Half-Life 2 Engine to complicated for major mods

[aeroripper]

It seems like the amount of work modders have to put into these games (and the amount of people, especially if organized soley over the internet)... takes years just to create a big mod

Do you guys think we'll see major mods like natural selection and nightwatch on hl2 engine with more and more work needed to bring it up to the players standards?

 

[Synthaxx R-or]

Depends totally on the tools.

Sure it's hard (er) work, but look at the mods done right now, they have to put in some serious "hacking" to get the old HL engine to do certain things. With the HL2 engine that'll no longer be needed.

I don't think it'll be that much harder, it'll just be different.

 

[Neutrino]

Yes, we'll definitely see big mods on the source engine. Sure it will be a bit more complex, but I think that just means we'll have to wait a while before we see anything big.

 

[Mr-Fusion]

The Half-Life 1 engine has been holding back mod makers ability to do so much for so long. The texture sizes, poly limits, map sizes, lack of vehicles are just a few examples.

I think we're going to see an extraordinary jump in quality for mods on the HL2 engine.

 

[killahsin-[CE]]

It's actually easier to make higher poly stuff than lower poly stuff. When working with lower poly counts you spend more time trying to figure out how to sacrifice tris but not quality. Same goes for texturing. All the new tech may seem like alot of new stuff to work with but most people working with 3D tools now a days understand it already.

So in my eyes nah it may actually be slightly easier, after learning the specific tools.

 

[brisck1]

actually with all of hl2's new tools and advanced features, I think you will see some mod coming alot faster than before. Dont forget that HL2 has been built from the ground up with ease of use and mods in mind.

 

[Sporky]

Well, for the FPS scene at least I think the heyday of mods is coming to an end. The time and expertise required to turn something that looks professional is rapidly expanding and although I'm sure we'll see some fine mods for HL2 I suspect we'll see less.

Fortunately in many ways, HL2 does things in 'the old' ways as far as textures and modelling go (both in object and mapping terms).

I'm really not sure what the mod community will make of say, the U3 engine when it arrives, even the D3 engine is going to require significant adjusting to in terms of content creation.

 

[JFry]

It really all boils down to what is fun for the end-user. For example Kill-box style maps are wildly popular (lord knows why), yet they take almost no effort to make. I can certainly see some kind of jenga(sp?) mod being popular as well, but it wouldn't be very hard to do.
That being said, people do appreciate quality content. While I think the actual process will be steamlined and mod-friendly, the sheer amount of content required is going to be enormous. Not to mention the complexity that will be possible in terms of interaction, which all requires lots and lots of work. Sure you can make another cs clone for the source engine, but are people going to be satisfied with that after playing hl2? Time will tell.

 

[SMT]

The mods that are actually finished and released will be fewer and better.

 

[cyborgguineapig]

My theory, and we are already seeing it happen, is that big games will continue to take longer and longer to develope because they are more advanced. Mod tools will continue to become easier and there will be more and more mods but fewer ideas. I expect there to be a moment in gaming in the near future where the pace slows a bit, but its not bad.

Take the space race for example. It was sparked by a need to explore, we made highly advanced technology in a few years, went to the moon and then slowed the pace, its like we will soon be reaching that point when the car wheel seems to spin in the opposite dirction from going SO fast. get what I'm saying? Prob no because its 5:13 am and I can't think.

 

[Cybernoid]

It seems like the amount of work modders have to put into these games (and the amount of people, especially if organized soley over the internet)... takes years just to create a big mod

Do you guys think we'll see major mods like natural selection and nightwatch on hl2 engine with more and more work needed to bring it up to the players standards?

I'd imagine that modding will cease to exist in the future. There's simply too much work to be done. Even Nightwatch is taking years.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

It won't cease to exist, it'll just require larger teams to work on it.

Also, not all mods require bucketloads of content. I've got a small HL2 mod planned that won't be more than a few mb in size.

 

[InZaneFlea]

Being one of two mappers for the nomoreroominhell(.com) team, I already know that it's going to be a lot more work than a HL map. But in the end, the payoff will be much better as well.

