organization that no government knows about or can control, you see. We're terribly sorry for the inconvenience."
or
"We already built such a device that proves what we say. See we have a video of it right here where it's levitating. See? There you have it! Oh what's that? You want to see the device now? Um....hmm...well. Of course! Err, it's just that it seems to have been misplaced. But we'll find it right away so you can examine it. Just give us a little more time."
But of course no such hard, incontrovertible evidence will ever come forward because there isn't any. If you push hard enough the whole hoax falls apart, which is why you can never get any real proof out of claims such as this. Same thing goes for why no one can ever seem to provide proof of bigfoot, the lochness monster, or crop circles. Take bigfoot for example. Sure there's all sorts of circumstantial evidence, and so called videos of the creature (mostly blurry and out of focus of course). But has anyone ever brough forward one strand of it's hair for a DNA analysis? Because that's all it would take to setttle the whole thing. Just a small clump of hair. That's not too much to ask is it? Yet of course no such hard evidence is ever produced.
As for them lying, all I'll say is that people are naturally drawn to consipiracy theories, especially when said theories provide the answers to all the problems of humankind. It's a tempting prize and can make people do weird things and even make them actually believe things that aren't true. Take people who create bigfoot videos, stay up all night to stamp down crop circles, or doctor photos to show a blurry lochness monster. Why do they do what they do?
But I will make one more point now.
Then build something with it. Wouldn't that be simple?
You say they understand all this technology and have documents which prove it and such. You see this just goes right back to my original point that all these things follow a similar pattern.
If they understand the technology, have all these documents than why don't they go to an engineering firm and build some alien devices that will easily prove that they are right. See, it would only take the tiniest thing to prove that they are legitimate. Just build one small component of this alien technology and everyone would have to take them seriously. It would be easy. Just like every crackpot theory is essentionally easy to prove at it's core. Oh and just to get it out of the way the most obvious argument is that they only have documents and diagrams but the full design specs and understanding of the technology are being held by their "secret organization" so they can't actually build one right now. Well, if that's true than how do they know any of those documents and diagrams are more than fancy words and pretty pictures. If they can't build one themselves they of course can have no idea if it can infact be built, or even ever existed. Just wanted to cut that line of reasoning off to start with....
But you know what? They never will build anything. There will always be excuses followed by more excuses.
"Oh it turned out to be too complex for us to understand after all. Of course it's still all true, but unfortunately we can't actually produce hard evidence by building anything."
or
"We would love to build a device to prove we aren't lying, but information necessary to do so is being suppressed by a secret organization that no government knows about or can control, you see. We're terribly sorry for the inconvenience."
or
"We already built such a device that proves what we say. See we have a video of it right here where it's levitating. See? There you have it! Oh what's that? You want to see the device now? Um....hmm...well. Of course! Err, it's just that it seems to have been misplaced. But we'll find it right away so you can examine it. Just give us a little more time."
But of course no such hard, incontrovertible evidence will ever come forward because there isn't any. If you push hard enough the whole hoax falls apart, which is why you can never get any real proof out of claims such as this. Same thing goes for why no one can ever seem to provide proof of bigfoot, the lochness monster, or crop circles. Take bigfoot for example. Sure there's all sorts of circumstantial evidence, and so called videos of the creature (mostly blurry and out of focus of course). But has anyone ever brough forward one strand of it's hair for a DNA analysis? Because that's all it would take to setttle the whole thing. Just a small clump of hair. That's not too much to ask is it? Yet of course no such hard evidence is ever produced.
As for them lying, all I'll say is that people are naturally drawn to consipiracy theories, especially when said theories provide the answers to all the problems of humankind. It's a tempting prize and can make people do weird things and even make them actually believe things that aren't true. Take people who create bigfoot videos, stay up all night to stamp down crop circles, or doctor photos to show a blurry lochness monster. Why do they do what they do?
Think about it. If the goverment has been researching this for 50 years then think how much that would cost. And you think that would go unoticed.
