Bush, SDI, and the future of the planet

[burnzie]

i love being in insignifigant australia... i swear we are gonna be the last ones left... untill nuclear winter sets in...


***Warning: cliche'd flash post***

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/end.php

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Assuming SDI goes active...

Shit, he can't even read. Anyway, my time is up so I have to go.

Apparently, you read what I had to say, and felt more like an ass. Goto bed, you need sleep. Besides, if you had'nt started the "OMFG THE US WILL OWNT HE WORLD OH NOES", I would'nt, at all, be replying or even posting this half-arsed bullcrap.

Its just a retort to your own.

seconded.

See, this why I wished you two people, did'nt start this "GRR I HATE TEH US BUSH WON WAAGGHH TIME TO KILL EM".

Because, like I said. I could argue this all day with you. Needless to say, your all too paranoid for your own damn good.

 

[crabcakes66]

Actually, reforms in 2001, returned our use to faster aircraft, like the F/A-18 Hornet. Your airforces, mostly relie on old US Equipment sold off to you during the 1980's.

This is not to say, since America developed the first Atomic Weapon, we would'nt be able to develope another weapon, with similiar or more devastating effects.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/10/04/MNGM393GPK1.DTL
scary shit isnt it?

 

[Tropico]

Hehe

You better watch out for indonesia they are smilling down on you

 

[Sprafa]

Actually, reforms in 2001, returned our use to faster aircraft, like the F/A-18 Hornet. Your airforces, mostly relie on old US Equipment sold off to you during the 1980's.

This is not to say, since America developed the first Atomic Weapon, we would'nt be able to develope another weapon, with similiar or more devastating effects.

We're discussing conventional warfare. If anyone drops a nuke it's the Apoc

 

[Prone]

i love being in insignifigant australia... i swear we are gonna be the last ones left... untill nuclear winter sets in...

Like in Nevil Shute's "On the beach"? That would suck

 

[Sprafa]

Besides, the Russians have anti-SDI hypersonic missiles

 

[crabcakes66]

We're discussing conventional warfare. If anyone drops a nuke it's the Apoc

Conventional warfare on that kind of WW2 scale just doesnt make sense any more.

Drop a few tactical nukes on your enemies largest and most concentrated unit formations and thats it.

 

[Tropico]

what about north korea?

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Besides, the Russians have anti-SDI hypersonic missiles

So, I have a Star Destroyer.

Get out of this bout people, geez. This "OMFG BUSH WILL DECLARE WAR ON US" is getting old. I dont feel the need to invade Europe, or take down Portugal.

I would'nt even feel the need if the next terrorist came out of France or Portugal airports.

I just sincerely would'nt care. Its time to relax, were not going to invade your countries. We have no reason too, and trust me, I would'nt support invading them either.

 

[burnzie]

Like in Nevil Shute's "On the beach"? That would suck

yeah I saw that one... theres 2 of them, havent seen the old one but ive seen the remake with Bryan Brown

its funny you should think that because thats what i was thinking of when i posted...

 

[Logic]

i love being in insignifigant australia... i swear we are gonna be the last ones left... untill nuclear winter sets in...

I don't know... Johnie Howard was very quick to offer our support to the US in Iraq, without a referendum or any kind of public consultation. They bought our support with the free trade agreement. Australia has, politically, been one of the most public supporters of Bush, and as such, to enemies of the US, we would also be enemies. You never know, in such a war we might be occupied for strategic reasons.

 

[Sprafa]

So, I have a Star Destroyer.

Get out of this bout people, geez. This "OMFG BUSH WILL DECLARE WAR ON US" is getting old. I dont feel the need to invade Europe, or take down Portugal.

I would'nt even feel the need if the next terrorist came out of France or Portugal airports.

I dont sincerely dont care. Its time to relax, were not going to invade your countries. We have no reason too, and trust me, I would'nt support invading them either.

oh , c'mon, I was having fun.... I wasn't serious, I just like to discuss hypotetical wars.

 

[Prone]

Haven't seen the movies, only read the book in school. That was long ago *starts to dream about the good ol' days* The story is really good but the end is soooo sad.

 

[AudioRage]

So, I have a Star Destroyer.

Get out of this bout people, geez. This "OMFG BUSH WILL DECLARE WAR ON US" is getting old. I dont feel the need to invade Europe, or take down Portugal.

I would'nt even feel the need if the next terrorist came out of France or Portugal airports.

I just sincerely would'nt care. Its time to relax, were not going to invade your countries. We have no reason too, and trust me, I would'nt support invading them either.

Because you're the one with the power, Right?

You are president Bush and you have the power to decide which countries are or are not invaded, Yes?

