Combine Vs. Imperials?

[MJ12]

I think this is an interesting thought, who would win in a war?

The Combine of HL2, or the Imperials of the original Star Wars trilogy?

Combine: Combine Soldiers, Elite Combine, striders, hunters, rollermines, manhacks, scanners, gunships, dropships, those tank things, helicopters, metro police, headcrab missels, possibly that disintigration beam, crab synths, motar synths, hopper mines. (anything I forgot)

Imperials: Stormtroopers, scout troopers, snowtroopers, those weird floating robots, AT-AT's, AT-ST's, tie fighters, tie bombers, maybe a star destroyer or two, and hell how about Darth Vader. (anything else I forgot)

There's no denying that the Combine are very stormtrooper-esque.


I like the combine more, but personally, I am going with the Imperials, they have that whole space flight thing. Tie fighters and shit would rape them.

But for kicks, lets say the Imperials need the planet they are fighting the combine on, so they will not destroy it with the deathstar.

 

[Que-Ever]

Mother****ing darth vader will force choke them all to death.

 

[MJ12]

I love darth vader and all, but lets not forget in return of the jedi he was a sad sappy old prune (edit, i added crab and motar synths, and hoppermines)

 

[MJ12]

but theres no denying a one on one battle between a combine soldier and a stormtrooper, the stormtrooper would get his butt handed to him

 

[Shift]

Once the Deathstar appears, its game over. Unless they can make an army of X-Wings with Luke Skywalker piloting them.

 

[MJ12]

read-


"But for kicks, lets say the Imperials need the planet they are fighting the combine on, so they will not destroy it with the deathstar."

 

[Llama]

Combine, simply based on superior numbers.

I'm not even going to take tech into account based on they outnumber the imperials in the (likely) region of more than a billion to one

 

[MJ12]

Yeah, but most imperials are cloned. So I would think the number of Human Combine soldiers to Stormtroopers would be about equal, or perhaps the stormtroopers would have more, I mean, there were millions of those storm troopers on different planets

 

[Shift]

read-


"But for kicks, lets say the Imperials need the planet they are fighting the combine on, so they will not destroy it with the deathstar."

I skim read posts.

In that case, the Combine. I feel their equipment on the ground is much better and they unlimited resources because of the Citadels, that can only be destroyed from within. Thats only the Overwatch forces, we haven't really seen the full military might of the Combine.

 

[ríomhaire]

You're comparing an land-and-air-based occupation force to an entire galactic military.

 

[Nitre]

I reckon the Combine would win because they are special.

 

[Shift]

I reckon the Combine would win because they are special.

lol.

 

[Adabiviak]

You're comparing an land-and-air-based occupation force to an entire galactic military.

Yeah, we don't know what kind of space forces the Combine have (nor have we seen the mortar synths or other Combine weapons in action). However, let's say for the sake of argument that this is restricted to a ground-based battle. The AT-ATs would be a tough contender, if we assume their armor is tough enough to withstand gunship/strider fire. AT-STs would probably get owned by the Striders (which can, if they want to, walk much faster and have more powerful weaponry). Actual infantry going toe to toe without mechanized backup? I honestly can't decide. Both factions recruit from human populations, no? Give them some training, weapons, light armor, instructions and voila, a standing army! I'd probably have to say the Combine (since despite all this, the Empire got owned by the Ewoks).

 

[Nitre]

Hehe, anything that gets owned by small furry creatures pretty much sucks i'd say.

 

[Que-Ever]

HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TACKLED BY A ****ING EWOK?

It's ****ing scary

 

[MJ12]

the Empire did not get "Owned" by ewoks, okay, so they built a couple of traps at one battle, big woop!

The Empire enslaved the friggin wookie planet! Thats awesome

 

[Narvi]

Dude, the Imperials win for the same reason the Combine won.

Orbital support. Watch the Star Destroyers rain fire on the pretty Striders, mummy.

Besides which, don't underestimate Stormtroopers. They really did quite well for the situations they were in. They were doing pretty well against the Ewoks before a giant Wookiee hijacked one of their AT-STs and started blowing apart their armour support. You think the US sucks because insurgents manage to take down tanks with IEDs?

