Do 56k players really lag servers?

[dæmon]

Yes, this is probably a stupid question, but I've been wondering about it for some time now.

Nearly every time I play a game, I see 56k players being flamed for "lagging the server". Is this actually true?

 

[Axyon]

It's actually entirely incorrect. In fact, it's actually the broadband users that are more likely to 'lag' a server, because they're extracting the most information with their faster speeds. 56k users are hardly taking any bandwidth from the server at all.

 

[ailevation]

:O Lag means hang back or fall behind. How would broadband users lag? If they can receive a lot of info at fast rates, they aren't lagging, they are ahead. 56k users DO lag, their connection is SLOW, so slow that they cannot attain all that data at the rate as broadband users do. I don't know how someone with 56k affect all other people instead of just themselves, but it happens.

 

[Lethal8472]

56kers do NOT lag servers. Most people see the average ping of the people on the server above their own pings and when a 56ker joins, it jumps up a bunch. This does not mean the server is lagging, it just means the average ping of the people on the server has increased.

 

[Sulkdodds]

The question was whether 56k users presence on the server lags it up for everybody. In my experience, a broadband user gets no lag per se but does find that his/her 56k adversary lags from place to place. I like playing laggy...generally because I enver get killed because of it, but instead I pump an entire clip into an opponent who has temporarily frozen (they haven't of course, but on my computer they have) to find that five seconds later they drop dead regardless of where they've been going.

 

[Snakebyte]

56kers don't "lag" the servers. They send/recieve fewer packets (data) from the server so they require less bandwidth than cable/dsl users. They may be laggy themselves but they don't hurt anyone else.

For example, a server running on cable might be able to handle 10 56k users but not 10 cable/dsl users, becuase they would require so much more data transfer.

 

[XenoSpirit]

anyone from 8.14kb/s to 56kb/s will lag a server down... i say ppl should stop waiting on the slow users and just go broadband on games!!! seriously if your still useing a 56k for games you need to be left behind if you cant keep up!!! faster internet is cheap its just so manny ppl are to lazy to go get thares upgraded... this is why Cstrike has data control rates... so you can lag the 56kers out

 

[Sulkdodds]

Don't be such an idiot. Some people can't afford broadband, and others must rely on their unwilling parents to buy it. Others can't even get it in their area!

 

[Brian Damage]

Actually, Xeno, many people still don't have access to broadband... Believe me, if there was a DSLAM on my local exchange, I'd sign up for it like a shot...

And let's not even mention cable... eeeuuurrgh, the expense...

 

[lePobz]

who cares if they lag servers, they shouldnt be in the game with that piece of prehistoric hardware... its only unfair on themselves, if they dont start crying about it when they die i suppose its ok, but they all do.

 

[simmo]

56k'ers are people too you know, I bet theres a 56k'er some where out there who can whop are asses on online games...

 

[Sulkdodds]

Do I count?

Krrchhhhweeeeee! Krrchhhheeee kcchhhhhrwwwwwwaaaoooooowww!

****ing dial-up.

 

[Maxi]

It's been proven that 56kers don't lag servers, it's just a myth.

 

[Lethal8472]

I'm on 56k, and I would gladly get broadband if I could. We just recently got a cable line put up behind our house, and Adelphia wants a little over 50 bucks a month for 3 Mbit down/256k up internet service. I'm having a real hard time convincing my parents to get it. I would rather have DSL, but I'm about 10 miles from my CO, so unless Bellsouth decides to put a mobile DSLAM somewhere nearby in the future, I'm screwed in that department. Plus I have a neighbor who has Adelphia cable internet, and theyre not even getting half the bandwidth there supposed to. Not all of us people have the luxury of living a mile away from a huge city in some cramped suburb.

 

[ailevation]

:dozey: Servers must be VERY different. Someone explain to me... someone mentioned a person with broadband can handle 5-10 56k users, while they cannot cope with 10 other broadband users. Why is it in Medal of Honor servers theres 20+ broadband users playing at a 80-100 ping rate, then just ONE 56k user comes in and everything is now 500-999 ping?

 

[Lethal8472]

Are you sure that your not looking at the average ping of the server?

 

[DiSTuRbEd]

56k'ers are people too you know, I bet theres a 56k'er some where out there who can whop are asses on online games...

Doubtful, when I play against 56k'ers in DM they end up getting slaughtered anyways. :cheese:

 

[Lethal8472]

Bring it on! I do fairly well in games as long as I don't get hit by a sudden lag spike. Also, since I started playing on Steam I can't join a server with 8 or more people on it or my ping goes into the thousands and my choke hits and stays at 100. Major suckage. :hmph:

 

[Direwolf]

What IS annoying is when in certain games (mostly older) where the 56ker teleports all around the screen. Can't hit the jerks.

 

[ComradeBadger]

XenoSpirit and others. 56k players do not lag games at all. Ever. It's a myth.

