Doom 3 & HL2

[Man|-|unter]

imo System Shock 2 has also the best dialogue compare to Half Life 2.

 

[Ennui]

For me Half-life 2 has the best dialogue to date in a videogame. Hands down. Even better than Deus ex I'd say. Why? Because it's human and very much down to earth.

Yeah, Valve way outdid themselves in that department. It's well written and well acted. I don't know about best dialogue overall, some older games with text dialogue were pretty good, like Manhunter says.

Half-Life 2 is a thousand times better than Doom 3. Remember back in the day , though? All the "Doom vs. HL2" discussions? Look who won

 

[Jintor]

I do like Deus Ex's dialogue, but it had a tendency to flare dramatic cliches everywhere.

 

[ríomhaire]

I think that Deus Ex could have done with a few better actors. Some are fine but I just didn't like the way some of Walton Simon's lines were delivered.

 

[taviow]

Deus Ex is ok. I just don't like those chinese voices.
I think Doom 3 got better near the end. The Delta Labs were ok, but I loved Hell, and the levels after Hell were nice too, but I don't remember their names. I also liked the sentry bot sequences. But of course, Half Life 2 wins, it's much better.

 

[chilledsanity]

I don't know, I'm a big Deus Ex and System Shock 2 fan. Deus Ex's was a tad cliched, but it had an amazing level of depth to it, even by today's standards for games. I really can't agree that HL2 has the best dialogue of any videogame though, I can think of quite a few that top it in my opinion. You mentioned that the people sound human, and down to earth, well one of my all-time favorite games, Phantasmagoria 2 (people seem to either love it or completely hate it), totally had that feel, all the human behavior felt extremely believable despite having a surreal environment.

HL2's was okay, but a lot of it felt kind of hokey. Like that rebel giving you the gun saying "I always like to bring a little irony to a firefight" I thought just sounded dumb the way it was worded. Also I got frustrated to the point where I used the gravity gun to turn a sentry gun on my entire team later in the game after hearing just one too many "Wha-hu-hey! It's Gordon Freeman! I'm coming with you!" lines.

And again, if you want dialogue that sounds practically like poetry it's so good, the Legacy of Kain series has a lot to deliver. Additionally it explores a lot existential issues and has a level of depth to it I don't often see. I find it rare when simply the writing of a computer game causes me to give pause to reflect upon my own philosophies. I can't say HL2 did that.

 

[nokori3byo]

Well, I suppose it's a matter of personal taste, but HL2's dialogue is by far the best I've ever heard in a video game. I'll also add my voice to the chorus of praise for the game's voice acting, which was top-notch accross the board.

I think I tuned out of Doom 3 the instant I heard a character use the term "FNG." Tough guy military speak has never failed to trigger my gag reflex.

 

[Bill Lumbergh]

Any sort of comparison between the two is subjective of course, outside of technical aspects.

I enjoyed the two games equally, but back in 2004, when Steam was a real PITA, Doom 3 won out for me because of it.

 

[TaoFan]

I feel I need to state an obvious point here:

I only liked HL1 because it had a variation of the Doom 1 story, and Doom 3 simply elaborated upon it, where you start both games before the invasion.
Doom 1, on the other hand, had you starting afterwards.

As a result, people keep saying that Doom 3 ripped off the HL1 beginning, which it didn't.

The Doom1/3 and HL1 plots are simply variations on a theme: there is an invasion of a remote research base by otherworldly creatures and forces, and only one lone man is able to drive those forces back to their place of origin. Substitute a scientist for a marine and aliens for demons and you can surely see the resemblance.

Half-Life should've ended with the G-Man recruiting Gordon at the end.

When I realised what HL2 was about I wasn't really interested, plus I really don't like games or films where Humanity starts out under an alien race's thumb. Plus, I was constantly fed up of the gravity gun this, gravity gun that, gravity gun the other raving, when frankly it really wasn't necessary. Especially when the puzzles were designed to show off this gimmick.

Actually, for this fact, I also didn't much like Resurrection of Evil BECAUSE it also had a "gravity gun" of sorts.

PC games for years and years have managed fine without gravity guns, so why do they suddenly need them now?

 

[99.vikram]

PC games for years and years have managed fine without gravity guns, so why do they suddenly need them now?

No game needs a gravity gun. It's just insanely fun to play with!

 

[Asknoone]

Your line of thinking leaves much to be desired, don't you think?

 

[99.vikram]

Your line of thinking leaves much to be desired, don't you think?

What'd I do this time?

 

[Asknoone]

Not you.

 

[chilledsanity]

Actually I agree with TaoFan on a lot of points there. I liked HL1 more than HL2 because it had that real-ish feel to it. These felt like some giant facility and you were just trying to escape. Although I was disappointed you just didn't take off once you hit the surface though. In HL2 the world is already conquered by aliens, so it feels much more after the face. I will say though (haven't played Ep. 1 yet) I DID like the ending to HL2 much better than HL1. In HL1 it was really quick and felt like it was thrown together at the last minute. In HL2 it was still pretty quick, but it left me wondering what the hell was going on. Utter confusion can be a cool way to end a game.

Actually, for this fact, I also didn't much like Resurrection of Evil BECAUSE it also had a "gravity gun" of sorts

Dude I found it more useful than HL2 becuase I could throw back those fireballs from the imps and it was THE weapon to take care of lost souls (though admittingly, I probably should have learned how to use HL2's on headcrabs).

