? Did Valve Lie ?

[Wolf]

Originally posted by weeds
There may be no logical reason not to come clean, but they ARE guilty of doing just that with HL1.
They were saying holiday release for a long time suddenly, one day in sept, they come on the contaminated.net forums and make the announcement that the game won't be released for another year.
Here we were, Valve fanboys, following the game from the beginning, expecting a release within weeks and BAM...still got another year wait.

Gabe admitted to all of that in that gamespot article I mentioned.
They aren't being completely honest with us is what I think.

Read the link below and stop being so melodromatic about the whole situation. They were on track with what they had for HL1, but then they realised that it was only really going to be a B-grade shooter unless they restarted with a more coherent focus. It was their first game as a start-up game dev FFS! Fact is without delaying it and revising the project they would not have had the financial success they did end up having which in turn enabled them to invest in technology, the mod community and future developing AAA titles.

http://www.gamespot.com/features/halflife_final/

Besides it is not an analogous situation anyway, back then they weren't hacked were they?

 

[True_Eraser]

Who cares if they lied or not. hl2 is delayed thats all that matters whatever the real reason whatever is the real truth doesn't change that.

 

[XtAkm4p]

im pretty sure the fact that hl2 didnt come out on 9/30 proves that valve has lied... gabe said numerous times that it would. so there, they lied. who cares i dont care much for hl2 as much as i do about savage and CoD

 

[weeds]

And look at CZ.
It isn't gold yet. They said it would be last friday.

Is that game I saw the other day called CZ not what is going to be released as CZ??

Is the new developer changing all that?

who knows, they wont say. Just that it went gold last week.

What the heck are they doing?
They need to be more up front.

Tho Im afraid we won't know the whole truth until after HL2 is released.

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by weeds
Its one thing to say "we are going to release in 2 months on ___ date" and then miss the date. Missing release dates is nothing new.
Its another thing when you say "we're gonna release in 1 month on ___ date" knowing you couldnt possibly make that date.

There's also quite a bit of difference between saying, "We hope to release around September 30," and "We will release September 30."

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by Wolf
Re: lying
Also, since when did reiterating a 'tentative' release date ever amount to lying in the gaming industry anyway?

Thing is, Valve in no way indicated that September 30 was a tentative date. Many articles I read even went so far as to tell their readers to mark the date on the calendar, so certain was Valve that they'd meet it.

This isn't a standard case of a developer blowing past a vague date, this is a case, beyond a reasonable doubt, of a company openly deceiving its customers.

Will I still buy Half-Life 2? Absolutely. Am I happy with the way Valve has conducted themselves? Hell no!

 

[Wolf]

CZ was outsourced to other developers from day one. First Gearbox started it, but then they had enough of the HL1 engine and decided to focus on more cutting edge engine software leaving the project. Fair enough, CZ was then handballed to Ritual. But Ritual didn't do such a great job according to earlier reviews so Valve passed to another developer a while ago. Personally I've always thought CZ will be shit anyway because it wasn't touched by Valve and it's a pappy franchise, but I still don't get your attitude - would you rather they just didn't give a stuff and released a total piece of shit anyway just to meet an estimate?

It seems to me that if the biggest problem Valve has is making little UBB goers feel totally 100% unfallibly confident in their projected release dates then they've got no real problems at all.

 

[Wolf]

Originally posted by Mountain Man
Thing is, Valve in no way indicated that September 30 was a tentative date. Many articles I read even went so far as to tell their readers to mark the date on the calendar, so certain was Valve that they'd meet it.

I'll admit that their language was firmer than typical but I also think they actually thought they would make that date - it's the only reasonable explanation. Personally, I think their communication could have been better but that is nothing to get twisted panties over. I think it is obvious, that the terrible Steam deployment caused the original delay because they needed more content servers, client bug fixes, and probably P2P capabilities. But then this f-wit hacker came along and made the whole situation A LOT worse.

If we give Valve even a tiny benefit of the doubt I'd say they might have kept silent because they still thought they had a chance of Steam release right up until the last minute before the hack....

 

[Milo]

Doesnt really matter if they lied or not. They hold all the cards.

Simple as this, You or any of us for that matter are not playing HL2 until Valve says so.

 

[OCybrManO]

How many games that are 5 years old do you regularly play today? I’d guess ONE! If they lie, but still release another game that last another 5 years until it is eclipsed by Half Life 3, would you really care? I think now.

Let's see... I play lots of old games.

Everything from Zork & HHGG (Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy), to Nethack, Asteroids, Wolf3d, Doom, Quake I/II, Half-Life and others...

Come back in 15 years... then we'll talk.

 

[wako]

yes

 

[phantomdesign]

Some of you OBVIOUSLY didn't read the first post carefully. Rather than wast my breath, please read it again carefully.

The Delay
Any programmer knows that delays are inevitable. To actually hit a your guessed release date and have a result you are pleased with is unheard of. For those who have ever watched the video-gaming industry, you’d realist that over 85% of worthwhile games are delayed. If you ever want to win some easy money, bet some punk that a game will not hit its first release date.
Games that do hit their release date suck. It can pretty much be summed up by “Games-Made-For-Movies” titles, like “Exit the Matix.” I have a feeling practically none of you are beta-testers, so chances are if you play the beta, you recleve an exit-the-matrix experience and become frustrated with the game. Valve knows when it is best to release the game, so I would suggest you be patient and TRUST they know what they are doing.