"Ok i bill i was just looking over this years budget and it seems that 20 billion has gone missing. Do you know anything about this
"Erm...em..well"
"Ok i bill i was just looking over this years budget and it seems that 20 billion has gone missing. Do you know anything about this
"Erm...em..well"
GuNzABlaZiN
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Just saw the whole thing, interesting stuff. There's too much work put into that for it to be a hoax. I think I'll follow this story...
http://www.laturi.org/pic/i_want_to_belive_orginal.jpg
http://www.laturi.org/pic/i_want_to_belive_orginal.jpg
N
nw909
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Oh shit guys, they're real!
Yakuza
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Xenome said:AS THEY SAY IN THE VIDEO, WICH YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE NOT SEEN: They won't go in the technical detail, because it's a press conference, and they won't even understand it.
You also wouldn't, if they explained it to you now.
They do however have documents ( wich they do show )
WICH PROVE what they say. Earlier, i gave a site wich shows how the alien reproduction vehicle works, in techical detail.
Don't understand it tough
On understanding alien technology:
If they can studie it, when the vehicle is lying in front of them, of course they can learn how to understand it, in 50 years.
They STARTED TO STUDY IT IN 1950, they didn't already understood it back then.
And no, they don't understand 'all alien technology', they only understand this part.
Furthermore, you're acting like "they're all the same', and all theories of extraterrestrial life are pure bullshit.
This simply means your not being open-minded.
OF COURSE the usa goverment can have classified 'divisions', wich only few people know of.
It's possible, so don't rule it out if you don't have proof of it's non-existence.
Of course it can be that you are totally right.
It can also be that they are speaking the truth.
What would they have to gain?
Spending alot of money on a campaign, for nothing? just lying?
They have to gain something with this, and I think that those 400 people finnally want to speak out the truth.
They saw it, you didn't.
Also look at my post earlier, about the mexican sighting, of wich mexican goverment released video material. You call that 'all the same', with the actual pilot telling us his story?
As i said earlier, the only proof for 'people like you'
--
This is my final reply to this thread for now..
It amazes me how ignorant people can be when it comes to subjects like this.
400 people from intelligence, cia, military high class positions, want to finnally disclose this subject and come out with their stories, willing to testify in congress.
That's pure proof to me, also concidering all the other sightnings.
Dr.Greer wrote a memo about it to president Bush.
And still some people keep on believing that it's "all the same".
You will never accept the truth, unless you see an alien yourself, am I right?
Remember, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Can I ask you a question......Do you reject the bible.
Wiseman
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Well, if he can prove the existence of any of this advanced technology, he can get a million dollars: www.randi.org
Although just to note, just because a lot of people are willing to put their careers on the line means absolutely nothing whatsoever. I'm sure I could find 1000 Christians who would do the same to claim the Christian god exists, 1000 Muslims claiming their god exists, 1000 atheists who claim no god exists, and 1000 <insert person with specific belief here> who claim that <insert belief here> is correct. Popular vote does not determine whether or not something happened, but you seem to be playing that angle quite a bit.
I'll make a more indepth comment later, after I've seen the movie (I'm on 56k 'till Friday)
Although just to note, just because a lot of people are willing to put their careers on the line means absolutely nothing whatsoever. I'm sure I could find 1000 Christians who would do the same to claim the Christian god exists, 1000 Muslims claiming their god exists, 1000 atheists who claim no god exists, and 1000 <insert person with specific belief here> who claim that <insert belief here> is correct. Popular vote does not determine whether or not something happened, but you seem to be playing that angle quite a bit.
I'll make a more indepth comment later, after I've seen the movie (I'm on 56k 'till Friday)
C
Cybernoid
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Xenome said:
Yeah, I get it. UFOs only visit America, and the Secret Shadow Government wants to keep it a secret. Obviously, no satellite or observatory in existence (except the secret CIA ones) can detec them.
Cybernoid said:
I never said that.
Many countries see them, these news just goes unnoticed alot of the time.
A month ago there was a sightning in germany somewhere wich many people, and also came on the dutch television.
