Bush: The worst president ever?

[Foxtrot]

No one has validated? Are you crazy? have you been under a rock for the last month? the British government validated it.

Links?

 

[No Limit]

Links?

Lets make you work a little since I have to go to bed becaus I have a long day tomorrow. find me any British government official that disputes the memo, you can start on Blair or whoever you'd like.

 

[Foxtrot]

Lets make you work a little since I have to go to bed becaus I have a long day tomorrow. find me any British government official that disputes the memo, you can start on Blair or whoever you'd like.

It doesn't need to be disputed, it needs to be validated by US officials (mainly Bush and his crew). It has already been called fake by US politicians.

 

[No Limit]

It doesn't need to be disputed, it needs to be validated by US officials (mainly Bush and his crew). It has already been called fake by US politicians.

it doesn't need to be disputed? Why are you here? you honestly can not grasp how politics works.

 

[Foxtrot]

it doesn't need to be disputed? Why are you here? you honestly can not grasp how politics works.

No, you can not grasp how it works. I could write a memo right now saying Bush lied and all this other crap, and then say that some US official said it was real.

 

[No Limit]

It doesn't need to be disputed, it needs to be validated by US officials (mainly Bush and his crew). It has already been called fake by US politicians.

Holy shit, I just missed what you said since I wasn't paying attention to the bullshit. how is Bush supposed to validate something that didn't come from his government?

 

[Foxtrot]

Holy shit, I just missed what you said since I wasn't paying attention to the bullshit. how is Bush supposed to validate something that didn't come from his government?

That doesn't even make sense, it didn't need to come from his Government, it could have come from anywhere. It directly involved him and he should have some knowledge of it.

 

[No Limit]

No, you can not grasp how it works. I could write a memo right now saying Bush lied and all this other crap, and then say that some US official said it was real.

No you can't. Instead of losing a huge part of his political power in elections Blar would have simply said that is not an accurate memo. Again, you don't know how politics works. No body is going to come out and say it is accurate, they will simply not dispute it.

Also this is not a memo, these are official minutes of a meeting. Look at the definition I posted which I guess you tried to dispute if you need info on what the difference is.

 

[No Limit]

That doesn't even make sense, it didn't need to come from his Government, it could have come from anywhere. It directly involved him and he should have some knowledge of it.

what doesn't make sense to you? I honestly don't know why you are here. BUSH CAN NOT VALIDATE SOMETHING THAT IS NOT FROM HIS GOVERNMENT. Only Blair and other British officials that saw and wrote the minutes can dispute it; which they have not. Bush, by the way, hasn't disputed it when he was asked. read the letter John conyers wrote as I know you will be asking for a source.

 

[Foxtrot]

what doesn't make sense to you? I honestly don't know why you are here. BUSH CAN NOT VALIDATE SOMETHING THAT IS NOT FROM HIS GOVERNMENT. Only Blair and other British officials that saw and wrote the minutes can dispute it; which they have not. Bush, by the way, hasn't disputed it when he was asked. read the letter John conyers wrote as I know you will be asking for a source.

Wow, I think I am going to write a memo. But if you are going to play around like this we are done.

 

[No Limit]

Wow, I think I am going to write a memo. But if you are going to play around like this we are done.

I love your tendency to repeat lies after they have been disputed by me. You can not just write a memo, it doesnt work like that buddy. But if you don't understand this I can't help you; politics is simply not for you. people like you shouldn't be able to vote but that's up for another debate. Hopefully you are under 18 and can't vote anyway.

 

[Foxtrot]

I love your tendency to repeat lies after they have been disputed by me. You can not just write a memo, it doesnt work like that buddy. But if you don't understand this I can't help you; politics is simply not for you. people like you shouldn't be able to vote but that's up for another debate. Hopefully you are under 18 and can't vote anyway.

Again, more allusions and references to things but no real facts.

 

[Solaris]

You have accidents and deliberate mixed up. A huge percent of those deaths were all accidents, just about every single one in fact. Very very few were deliberate which is a very serious crime. Murder is more serious in the states, people are murdered a whole lot more than by soldiers in Iraq. Are you going to say the united states is a failure because of that? Well if you say the military is a failure because of that well the U.S. is worse, so think things through and realize a few deliberate deaths were not commanded by Bush or anyone higher up, those people were crazy.