And AT-STs versus Striders... depends on whether the Strider gets their cannon charged up before the AT-ST blasts it. The AT-ST has a blaster cannon which should be equivalent to an RPG.

And you gave them starfighters. Come on, starfighters. The Combine don't have anything that can take down a starfighter. These are the same starfighters which turned random bits of the Death Star surface white-hot.

 

[watermonster]

Stormtroopers win, definitely. Look at their shiny armor! Those masks! Every girl's dream. Combine have nothing to retaliate with.

 

[morgs]

Storm troopers win!

 

[Jintor]

Two words: Stormtrooper Effect.

 

[soulslicer]

republic commando, storm troopers, laser weapon used, kills in 20 shots
half life 2, combine elite, any weapon kills them easily..

 

[Kevin]

Stormtroopers WILL overcome.

Besides, the stormtroopers still have their manly bits left.
So they fight with vigor.

But the striders singularity cannon will make scrapmetal out of the at-at's. Unless the starfighters don't rocket them.

And the suppression device could be used to destroy the smaller at-st's and infantry.

But since the imperials clone the troopers, theres too much of them.

So eventually the combine will suffer defeat.

 

[Narvi]

But the striders singularity cannon will make scrapmetal out of the at-at's. Unless the starfighters don't rocket them.

The strider's singularity cannon, blowing up AT-ATs? You do know what AT-AT armament is like, yes? It consumed up the rebel shield generator with one shot from kilometers away.

The most we've seen the singularity cannon do is blow up bits of random buildings. Certainly no "boom explosion blarg building dead" level explosions. Not to mention we've never seen the cannon used from long-range.

The reason buildings and such are so much charcoal is because of, you know, the striders firing more than once.

And the suppression device could be used to destroy the smaller at-st's and infantry.

The suppression device which, of course, was used to destroy things at long range... or wait. It wasn't.

One AT-ST falls. Then the rest of the AT-STs blow up the Overwatch building the suppressor is attached to, while infantry dodges the slow-ass beams.

Two words: Stormtrooper Effect.

The Combine is an entire army made of faceless mooks.

Stormtroopers excel against mooks. Recall A New Hope, where they blew through mooks like nothing else.''

They also have this wonderful anti head-crab device known as helmets and full NBC gear in their body-armour.

Unless James Blunt (Super-Combine Commando who loves his Combine wife and kids back at the Citadel,) shows up, the Combine will not benefit from the Stormtrooper Effect.

 

[Shift]

But how do they destroy the Citadel's that continously flood troops out, when nuclear missles cant even scratch them?

Not to mention I like I said, this is just Overwatch forces we are talking about, their main strength is yet to be seen, and I reckon it will an entire can woop ass.

 

[Llama]

Seems people are getting more stupid by the minute over here.

The Combine would win, due to the simple reason THEY OUTNUMBER THE IMPERIALS A MILLION TO ONE, (at least).

They aren't called the 'Universal Union' for nothing.

That's not even counting their superior tech. Do the imperials have an infinite number of self-repairing synthetic soldiers? I think not.

It's like a man with a bazooka against a million people with slightly smaller bazookas

Yeah, but most imperials are cloned. So I would think the number of Human Combine soldiers to Stormtroopers would be about equal, or perhaps the stormtroopers would have more, I mean, there were millions of those storm troopers on different planets

Based on Episode 2, the number of total stormtroopers numbers in the MILLIONS. That's nothing, a drop in the ocean. You cannot use the Over watch as a baseline for the Combine Empire itself.

 

[Narvi]

But how do they destroy the Citadel's that continously flood troops out, when nuclear missles cant even scratch them?

Not to mention I like I said, this is just Overwatch forces we are talking about, their main strength is yet to be seen, and I reckon it will an entire can woop ass.

Orbital bombardment. Good luck trying to get your forces out with the continuous stream of fire obliterating everything from orbit. Besides which Star Wars has ships, that, you know, can melt continents. I think that's slightly better than nuclear missiles.

Seems people are getting more stupid by the minute over here.

The Combine would win, due to the simple reason THEY OUTNUMBER THE IMPERIALS A MILLION TO ONE, (at least).

They aren't called the 'Universal Union' for nothing.

That's not even counting their superior tech. Do the imperials have an infinite number of self-repairing synthetic soldiers? I think not.

