Buying HL2 BE HONEST!

[Dile]

Originally posted by PvtRyan
We have a very simple solution to that: don't play it.

It's not like you have some devine right to play everything that comes out, and not playing a game won't kill you.

I don't have money for a Ferrari, does this grant me the right to steal it, just because I wouldn't buy it anyway? If you have the money to buy the pc you play it on, you've got the money to but a game every other 2 months or so. "I wouldn't buy it anyway" is a lame excuse to make up for downloading. But there is no good excuse to do it.
If you just admit it's wrong no matter what way you look at it, I won't bother bitching about it, but people who make up stupid excuses for their bad habits to try to make right what's wrong really piss me off.

Just think. Only those people can do harm to the developers who say "I can download the game, why should I buy it?" It's +1 fan -1 money.

Those that say "I can't afford the game, I need to warez it if want to play it" are +1 fan, +0 money. No harm!

 

[Lil' Timmy]

Originally posted by PvtRyan
If you have the money to buy the pc you play it on, you've got the money to but a game every other 2 months or so.

so i stole my 'puter.. can i steal a game every 2 months or so? theenks!

 

[Lil' Timmy]

dile, seriously, is that the way you think the economy should work? i admit, there's no way i'm ever going to be able to afford a ferarri (as per the topical example), but i'd definitely be a fan if i could drive one around.

 

[iamironsam]

You all better buy it or Mr. Newell's gonna bust your kneecaps.

 

[Iconoclast]

Originally posted by Dile
Those that say "I can't afford the game, I need to warez it if want to play it" are +1 fan, +0 money. No harm!

It must be nice being so ignorant.

No harm? How about the £30/$50 you just stole straight out of their pockets?

I guess your definition of a fan is someone who will continue to steal and enjoy Valve's games? Valve must really love it's "fans".

 

[iamironsam]

Originally posted by Iconoclast
It must be nice being so ignorant.

No harm? How about the £30/$50 you just stole straight out of their pockets?

I guess your definition of a fan is someone who will continue to steal and enjoy Valve's games? Valve must really love it's "fans".

Specially the ones that are willing to go out of their way to hack Valve just to get their hands on an early copy of the game. Now that's a dedicated fan.

 

[Dile]

Originally posted by Iconoclast
It must be nice being so ignorant.

No harm? How about the £30/$50 you just stole straight out of their pockets?

I guess your definition of a fan is someone who will continue to steal and enjoy Valve's games? Valve must really love it's "fans".

If I download game, no bank account loses money, and it doesn't even have effect on anything as long as I woudn't buy it if I didn't have the chance to download it (Sentence of the Year).

I really can't add anything, just read my above post again and again if you still don't understand

 

[Dile]

Originally posted by Lil' Timmy
dile, seriously, is that the way you think the economy should work? i admit, there's no way i'm ever going to be able to afford a ferarri (as per the topical example), but i'd definitely be a fan if i could drive one around.

No, I don't think of how the economy should work, I just do what I suppose to be right in my point of view, and the developers/etc are the ones that should convince me to do things in a certain way.

 

[Lil' Timmy]

Originally posted by Dile
just read my above post again and again if you still don't understand

we all understand. we understand that you're wrong. i think this picture should help you get the idea.

 

[Dile]

And know what?

If I hadn't borrowed HL from one of my classmates 4 and a half years ago, I wouldn't be here, I wouldn't be making a mod for HL2, I wouldn't be a huge HL and CS fan, I wouldn't be nowhere!

 

[iamironsam]

Originally posted by Dile
And know what?

If I hadn't borrowed HL from one of my classmates 4 and a half years ago, I wouldn't be here, I wouldn't be making a mod for HL2, I wouldn't be a huge HL and CS fan, I wouldn't be nowhere!

Just admit you're a dirty rotten thief and get on with it.

 

[Dile]

No further comment...

 

[Axyon]

Originally posted by Dile
And know what?