 

[burnzie]

I don't know... Johnie Howard was very quick to offer our support to the US in Iraq, without a referendum or any kind of public consultation. They bought our support with the free trade agreement. Australia has, politically, been one of the most public supporters of Bush, and as such, to enemies of the US, we would also be enemies. You never know, in such a war we might be occupied for strategic reasons.

Howard will never be taken seriously tbh...

I voted for Mark "ease the squeze" Laitham

 

[burnzie]

Haven't seen the movies, only read the book in school. That was long ago *starts to dream about the good ol' days* The story is really good but the end is soooo sad.

ahh yes i forgot about the book, and yes the ending is rather sad, i havent read it myself though...

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Because you're the one with the power, Right?

You are president Bush and you have the power to decide which countries are or are not invaded, Yes?

Im a citizen now, so if we invaded Europe, you think I would'nt protesting...and non-violently?

 

[Prone]

@Burnzie: Well, you should. It's well worth it.

 

[Logic]

So, I have a Star Destroyer.

Get out of this bout people, geez. This "OMFG BUSH WILL DECLARE WAR ON US" is getting old. I dont feel the need to invade Europe, or take down Portugal.

I would'nt even feel the need if the next terrorist came out of France or Portugal airports.

I just sincerely would'nt care. Its time to relax, were not going to invade your countries. We have no reason too, and trust me, I would'nt support invading them either.

Why do you feel that your personal opinions, what you care about or feel the need to do, has any effect on your country's political actions?

Edit: This thread is moving fast!

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Well, you should. It's well worth it.

If we invaded Europe, I meant, I would.

Like I said. This is just initial "OMFG IM MAD" hysteria coming out. Kerry is not over, not by a long shot.

 

[Prone]

No Kerberos, sorry. You posted while I was typing, I edited it. I was talking to Burnzie.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Why do you feel that your personal opinions, what you care about or feel the need to do, has any effect on your country's political actions?

Thats why its called Protest, and revolution. One our greatest founding fathers, had the opinion: "For every election, America should have a new revolution"

 

[burnzie]

I dunno, hows the oil in europe? thats probably the real decider for america (bush)...

:hmph:

 

[Raziaar]

Heh. this is funny and really stupid. You guys are discussing(sprafa i'm talkinga bout mainly here, his panties seem to be in a bunch) allying the rest of the world against the united states in a bitter feud simply because of an election that happens every 4 years in the united states, all because some guy you forsee as an idiot got elected.

That puts you in worse shoes than the united states invading iraq. Taking out a country because someone was elected! lol

Seriously Sprafra, relax dude, you may say you're only joking around, but with the tone of your posts I get a real 'my dad can beat up your dad' vibe from you right now.

 

[Logic]

Thats why its called Protest, and revolution. One our greatest founding fathers, had the opinion: "For every election, America should have a new revolution"

Yes, but you can't say your country won't do something simply because YOU don't care for it. That's total arrogance. Besides, protests are after the fact.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Yea, no shit. I was wondering why the forum was turning into this. Yea sure, Bush, but Kerries not over anyway.

...besides, we have no reason to invade Europe., Why, the hell, would we?

<To the person who said it like this

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Yes, but you can't say your country won't do something simply because YOU don't care for it. That's total arrogance. Besides, protests are after the fact.

Oh BS. I'd care if we invaded Europe. Besides, it takes planning and troop movements to do so.

That gives me time.

 

[Logic]

Heh. this is funny and really stupid. You guys are discussing(sprafa i'm talkinga bout mainly here, his panties seem to be in a bunch) allying the rest of the world against the united states in a bitter feud simply because of an election that happens every 4 years in the united states, all because some guy you forsee as an idiot got elected.

That puts you in worse shoes than the united states invading iraq. Taking out a country because someone was elected! lol

Seriously Sprafra, relax dude, you may say you're only joking around, but with the tone of your posts I get a real 'my dad can beat up your dad' vibe from you right now.

I agree, lets drop this hypothetical war on the US, and have some serious discussion on the topic - what do people think about SDI? A good thing? A bad thing? A good thing in the wrong hands?

 

[burnzie]

...besides, we have no reason to invade Europe., Why, the hell, would we?

I dunno, hows the oil in europe? thats probably the real decider for america (bush)...

:dozey:

 

[Foxtrot]

Back during the cold war, America (under President Reagan) announced a program for strategic missile defence that would allow enemy missiles, air craft, and other airborne threats, to be targeted and eliminated from space, through the use of a large satellite system that would orbit the earth. This project, often called "Star Wars", was known as SDI, or the 'Strategic Defense Initiative". At the time, critics called the project unrealistic, but since Russia and the US were so competitive at the time (this was the cold war after all), Russia announced their own similar project. Ridiculous sums of money were poured into both projects, and in a sense, SDI became an economic weapon, contributing to the Soviet Union's downfall by causing them to spend enormous amounts of money to compete with the US. Once the cold war ended, though, I don't think anyone really believed that either project would ever come to fruition. Big space lasers? Nah, not gonna happen. The project was cancelled in the early 90s, though military research of course never ended. Since then, different presidential administrations have proposed varying different missile defense systems, such as "GPALS", but these were merely proposed, not developed.