It's like a man with a bazooka against a million people with slightly smaller bazookas



Based on Episode 2, the number of total stormtroopers numbers in the MILLIONS. That's nothing, a drop in the ocean. You cannot use the Over watch as a baseline for the Combine Empire itself.

The term used in Episode 2 was units. A unit could be a battalion, a squad, or a single stormtrooper. Hardly conclusive evidence of numbers in the millions, ignoring the stupidity of such a low number of troops effecting a galactic civilization. If you take the EU into account it goes at least into the quadrillions.

And we have self-repairing soldiers. They're called humans.

This so-called awesome Overwatch can be taken down by the equivalent of Iraqi insurgents with AK-47s, recall.

We're going with what we've seen of the Combine empire. We haven't seen them unleash anything as powerful as the Death Star yet. Not counting the numerical advantage, because it's silly. It's like saying that an infinite number of chimps can defeat Godzilla.

We haven't seen their spaceforce yet, so what we've seen gets pummeled from orbit.

 

[Llama]

Orbital bombardment. Good luck trying to get your forces out with the continuous stream of fire obliterating everything from orbit. Besides which Star Wars has ships, that, you know, can melt continents. I think that's slightly better than nuclear missiles.

Please don't use useless add-on material to make a piont. There have been no examples of such powerful weapons, at least not in the films. Even if you could cite such examples, that would show how stupid, and self-contradictory everything is. If a single SD can melt continents, why would you need a deathstar?

The term used in Episode 2 was units. A unit could be a battalion, a squad, or a single stormtrooper. Hardly conclusive evidence of numbers in the millions, ignoring the stupidity of such a low number of troops effecting a galactic civilization. If you take the EU into account it goes at least into the quadrillions.

I very much doubt that. It most most likely using Unit in the literal sense - One unit = One Storm trooper. Whether or not you think it's stupid, it's what's in the movie, so you can't argue it.
Even then, you'd have (at most) A galaxy's worth of units. Hardly a match for an entire universe.

And we have self-repairing soldiers. They're called humans.

How many? Not enough?
Humans aren't very efficient at it either, they take a very long time.

This so-called awesome Overwatch can be taken down by the equivalent of Iraqi insurgents with AK-47s, recall.

I didn't say the Overwatch was awesome. Indeed, the very fact that it isn't is a principal argument.

We're going with what we've seen of the Combine empire. We haven't seen them unleash anything as powerful as the Death Star yet. Not counting the numerical advantage, because it's silly. It's like saying that an infinite number of chimps can defeat Godzilla.

Don't be ridiculous. We don't have to go simply with 'What we've seen' because we know the true magnitude of the Combine forces. Of course you count the numerical advantage, to say otherwise is plain stupidity. This isn't a man-for-man comparison, it's empire-vs-empire, so the numerical advantage is the most important thing to consider.

We haven't seen their spaceforce yet, so what we've seen gets pummeled from orbit.

With the continent melting lasers that both a) Magically do far more than they should, and b) have never actually done anything of the sort in any official film, ever.
[/quote]

C'mon, the Combine took over an entire universe. Do you really think they haven't trounced empires like the Imperials before?
Plus, the Imperials got their asses handed to them by a few rebels and a mushroom farmer named Luke.

 

[Kevin]

The strider's singularity cannon, blowing up AT-ATs? You do know what AT-AT armament is like, yes? It consumed up the rebel shield generator with one shot from kilometers away.

Have you heard of ambushes? And there could be more then 1 srider shooting it.

The most we've seen the singularity cannon do is blow up bits of random buildings. Certainly no "boom explosion blarg building dead" level explosions. Not to mention we've never seen the cannon used from long-range.

Ahem, the singularity cannon isn't as weak as you think.

The reason buildings and such are so much charcoal is because of, you know, the striders firing more than once.

So why not have many striders shoot an AT-AT more than once?

The suppression device which, of course, was used to destroy things at long range... or wait. It wasn't.

Who ever said anything about using it in long range?

One AT-ST falls. Then the rest of the AT-STs blow up the Overwatch building the suppressor is attached to, while infantry dodges the slow-ass beams.