The leveling of a civillian city is a deliberate act (falujah)

>A huge percent of those deaths were all accidents
Wrong Mansluaghter

>people are murdered a whole lot more[in the USA] than by soldiers in Iraq.
There are more people in USA, to compare you would have to do it proportionally.

>so think things through and realize a few deliberate deaths were not commanded by Bush or anyone higher up
Red cross officials have estimated that 800+ civillians died in the seige of fallujah. The tatics employed by the USA are careless.

 

[No Limit]

Again, more allusions and references to things but no real facts.

I think you are just trying to fill this thread with junk to hide what is written as you are making absolutely no sense. So just in case here is what you are yet to address.

Why will Bush not respond to the following letter signed by 88 members of the house:

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/letters/bushsecretmemoltr5505.pdf

You did not address the following 10 lies the administration told about Iraq:

http://www.alternet.org/story/16274

You will not address why Blair would lose many of his parliament positions instead of simply saying the memo is not authentic. You made the compltely stupid claim that the memo is not authentic. This claim by you simply tells me you know nothing about politics or you are just making an ass of yourself to not have to address it. Remember, even you brother didn't dispute the authenticity of the memo. In fact, you can not find a single person in the American, British, or any government that disputes this memo. But you, Foxtrot, are above all these people and can dispute it. :dozey: Please, pass me what you are smoking :smoking:.

You will not address why we went in to war without UN approval when Bush said he would get UN approval before going in to war.

You did not tell me what Saddam did that defied UN resolution 1441. Remember Bush said if Saddam complies with this resolution he would avoid war.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationw...,0,5899539.story?coll=ny-uspolitics-headlines

A former Bolton deputy says the U.S. undersecretary of state felt Jose Bustani "had to go," particularly because the Brazilian was trying to send chemical weapons inspectors to Baghdad. That might have helped defuse the crisis over alleged Iraqi weapons and undermined a U.S. rationale for war.

Why was Bolton trying to fire people that were investigating our intelligence? The firing that the article talks about has been ruled illegal by the UN.

This is just the icing on the cake as I have to get back to work, there are many more points in this thread you, and your republican friends, didn't address. And most of these points I posted don't even have anything to do with the memo.

 

[Foxtrot]

The leveling of a civillian city is a deliberate act (falujah)

>A huge percent of those deaths were all accidents
Wrong Mansluaghter

>people are murdered a whole lot more[in the USA] than by soldiers in Iraq.
There are more people in USA, to compare you would have to do it proportionally.

>so think things through and realize a few deliberate deaths were not commanded by Bush or anyone higher up
Red cross officials have estimated that 800+ civillians died in the seige of fallujah. The tatics employed by the USA are careless.

Now you are contradicting yourself, is it careless accidents or manslaughter?

 

[CptStern]

if there was even an attempt to answer even one of those questions, I'd be surprised ...even a little astonished

 

[No Limit]

Now you are contradicting yourself, is it careless accidents or manslaughter?

LOL :E

Republicans say the dumbest things. Again, why the hell are you here?

 

[Solaris]

Definitions of manslaughter on the Web:
Accidental homicide or homicide which occurs without an intent to kill, and which does not occur during the commission of another crime or under extreme provocation.

 

[Foxtrot]

Bah it is early, my fault.
This is what I was looking for

not accidents ....deliberate

Yes confusion. Unarmed man lying on floor bleeding------>Shot deadin the head by marine

Yes, thats the sort of mistake that can happen to anyone, I mean he WAS ON THE FLOOR DYING! If thats not a threat I don;t know what is.

<Accidents happen, and always will

Yes when you use these sort of tatics

 

[No Limit]

if there was even an attempt to answer even one of those questions, I'd be surprised ...even a little astonished

Yeah, it won't happen. When the guy doesn't understand how offical government documents work you really can't do much for him. I just pray to god he won't be eligible to vote by 06 and 08.

I was hoping Seinfeld, who I'm guessing still supports Bush, would come in and address this. If not next time Iraq is brought up any republican on this board that didn't come in here needs to be pointed to this thread if they try to defend Bush's actions.