If I hadn't borrowed HL from one of my classmates 4 and a half years ago, I wouldn't be here, I wouldn't be making a mod for HL2, I wouldn't be a huge HL and CS fan, I wouldn't be nowhere!

Did you end up buying Half-Life though? That's what I want to know.

 

[Dile]

Originally posted by Abom|nation
Did you end up buying Half-Life though? That's what I want to know.

Yes, because Valve convinced me to do so.

 

[Lil' Timmy]

ok, i personally emailed gabe, the whole valve staff, the police, fbi, the cia, mi5, nsa, the nba, cbs and qed about this "dile" person. consider yourself acronymed!

 

[Iconoclast]

Originally posted by Dile
If I download game, no bank account loses money

Are you a total moron?

Valve lose the price of the game because you stole it (and don't dress up the word by using "downloaded", you are a thief). Their bank account loses the price of the game.

Think of it this way - you go to work and earn $50. On your way home I hit you and steal your money. But hey, it's okay - your bank account hasn't lost money! Good job I didn't rob you!

Please use your brain. I seriously worry about the state of the world with people so blissfully stupid as you in it.

 

[Dile]

Originally posted by Iconoclast
Are you a total moron?

Valve lose the price of the game because you stole it (and don't dress up the word by using "downloaded", you are a thief). Their bank account loses the price of the game.

Please, seriously, use your brain.

My choices were: Not buying, not playing OR Not buying, playing

EDIT: Anyway, it's not about me and HL...

 

[iamironsam]

Originally posted by Dile
My choices were: Not buying, not playing OR Not buying, playing

EDIT: Anyway, it's not about me and HL...

Then you are morally and legally wrong. Stop trying to justify your actions. Just accept it and move on.

 

[Lil' Timmy]

well, as much fun as it was picking on dile, you people do know he has something of a point (though he seems reticent to articulate it) that's worth discussion. if a person was not going to buy somehting in the first place, then how can you say the company is losing money? it's not as if they have to replace anything. the argument is rather strainght-forward. it's not without it's complications though. the obvious counter is that if you didn't know that it would be so easy to obtain a game without paying, you may have wanted to buy it in the first place. i can afford to buy music and there's music i have and didn't pay for, but some of it i probably would have if i couldn't have gotten it free. it's easy to decide, "hey, i wasn't going to buy it anyway" when you know you don't have to to use the product. and if everyone takes that example, then development would stop right-quickly. however, one can't police another persons mind, and i can't honestly say whether you would have bought it if you knew you couldn't get it for free.

to say it's the developers fault if you use warez is just stupid though. how the **** is it their fault? b/c they didn't protect themselves from it with better security? that's a falacy. it's like saying people who get robbed or raped or murdered deserved what they got. extreme examples? well, not really, they are all crimes. it's not always possible to protect oneself, be one a person of company. that's what laws are for. is the end-user the criminal though? well, yes. maybe not as big a criminal as the hacker who made the warez in the first place, but you're still the recipient of stolen property (which is a crime).

is there is a difference between something like a manufactured good (e.g. car, cd) or money in the pocket and a released game? without getting into ethics (b/c then all hell breaks loose), that's not an easy question to answer. legally i don't think there is, so assuming you like living in a lawful country and take advatage of such laws, perhaps you should follow them when you can. it's not the developers responsibility to "convince" you to do something. in many cases, you are expected to do that yourself, or a legal representative will come along and do it for you. of course, we know that won't really happen, which is why all of this happens in the first place. a world without consequences is full of children. the mentality on display is 'i do what i want until someone stops me'. which is entirely anti-social in the clinical sense of the word. it's the same mentality as most criminals.

 

[Loke]

I'm really going to buy this game, I was (or I’m still) a huge fan of Half-Life.

Just a little upset that they haven’t released something new yet. Boring to wait...

 

[poseyjmac]

Originally posted by Dile
BTW it's not the user's fault if he gets it from warez. It's always the developer's fault.

And if one can't afford a game, it's nothing bad because he wouldn't buy it anyway...