Does it necessarily have to be attached to a building?
From what i saw in the game, the suppression device was a mobile cannon on the roof of the nexus.
And again, what about ambushing the AT-ST's with them?

They also have this wonderful anti head-crab device known as helmets.

I recall the combine overwatch also having those fancy anti-headcrab things.

Unless James Blunt (Super-Combine Commando who loves his Combine wife and kids back at the Citadel,) shows up, the Combine will not benefit from the Stormtrooper Effect.

Who the hell is James Blunt?

 

[Rapstah]

My life is brilliant.

My life is pure.

That's James Blunt.

 

[Narvi]

Have you heard of ambushes? And there could be more then 1 srider shooting it.

Ambushes depend on the environment. Besides which, I'm talking a straight on engagement.

Ahem, the singularity cannon isn't as weak as you think.

The reason buildings and such are so much charcoal is because of, you know, the striders firing more than once.

So why not have many striders shoot an AT-AT more than once?

Because after a strider fires once, it's revealed its position, and it shall be immediately blasted by the AT-AT.

Does it necessarily have to be attached to a building?
From what i saw in the game, the suppression device was a mobile cannon on the roof of the nexus.
And again, what about ambushing the AT-ST's with them?

Ambushing the AT-ST with a cannon that is attached to a building power supply. Right.

Who ever said anything about using it in long range?

I was pointing out that AT-ATs can attack at range, and outmatch the strider.

Please don't use useless add-on material to make a piont. There have been no examples of such powerful weapons, at least not in the films. Even if you could cite such examples, that would show how stupid, and self-contradictory everything is. If a single SD can melt continents, why would you need a deathstar?

To take out planetary shields. Which, you know, can deflect bombardments. The Death Star is much more powerful than your average Star Destroyer.

I very much doubt that. It most most likely using Unit in the literal sense - One unit = One Storm trooper. Whether or not you think it's stupid, it's what's in the movie, so you can't argue it.
Even then, you'd have (at most) A galaxy's worth of units. Hardly a match for an entire universe.

You are aware that units in the literal sense apply to units such as megawatts, yes? And we still don't know the scale.

With the continent melting lasers that both a) Magically do far more than they should, and b) have never actually done anything of the sort in any official film, ever.

The continent-melting lasers are derived from scenes in the film. Just so you know.

C'mon, the Combine took over an entire universe. Do you really think they haven't trounced empires like the Imperials before?
Plus, the Imperials got their asses handed to them by a few rebels and a mushroom farmer named Luke.

A few rebels which had an armed military and combat fighters. Hardly comparable to a standard one.

 

[Kevin]

Because after a strider fires once, it's revealed its position, and it shall be immediately blasted by the AT-AT.

You DO know how slow those things are? And im talking about MANY striders shooting it once.

Ambushing the AT-ST with a cannon that is attached to a building power supply. Right.

What? I said it looked like a cannon, ready to be moved around.

I was pointing out that AT-ATs can attack at range, and outmatch the strider.

I was talking about the suppression device...

 

[Llama]

The continent-melting lasers are derived from scenes in the film. Just so you know.

One - Do not use ridiculous pseudo-science in an attempt to baffle me.

Two - Find a source which matches the official specs of an imperial star destroyer. Yeesh.

You are aware that units in the literal sense apply to units such as megawatts, yes? And we still don't know the scale.

Don't be a smartass . You know what I meant. You still can't seem to grasp the difference in size between the two empires. Stop focusing on single-unit match ups and look at the bigger picture.

 

[WingsofJecka]

Quite an amusing debate going on here. The lurker in me likes to refrain from posting but I find this is a topic I could get into.

I agree with the the idea of the Combine having loads more 'military things' to use at their disposal, being as they are called the universal union. But that force is only good if they are able to use all of it effectively. I would believe that to supply a large enough force to disable the Imperials would take such an massive undertaking, more then one planet's worth of Citadels. And for some reason I don't see the Combine overwhelming the Imperial Army like that.

And in defense of the Star Destroyer, I see no reason why it wouldn't just lay slag down upon the Citadel's.

 

[Que-Ever]

blur-de-blurblur

How can you say we aren't allowed to take star wars EU into consideration and then keep blathering on about all the unseen and unknown forces of the combine?