 

[McGooTheWise]

Actually I agree with TaoFan on a lot of points there. I liked HL1 more than HL2 because it had that real-ish feel to it. These felt like some giant facility and you were just trying to escape. Although I was disappointed you just didn't take off once you hit the surface though. In HL2 the world is already conquered by aliens, so it feels much more after the face. I will say though (haven't played Ep. 1 yet) I DID like the ending to HL2 much better than HL1. In HL1 it was really quick and felt like it was thrown together at the last minute. In HL2 it was still pretty quick, but it left me wondering what the hell was going on. Utter confusion can be a cool way to end a game.


Dude I found it more useful than HL2 becuase I could throw back those fireballs from the imps and it was THE weapon to take care of lost souls (though admittingly, I probably should have learned how to use HL2's on headcrabs).

Actually, I think the "Grabber" is more of a ripoff of the physics gun, because of the beam, and that it can push, and pull with the beam.

 

[Jintor]

IT WAS IN DEVELOPMENT BEFORE HALF-LIFE 2!

I SWEAR!

*shifty eyes*

 

[chilledsanity]

IT WAS IN DEVELOPMENT BEFORE HALF-LIFE 2!

Only the outcome of the ongoing civil suit case of Kleiner Labs v. Union Aerospace Corporation will be able to answer that.

 

[Mahalis]

Because it's human

...except for Dr. Kleiner, who - particularly during the first teleporter scene - sounds like a five-year-old's idea of a scientist at times.
"Yes, Gordon, we're ready to transmit you!"
"My relief is almost palpable."

 

[Frentzen]

He's absent minded, remember that

 

[Seppo]

Basically, with Doom 3 you get the glaze, but Half-Life 2 is the whole cake.

 

[Bill Lumbergh]

I feel I need to state an obvious point here: . . .

Your line of thinking leaves much to be desired, don't you think?

I don't get it . . . why would he post something and then figure his line of thinking left much to be desired?

 

[Wanted Bob]

IMO, HL2 is better than Doom 3, and Doom 1/2 are better than Doom 3 (maybe just cause of the nostalgic value). HL2 beats all the Dooms though...

 

[Seppo]

Half-Life games are simply more entertaining than Doom 3. Fascinating locations, smooth gameplay, innovative weapons, it's all there

 

[function9]

My biggest problem with D3 was the incredible amount of backtracking the player had to do in order to move past a level. While there is some amount of backtracking in games, with D3 it almost felt like they ran out of ideas at times so they just had us backtrack to a key panel or something. And the AI was poor. I remember defeating a Hell Knight by just circling a very small column and shooting. Instead of just standing there and smashing me it would just follow.

D3:RoE I found a bit more fun at times. The boss fights seemed a little more challenging and enemies in general seemed to use an updated AI. And it kept you moving forward more than D3.

I've never played D3 online, so I can't speak about that. D3 was so so, while it's not incredibly bad, it's not a game at least for me that can be played through multiple times.

PC games for years and years have managed fine without gravity guns, so why do they suddenly need them now?

Games managed fine for a while without the help of 3d accelerators that we have all come to love too. But at some point things have to move forward. With the intro of the gravity gun (and maybe possibly the portal gun) it will make for some interesting gameplay options, at least in Valve titles.

I found the puller/gravity gun in D3:RoE to be awkward. I found myself not using it at all except for the few times it had to be used. On the other had, I used HL2's GG a lot because it was just so damn fun.

 

[Seppo]

To me any FPS nowadays without proper physics is just meh

 

[TaoFan]

My biggest problem with D3 was the incredible amount of backtracking the player had to do in order to move past a level. While there is some amount of backtracking in games, with D3 it almost felt like they ran out of ideas at times so they just had us backtrack to a key panel or something.

Maybe, but because of the level-load boundaries in HL2 you can't backtrack at all without causing some irritation.

And the backtracking isn't anywhere near as bad as that in games with hubs, like Quake 2 or even the classic Hexen. Man, that was annoying to backtrack through!

Besides, backtracking makes a game feel a lot less linear. And HL2 is certainly linear.

 

[99.vikram]

Besides, backtracking makes a game feel a lot less linear. And HL2 is certainly linear.

How can you say that? For me the running to-and-fro on a level was what partially ruined my Doom 3 experience.

 

[Seppo]

How can you say that? For me the running to-and-fro on a level was what partially ruined my Doom 3 experience.

indeed, but I guess it helps if the levels are fascinating. Doom 3 maps unfortunately weren't interesting enough.

 

[Asknoone]

Besides, backtracking makes a game feel a lot less linear. And HL2 is certainly linear.

I don't think linearity is actually that bad of a thing. I'm a big fan of constrained levels so long as the gameplay is tight.

 

[ríomhaire]

Maybe, but because of the level-load boundaries in HL2 you can't backtrack at all without causing some irritation.

And the backtracking isn't anywhere near as bad as that in games with hubs, like Quake 2 or even the classic Hexen. Man, that was annoying to backtrack through!

Besides, backtracking makes a game feel a lot less linear. And HL2 is certainly linear.

Actually one of the things I really liked about HL1 is that you got to glimps areas up ahead and you get to see araes that you've already gone through. One good example of this is We've Got Hostles. At the end you get to revisit the start and you can see areas that you've already been from vents.

 

[TaoFan]

I admit, it can be most tedious when you get lost at some point and wander all over the place looking for the right area, but Doom 3 is different, as the sheer quality of the eye candy means there's always something to see.

Frankly, I cannot actually tell how the Doom 3 maps were put together as the normal mapping applied on every surface makes it hard to tell where the brushes are. And the huge sweeping curves of half the maps add to the complexity of it all. And I could just spend ages admiring the interaction of multiple moving lightsources with shadows with the surfaces, which are lit realistically.

Mind you, I am quite impressed by the objects that you can manipulate, like dustbins, cars, boxes, etc in HL2, even if they make the world feel more ordinary and even mundane.