 

[blahblahblah]

I just went from 56k to broadband 2 months ago. If I played an online game (which was rare) I did not cause lag for other people. What would happen to me is that I would miss player movements (I would shoot a player at location A but they had already moved to location B without me knowing it till afterwords). So being on 56K didn't lag the server, it just lagged me.

The only way a 56k is going to lag a game is if they were acting as a server. And I haven't seen a 56K server in a long time.

 

[Edcrab]

Just for the record- we don't all suck. We just lag. And if someone else says something along the lines of "OMG JUst Get BBROANDBANDS yuo CHEPYS BstarD" I'll probably kill them. Or try and persaude you to enter Sven Co-op's forums so I can ban you.

It's my understanding that no, 56kers do not lag servers, which is reassuring. And it's a horrible, arrogant thing to do... but below is the reason why I was once part of a clan, regardless of the beepy lag box connecting me to the web.

Ping is massively important online, but not quite everything.

Which is why "Autokick everyone who fluctuates over 250 ping" servers are daft. I could play online with up to 350 ping, and the only real problem was the lag spikes on my 600+. Oh, and the people who didn't know enough about the system to complain about getting lagged up.

 

[umop]

56kers DO NOT lag servers. Well, it depends on the game and the netcode being used, but for HL and almost every current game, 56kers do NOT lag them. Abom is right.

Servers do NOT have unlimited and infinite bandwidth. People who cry "get oot u 56kers YeR laggin every11!!" is a complete moron and I wish I could get my hands around their necks. Or nuts. Ok maybe not nuts... but it makes me sick.

The faster your internet connection is, the more bandwidth you DRAW from the server. The more bandwidth you draw from a server, the slower it gets. Say you have 10 dialuppers on a server, each downloading 4 KB/sec from it. That means the server must be uploading 40 KB/sec to all of the 10 clients. That is no sweat for most servers. Now let's say you have 10 broadband users on the server, each downloading 50 KB/sec from it. That means the server must now upload 500 KB/sec to all of the clients (total, not 500 to each one), which would be WAY more likely to lag the server and cause everyone else's pings to shoot up. Get it?

Ailevation, to answer your question, the reason why a MoH server would start lagging when a dialupper comes in is maybe because the server cannot handle that ONE extra person. Seems like a rare case. Take out one of the broadband users and replace it with a dialupper and nothing will happen. Your belief in the "56ks lag every1" myth is silly.

Also, did you not steal that avatar yourself 2 or so years ago? I know you didn't make it, you had to have got it from somewhere. So how can you claim it's YOURS? Sabre probably got it from the same place you did.

 

[Dux]

Now, I've been playing with my 56k for 5 years now, and I've had no access to Broadband for all this time. I've had stick from people about my high ping. I got claled "n00b" many times for having killed broadband users who claimed that for me to kill them was "impossible" Apparantly because I'm on 56k I'm not good enough to kill them. Oh how I had me some fun with those dumb kids.

I still get people telling me to "get a better connection ffs!" Ok, yes, very well thought out there, Winston. It's either that th entire gaming community are dip shits with no idea that not everyone can get Broadband, or they just love to look like prats with an IQ as low as their pings.

From my old Counter - Strike day's, when it used to be good. I was the only 56k'er on that server.

And the Second is from when I had to play in Software Mode for a week while waiting for my GeForce 4 to turn up.

Silly French Servers and their bad, bad settings :hmph:

 

[Edcrab]

Dux- Bloody well done! Good to see someone with an utterly-unbearable 100+ ping kicking arse.

I tend to play NS a fair bit too, simply because you're awarded for tactical structure destruction as well as kills XD Not to mention that cloaked Fading is the best experience anyone can have in a game, ever.

Sven Co-op would be good, but for some reason I've stopped playing it as of late. 3.5 should change all that if they add half of what they're promising...

And I'd try the new Specialists 2.1, but so few people play I don't think it warrants the forty meg download...

And Dod was good. I guess I just like realistic (or extreme at the least) damage.

 

[G.Freeman]

they shouldnt be in the game with that piece of prehistoric hardware... its only unfair on themselves, if they dont start crying about it when they die i suppose its ok, but they all do.

Now thats just bad, you, YOU BIG BULLY!!!!!11

I'll used to be a regular 56ker on RTCW, ET and DOD and I was always in the 1/3 of the fraggers, sometimes, in the words of UT, DOMINATING!!1, so there :dork:

Now I have Broadband and DOMINATE x 1000000

 

[Lethal8472]

Most people who have played on 56k for awhile and gone to broadband are kick-ass players. Suddenly you can actually shoot directly at people and hit them, instead of having to lead ahead of them a little bit. I am an average player at CS on 56k, but every so often when I play on my friends cable, I end up owning the server. :afro:

 

[MultiVaC]

Actually The Specialists would be plenty worth it Edcrab. There's not as many people playing right now as, say, NS, but still almost as much as Quake 2 (going by gamespy stats). There's enough players and low-ping servers at pretty much any given time.

