Half Life 2's Combine are dimwitted...

[InnerDemon]

According to several previews I have read. I was, myself wondering of the actual power of HL2's AI enemies.
In the Bink videos availiable on this site, the enemies seemed to lack much in the smart department. And mainly stood and shot with very little strafing to save their hides.

Though, I do remember seeing one clip and the Combine forces did actual strafe, but failed to acknowledge that Gordan had just picked up a table with the manipulator.

This sentry like behaviour could have a relatively large impact. I mean, the scripted forces in HL themselves did a whole duck and cover routine.

Maybe these lack of smarts are just part of the demo, but I personally would find it a deep and devasting shame and a big impact on tactical gameplay if the majority of enemies have a lacking in AI structure.

Which is a shame, because I had read articles pre-HL2 E3 which stated from the Horses mouth; Valve: That the AI in HL2 would be very impressive and the AI would act in a tactical and realistic fashion which would be far more impressive that scripted AI constructs.
The articles more or less were saying: if Gordan pulls out a nade they duck for cover. Or the Combine would regroup and try and flank Gordon using realistic and impressive tactics.

So far, I've only ever seen Halo's covenant AI to be diverse and tactical.
I remember many a good fire fight with the Elites.

 

[A.I.]

Halo was run-and-gun where I was flanking them around their butts and they were dying. Fast.

 

[eth8686]

Factoring in the 6 years of development, highest ever ratings in many magazines, I think it's safe to say that the A.I. VERY likely will be pretty damn good!

 

[Brian Damage]

I got quite the opposite impression from the reviews.

As far as I could tell, the only AI that was slightly lacking was the AI of Gordon's teammates, who sometimes get in the way...

 

[KurtCobain]

AI improves depending on what dificulty you have it on

 

[Asuka]

He has a halo avater JUMP HIM. jk

Anyway the a.i in hl2 videos looks bad because they lowered everything so they can show off the games gfx. guns all that stuff without dieing.

 

[Varsity]

Combine police are the first major enemy. The videos were played on easy difficulty. 2+2=4.

 

[lans]

The squad A.I and the combine A.I., according to most reviews is very good.

The only criticism I've heard is that the squad A.I can act stupid - like they'll follow you anywhere - so in a small room they'll block your way.
But this is the ONLY flaw they've reported, with the A.I.

Oh - and BTW you should know that the A.I. in bink videos is dumped down to show of the combat/gameplay in general. Seeing that you are a halo fan - notice how Master chief doesn't even have a health bar or any loss of health at all in the E3 2003 SP presentation of halo 2.

 

[Dougy]

According to several previews I have read. I was, myself wondering of the actual power of HL2's AI enemies.
In the Bink videos availiable on this site, the enemies seemed to lack much in the smart department. And mainly stood and shot with very little strafing to save their hides.

Though, I do remember seeing one clip and the Combine forces did actual strafe, but failed to acknowledge that Gordan had just picked up a table with the manipulator.

This sentry like behaviour could have a relatively large impact. I mean, the scripted forces in HL themselves did a whole duck and cover routine.

Maybe these lack of smarts are just part of the demo, but I personally would find it a deep and devasting shame and a big impact on tactical gameplay if the majority of enemies have a lacking in AI structure.

Which is a shame, because I had read articles pre-HL2 E3 which stated from the Horses mouth; Valve: That the AI in HL2 would be very impressive and the AI would act in a tactical and realistic fashion which would be far more impressive that scripted AI constructs.
The articles more or less were saying: if Gordan pulls out a nade they duck for cover. Or the Combine would regroup and try and flank Gordon using realistic and impressive tactics.

So far, I've only ever seen Halo's covenant AI to be diverse and tactical.
I remember many a good fire fight with the Elites.

Im sorry but if you think Halo had good ai then there is no point even trying to tell you otherwise as you are quite clearly deluded.

 

[brisck1]

I dont know about you guys, but I dont plan on using squad A.I, I just cant stand A.I allies

 

[InnerDemon]

Oh of course, I know the demos were set to show of Gameplay. I mean, he hardly lost any health regardless of what beating he took.

I was moreso just commenting on the reviews. They seem to have taken note that the Combine themselves weren't at all particulary smart.

Halo itself did have a rather smart AI construct. Mainly noticable on the likes of Heroic and Legendary mode.
However, one could get the wrong impression because the Covenant have purposely been made disorganised... Mainly the grunts.

I'm not doubting HL2's A.I. I was just concerned by the spree of "Half Life 2's main fault is the poor A.I."

Looking over what I've wrote I have noticed that I did word most of it wrong. x_x

Lans: Oh yes, of course. Like I said: I know the A.I. is numbed. I was merely commenting on reviews.

Brisck: Try Resident Evil:Outbreak. You'd sooner kill them yourself. RE series never maintained a particulary smart A.I. (Remembers the likes of RE:0 Yeuck.)

 

[maximus0402]

I dont know about you guys, but I dont plan on using squad A.I, I just cant stand A.I allies

I like allied A.I. I thought Halflife 1 was ok. The robot sentries in doom3 were also quite helpful in a tight pinch. You are not always going to have squads in hl2 so you dont have to worry too much, but after reading the US pc gamer, they said there is nothing like coordinating rocket attacks with your friendlies against the striders and especially with the robot D.O.G. Even when the AI gets in your way and say you shoot them, they will turn around, appoligize for being in your way and move out of the way for you, quite impressive. Now I do get annoyed when they give you friendly AI that you MUST not let them die or the game is over, that is annoying. Farcry friendly AI with Valerie was a waste and yes I wanted to just shoot her down.