 

[Dog--]

I have read this whole thread, and can say that the Combine can take out AT-AT's (AT-AT's are the huge 4-legged walkers right?).

Combine can make more Striders then the Imperials can make AT-AT's. Also AT-AT's are huge, Striders are pretty nimble, and can do things like ducking, dodging and the like, and also think on their own, so they don't need to wait for a pilots reaction time. AT-AT's take an eternity to turn around. Also, Taking the size into account, Striders can easily get through cities with speed, AT-AT's would take forever. However, one on one, wide open field, face-to-face (well, like half-mile away starting point), the AT-AT would win. Although, if the Strider dodges the AT-AT's attacks, and gets underneath it, the Strider should win.

I never said which empire would win, I was just explaining that one type of unit can kill another. Think about that before the flaming starts.

 

[Robert-]

Combine. Simply more awesomeness.

HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TACKLED BY A ****ING EWOK?

It's ****ing scary

Do you think that Steve Irwin ever made a lost episode on Ewoks?

 

[Higlac]

Has there ever been any evidence that the combine actually are universal? It could just be a ploy to keep down rebellion. Universal Union my ass.

 

[Narvi]

One - Do not use ridiculous pseudo-science in an attempt to baffle me.

Two - Find a source which matches the official specs of an imperial star destroyer. Yeesh.

One: Pseudoscience? It was written by an engineer.

Two: The Star Wars Incredible Cross Sections. Or, if you dislike the EU, here's a fan analysis.

Don't be a smartass . You know what I meant. You still can't seem to grasp the difference in size between the two empires. Stop focusing on single-unit match ups and look at the bigger picture.

You appear to have ignored my point that the OP explicitly tells us which bits of the Empire are fighting which bits of the Combine. That's ignoring the fact that 'rar rar unseen awesome' is really stupid.

You DO know how slow those things are? And im talking about MANY striders shooting it once.

They're more maneuvarable than you think. Recall the bit in Empire Strikes Back where one blasts a snow-speeder coming in from an angle?

Combine can make more Striders then the Imperials can make AT-AT's. Also AT-AT's are huge, Striders are pretty nimble, and can do things like ducking, dodging and the like, and also think on their own, so they don't need to wait for a pilots reaction time. AT-AT's take an eternity to turn around. Also, Taking the size into account, Striders can easily get through cities with speed, AT-AT's would take forever. However, one on one, wide open field, face-to-face (well, like half-mile away starting point), the AT-AT would win. Although, if the Strider dodges the AT-AT's attacks, and gets underneath it, the Strider should win.

You know, the damn things are glorified artillery pieces. They're deployed with AT-ST support, if you recall the Battle of Hoth. AT-ATs wouldn't be used in a city.

(Admittedly, by the end of that battle, all the AT-STs had been taken out by rebel emplacements, but you can't have everything.)

 

[Llama]

You appear to have ignored my point that the OP explicitly tells us which bits of the Empire are fighting which bits of the Combine. That's ignoring the fact that 'rar rar unseen awesome' is really stupid.

:| The OP evidently knows jack shit about HL2, because if he did, he would have actually talked about the Combine itself, rather than the Over watch.
If you don't use a proper comparison, you might as well not have one at all.

You can either be ignorant and lather about the strength of a few poxy AT-AT's, or you could stop riding the Star Wars fan boy bandwagon and actually look at how screwed the Empire would be.

Disclaimer: I am in no way an angry man and no offense is meant

Edit: I've looked at his website, and it seems your claim of 'melting continenets' was a little off.

"The atomic bomb that was dropped on Hiroshima was rated at 15 kilotons. This translates to about 63 terajoules. Using my conservative estimate for TL bolts (ignoring vaporisation), a middle-sized TL bolt has about 30 TJ of energy. Therefore, a TL bolt has about half the energy of the Hiroshima bomb."

 

[Kevin]

Im sorry Narvi, but i haven't seen the movies.

They're more maneuvarable than you think. Recall the bit in Empire Strikes Back where one blasts a snow-speeder coming in from an angle?

Maybe from an angle, but what about the behind of the AT-AT.
If not considering the AT-ST's guarding it, i'd say the big guy is ****ed.
And the striders can aswell target they're cannons towards the leg joints of the AT-AT.
If it misses a leg, it's as good as down.