Do you think that the US should change the constitution to ban firearms?

Should the US ban firearms?

  • I'm from the US and I think we should

    Votes: 12 7.8%

  • I'm from the US and I think we shouldn't

    Votes: 63 40.9%

  • I'm from the US and I don't have an opinion

    Votes: 2 1.3%

  • I'm from outside the US and I think they should

    Votes: 59 38.3%

  • I'm from outside the US and I think the shouldn't

    Votes: 11 7.1%

  • I'm from outside the US and I don't have an opinion

    Votes: 7 4.5%
  • Total voters
    154
What I think the problem is, is not handguns. I think it is the stupid-ass justice dept not doing their job and babying the violent criminals. If violent criminals would spend the entire time behind bars, and stop with this bullshit early release or parole crap, I bet you would see the crime rate plummet at a huge rate.
 
exactly

we need to have tougher punishments, like forced labor, none of this rehabilitaion crap
 
AzzMan said:
What I think the problem is, is not handguns. I think it is the stupid-ass justice dept not doing their job and babying the violent criminals. If violent criminals would spend the entire time behind bars, and stop with this bullshit early release or parole crap, I bet you would see the crime rate plummet at a huge rate.
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EXACTLY


Most murders involving handguns are committed by criminals on parole or on early release. It's an overwhelming percentage, those who don't agree should look it up, too, I wrote an entire reasearch paper on this subject.
 
The_Monkey said:
No, we can't ban bathing, but we(you) can ban weapens, and that alone would save tens of thousands of lives per year. Sure, most people use their gun(s) to protect themselves, but if you got a criminal that plan to kill someone, atleast the goverment shouldn't be helping him doing it.
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a Gangsta dont care if he gets his gun legal or not he gets and shots someone :sleep:
 
Eg. said:
exactly

we need to have tougher punishments, like forced labor, none of this rehabilitaion crap
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You never cease to amaze me.
 
Eg. said:
exactly

we need to have tougher punishments, like forced labor, none of this rehabilitaion crap
Click to expand...

True, to the Pedos and Murderers that ARE FOUND GUILTY.
what if that person is executed and was innocent. thatll be lame imo, its like that film "the life of david gale" with kevin spacey :D
 
KoreBolteR said:
True, to the Pedos and Murderers that ARE FOUND GUILTY.
what if that person is executed and was innocent. thatll be lame imo, its like that film "the life of david gale" with kevin spacey :D
Click to expand...
Well, I support the death penalty, but not in cases that you could say are like, for example- Scott Peterson. I mean.. the jury decided there was no doubt he is guilty, but if an arguement took that long and a lot of people are iffy, if it wasn't outright sure at first- life, as he may not have 100% done it.


Now- someone who runs into a grocery store, stabs 10 people then shoots 3, and is taken down by cops in the process.. and .. you KNOW it is him.. :p that is when I support the death penalty. Basically any case where there is ZERO common sense doubt that it was them.
 
RakuraiTenjin said:
Well, I support the death penalty, but not in cases that you could say are like, for example- Scott Peterson. I mean.. the jury decided there was no doubt he is guilty, but if an arguement took that long and a lot of people are iffy, if it wasn't outright sure at first- life, as he may not have 100% done it.


Now- someone who runs into a grocery store, stabs 10 people then shoots 3, and is taken down by cops in the process.. and .. you KNOW it is him.. :p that is when I support the death penalty. Basically any case where there is ZERO common sense doubt that it was them.
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Excatly...

who the hell is scott peterson .. LOL!!! :angel:
 
he killed his pregant wife, they dont mention it, but he cut out teh baby and choked it too
 
No I don't think we should change the Constitution for gun ownership.
 
I wonder why anyone outside the US should care.

I don't own a gun and don't know why I would ever want one, but I strongly believe that guns SHOULD NOT be bannned. I think stricter enforcment of existing laws is needed, but a ban on guns means that only the criminals have them.
 
I still think it's kinda crazy that people are debating their civil right to have a firearm, when the government can come into their house and hold them indefinately, without explaination or trial.
 
I think it's common sense to ban guns.
 
here's a sobering stat ...last year in my city of 4 million + there were 62 murders, less than half involved firearms ...there isnt a city in the US that has figures that low ...methinks it has something to do with a ban on handguns in canada ...call me crazy but gun control works
 
look, if you ban guns, then all the criminals will have them and the innocent people havnt...therefore they wont be able to defend themselves tbh :(
 
KoreBolteR said:
look, if you ban guns, then all the criminals will have them and the innocent people havnt...therefore they wont be able to defend themselves tbh :(
Click to expand...

It's not that simple.
 