 

[Solaris]

Yes they can easly support it, but don't actually know why.

 

[No Limit]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,11069-1647332,00.html

One senior US editor frankly admitted this week that his paper hadn’t touched the Sunday Times memo because it hadn’t been able to obtain a copy from its own sources. Jim Cox of USA Today said his newspaper had tried calling Downing Street, but not surprisingly had failed to obtain "explicit confirmation of [the memo’s] authenticity".

It was not until President Bush was asked about the memo on Tuesday that USA Today mentioned it to its readers for the first time. So frustrated were some of the President’s opponents at the US media’s silence that one left-wing website, Democrats.com, offered a $1,000 reward to any reporter ready to tackle the President on the issue. The Reuters reporter who posed the question on Tuesday was unaware of the reward and has no intention of collecting it.

Yet now the controversy is out in the open and there is no further doubting of the memo’s authenticity, or excuse for media foot-dragging. The original Sunday Times report was widely quoted in leading newspapers this week. A Democratic senator entered the memo into the record of a meeting of the Senate Foreign Affairs Committee.

A group of 89 Democratic congressmen has already written to the President questioning him about the claims in the memo, and several of their number have told The Sunday Times they do not intend to let the matter drop, despite the White House’s refusal so far to respond.

Perhaps most significantly, the President’s continuing difficulties in Iraq are taking a heavy toll of his approval ratings, and are beginning to threaten the Republicans’ chances in mid-term elections next year. Further violence in Iraq may yet encourage a rebirth of American public interest in how the war came to be started.

.At Tuesday’s press conference, Mr Bush and Mr Blair managed to dodge serious examination of their preparations for war, but the issue does not look like going away soon.

 

[CptStern]

I'm sure given enough time they'll try resort to their usual excercise in revisionist history

 

[KoreBolteR]

i wonder where seinfeldrules is....

 

[No Limit]

Bah it is early, my fault.
This is what I was looking for

So foxtrot, you haven't refuted the points yet. Does that mean you admit Bush lied his ass off?

 

[KoreBolteR]

So foxtrot, you haven't refuted the points yet. Does that mean you admit Bush lied his ass off?

what leader doesnt?

 

[CptStern]

yes but most 1st world leaders dont resort to lying to justify destroying an entire nation

 

[No Limit]

what leader doesnt?

There are different levels of lies. There is "No, I did not have sexual relations with that women". And then there are lies like "Saddam can set off a mushroom cloud in this country today". You be the judge of which is worse and which one should be an impeachable one.

 

[CptStern]

the sex one?

 

[No Limit]

the sex one?

Well according to the Republicans. Sure, president can lie about war but since we now run the government lets just be Bush apologists. Clinton gets a BJ and they have power; IMPEACH!!!!!!!!

Foxtror, I would also like to remind you that your borther, which I assume you agree with, said Bush should be impeached if he lied. And since you agree he lied you agree he should be impeached.

 

[Foxtrot]

Well according to the Republicans. Sure, president can lie about war but since we now run the government lets just be Bush apologists. Clinton gets a BJ and they have power; IMPEACH!!!!!!!!

Foxtror, I would also like to remind you that your borther, which I assume you agree with, said Bush should be impeached if he lied. And since you agree he lied you agree he should be impeached.

I agree, if it can be proved without a doubt that he lied (like Clinton) then he should be. And don't assume my brother and I agree on everything, we don't.

 

[No Limit]

I agree, if it can be proved without a doubt that he lied (like Clinton) then he should be. And don't assume my brother and I agree on everything, we don't.

WE JUST PROVED IT! You haven't refuted it which means you agree which also means you agree he should be impeached. I will not let you, or any other republican ignore the facts and this post. Its time to stop this bullshit.

 

[Foxtrot]

WE JUST PROVED IT! You haven't refuted it which means you agree which also means you agree he should be impeached. I will not let you, or any other republican ignore the facts and this post. Its time to stop this bullshit.

It is time for you to stop the bullshit, until that memo is validated from a trusted source most people aren't going to believe it.

