China and Taiwan

[Calanen]

Bliink -

I think you are a good guy. Obviously Australian. And I know you like PMs more than things in public. But what is said in public, must be responded to in public.

Going on the example that you have cited for Scoobl, and basing it soley on this alone (not prior behaviour) I think that even if you are not actually biassed (ie was not deliberate), that there is the 'reasonable apprehension of bias' present in the fact that all manner of people say the most vile things about President George Bush here, and one guy criticises Jimmy Carter and you put the boot in?

I know its your board, and you can warn, moderate ban whoever you want. Including me, which you may do for me responding to this (which is human nature - ethics take second place to a man's ego most often ie don't criticise what I do, I have the power... so cop this!.).

But I have to say, that while I would not have said what this guy said about Jimmy Carter, its a bit rich him having his teeth kicked in for it given the pages and pages of ravings posted about President Bush on here that are tolerated, praised, or ignored.

But i swore 2 oaths relating to justice and injustice. And I think, that the last comment was unjust. So here I am speaking up....

 

[bliink]

Bliink -

I think you are a good guy. Obviously Australian. And I know you like PMs more than things in public. But what is said in public, must be responded to in public.
...
But I have to say, that while I would not have said what this guy said about Jimmy Carter, its a bit rich him having his teeth kicked in for it given the pages and pages of ravings posted about President Bush on here that are tolerated, praised, or ignored.

It was nothing to do with his comments about carter.

It was more the whole:

jihadi scumbags

I had the best laugh I've had in years.

what a weak A$$ed puke.

and probably

ya gotta love the lefties.

Not exactly the most civilised way to talk, and maybe even arrogant.
Its that kind of behaviour that leads to flaming, and thats what I'm trying to stop.

 

[Gray Fox]

ya gotta love the lefties.


ahhhh bless Jimmy Carters cowardly little heart, he sold out the millions in Taiwan, did nothing to help those in Cambodia, gave the Panama Canal away and let a bunch of jihadi scumbags overrun our embassy and hold 77 of our citizens hotage for 444 days.

what a weak A$$ed puke.

I must admit when he was on stage at the DNC talking about a stronger America, I had the best laugh I've had in years.

I have noticed that you often blame carter for your problems, have you ever considerd talking to a shrink. This might become serious if you are not able to focus that healthy hate against other lefties other than him.

 

[kirovman]

In other news: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4341557.stm

Chinese is the language to learn, for the future.

It is set to be one of or the main dominant language in business in the future.

Not suprising since it is 1/5 the world's population speaking it.

 

[Eg.]

i have a few hong-kong chinese in my school, and they hate the mainland. they have the whole asian pride thing going, with the rich culture and whatnot, but they hate the mainland. i even have friends from bejing that like it here a lot more than at home.

so if taiwan does remain independent, then it may raise anti communist feeling on the mainland.

 

[kmack]

Our trade defecit has hit the 2nd highest in history (first highest was last november ) at $58.3 billion dollars. Our biggest defecit is to China with an imbalance of $15.3 Billion. trade gap surged last year by 24.3% and set a new record for the THIRD straight year at $617.1 billion. This year will set another new record according to private economists.

We are so dependent on China it will be hard to disallow their actions.

(source Martin Crutsinger, Associated Press, March 12th 2005)

 

[Scoobnfl]

I have noticed that you often blame carter for your problems, have you ever considerd talking to a shrink. This might become serious if you are not able to focus that healthy hate against other lefties other than him.

hardly. Carters legacy of shame is his own, and I do not hate him. How could I hate a man that restored the honor of Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee, 2 unyielding and patriotic american heroes.

He did cost the USA and freedom loving people across the world dearly, due to his absolute ineptness at foreign policy.

You need to sort out your attitude. Hardly any other members carry on like you are right now.

Attitude?

If Jimmy Carter had not ended the mutual defense pact that we had with Taiwan, this discussion would not even be occurring, because the millions of people in Taiwan would not be in fear of invasion, because China would not dare threaten such action.

Sorry that you want to ignore history, fact, or irony, heck all three for that matter.

 

[Razor]

hardly. Carters legacy of shame is his own, and I do not hate him. How could I hate a man that restored the honor of Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee, 2 unyielding and patriotic american heroes.

He did cost the USA and freedom loving people across the world dearly, due to his absolute ineptness at foreign policy.

You could say the same about Reagan and a quite a few other American presidents, as well as other world leaders from other countries. Just what makes Jimmy Carter so much worse then all the others?

 

[Scoobnfl]

You could say the same about Reagan and a quite a few other American presidents, as well as other world leaders from other countries. Just what makes Jimmy Carter so much worse then all the others?

1. His unilateral (lefties dislike that type of action right?) ending of the mutual defense pact with Taiwan.

This IMHO is the worst thing he did. He turned his back on the 20 million people of Taiwan and has left them in fear of being invaded by China ever since.

2. Giving up control of the Panama Canal.

In case you didn't know we constructed the Panama Canal and its strategic and economic importance to us is vital. A communist Chinese owned conglomerate Hutchinson Whampoa is now in control of the panama canal. Thanks Jimmy.

3. Absolute cowardice in the face of Islamic extremism in regards to the Hostage crisis that began on 11/04/79 and lasted for 444 days. If Carter had the guts to fight the fight then and take on Islamic extremism and kill the purveyors of hate, think of all the victims of terrorism that may have lived. This is the price of pansification of the left.