Warbie said:
It's not that simple.
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It is, think about it, all the civilians will be charged over possession over a gun, and all the gangsters and criminals will not.

then the people who are charged COULD be robbed that night and get shot, and have no gun of thier own to protect themselves. :sleep:
 
Ugh did anyone read some of the posts a couple pages back? Guns isn't the problem, it's the violent criminals that get released early and commit more crimes. If it isn't guns, it would be knives, bats, whatever. We're just too damn lenient on our violent criminals. Hell I've seen people get more time for drugs charges and robbery than murder and rape. Damn the more I think about it the more I agree with Stern that this country is sucking more and more... ;[
 
AzzMan said:
Ugh did anyone read some of the posts a couple pages back? Guns isn't the problem, it's the violent criminals that get released early and commit more crimes. If it isn't guns, it would be knives, bats, whatever. We're just too damn lenient on our violent criminals. Hell I've seen people get more time for drugs charges and robbery than murder and rape. Damn the more I think about it the more I agree with Stern that this country is sucking more and more... ;[
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Its like that all over the world m8, not just america, so stern should criticize the whole world if it comes to guns, hehe :p
 
Come on people.... learn your history!... A man with a gun is a citizen, an unarmed man is a subject.

To say that guns cause crime is like saying flys cause garbage, I don't think so.

You say the world would be safer if we didn't have guns! I hate to break the news, but more people are killed in the United States by traffic accidents.... I guess we need to Bann cars too.

I agree that gun control works, just ask Hitler or any of the other evil tyrants.

The second Amendment is more than just a right to bear arms. It’s the last defender of all the other rights.

Don't just read the words, understand them and what they stand for.

July 4, 1776
The Unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united* States of America.

"When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the Political Bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the Powers of the Earth, the separate and equal Station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent Respect to the Opinions of Mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the Separation.

We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness -- That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive to these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness....."

The Patriot
 
RZAL said:
Come on people.... learn your history!... A man with a gun is a citizen, an unarmed man is a subject.

To say that guns cause crime is like saying flys cause garbage, I don't think so.

You say the world would be safer if we didn't have guns! I hate to break the news, but more people are killed in the United States by traffic accidents.... I guess we need to Bann cars too.

I agree that gun control works, just ask Hitler or any of the other evil tyrants.

The second Amendment is more than just a right to bear arms. It’s the last defender of all the other rights.
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You've already given them away and nobody started shooting congressmen or The Prez, so I think it's safe to say that argument is fruitless.
 
no, u are using a lame excuse to bash his statement, guns are not there to shoot the prez, therefore using that as a reason is half-assed.
 
KoreBolteR said:
It is, think about it, all the civilians will be charged over possession over a gun, and all the gangsters and criminals will not.

then the people who are charged COULD be robbed that night and get shot, and have no gun of thier own to protect themselves. :sleep:
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There is very little gun crime in europe. The ban on firearms is working right now.

If anything we should make the penalty for having a weapon so harsh that only the most die hard crim will even consider carrying one. Start putting ppl away for many years at a time for simply having a gun in their possession and you'll soon see gun crime drop. Make them available to everyone and it's far more likely the opposite will be the case.

If someone feels they need a firearm to be safe they're either deluded, or living in a very sorry place :/
 
Warbie said:
There is very little gun crime in europe. The ban on firearms is working right now.
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How are ya'll doing on stabbings?
 
He_Who_Is_Steve said:
How are ya'll doing on stabbings?
Click to expand...

Not good, they outnumber shooting by 3-1 in the UK (272-80 last year).

(It's alot harder maintaining a restriction on knives .... although the penalties for carrying and using bladed weapons, knives in particular, will soon be increased to match that of firearm offences)

Of course, banning weapons doesn't get rid of the problem. Why are there some countries with very little crime (Japan and Germany) and others where it is far more common place (US and UK)?

However, i'd rather access to deadly weapons (of any kind) was heavily restricted in the countries where violent crime is becoming an increasing problem - which does include guns in America.
 
Yeh - I know.

The ban is working, that doesn't mean gun crime hasn't been increasing, though. If they were not banned there would be far more gun crime.

Also, guns in general have been banned for ages - that article you linked to only concerns handguns.
 
Warbie said:
Yeh - I know.

The ban is working, that doesn't mean gun crime hasn't been increasing, though. If they were not banned there would be far more gun crime.

Also, guns in general have been banned for ages - that article you linked to only concerns handguns.
Click to expand...
Before they were banned there was LESS gun crime.

Over the last 70 years, Europe has averaged about 400,000 murders per year, when one includes the murders committed by governments against mostly unarmed people. That murder rate is about 16 times higher than the murder rate in the U.S.
 
RakuraiTenjin said:
Before they were banned there was LESS gun crime.
Click to expand...