 

[No Limit]

It is time for you to stop the bullshit, until that memo is validated from a trusted source most people aren't going to believe it.

What the hell is wrong with you? Out of all the examples I posted of Bush lying one had to do with the memo. Care to address the others?

 

[Foxtrot]

What the hell is wrong with you? Out of all the examples I posted of Bush lying one had to do with the memo. Care to address the others?

Wouldn't the memo be the strongest one (if it is real) though? That is actual proof, the others are just speculation IIRC.

 

[CptStern]

you wont listen anyway ...I suspect if Bush himself knocked on your door and said "foxy I'm a big fat liar, pants on fire" ...you still wouldnt believe it


No Limit gave you enough material to disprove a boatload of lies ....I gave you an interview with the former anti-terrorism advisor for Bush explicitly saying Bush lied and you didnt believe ...seriously I dont know what would ever change your mind if facts havent worked so far

 

[No Limit]

Wouldn't the memo be the strongest one (if it is real) though? That is actual proof, the others are just speculation IIRC.

NOTHING IS SPECULATION. For christ sake dude, do you even understand what you are saying.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Why will Bush not respond to the following letter signed by 88 members of the house:

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_demo...memoltr5505.pdf

You did not address the following 10 lies the administration told about Iraq:

http://www.alternet.org/story/16274

You will not address why Blair would lose many of his parliament positions instead of simply saying the memo is not authentic. You made the compltely stupid claim that the memo is not authentic. This claim by you simply tells me you know nothing about politics or you are just making an ass of yourself to not have to address it. Remember, even you brother didn't dispute the authenticity of the memo. In fact, you can not find a single person in the American, British, or any government that disputes this memo. But you, Foxtrot, are above all these people and can dispute it. Please, pass me what you are smoking .

You will not address why we went in to war without UN approval when Bush said he would get UN approval before going in to war.

You did not tell me what Saddam did that defied UN resolution 1441. Remember Bush said if Saddam complies with this resolution he would avoid war.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationw...itics-headlines

A former Bolton deputy says the U.S. undersecretary of state felt Jose Bustani "had to go," particularly because the Brazilian was trying to send chemical weapons inspectors to Baghdad. That might have helped defuse the crisis over alleged Iraqi weapons and undermined a U.S. rationale for war.

Why was Bolton trying to fire people that were investigating our intelligence? The firing that the article talks about has been ruled illegal by the UN.

 

[No Limit]

What is wrong about each of these:

LIE #1: "The evidence indicates that Iraq is reconstituting its nuclear weapons program ... Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment needed for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons." -- President Bush, Oct. 7, 2002, in Cincinnati.

FACT: This story, leaked to and breathlessly reported by Judith Miller in the New York Times, has turned out to be complete baloney. Department of Energy officials, who monitor nuclear plants, say the tubes could not be used for enriching uranium. One intelligence analyst, who was part of the tubes investigation, angrily told The New Republic: "You had senior American officials like Condoleezza Rice saying the only use of this aluminum really is uranium centrifuges. She said that on television. And that's just a lie."

LIE #2: "The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." -- President Bush, Jan.28, 2003, in the State of the Union address.

FACT: This whopper was based on a document that the White House already knew to be a forgery thanks to the CIA. Sold to Italian intelligence by some hustler, the document carried the signature of an official who had been out of office for 10 years and referenced a constitution that was no longer in effect. The ex-ambassador who the CIA sent to check out the story is pissed: "They knew the Niger story was a flat-out lie," he told the New Republic, anonymously. "They [the White House] were unpersuasive about aluminum tubes and added this to make their case more strongly."

LIE #3: "We believe [Saddam] has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons." -- Vice President Cheney on March 16, 2003 on "Meet the Press."

FACT: There was and is absolutely zero basis for this statement. CIA reports up through 2002 showed no evidence of an Iraqi nuclear weapons program.

LIE #4: "[The CIA possesses] solid reporting of senior-level contacts between Iraq and al-Qaeda going back a decade." -- CIA Director George Tenet in a written statement released Oct. 7, 2002 and echoed in that evening's speech by President Bush.