And, like I said in my post earlier, in Mexico there has also been a really WEIRD sightning.
The disclosure project just wants to show us that the us goverment is studying crashed vehicles, and knows alot more then they tell. They want to keep secret how much they already know about them.
That doesn't mean other countries don't see them or know things about them.
[There] exists a shadowy Government with its own Air Force, its own Navy, its own fundraising mechanism, and the ability to pursue its own ideas of the national interest, free from all checks and balances, and free from the law itself.
— Senator Daniel K Inouye
In the councils of Government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the Military Industrial Complex.. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together
— President Eisenhower – January 1961
The above address by two-term Republican US President and five- star Army General Dwight Eisenhower was issued as a prescient warning when he left office in 1961. Many have wondered why such a conservative, pro-military president would issue such a warning. We now know why.
http://www.disclosureproject.org/World Affairs - The Journal of International Issues.htm -- PEOPLE READ THIS!
And neutrino, they never said that they themselved have the replacement enegery for oil, nuclear power, etc.
THIS is what they say:
The Disclosure Project, an NGO based in the United States, has identified several hundred military, intelligence and corporate witnesses to illegal and extra-constitutional projects that have suppressed information and prevented public access to technologies which could provide a definitive replacement for oil, coal, nuclear power and other conventional energy sources. These technologies have been both acquired and developed by military and industrial interests in the US, UK and other countries that have repeatedly lied to or withheld this information from legally constituted authorities and the public.
Also:
We have identified nearly 500 military, corporate, intelligence and laboratory witnesses to events and programmes connected to these matters. The body of evidence is overwhelming and definitive. In May 2001, we held a press conference at the National Press Club in Washington, DC at which more than 20 such witnesses provided testimony and documents regarding their direct, first-hand involvement in the subject. It was the most-watched webcast in history, and ultimately over a million people viewed the event over the Internet. The event was reported by CNN, CNN International, major networks like the BBC, the Voice of America, Pravda, the Chinese News Agency, Telemundo, The Washington Times and other media around the world. Tens of thousands of people wrote to the president and members of Congress asking for an investigation of the subject and a general declassification of information.
--
"And then September 11 happened. In view of the US Patriot Act and other developments, including the Iraq war, the US Congress has elected not to pursue the matter. But the international community, which is greatly harmed by the continued imposition of this secrecy, is the primary victim and should be the prime mover in getting these matters investigated. "
--
People don't ignore this, and read/watch it.
Neutrino you're totally misunderstanding what they say, I think.
— Senator Daniel K Inouye
In the councils of Government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the Military Industrial Complex.. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together
— President Eisenhower – January 1961
The above address by two-term Republican US President and five- star Army General Dwight Eisenhower was issued as a prescient warning when he left office in 1961. Many have wondered why such a conservative, pro-military president would issue such a warning. We now know why.
http://www.disclosureproject.org/World Affairs - The Journal of International Issues.htm -- PEOPLE READ THIS!
And neutrino, they never said that they themselved have the replacement enegery for oil, nuclear power, etc.
THIS is what they say:
The Disclosure Project, an NGO based in the United States, has identified several hundred military, intelligence and corporate witnesses to illegal and extra-constitutional projects that have suppressed information and prevented public access to technologies which could provide a definitive replacement for oil, coal, nuclear power and other conventional energy sources. These technologies have been both acquired and developed by military and industrial interests in the US, UK and other countries that have repeatedly lied to or withheld this information from legally constituted authorities and the public.
Also:
We have identified nearly 500 military, corporate, intelligence and laboratory witnesses to events and programmes connected to these matters. The body of evidence is overwhelming and definitive. In May 2001, we held a press conference at the National Press Club in Washington, DC at which more than 20 such witnesses provided testimony and documents regarding their direct, first-hand involvement in the subject. It was the most-watched webcast in history, and ultimately over a million people viewed the event over the Internet. The event was reported by CNN, CNN International, major networks like the BBC, the Voice of America, Pravda, the Chinese News Agency, Telemundo, The Washington Times and other media around the world. Tens of thousands of people wrote to the president and members of Congress asking for an investigation of the subject and a general declassification of information.
