Developer: Bioshock, Halo3 not "next gen"

[CptStern]

Frontier Developments boss David Braben believes BioShock and Halo 3 are not examples of "next-gen" games.

"I loved the 1930s-1950s atmosphere of BioShock: the lovely Art Deco visuals and the audio that worked especially well," Braben told us. "Overall the whole game was beautifully executed, but the gameplay itself was not 'next-gen'."

"I found Halo 3 great fun, too, but also a little disappointing - as although there were a few nice touches and improved graphical fidelity, it hadn't really moved on much from Halo 2 in terms of the gameplay.

besides the graphics I tend to agree ..the gameplay isnt any different than what we've seen in other games ..although to be fair I havent played either game and in my mind Bioshock looks like it adds something new to survival fps, dont know what, but I'm sure one of you will fill the blanks



no developer interview would be complete without the developer plugging his game while deriding it's competition:

"So to answer your question, if anything I am reassured; I think Outsider more than stands up to them, and I still think Outsider will be one of the first 'next-gen' games," he added.

The Outsider was announced back in 2005 as a game that would bring around the same sort of freedom as Braben's other famous creation, Elite. For him, a next-gen game means giving you the tools to change the outcome of a story much more dynamically than by choosing good or evil paths - something only the new consoles have the grunt to deliver.

The Outsider is a high-tech thriller that pops you in the shoes of an Elite CIA agent made public enemy number one at the outset of the game. From here your choice of how to proceed is up to you: turn the tables and exploit your former employers, bring about ultra-violent destruction with your Jack Bauer-like training, or crusade to clear your wrongly slurred name.

so what's the verdict on "next gen" games, next gen? yay or nay ..still havent played enough games on console but from what I've seen too many companies are sticking with with proven genres and just add a layer of paint to mask the same tired gameplay ..of course there's always exceptions to the rules

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=85108

 

[No Limit]

I think GTA4 will be a great example of a next gen game. The open enviroment and gameplay, the amazing graphics, and hopefully realistic physics.

I played a bit of Halo 3 and I really wasn't impressed. The water in this "high end" game doesn't even reflect. Bioshock was an awesome game but graphics wise it wasn't any more special than HL2 was, and that came out how long ago now, 3 years?

 

[ricera10]

"So to answer your question, if anything I am reassured; I think Outsider more than stands up to them, and I still think Outsider will be one of the first 'next-gen' games," he added.

The Outsider was announced back in 2005 as a game that would bring around the same sort of freedom as Braben's other famous creation, Elite. For him, a next-gen game means giving you the tools to change the outcome of a story much more dynamically than by choosing good or evil paths - something only the new consoles have the grunt to deliver.

The Outsider is a high-tech thriller that pops you in the shoes of an Elite CIA agent made public enemy number one at the outset of the game. From here your choice of how to proceed is up to you: turn the tables and exploit your former employers, bring about ultra-violent destruction with your Jack Bauer-like training, or crusade to clear your wrongly slurred name.

So he's saying instead of just having good and evil as choices, just have two evil choices and one good choice?

What is an example of next-gen gameplay, though? Those two words don't make much sense put together in my head.

 

[CptStern]

I think he's just using it as an excuse to pimp his game

"these games are not next gen because of so and so ..my game is next gen because it has things those other games dont have"

 

[Tagaziel]

Next gen is an incredibly stupid term that doesn't apply anywhere outside console hardware.

Also, Bioshock is just a shooter. Nothing inventive, nothing new, except for a streamlined interface. Just a shooter.

 

[Alig]

I think GTA4 will be a great example of a next gen game. The open enviroment and gameplay, the amazing graphics, and hopefully realistic physics.

I played a bit of Halo 3 and I really wasn't impressed. The water in this "high end" game doesn't even reflect. Bioshock was an awesome game but graphics wise it wasn't any more special than HL2 was, and that came out how long ago now, 3 years?

What? Either you are you blind or incredibly HL2 inclined. Bioshock looks absolutely stunning compared to HL2... Even on my 360 in HD it looks a lot better than HL2 does.

I only ever played the first Halo when the first Xbox came out and i hated it, and considering it's Halo that Halo 2 and 3 are trying to be 'as good as'... I don't need to play either to come to the conclusion that Halo 3 is whack. However, i have got Bioshock, and its a bloody good FPS. What the hell is next-gen gameplay?.. i do not know...

 

[Lt. Drebin]

Well, nice to see a developer with his head screwed on tight. He's 100% correct...

To the mindless majority, all next-gen means is prettier. Nintendo is the only one really working to change that mentality...successful so far.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

I think GTA4 will be a great example of a next gen game. The open enviroment and gameplay, the amazing graphics, and hopefully realistic physics.

I dunno. I have a feeling GTA4 is gonna be more of the same but +1. Hey, whatever works for them...

 

[No Limit]

What? Either you are you blind or incredibly HL2 inclined. Bioshock looks absolutely stunning compared to HL2... Even on my 360 in HD it looks a lot better than HL2 does.