 

[Cybernoid]

It won't cease to exist, it'll just require larger teams to work on it.

With every new engine, the amount of work required will increase. I don't see how mod teams can keep up.

Also, not all mods require bucketloads of content. I've got a small HL2 mod planned that won't be more than a few mb in size.

Small mods... there used to be tons of small mods for Quake. All sorts of stuff. There were almost none for Half-Life.

 

[joshsmog]

I don't think mods will die, I've been playing hl1 for a long time and the mods keep on flowing in lots of them with original ideas. Theres also gonna be alot of newer modders because of the possibilities of the source engine and the up to date graphics im sure alot of newer people looking to mod will find hl2 the easiest out of all the newer games.

 

[Cybernoid]

MODS ARE GONE! They're just GONE!

The Apocalypse!
REPENT!

 

[kussie]

Small mods... there used to be tons of small mods for Quake. All sorts of stuff. There were almost none for Half-Life.

Uumm there have been a whole bunch of Half-Life mods.

Some of the biggers ones i can recall:
Natual Selection
Science And Industry
Day of Defeat
Counter-Strike
The Specialists
Sven Co-Op
Hostile Intent
Earth Special Forces


A moddb.com search found 503 mods for Half-Life 1 alone
Moddb.com

 

[Raxxman]

Thing is, Modding is a good way for people who are looking to break into the gaming industry to start on.

And ID said the major amount of time required is in graphics, thus the demand for good graphic artists is increasing. As this is one of the larger aspects of modding I can't see it dying. I think it will be true we'll see less mods springing up, as it takes more and more time to get all the artwork done but the death of mods? hardly.

 

[Cybernoid]

Uumm there have been a whole bunch of Half-Life mods.

A moddb.com search found 503 mods for Half-Life 1 alone
Moddb.com

I meant small mods. Quake had small singleplayer mods that added/modified weapons, changed monsters and whatnot. I can't recall a single mod like that for Half-Life.

 

[kussie]

I used a few ages ago, Counter-Life for example, just placing CS weapons into HL1 story.

of those 503 mods some of those are small ones and quite a few are SP only.

 

[Cybernoid]

The thing about Counter-Life was that it took ages to develop, even though it didn't do much.

 

[kussie]

only took me and my friends to develop a small SP mod for a uni project only took us a couple of weeks.

 

[SLH]

I want to see a rise in UT style mods. i.e. Mutators. Those are MUCH easier to develop, and because multiple ones can be ran at once small mutators are a good thing, as then you can mix and match.

Of course i love the total conversion mods as well, but for me, having mutators is what makes the UT series so re-playable, and unique.

 

[Wildhound]

There'll always be people out there to make mods, no matter how difficult or challenging it becomes. Modding has always been both of those things and that's why people love it. If it was too easy, well where's the fun in that?

I'm currently part of a HL mod team, and by the time I leave college I'll probably have started a mod of my own. The only reason I haven't already is because I wouldn't start until I was sure I could make it work.

 

[Mountain Man]

I once read a statistic that said that only 10% of mod projects ever see completition and out of those only 10% are even worth playing. If Half-Life 2 sees only half-a-dozen quality mods released in the next few years, I will consider the HL2 mod community a roaring success.

 

[Wildhound]

I once read a statistic that said that only 10% of mod projects ever see completition and out of those only 10% are even worth playing. If Half-Life 2 sees only half-a-dozen quality mods released in the next few years, I will consider the HL2 mod community a roaring success.

You have to bear in mind that a lot of the ones that fail are the same as the ones that come back later and pull it off.

It's all about experience and learning from your mistakes. First time around everyone's too ambitious.

 

[Gajdycz]

yeah, mods are a trial of love and determination. only the really good ones get by, and those will be high quality.

its just that we wont see mods springing up for hl2 as fast as lats time, ppl are going to be oggling for a loonnng time.

btw, the mods i think will do well are:

Hull-Breach

Ns2(?)

 

[Farrowlesparrow]

I meant small mods. Quake had small singleplayer mods that added/modified weapons, changed monsters and whatnot. I can't recall a single mod like that for Half-Life.