--
"And then September 11 happened. In view of the US Patriot Act and other developments, including the Iraq war, the US Congress has elected not to pursue the matter. But the international community, which is greatly harmed by the continued imposition of this secrecy, is the primary victim and should be the prime mover in getting these matters investigated. "
--
People don't ignore this, and read/watch it.
Neutrino you're totally misunderstanding what they say, I think.
Brian Damage
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Hah, I know what it's all about.
Earth's under one big quarantine operation because aliens don't want DataSprites like Friggy to spread and cause havoc throughout the galaxy...
Seriously, though, this is interesting stuff... pity my connection's so crap...
Earth's under one big quarantine operation because aliens don't want DataSprites like Friggy to spread and cause havoc throughout the galaxy...
Seriously, though, this is interesting stuff... pity my connection's so crap...
Also, Neutrino: All the technical details are described in their books.
Remember, this was just a press conference with the purpose of telling the world 'what's up'
Also:
http://www.disclosureproject.org/briefingpoints.htm
Remember, this was just a press conference with the purpose of telling the world 'what's up'
Also:
http://www.disclosureproject.org/briefingpoints.htm
The Monkey
The Freeman
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Good writing there, Neutrino.
I have very hard to believe in any form of aliens, ghost etc. Did you know that there never have been any scientific proof whatsoever for any presence of aliens and ghost?
There are a lot of things that happens in nature that we do not know of, we've only begun to explore the mysteries of our planet, but I can tell you this, everything has a natural explanation, even if we don't know what that explanations is...yet.
I have very hard to believe in any form of aliens, ghost etc. Did you know that there never have been any scientific proof whatsoever for any presence of aliens and ghost?
There are a lot of things that happens in nature that we do not know of, we've only begun to explore the mysteries of our planet, but I can tell you this, everything has a natural explanation, even if we don't know what that explanations is...yet.
Brian Damage
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What if the natural explanation is that the object flying over your house is an alien spacecraft, or that the wierd vapoury thing moping around is a ghost?
![[Matt]](https://valvetime-data.community.forum/avatars/m/0/25.jpg?1330940173){kind=avatar}
[Matt]
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never mind.... in a few short weeks we'll all be donning HEV suits and brandishing crowbars to combat such a threat! :EVarg|Hund said:Am I the only one who doesn't want any fecking aliens on this planet?
They'll just mess things up
Neutrino
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Xenome said:Also, Neutrino: All the technical details are described in their books.
Remember, this was just a press conference with the purpose of telling the world 'what's up'
Also:
http://www.disclosureproject.org/briefingpoints.htm
Well, you keep saying they have all the technical details. Then why don't they build something and quit beating around the bush. Why don't they build an alien weapon or an anti grav device or any little thing that would provide some hard evidence. Is that really too much to ask? That's all it would take. One bit of hard evidence they could submit to the scientific community for examination.
If they want to be taken seriously all they need to do is provide a little hard proof. But like I said in my previous post there will always be a million vague excuses carefully explaining how they would like to, but, you see, it's just not possible because of: (Fill in blank with vague or secretive reason) .
You don't seem to be really addressing any of the issues I've written about either. Oh, and sorry I haven't had time to watch the video yet. I'll try to get to it sometime here.
Just one additional thing. You see, I have what I consider to be a pretty reasonable rule of thumb when it comes to these things. In my opinion the burden of proof lies on the shoulders of he who makes the fantastic or improbable claims, not on the person trying to refute them. This is because it's very hard to prove something doesn't exist, while on the other hand it is very easy to prove something does exist. In other words, it's easy to claim something exists but it is very difficult to completely refute that claim. (With the exception of course of things that are, by their nature, easily put to scientific examination like claiming the Earth is flat for instance.) I've found if I don't take such an attitude than I'm forced to take every crackpot seriously. Therefore if someone claims they've discovered a free source of energy, I say, "show it to me". If someone says they discovered bigfoot, I say, "bring me a DNA sample." And if someone says that aliens are invading us and they can create a world utopia from the stolen alien technology, I say, "show me one shred of incontrovertible proof." I think that's a pretty reasonable position to take.