Less handgun crime - yes. That doesn't mean the ban isn't working (if there was no ban, i'm not just talking handguns here either, then there would be more gun crime.)

Do you honestly believe handgun crime went up because of the ban?? - that would be ridiculous. Violent crime is on the increase - that is why it went up.

This is going to become an induction/deduction debate before long.
 
Warbie said:
Less handgun crime - yes. That doesn't mean the ban isn't working (if there was no ban, i'm not just talking handguns here either, then there would be more gun crime.)

Do you honestly believe handgun crime went up because of the ban?? - that would be ridiculous. Violent crime is on the increase - that is why it went up.

This is going to become an induction/deduction debate before long.
Click to expand...
Yes, that is PRECISELY why it went up.

Why then, when between 1977 and 1992, 10 states adopted right-to-carry concealed handgun laws, was there:

-- no change in suicide rates,
-- a .5% rise in accidental firearm deaths,
-- a 5% decline in rapes,
-- a 7% decline in aggravated assaults,
-- and an 8% decline in murder

for the 10 states that adopted these laws between 1977 and 1992.

Using 1995 numbers, this amounts to:

-- 1 more accidental gun death,
-- 316 less murders,
-- 939 less rapes,
-- and 14,702 less aggravated assaults
 
I don't know - why are some countries far more violent than others?

(if those statistics are true, source?, then that is a very depressing state of affairs. The thought of living in a country were the number of rapes goes down by such a degree because of ppl carrying lethal weapons is not at all attractive)

I'm not pretending to have the answers here btw - just stating what I believe.

And no - handgun crime didn't go up because of the ban (I get the impression you think that b4 the ban handgun availability was similar to how it is in the US in the present day. It wasn't - very, very few ppl had, or were allowed, handguns. We're talking way under 1%. The ban on handguns had basically no effect on the number of handguns around)

Violent crime is on the increase in the uk - simple. It would have risen regardless.
 
Sources

"1995 Uniform Crime Reports." Pages 68-78. Federal Bureau of Investigation

Lott, John R. Jr. More Guns, Less Crime. The University of Chicago Press, 1998.

"Accident Facts." Page 27. National Safety Council, 1998.

Lott, John R. Jr. and Mustard, David B. "Crime, Deterrence, and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns." University of Chicago School of Law, 7/26/96.


Enact concealed right to carry laws (similar to those here. It's not an all out "YOU CAN CARRY CONCEALED ANYONE. It's a license) in your country, county, parish, state, or government division- you'll end up seeing those crime numbers plummet in a similar fashion.

Criminals are afraid to burglarize 'hotly' occupied houses (those who may have an owner who will defend themselves) or potentially armed mugging victims.
 
So what's the point of a ban if it doesnt change the crime rate?
 
ok.

- that is not a good situation to be in. Living in a country where it's actually safer to be armed is definately not for me.

In this respect, at the moment, our two countries aren't comparable. The way things are going though, it probably won't be too long untill we're in the same boat (and I move somehwere else)

(I still feel that it'd be safer in the states if all guns were illegal - if the penalties for being caught with one were very harsh)
 
AzzMan said:
So what's the point of a ban if it doesnt change the crime rate?
Click to expand...

It does - just not in this one particular situation.

The ban on handguns had such a little effect because noone had any handguns. The crimes that were being commited certainly weren't by legally owned guns (but by illegal ones - which the ban obviously has little impact on)
 
That's the point we (anti gun control people in general) have been making for ages though-

A huge majority of gun crime in the FIRST place is committed by illegal gun users. Legal firearm owners are far far less likely to commit gun violence.

By disarming the legal firearm owners, you leave the illegally owned weapons in the hands of criminals (as.. you know, by virtue of the fact that they are criminals) aren't going to turn in their weapons. Now you've got muggers with guns with no fear of law abiding people having any.
 
RakuraiTenjin said:
That's the point we (anti gun control people in general) have been making for ages though-

A huge majority of gun crime in the FIRST place is committed by illegal gun users. Legal firearm owners are far far less likely to commit gun violence.

By disarming the legal firearm owners, you leave the illegally owned weapons in the hands of criminals (as.. you know, by virtue of the fact that they are criminals) aren't going to turn in their weapons. Now you've got muggers with guns with no fear of law abiding people having any.
Click to expand...

But illegal gun owners dont walk into a gunshop and buy guns, they steal them from legal gun owners...
Its an endless cycle, breaking it anywhere will solve the problem, but where do you break it?
The anti-gun lobby has been saying at the criminals for as long as its existed, but there are no resources to do that, so the logical place is with the legal gun owners.
Break the chain, and it will slowly disappear.
Guns break, run out of ammo, get lost and with a zero tolerance law, they wouldnt last long being confinscated on sight.
Once you break the cycle its just a matter of time before guns fade away
 
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