*cough*warez monkey*cough*

 

[The Mullinator]

*sigh* Its always fun to watch the young warez monkeys try and justify what they do.

So wrong, so stuborn, so ignorant or unwilling to admit the truth.

 

[Iconoclast]

Originally posted by Lil' Timmy
a person was not going to buy somehting in the first place, then how can you say the company is losing money?

Because the company has had it's product stolen, and is now receiving no income for said product. It HAS lost money. If you're never going to buy something then you never play it. If you then proceed to steal the product then you are denying the company their income for the game.

This is totally dispicable - you are literally stealing the money the
employees of the company use to put food on their table; if nobody buys their product they don't make any money.

Random example: I don't have a Jaguar. I'm not going to buy a Jaguar. By your logic, if I now stole a Jaguar from a showroom that's just fine, because I wasn't ever going to buy one. Jaguar has "lost no money" according to you. Stupidity. Please think your arguments through, because apparently in your world actions do not have consequences.

 

[Dabs]

Buying it and if they're still planning on making tiered versions, I'm getting the most expensive Collectors Edition one. :cheers:

 

[gamblor]

There is no chance i would ever download that game, too much respect. Buy is a no brainer for me, and hopefully for all of you.

 

[pk1209]

i'll be buying this game but Iconoclast your jaguar example isn't really right. If i make a jaguar and some one steals it i lose money because i no longer have the car to sell to somebody else for profit. if i download warez i am not stealing off a shelf (so no one else can buy the product). so valve don't lose any money, cos all the copies they make are still on shelfs ready to be bought....

 

[Lil' Timmy]

iconoclast, you should read my whole post. pk1209 has a point as well, but that's where the distinction (or lack of) physical and intellectual property come in. it's a little more complicated than, "it's stealing!!"

 

[bgesley426]

If you download a game. Its basically like this... best explained in a tree example

1 game.
/\
2 2 downloaded.
/\ /\
3 3 3 3 p2p.

You now have about 7 people using what 1 person bought. 1 game used among 7 people. If the game was 48 bucks. Instead of it being really 48 bucks per person its now become 8 bucks per person. Thus a company making 1 game for 1 person. Is now losing money since its making 1 game for 7 people. The value per game goes way down and so do sales. I probably ****ed up my equation since I didn't take calulous my senior year and thus slacking off on all math in general. But I think I at least got a point across.

Also I'm buying my HL2 game. For all its worth. It doesn't matter if Dile originally got his copy of HL for free. He did eventually buy the game. But even I'm an example of what he did wrong. My friend let me borrow his HL came and told me to download CS so I did. Then one of his friends gave me another CDKEY and I've been using that for over a year. Which is why NOW I choose to buy HL2 and give something back.

 

[Lil' Timmy]

look, everyone, jesus! what dile was trying to point out, is that one can draw a distinction between someone who uses the hack but wouldn't have bought the game anyway, and someone using the hack that would have bought the game. they are different cases and branch diagrams like bgesleys implicitly assume that all of the nodes (end-users) on the tree would have payed for the game otherwise. whether you believe him or not is a different question, but dile is saying monetary concerns such as the one above don't apply to someone who is going to buy the game anyway. i don't exactly agree with (see my post a page ago), but can certainly see the particular logic of it. it's not so cut and dry.

 

[Styloid]

I think that where Dile comes from is that there is no actual material being stolen. When you steal a car you take metal machine parts that are expensive to produce and put together. He probably sees it the same way with music. When you download a bunch of songs you don't actually take anything of physical value... it's information in a computer.
There is, however, the idea that Valve or any artist put a lot of effort, time (5 years) and money (made from HL1) into their project and that they deserve to be compensated for that... it's a job. Creativity needs to be rewarded or not many people would pursue it and we'd all live in a dry, sucky world.

 

[~}A{~TF2]

HL2. BUYING?