I'm sorry, I just don't see it. All these new games for consoles are about as graphically advanced as HL2 and Doom 3 were. I played the 360 version on a 42" LCD in 720p and I stand by my statement, the graphics looked good but they were on par with HL2, a game that was released 3 years ago:

http://www.unleashedcreativity.net/pics/mobo/coastline.jpg

http://www.britishgaming.co.uk/wp-content/screenshots/pc_bioshock/02.jpg

 

[CR0M]

I thought 'next-gen' described a bunch of graphical advancements in software code that utilized hardware not yet created to run them properly. If it refers to gameplay too, then that would amount to... say... 5 games in the entire history of games evar.

Of course he's plugging his game, and arrogance is what sells these days - just look at the Oblivion self worship that went on long after that sandwich got stale.

Gotta admit tho that Braben is one of my gaming heroes, games like Elite and Virus are cornerstones in my gaming history.

 

[Reginald]

I dunno. I have a feeling GTA4 is gonna be more of the same but +1. Hey, whatever works for them...

To me, GTA + more physics (i.e. ragdolls etc.) will be a truly next-gen game.

 

[Anthraxxx]

So he's saying instead of just having good and evil as choices, just have two evil choices and one good choice?

What is an example of next-gen gameplay, though? Those two words don't make much sense put together in my head.

Nest-gen gameplay = Portal

 

[Bad^Hat]

Okay, listen up, cause I'm only gonna say this once. And I hope I speak for more than just myself when I say...

SHUT THE F*CK UP ABOUT NEXT GEN. IT DOESN'T EXIST.

Atleast not anymore. Why? It's here already. This is the "next" generation of consoles! Jesus Christ, am I the only one who's noticed?

 

[CptStern]

mmmmm ...Oblivion sandwich


if next gen is strictly limited to graphics (which I agree to an extent) it's a sorry state indeed ..I mean bioshock may look nice now but will look dated in 3 years and when more time has passed it may not even recieve a footnote in the annuls of gaming history ..graphics are relative to the time period ..I think the problem is that developers think mostly about instant gratification in terms of eye candy, but big budgets preclude investing a lot in gameplay because they only have so much of a buying window before gamers move on to the next big thing ..it's funny how games on the DS or simplistic games still resonate with gamers. Mostly because they're less of a risk so devs can try to shake up gameplay because they dont have a multi-million dollar budget and a publisher breathing down their necks ..I think it'll get worse as gamers demand better graphics and developers are forced to churn out eye candy with a few new features instead of trying to rewrite the rules ..anyways I'm babbling

 

[Stigmata]

The only people being particularly innovative are Nintendo and Valve. This sucks.

 

[Tagaziel]

We need a second great videogame crash. Now.

 

[Cormeh]

I disagree with the guy to be honest. He doesn't exactly seem sure what he even means by "next-gen".

BioShock was not only a gorgeous game, it was deeper than a simple run and gun affair, used varying approaches to every situation (tactical plasmid? attacking plasmid? guns?).

Halo 3 is so damn easy to pick apart to be honest. Theatre and Forge mode are really where Halo 3 shines through, and no other console game that I know of does either (Obviously, correct me if I'm wrong). No one seems to even bother giving it a second look.

Anyway, before I derail this into some pointless bashing thread, I would ask what "outsider" does differently than any game out there.

What I perceive as next gen, as Stigmata said, are Nintendo and Valves approach and vision. Nintendo are going much more hands-on with their consoles (wii, ds) and Valve (having just finished Portal myself), are taking conventional gaming completely out of the box in terms of gameplay approach.

 

[CptStern]

I think he says it gives you choice ..in the vague sort of way that developers seem to have pioneered

 

[VictimOfScience]

Hmm, story elements = next gen?

I would argue that this sentiment is like 3 or 4 generations ago. Back in the heyday of Lucasfilm Games they ruled the roost with some of the best stories in gaming.

These developers are all sounding like idiots now. Carmack and this guy can go screw.

 

[Baal]

The phrase next-gen really needs to be eliminated from gaming.

 

[Warbie]

I'd prefer a return to the gen before last. For a decent story i'll read a book or watch a movie.

 

[Alig]

I'm sorry, I just don't see it. All these new games for consoles are about as graphically advanced as HL2 and Doom 3 were. I played the 360 version on a 42" LCD in 720p and I stand by my statement, the graphics looked good but they were on par with HL2, a game that was released 3 years ago:

http://www.unleashedcreativity.net/pics/mobo/coastline.jpg

http://www.britishgaming.co.uk/wp-content/screenshots/pc_bioshock/02.jpg

Don't want to get into a bashing discussion because the proof is on page 1 of a google image search for both games... And also on the technology of the Source Engine compared to the new Unreal Engine.

 

[-Psy-]

Enough of this next-gen bullshit. It's lost all meaning.

 

[Asknoone]

'Next-gen' is stupid and flawed.