Oh, and someone else in this thread made a very excellent point. Testimonial evidence does not constitute proof of a concept. It is purely circumstantial. As the previous poster pointed out, you can easily find a million christians who will absolutely testify that God exists. Just as easily a thousand atheists can be found to testify that God does not exist. A few thousand years ago I'm sure you could find thousands of people who would have told you, without a doubt, that the Earth is flat. People and their opinions are fallible and cannot be solely used for proof of a fantastical claim. The only evidence that counts is repeatable and demonstratable. See, it's just like a scientific hypothesis really. Until you subject it to the scientific method it cannot hope to graduate to theory or fact.
The_Monkey said:
Thanks. I do agree with you about there being a natural explanation for everything. However, like Brian Damage pointed out, the natural explanation could very well be ghosts, aliens, or something completely new. I extemely doubt it of course, but there's always a tiny possiblity. I think Xenome rather misunderstands me and thinks I'm some closeminded, consertive thinking, stuck in the mud that can't see beyond what he thinks he knows. Hehe
. But to the contrary, I like to think that I'm quite open minded really. But I do refuse to believe anything without facts and proof. Any other system just seems irrational to me. That is to say, I'm perfectly willing to accept the existence of God, aliens, ghosts, bigfoot, and leprachauns at the end of the rainbow if someone can only show some real evidence of them. Until then, I see no reason to jump the gun and start believing everything I hear. Without a reasonable amount of skepticism I probably would have been in a mass religious cult suicide long ago. At least then I suppose you would have to read my long ass posts.
bud7miker
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To right, theres a 99.9% chance theres other life out there just not little green men i reckon theres bowned to be another planet with creatures that look and act like us! Like there could be one planet were there still in the medieval period another were there more advanced then us... get my difted?!
Neutrino said:Well, you keep saying they have all the technical details. Then why don't they build something and quit beating around the bush. Why don't they build an alien weapon or an anti grav device or any little thing that would provide some hard evidence. Is that really too much to ask? That's all it would take. One bit of hard evidence they could submit to the scientific community for examination.
If they want to be taken seriously all they need to do is provide a little hard proof. But like I said in my previous post there will always be a million vague excuses carefully explaining how they would like to, but, you see, it's just not possible because of: (Fill in blank with vague or secretive reason) .
You don't seem to be really addressing any of the issues I've written about either. Oh, and sorry I haven't had time to watch the video yet. I'll try to get to it sometime here.
Just one additional thing. You see, I have what I consider to be a pretty reasonable rule of thumb when it comes to these things. In my opinion the burden of proof lies on the shoulders of he who makes the fantastic or improbable claims, not on the person trying to refute them. This is because it's very hard to prove something doesn't exist, while on the other hand it is very easy to prove something does exist. In other words, it's easy to claim something exists but it is very difficult to completely refute that claim. (With the exception of course of things that are, by their nature, easily put to scientific examination like claiming the Earth is flat for instance.) I've found if I don't take such an attitude than I'm forced to take every crackpot seriously. Therefore if someone claims they've discovered a free source of energy, I say, "show it to me". If someone says they discovered bigfoot, I say, "bring me a DNA sample." And if someone says that aliens are invading us and they can create a world utopia from the stolen alien technology, I say, "show me one shred of incontrovertible proof." I think that's a pretty reasonable position to take.
Oh, and someone else in this thread made a very excellent point. Testimonial evidence does not constitute proof of a concept. It is purely circumstantial. As the previous poster pointed out, you can easily find a million christians who will absolutely testify that God exists. Just as easily a thousand atheists can be found to testify that God does not exist. A few thousand years ago I'm sure you could find thousands of people who would have told you, without a doubt, that the Earth is flat. People and their opinions are fallible and cannot be solely used for proof of a fantastical claim. The only evidence that counts is repeatable and demonstratable. See, it's just like a scientific hypothesis really. Until you subject it to the scientific method it cannot hope to graduate to theory or fact.