Most mods like that for hl were mades years ago, and basically worn out. Some are still floating about but really mod makers either made bigger mods or moved onto other engines. Simply because people didn't want to just play with a new shotgun anymore.

 

[Mountain Man]

Not to mention that mods that change the core gameplay are often an acquired taste.

 

[killahsin-[CE]]

The Golden age for modding over? Sorry but I don't think, the golden age for modding has even begun.

But I do think half-life 2 will be much more mod friendly than the original. I mean lets be realitistic, there are a silly amount of mods already in design stages, just waiting for the release.

 

[Citizen 1150421]

i can't wait for them to release all of the sdk so that i can start modding my game.

right now i m a one man team and have all the models textures maps etc complete.. i just don't have an engine to run them

the longer the game takes to release (hl2) the longer you all will have to wait for the best mod this side of the universe has everyone seen.

 

[Insano]

Amen

 

[ukfluke]

citezen give us some info on ur mod plz

 

[Kadayi]

I think that the future lies in promising mods becoming picked up and adopted/financed and pushed to completion by professional games companies. All of the recent and upcoming game engines offer far greater levels of creative freedom to mod makers, however at the same time they also up the ante with respect to a games potential complexity and players expectations of the end result.

If your creating a straight shooter, you have the likes of Doom³ to compete with. A tactical shooter? You've got CS:S. A single player story driven experience? HL². They are the present and forthcoming benchmarks that any mod has to develop beyond if it is going to be successful in any way.

Interesting times are ahead.

 

[aeroripper]

Yea i just think it sucks we're gonna hafta wait around 2 years before we see any really big mods come out of the woodwork

 

[Mint_Sauce]

I believe all that will happen is modding teams will get larger. Instead of 3 modellers, they'll be 6 etc. I think it's just gunna take more organisation.

 

[aeroripper]

Yea but once you get, say, 25 people in a mod team all meeting soley on the internet, you almost have to have some sort of an adminstration system.... it just seems keeping track of 25 people would be a hard task... i guess it all depends on how serious people in your team are and how well they work in a team

 

[urseus]

Seeing as you can import hl1 stuff into hl2 then pretty it up and tweak it i dont think it will take as long to develop a mod. Especially for ones like dod and Natural selection. The whole buildup for a mod that takes time is also what direction you want the mod to take. Because they have been out and play tested for years, they already have a head start and know what players want. That means all they need to do is spruce their stuff up abit and make use of the new source engine.

This game isnt Far Cry or even Doom3. This is HL2. This is the game that people were claiming would be crushed by the longevity of Far Cry and the likes. The game isnt even out yet, and you already have tonnes of mods ready to get to work streight out of the box. Mods are massively massivly popular. Its almost the measure of a game nowadays on how well it can be modded. This game was made for specifically for mods. The next few years will belong to HL2.

That is, if the fcuking game is released some time in the next few years.

 

[smwScott]

The engine will both be harder and easier for modders. Designing levels and characters, as well as pretty much all of the graphics will be much more difficult and will take much more time. Just because there's a higher polygon count doesn't mean you can waste them, every poly still has to worthwhile. The end result is an object with more detail but still running as well as humanly possible.

It will be easier in the sense that most things people would want to do can be easily accomplished. Half-Life Rally would've only been a some vehicle models and race courses, as well as some racing code if it was released on Source. With the HL1 engine they had to write a vehicle engine almost from the ground up.

Overall, we'll get better mods, that may take a little longer. Maybe not, depending on the mod.

 

[Bigcheese]

just look at unreal tornament 2004. unreal can do everything soruce can do exspet for some of the funky advanced shaders and it dosnt look the same. but it has vehicles, HUGE maps and physics. etc...

but the one major diferane is the new animation and player "stuff" mods can be sooo much more emersive and make you care about the people in them, not just like other games/mods where you see a guy with a smile on his face being beaten to death...

now (with both engins) there are almost no limits if you want it bad enough you can make it.

i say it will be wayyy ezer than stuff was with hl1. so many new tools to do stuff that would be extreamly hard to implament in hl1