FACT: Intelligence agencies knew of tentative contacts between Saddam and al-Qaeda in the early '90s, but found no proof of a continuing relationship. In other words, by tweaking language, Tenet and Bush spun the intelligence180 degrees to say exactly the opposite of what it suggested.

LIE #5: "We've learned that Iraq has trained al-Qaeda members in bomb-making and poisons and deadly gases ... Alliance with terrorists could allow the Iraqi regime to attack America without leaving any fingerprints." -- President Bush, Oct. 7.

FACT: No evidence of this has ever been leaked or produced. Colin Powell told the U.N. this alleged training took place in a camp in northern Iraq. To his great embarrassment, the area he indicated was later revealed to be outside Iraq's control and patrolled by Allied war planes.

LIE #6: "We have also discovered through intelligence that Iraq has a growing fleet of manned and unmanned aerial vehicles that could be used to disperse chemical or biological weapons across broad areas. We are concerned that Iraq is exploring ways of using these UAVs [unmanned aerial vehicles] for missions targeting the United States." -- President Bush, Oct. 7.

FACT: Said drones can't fly more than 300 miles, and Iraq is 6,000 miles from the U.S. coastline. Furthermore, Iraq's drone-building program wasn't much more advanced than your average model plane enthusiast. And isn't a "manned aerial vehicle" just a scary way to say "plane"?

LIE #7: "We have seen intelligence over many months that they have chemical and biological weapons, and that they have dispersed them and that they're weaponized and that, in one case at least, the command and control arrangements have been established." -- President Bush, Feb. 8, 2003, in a national radio address.

FACT: Despite a massive nationwide search by U.S. and British forces, there are no signs, traces or examples of chemical weapons being deployed in the field, or anywhere else during the war.

LIE #8: "Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical weapons agent. That is enough to fill 16,000 battlefield rockets." -- Secretary of State Colin Powell, Feb. 5 2003, in remarks to the UN Security Council.

FACT: Putting aside the glaring fact that not one drop of this massive stockpile has been found, as previously reported on AlterNet the United States' own intelligence reports show that these stocks -- if they existed -- were well past their use-by date and therefore useless as weapon fodder.

LIE #9: "We know where [Iraq's WMD] are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south, and north somewhat." -- Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, March 30, 2003, in statements to the press.

FACT: Needless to say, no such weapons were found, not to the east, west, south or north, somewhat or otherwise.

LIE #10: "Yes, we found a biological laboratory in Iraq which the UN prohibited." -- President Bush in remarks in Poland, published internationally June 1, 2003.

FACT: This was reference to the discovery of two modified truck trailers that the CIA claimed were potential mobile biological weapons lab. But British and American experts -- including the State Department's intelligence wing in a report released this week -- have since declared this to be untrue. According to the British, and much to Prime Minister Tony Blair's embarrassment, the trailers are actually exactly what Iraq said they were; facilities to fill weather balloons, sold to them by the British themselves.

 

[Glirk Dient]

Definition of a lie from dictionary.com

1 A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.

Bush didn't lie, he was mislead. He did not present that information on purpose. You have shown as much valid information as we have valid information for Iraqs WMDs. Which is no hardcore evidence, just a whole lot of pieces to the puzzle.

Another way I look at it, why isn't there a huge investigation of Bush lying? Because they know it is just a bunch of BS and won't hold up.

 

[No Limit]

Definition of a lie from dictionary.com

1 A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.

Bush didn't lie, he was mislead. He did not present that information on purpose. You have shown as much valid information as we have valid information for Iraqs WMDs. Which is no hardcore evidence, just a whole lot of pieces to the puzzle.

Another way I look at it, why isn't there a huge investigation of Bush lying? Because they know it is just a bunch of BS and won't hold up.

Do you not know how to read. You just repeated what you said earlier and I refuted everything you said. There isn't an investigation because the government is ran by Republicans, democrats have no power.

He was mislead is the biggest load of bullshit on the face of this earth after everything I just posed. As Stern pointed out, Bush could come knock on your dor, say "I lied" and you would reply "no mr president, you didn't lie, you were mislead".

I am also disappointed it took you a whole day to copy and paste what you wrote yesterday. Address my post above, I am getting sick of this.