Heh. There is no way in hell I'm not buying HL2! Everything about HL2 just oozes fun, style, and hell , more fun! This game is going to bring about an even bigger following for MOD authors and such, including me! And multiplay is just going to blow the hell out of everything else out there... whatever the multiplay is... just the fact that you can blow shit up and interact with stuff in the game world, and manipulate it just makes it that much harder waiting for this game!

:cheers:

 

[iamaelephant]

Tell me, all you people bashing Dile, do you have any pirated software on your computer? Am I to assume that you have no illegal mp3s, no episodes, movies, cracked software etc.? Everyone who makes those cool photohop images, did you actually pay for Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro or whatever you use? Did you pay for Shockwave to make those flash movies?

I guarantee that 90% of the people bashing Dile are complete hypocrites.

And as for this bullshit argument about the Jaguar, maybe it would apply in the real world if it was possible to make an exact replica of the Jaguar by simply pressing a couple of keys. When I download a game I'm not walking up to the Dev, punching him in the face and stealing the box, I'm downloading a copy of the game which I would not have bought anyway. If game companies want me to pay for games they're going to have to produce something better than H&D2 or NFS:U.

I will probably buy HL2, providing it doesnt suck ass, but if the reviews are shit then I will have no problem downloading it.

 

[iamaelephant]

quote is too close to edit....

 

[Lil' Timmy]

and "payed" is too close to "paid".. what a ****tard.. jesus.

 

[iamaelephant]

I made a spelling error so that makes my entire post null and void? Try reading it for what it is, and making a proper comment....

 

[iamaelephant]

Originally posted by Lil' Timmy

'puter
theenks!
somehting
strainght-forward


what a ****tard.. jesus

 

[Javert]

Platinum Edition, here I come!!!

 

[PvtRyan]

Originally posted by iamaelephant
Tell me, all you people bashing Dile, do you have any pirated software on your computer? Am I to assume that you have no illegal mp3s, no episodes, movies, cracked software etc.? Everyone who makes those cool photohop images, did you actually pay for Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro or whatever you use? Did you pay for Shockwave to make those flash movies?

I guarantee that 90% of the people bashing Dile are complete hypocrites.

And as for this bullshit argument about the Jaguar, maybe it would apply in the real world if it was possible to make an exact replica of the Jaguar by simply pressing a couple of keys. When I download a game I'm not walking up to the Dev, punching him in the face and stealing the box, I'm downloading a copy of the game which I would not have bought anyway. If game companies want me to pay for games they're going to have to produce something better than H&D2 or NFS:U.

I will probably buy HL2, providing it doesnt suck ass, but if the reviews are shit then I will have no problem downloading it.

Did you ever see me stating that I don't have any warez? No. I just said people who try to talk right what's so obviously wrong really sicken me.

And you're right that there is no material loss in downloading, but you're downloading a game, playing it, liking it, a game which costed the developer millions, artists spending months on their work, and you're too cheap to pay for it. Maybe you ain't a thief, you're just a freeloader, just as bad.

And you say if HL2 rocks, you'll buy it, and if it sucks you'll download it. Why the hell would you bother downloading it if it sucks? I never played Enter the Matrix, I was planning to buy it, but as soon I heard that it sucked, I didn't bother to download it, and why would I, IT SUCKED! If HL2 is gonna suck, I'll probably play it as some friends house, make my conclusions and forget it. The excuse "I didn't really liked the game, so I'll just go and download it, I have that right to do so" is just bullshit, that can be an excuse for any game to justify you downloading it.
If it's worth playing for 20 hours or so, it's worth buying.

 

[Lil' Timmy]

well, 'puter and theenks were intentional, and somehting is an honest typo. not sure how the "n" got in strainght, but i sat there and typed out "payed" instead of "paid". that takes a special kind of stupid, in my book.

 

[Brian Damage]

Buying. Honest!

I want a nice, big, shiny box. Hopefully with a slightly smaller, shiny manual inside.

EDIT: What option would someone choose if they know someone is going to give HL2 to them? I'm guessing "Buy".