 

[lePobz]

Oh yeah, and its understandable to see why people with high pings can find themselves at the top of the leader boards in games like CS - because the people jerk around the screen so much they are impossible to aim at!! and when you do think you're shooting them you're actually shooting where they were about a second ago - and before you know it (or can even see it) you've been killed by them.

Infact there are even cheats out that simulate high pings (slowing down peoples connections to emulate a 56k) so that they too can have these advantages.

IT SUCKS.

 

[Edcrab]

That's only with FEP infested people. That's a Flush Entity Packet; some poor sod with a fluctuating ping who's dropping packets so often that other players can watch them spasm across the map. That's not so much a modem problem as an idiot with too high a set of graphics options for the rig he actually has- poor machine and poor connection? Accident waiting to happen.

I, for example, don't constantly jerk around like an ape on aphetamines. If I do, it's because I'm having a lag spike, and as I'm totally unable to control myself during that handful of seconds I'm basically a free kill, unless a target moving backwards and forwards in a pathetic little figure of eight is too hard to hit for most BBers.

 

[Lethal8472]

Has anyone ever noticed that when you lag you sometimes hear a water sloshing sound?

 

[Edcrab]

Yes. Ever experienced something similar when using noclip? That's because the servers trying to calculate your location during the lag spike, and apparently it has to choose every point you could be in during any frantic key-bashing during the occurence.

So, in the virtual sense at least, its moving you around, which is why when you come back to the real world you often hear a sloshing sound and possibly even take a few involuntary steps in some random directions.

 

[ailevation]

Also, did you not steal that avatar yourself 2 or so years ago? I know you didn't make it, you had to have got it from somewhere. So how can you claim it's YOURS? Sabre probably got it from the same place you did.

Umop, you obviously don't know the whole situation, so don't comment. I put that to mock Sabre's sig... look at his ASAP, for he might change it. I know I didn't make the avatar, but I took a copy, for free and it was the makers choice to distribute the avatar for people to use/keep/have. You're statement is basically saying although you bought a pair of shoes, it isn't yours because you did not create them. No, i'm not the true creator, but the creator chose to distribute his avatar for people to keep a copy, which means they DO own it. I did not steal it, because it was submitted by the creator and if he wanted to just show-off his avatar on a site, he does have the ability so that you cannot "save picture as" or "copy".

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=16907

 

[umop]

Umop, you obviously don't know the whole situation, so don't comment. I put that to mock Sabre's sig... look at his ASAP, for he might change it. I know I didn't make the avatar, but I took a copy, for free and it was the makers choice to distribute the avatar for people to use/keep/have. You're statement is basically saying although you bought a pair of shoes, it isn't yours because you did not create them. No, i'm not the true creator, but the creator chose to distribute his avatar for people to keep a copy, which means they DO own it. I did not steal it, because it was submitted by the creator and if he wanted to just show-off his avatar on a site, he does have the ability so that you cannot "save picture as" or "copy".

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=16907

Well it looks like you COMPLETELY missed my point. How can you FEEL OWNERSHIP of that icon? Who cares where you got it from, that doesn't matter.

Say you are wearing a pair of Nike Air Jordans. Ok, cool. Now some kid walks down the street wearing the same shoes. Ok, that's cool too. But then you yell at him saying "OMG YOUR WEARING MY SHOOZ WTF STOP WTF GTFO". You both got them from somewhere, so what? I mean if he actually saved your avatar image from the forums and used it that's pretty lame, but if he just started using it not knowing about yours then who cares? I never said you stole it either.

 

[ailevation]

but if he just started using it not knowing about yours then who cares? I never said you stole it either.

Well, Sabre should take offense of this. I never knew he had the same avatar. He approached me in Personal Messages, asking then to remove it, of course I refused.

 

[Cole]

Ive played on the BPT Clan Server for a long time with my 56k.(I pretty much only play on theres)
I dled steam with my 56k 2 times (Screwed up first).
I am friends with the admins on the BPT server... I get around 200 ping.
No one has ever complained about me on Bpt server....
I get a good amount of kills...lag has nothing to do with it when i do bad (Usually).
I can shoot a person while hes running, or any time and hit him. I am on a lan network and other people connect through me, so if someone on one of the other computers does something it lags me...that is the only time i lag.
I get 5.4-5.6 dl speeds.... very good fora 56ker. I think most broadband people hate alot of 56kers without relizing that most of them are 28kers (or AOL users).
There are still 28k hosts around and crappy 56k modems will get 28k connections.

I do gladly admit im a 56ker on any game. From Sc - Wc3 - Cs.
I rarley and i mean like every other hour i will get a lag spike. Its VERY rare for me to get one.

I had a friend that was complaing about a 1 hour download on his cable... I laughed at him... 2 times dling steam for me was well 45-60 hours total. I also have NS and The Specalists. I have NS:CO (Q3 Mod). Many megs in all those.. I can't see why any cable person would complain about a 2 hour download... I seriously can't...