Also related to this is his revisionist historian lying about the Iranian Hostage situation in this quote taken directly from the Carter Library's website.

The toll of patient diplomacy was great, but President Carter's actions brought freedom for the hostages with America's honor preserved.

only a true left wing idealogue could attempt to portray Carters ineffectiveness in regards to that situation as bringing freedom to the hostages while preserving Americas honor. It was President Reagan being elected and the fear of retribution from him that lead to their being released, that's why they were released after Reagan was innaugurated and Carter was out of office.

4. His appalling management of our economy.

5. The damage he did to the American farmer.

The list goes on and on and on.................

I will admit that I was absolutley disgusted with Reagans decision to run from the ME after our embassy was bombed and 240+ marines were killed. That was his chance to fight Islamic extremism and he dropped the ball. Thanks Gip.

 

[Razor]

3. Absolute cowardice in the face of Islamic extremism in regards to the Hostage crisis that began on 11/04/79 and lasted for 444 days. If Carter had the guts to fight the fight then and take on Islamic extremism and kill the purveyors of hate, think of all the victims of terrorism that may have lived. This is the price of pansification of the left.

Whether him taking a harder stand on that incident would of saved or cost more lives is anyones guess.

 

[Gray Fox]

Scoobnfl:

3. Absolute cowardice in the face of Islamic extremism in regards to the Hostage crisis that began on 11/04/79 and lasted for 444 days. If Carter had the guts to fight the fight then and take on Islamic extremism and kill the purveyors of hate, think of all the victims of terrorism that may have lived. This is the price of pansification of the left.

Ist here any truth to this http://www.btinternet.com/~nlpwessex/Documents/coupreaganbush.htm

 

[jondy]

Attitude?

Yeah, attitude.

Present the facts and get rid of the pisstaking. It's not doing you any credit.

And don't question Bliink, she's spot on.

 

[Scoobnfl]

Scoobnfl:

Ist here any truth to this http://www.btinternet.com/~nlpwessex/Documents/coupreaganbush.htm

I do not know.

Yeah, attitude.

Present the facts and get rid of the pisstaking. It's not doing you any credit.

do you mean the fact of Carter turning his back on 20,000,000 Taiwanese and unilaterally ending the mutual defense pact we had with them? Because if it weren't for that fact we would not even be having this discussion. oh and also that fact has already been stated.

 

[bliink]

do you mean the fact of Carter turning his back on 20,000,000 Taiwanese and unilaterally ending the mutual defense pact we had with them? Because if it weren't for that fact we would not even be having this discussion. oh and also that fact has already been stated.

No, I'm sure he meant what I did, which was in regards to the comments I quoted in my reply a few posts back. Nothing to do with carter... theres no giant conspiracy to bully you because you dont like carter. (like anyone would even bother)

 

[Tr0n]

I have a good friend in Taiwan and I pray to god this doesn't get out of control and turn to war.

Only time will tell.

 

[Gray Fox]

Why is it that when scoobnfl quoted Jondyfun, my name is in the quote as if I had posted that, this is not the first time this happend??

 

[The Monkey]

There's a very small chance that china would invide Taiwan with the knowlage that that would trigger off WWIII.

 

[Razor]

There's a very small chance that china would invide Taiwan with the knowlage that that would trigger off WWIII.

It isn't China's invasion of Taiwan that would create World War 3, it would be the rest of the world's reaction to it.

 

[jondy]

That's why he said 'trigger off'

 

[bliink]

Why is it that when scoobnfl quoted Jondyfun, my name is in the quote as if I had posted that, this is not the first time this happend??

sorted.

 

[Calanen]

There are still people here that are applying their western minds to the taiwan solution - and its not realistic. China wants Taiwan, will take it by force if it has to. And that force is going to be applied over the next few years. And it will not start WWIII - because America and the allies will stay out of it. They will find some way too. Not even Eisenhower would go to war when 500,000 Chinese poured over the border into North Korea and attacked UN troops. That would have been a perfectly valid reason to go to war with china but the US did not.

My hit prediction is, that whatever happens to Taiwan, the US may sabre rattle but they will not go to war. Its not a good enough reason.

 

[kirovman]

There are still people here that are applying their western minds to the taiwan solution - and its not realistic. China wants Taiwan, will take it by force if it has to. And that force is going to be applied over the next few years. And it will not start WWIII - because America and the allies will stay out of it. They will find some way too. Not even Eisenhower would go to war when 500,000 Chinese poured over the border into North Korea and attacked UN troops. That would have been a perfectly valid reason to go to war with china but the US did not.

My hit prediction is, that whatever happens to Taiwan, the US may sabre rattle but they will not go to war. Its not a good enough reason.

I agree with that.

Particularly the part about people applying their western minds to try to get a solution. If you try to argue against almost any mainland Chinese person about Taiwan...well the words 'head' and 'brick wall' spring to mind.

Taiwan too, they could have easily had independence in the years following 1949, with no fear of being attacked, but they stubbornly believed they could still retake the mainland, until recently.
They could have been at the UN called "Taiwan", instead of "China".

Now China would have had a hard job arguing against Taiwan in the UN if Taiwan had gone properly independent from the start.

Now it's become too late to become independent without severe consequences.