Thanks. I do agree with you about there being a natural explanation for everything. However, like Brian Damage pointed out, the natural explanation could very well be ghosts, aliens, or something completely new. I extemely doubt it of course, but there's always a tiny possiblity. I think Xenome rather misunderstands me and thinks I'm some closeminded, consertive thinking, stuck in the mud that can't see beyond what he thinks he knows. Hehe
"Well, you keep saying they have all the technical details. Then why don't they build something and quit beating around the bush. Why don't they build an alien weapon or an anti grav device or any little thing that would provide some hard evidence. Is that really too much to ask? That's all it would take. One bit of hard evidence they could submit to the scientific community for examination."
---------
That's exactly the misunderstanding here.
The people of the disclosure project don't have these '' alien vehicles' or understanding of alien technology THEMSELVES, but, as said in the vid
, they have 400 witnesses from usa intelligence, cia, etc saying that the US government does, and they are willing to testify in congress under oath, saying so.The disclosure project states that they have obtained official documents of the 400 people (nearing 500 actually) willing to testify, that state that the USA goverment is and has been studying these alien lifeformes, and that they are covering it up.
These 400 witnesses also want to tell their stories about how they encountered or saw alien lifeformes ( for example as part of or somehow connected to a science team researching it after a crash), because they had to be silent for a LONG time. They were told by the CIA etc to be silent about it.
As one witness in the video states: "and, as my usual response was: nothing rare was seen."
They have actual PROOF of this, and want to show that in all detail to the congress of the USA.
So yes, these witnesses WANT to show you and the public the evidence of this, but in front of the US congress.
clarky003
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Shuzer said:SO many people took my post seriously.. I'm ashamed
And alot of you missed the bit where he started singing? Hrm.
I watched 10 minutes of it, but had to stop. It seemed a bit too campy..
may seem that way to you, but if its true,,
star trek might not be so far fetched and so far away afterall.
and wheither we believe it or not , like they said at the start, their looking for the truth, not a belief.
Wiseman
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Technically, as they're currently defined, a ghost wouldn't be a natural explanation. However, if any evidence of ghosts was found (good evidence) then they would have to be considered natural, because anything that we can observe is considered natural iirc.Brian Damage said:
What you're basically saying is that they don't have any technological evidence, and they're not willing to show us (and I mean us, not congress) the evidence that the government has this technology. So all you have right now is some testimonials of a very unlikely event, with no current evidence to back it up. Seems to me like it should just be left alone until they actually show the evidence they have, rather than debate about it on an internet message board.Xenome said:
Brian Damage
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That was kinda my point, Wiseman. We just don't know enough about them yet. I'll go as far as "supernatural explanation". Which sounds as though it literally means "really, really natural"...
And for everyone's info, my old house was haunted...
And for everyone's info, my old house was haunted...
DEATH eVADER
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Murray_H said:
Think StarwarsII, George Bush was behind the attacks
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Do you mean: Star Wars Episode II?
The Mullinator
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When developing secret weapons and vehicles for fighting another country in a "cold war" what would be a good way of keeping them secret even during live tests?
Make the public think they are aliens from another planet would work well. Both the Canadian and the US government had for a time been developing actual flying saucers, a few were tested supposedly. There wasn't anything special about them though, they didn't defy the laws of physics or anything of that sort. If you ask me all real sightings of UFO's are either weather related events, imagination, or tests of military aircraft and vehicles. Not aliens.
I believe there is intelligent life out there, I just don't think any of it has come here yet.
Make the public think they are aliens from another planet would work well. Both the Canadian and the US government had for a time been developing actual flying saucers, a few were tested supposedly. There wasn't anything special about them though, they didn't defy the laws of physics or anything of that sort. If you ask me all real sightings of UFO's are either weather related events, imagination, or tests of military aircraft and vehicles. Not aliens.
I believe there is intelligent life out there, I just don't think any of it has come here yet.
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