Now all this stupidity about how they said they would release it in the 30th, but didn’t means they're being malicious to the customers is a bunch of BS. If you know anything about programming or have every anticipated a game (like CZ) you will never be surprised by a delay. Release dates aren't written contracts, but merely an ETA (estimated time of arrival).

 

[Wraithen]

You know, I'd settle for a single player only release, with multiplayer to be released when the source code leak problem is fixed. This could be via download, cover disk, expansion pack or whatever, but while the multiplayer increases the lifespan of a great game, my best memories of HL1 are of playing the story not fragging strangers.

 

[dawdler]

Originally posted by Wraithen
You know, I'd settle for a single player only release, with multiplayer to be released when the source code leak problem is fixed. This could be via download, cover disk, expansion pack or whatever, but while the multiplayer increases the lifespan of a great game, my best memories of HL1 are of playing the story not fragging strangers.

Once again, as many have pointed out including me, its the SP game that takes FAAAAR longer to fine tune than the MP game. The SP game cant be released until it is 100% finished, no more, no less. The MP game however, can be released with missing maps, missing classes, missing weapons, and on average in a terrible state, and still be playable and fun.

Sidenote: UNLEASH THE HEADCRABS!!!

 

[phantomdesign]

MODERATOR: Can I have my status changed to "UNLEASH THE HEADCRABS!!!" : instead of "Headcrab?"

PLEASE!!!!!!!



Agree about single-player/milti-player comparison.

 

[Aknot]

"If you know anything about programming or have every anticipated a game (like CZ) you will never be surprised by a delay. "

Then maybe you should not have asked did Valve lie. Maybe you should have rephrased your question to something along the lines of delays in games. You asked a Yes or No question. Based on past "writings" and the such yes they lied. Period. "THEY" know about programming "THEY" know about delays. So why did they give a "firm" date over stating "Fall/Winter" of 2003?

I will give you this, very well thought out and proper post. BUT then I read:
"MODERATOR: Can I have my status changed to "UNLEASH THE HEADCRABS!!!" : instead of "Headcrab?"

PLEASE!!!!!!!"

And you loose a little........

 

[SiRiNO]

Stop the lying, think of the children!

 

[Cheater]

While it's true that the hacker has ruined valve by stealing their codes and cs zero condition, he still has done something good to the community people like us who can't wait to get our hands on hl2.

I don't mind at all whether valve has lie to us, I don't care what it's the stage of the development of hl2 now, I just want to play the game.

by the way, I always do the school work at the last minute, if valve is doing that right now, I have no problem with it.

 

[silent]

Did U Lie?
Admit it you stinking foot!

 

[phantomdesign]

I will give you this, very well thought out and proper post.

That was my little brother being a moron. I wouldn't mind it being changed to "UNLEASH THE HEADCRABS!!!" That was a decent attempt to undercut my credibility though, I'll give you that.

"Did Valve Lie" was directed at those who say valve is lying and have an attitude of "lets screw valve, they're screwing us."
In reality, missing a release date is not a lie unless you intended to miss the release date from the start. Valve had no reason to lie about the release date. Chances are they were being over-optimistic.

he still has done something good to the community

(mutters direct insults at Cheater's intelligence)
I'll assume you are just misinformed at the moment. What the hacker did was release the source code. Now, if he released the beta by itself, that would have been anywhere near as bad, but he released the entire (what he got) source code. He did a horrible thing for the community. Chances are this will have massive repercussions on Half-Life 3. I'm sure Half Life 3 will still be an awesome game, probably the best at the time if it's release. Releasing the source code itself has massive repercussions in the long run, and is very damaging to valve. The hacker has done a GREAT DISERVICE to the community, and comments like that do not help the situation.

 

[notchbak]

release date reality

So just assuming valve did hit the Sept. 30th release date.... I have just one simple question. Considering all the flames, directed hate, and disgust with Valve at not giving us the almighty HL2, I can only imagine that it would be at least 10 times the crazed mess here if they did release it full of bugs. Especially if the multiplayer aspect wasnt up to par, and we had to wait on patch after patch for them to get it right. Jeez the crying would never end.
With that in mind i guess i can deal with the junk posts and comments and be somewhat thankfull that (hopefully) the end product will be a solid piece of software worth every dollar. Then the patches can be focused at tweaking the game to perfection, not fixing major issues because they rushed to meet a date. (and keep all the CHILDREN from crying!)
My only argument with anything being said is this: The fact that valve is not lying to us, just because they choose to be so blatently silent. OMG apply that concept to just about anything else in life and you basically get a liar. With the millions of Valve hardcore Fans and Supporters out here.... i just wish they would show a little faith/ trust in us by opening up the lines of communication. After E3 and the HL2 presentation.. that is where they should have started, and most of us could have waited until "whenever."
Valve has a "relationship" of sorts with its customers and fans, and the key to any "relationship" is communication.

Notchbak

btw .. my first post ... *squints eyes at flames to come....:bounce:

 

[phantomdesign]

I don't think their silence is helping, but I'm sure they'll be more than helpful once HL2 is released. I don't think any of us should complain until the game is released. I trust they're doing their best to make us happy.