 

[clarky003]

I agree, 'next gen' is a coined phrase that is often put forward for some kind of hype effect. But vaguely the meaning is supposed to associate with the next big step in technological developments, It really means nothing more, and is totally down to what you consider 'the next big step'.

On another note I just finished Halo 3 and the ending was complete tripe, otherwise it was a really good game.

 

[AmishSlayer]

The term "next-gen" is just stupid. The need for every game to be groundbreaking is just silly to me.

 

[Javert]

I must disagree with Bioshock. The developer seems to place his "next-gen" standards on moral choices, but Bioshock is about much more than that.

I say the real "next-gen" games so far has been Oblivion and Bioshock.

 

[Warbie]

On another note I just finished Halo 3 and the ending was complete tripe, otherwise it was a really good game.

The ending continues after the credits. You also get a tiny bit more for finishing it on Legendary.

 

[StardogChampion]

I agree, 'next gen' is a coined phrase that is often put forward for some kind of hype effect. But vaguely the meaning is supposed to associate with the next big step in technological developments, It really means nothing more.

Agreed. People often talk about "next-gen gameplay" but it doesn't exist. Next-gen is just about the next generation of consoles.

If Bioshock has next-gen gameplay, as some people say it does, then what they're basically saying is that the PS2/Dreamcast/GC etc wouldn't have the power to code the mechanics of the game (it's gameplay), which isn't true. It would easily run on the PS2 minus the visual enhancements such as physics and graphics which don't affect gameplay at all.

Bioshock is run-of-the-mill. I could probably recreate a scene from it in the D3 engine with barely any visual difference.

 

[Nemesis6]

And in Doom 3 it wouldn't lag.

 

[Stigmata]

"Next-gen gameplay" is yesterday's gameplay with tomorrow's graphics.

 

[Nemesis6]

Kind of like the game Clive Barker's Jericho... Except its graphics are just like, a few hours before midnight; not quite tomorrow.

 

[Wanted Bob]

The only people being particularly innovative are Nintendo and Valve. This sucks.

Personally, I think that Spore displayed TRUE innovation, a venture into unknown grounds of gaming (you know, before it got dumbed down...)

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

'next-gen' is completely subjective.

For instance I believe boxer-briefs to be next gen, as they capitalize on the features I enjoy in both boxers (shorts-like coverage, warmth) and briefs (snug and comfortable). Eventually, everyone will catch on with this next-gen fad and we won't see anyone wearing exclusively boxers or briefs, only boxer-briefs.

 

[Kschreck]

I checked out the company site:


http://www.frontier.co.uk/home.html


All they make is crap. What gives them the right to rip on the best selling games ever when they release crap not even good enough for the DS? :|

 

[Krynn72]

For me, Next Gen simply means a game or piece of hardware made for the most current/upcoming technology. Which essentially means, everything is next gen because nobody would design something for last generations tech that nobody uses anymore.

 

[Sparta]

I must disagree with Bioshock. The developer seems to place his "next-gen" standards on moral choices, but Bioshock is about much more than that.

I say the real "next-gen" games so far has been Oblivion and Bioshock.

Bioshock is cut and paste from System Shock 2.

I'm not joking either, its truly a clone of System Shock 2. I'm sure you've seen this already, but if you haven't it really does sum up Bioshock perfectly

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/art...eropunctuation/1394-Zero-Punctuation-BioShock

 

[No Limit]

Don't want to get into a bashing discussion because the proof is on page 1 of a google image search for both games... And also on the technology of the Source Engine compared to the new Unreal Engine.

Wow, everything is shiny . Did it have slightly better graphics than HL2? Sure, obviously I can't dispute that, this game came out 3 years later. But half life 2 was truly a "next gen" game at the time, bioshock is still in the same generation with little improvement over HL2. To be fair though I have not played Bioshock on the PC so the PC version might look a lot better.

 

[alehm]

Obviously "next gen" has some subjective parameters surrounding its meaning. I always looked at next-gen being something that set standards in that genre for all games to come.

For example, people will tell you Doom 1 and 2 and Quake 1 and 2 had a story but when Dark Forces II :Jedi Knight and Half Life came out it totally set a new standard on the "storyline" in games. Half Life set new standards in terms of connected levels for a seemless enviroment (no more get blue key to open blue door to load next level) and I also believe having to reload your weapons to highten the tension in combat among several other things that all combined really transformed the genre for all FPS's that came after it.

I think where gamig has been the past few years is essentially dressing up the existing cake of gaming with great frosting. If you pardon the crude analogy. And when we actually have a next gen game we will all know it.

 

[L3adCannon]

Well if this is next gen, then it sucks balls. Past games have been more fun and full of innovatio, cool features n s*it you don`t find in todays games.

I don`t know how next-gen games will play like but Halo 3 and Bioshock are def not it.

I hope the mark when you can`t tell a difference between a screenshot and a photo will come soon, then they can focus on things like gameplay.