Now, though, it looks as if it will not only happen, but that it's just around the corner. George W. Bush is determined to bring the project into fruition, and the system is intended to be deployed, at a cost of up to US$60 billion, by 2005. The project will breach the 1972 ABM treaty with Russia, but Bush has stated that if the Russians won't change their terms, he will go ahead with it anyway. Previous presidents (such as Bush Sr.) have suggested that the project could be a joint venture by the US and Russia, but the current project is being developed solely by the United States. The US has has oposition from many nations regarding the development of SDI, but the project continues.

There is absolutely no intention for the project to be turned over to the United Nations, which I believe it should be, indicating that this project is, just as it was in the cold war, being developed to give the US a nearly unmatchable military component, and consequently, effective control of the planet through military power. Of course, we all know that not even United Nations resistance will stop Bush, who effectively destroyed the UN's power by ignoring them and going to war with Iraq against their decisions. This is not a case of the US trying to keep peace throughout the world, but rather a case of the US trying to gain and maintain control of the world.

During the cold war, neither Russia nor the US fired on each other, because they knew that if one country deployed a nuclear strike, the other would deploy a retaliation strike moments later, and both countries would be devastated. With this system in place, particularly as the technology improves in accuracy and effectiveness, the US will be able to stop foreign nuclear weapons from reaching their country, meaning they will be able to attack without retalliation. Considering Bush's recent actions, and indeed America's past use of large-scale weapons, it seems now that the world may yet again see the use of nuclear \ atomic weapons.

This is happening NOW. This isn't some far off fantasy, or science fiction, or even an unrealistic military objective.. In no time at all, Bush will have a space-deployed weapon system, capable of being pointed at anything, anywhere, on or around planet earth. Bush has demonstrated that he has no hesitation using military power to achieve goals. Though the system is technically 'defensive', the offensive potential of such a weapon system is obvious, and once deployed, it would simply become another part of the US military's arsenal, and another step, if not the defining step, towards a world governed not through peace by the United Nations, but through the threat of destruction, by George W. Bush.

Whether or not you support Bush, and whether or not you are American, this is cause for concern. If anyone has a point of view on this, please share it, and lets have some open minded discussion on the topic.

Wow, please go kill yourself.

 

[Prone]

That gives me time.

That again has me chuckling. Kerberos, I really didn't like you. Until I now started to understand the irony and satire behind your words. Sorry for taking so long.

 

[Logic]

Wow, please go kill yourself.

A valuable point of view, no doubt, I'm glad you shared it with us :cheers:

Care to elaborate on your feelings on the subject?

 

[Foxtrot]

A valuable point of view, no doubt, I'm glad you shared it with us :cheers:

Care to elaborate on your feelings on the subject?

Anyone this paranoid about national defense does not need to breed anymore.

 

[burnzie]

Pollitics makes me sooooo horny.


cheakout my web cam pic at preidential sluts.com

 

[Logic]

Anyone this paranoid about national defense does not need to breed anymore.

So basically what you're saying is... "I don't care about national defense, and anyone who cares more than I do doesn't deserve to live." Great insight there. If you don't think the subject is important enough to discuss, by all means don't discuss it. Just don't come on here, telling people that they shouldn't breed, simply because they give a shit about matters that may, in the near future, prove to be extremely important to all of us.

Edit: and it's not just "national" defense.. you obviously don't realise the impact it has on world politics.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

That again has me chuckling. Kerberos, I really didn't like you. Until I now started to understand the irony and satire behind your words. Sorry for taking so long.

So, you want war then?

Its your choice, but both have grim consequences.

 

[UmbrellaMaster]

Very nicely put thread Logic. :thumbs:

Personally it's a sad day for me as an American. I felt this country was a bit more "on the ball" but they proved me wrong yet again.

God bless Americans (we're going to need it in the next 4 years, I guarentee you that), God bless those America plans on invading, and God bless the other countries that have to deal with our government.

 

[Tr0n]

And god bless me for having to deal with a bunch of political bullshit today.

 

[DEATH eVADER]

If the system gets launched, I hope that terrorists will do something about it. Seriously. I'd rather see the US get nuked.

If this happens, and for some odd reason Bush declares war against Russia (why 'o' why ) I just hope that the UK doesn't get stuck in the middle.

Anyway, if anything this remarkable does happen, I would see a new revolution happening in the USA, and I am not just saying farmers with picth-forks. Tanks against Tanks, Aircraft dogfights, Martial Law. The UN would pull out of New York. The super powers of the world would allie.

This would be a good mod concept, i just hope it does not happen in the real world.