 

[Peqkx]

Oh of course, I know the demos were set to show of Gameplay. I mean, he hardly lost any health regardless of what beating he took.

I was moreso just commenting on the reviews. They seem to have taken note that the Combine themselves weren't at all particulary smart.

Halo itself did have a rather smart AI construct. Mainly noticable on the likes of Heroic and Legendary mode.
However, one could get the wrong impression because the Covenant have purposely been made disorganised... Mainly the grunts.

I'm not doubting HL2's A.I. I was just concerned by the spree of "Half Life 2's main fault is the poor A.I."

Looking over what I've wrote I have noticed that I did word most of it wrong. x_x

Lans: Oh yes, of course. Like I said: I know the A.I. is numbed. I was merely commenting on reviews.

Brisck: Try Resident Evil:Outbreak. You'd sooner kill them yourself. RE series never maintained a particulary smart A.I. (Remembers the likes of RE:0 Yeuck.)

Instead of reading all of that, I'll just assume it says something along the lines of: "Half-Life 2 is better than Halo 2."

 

[maximus0402]

Instead of reading all of that, I'll just assume it says something along the lines of: "Half-Life 2 is better than Halo 2."

Don't bash the guy just because he is WORRIED that hl2 AI might not be good. He just wants to have a ultimate experience thats all and he is looking for any flaw he can about this game to see if it is a awesome game or not. I do the same thing, like with movies, I will look everywhere for the bad reviews and if the bad reviews aren't really bad, then its a go. Dont worry this game is going to rock in every way. PC gamer (US) says that some games have the gameplay, some have the graphics, some have the replayability and some have the A.I.. But there is no game that had the complete packgage UNTIL NOW: Halflife 2

 

[alehm]

I don't know what reviews you have been reading but the one that was most vocal about AI, which was UK PC GAMER basically said they expected more from AI but said it is just as good if not better than the original HL's AI.

You already said you liked HL's AI so maybe that biggest complaint already answers your question?

 

[Sharrd]

Instead of reading all of that, I'll just assume it says something along the lines of: "Half-Life 2 is better than Halo 2."

Instead of posting without reading through the thread, you should just stay quiet.
I also remember reviewers saying that the Combine A.I. can be rather bad at times, but this was what they said in the earlier reviews, didn't check info about the later ones; I doubt they played on any other level than normal/easy.

Edit: Alehm, I actually was expecting it to be [/B]better than that. Don't get me wrong though, I'm not depressed, rather I am surprised.

 

[Wicked Spider]

if you guys say that the AI in the binks was tuned down than im relaxed.
from the review's i can conclude that the AI is some what disapointing (we'll need to see for ourselves)
i do however remember valves post on the supperior AI that could do all these great things (break down doors if u hide in them for example) which i dunno if they scripted or real, my first impression is that valve "hyped" the AI too much

 

[Apos]

Er...

"Combine provide a consistently dangerous challenge in combat"

Section about Combine and striders is described as "most intense and exhilirating conflict ever undertaken in a videogame"

Everything I've seen suggests that the Combine in fact have very good AI: definately better than the marines in HL1 (which were as good as just about any enemy in a game since) with more complex moves and interactions and all sorts of squad coordination.

And the complaint about the human AI getting in your way seems to be, and is even described as, a nitpick that they used because they couldn't really think of any: they quickly get out of your way anyway, and even apologize for being in the way.

 

[Frank]

They turned off the AI for those BINKS, right?

 

[MaDMaXX]

The combine are not dumb in the AI dept. no one, unless they've played the game (not the stolen pre alpha) actually know how good the combine are.
Take it from me, you will be very happy trying to fight them.

 

[PvtRyan]

The combine are not dumb in the AI dept. no one, unless they've played the game (not the stolen pre alpha) actually know how good the combine are.
Take it from me, you will be very happy trying to fight them.

I've seen you making more posts like this, what's your source if I may ask so?

And the complaint about the human AI getting in your way seems to be, and is even described as, a nitpick that they used because they couldn't really think of any: they quickly get out of your way anyway, and even apologize for being in the way.

Yeah, one of the reviews described it as that the AI doesn't know that it's not necessary to follow the player in every tiny room.
PC Zone said that they also get in your line of fire but quickly move out of the way and apologize. If anything, that is a pro, not a con, I can't think of any AI that checks if it's in the way.

 

[MaDMaXX]

I've seen you making more posts like this, what's your source if I may ask so?

source = me

 

[PvtRyan]

source = me

And err.... how do you know it? :E

 

[Eat Fresh]

According to several previews I have read. I was, myself wondering of the actual power of HL2's AI enemies.
In the Bink videos availiable on this site, the enemies seemed to lack much in the smart department. And mainly stood and shot with very little strafing to save their hides.

Though, I do remember seeing one clip and the Combine forces did actual strafe, but failed to acknowledge that Gordan had just picked up a table with the manipulator.

This sentry like behaviour could have a relatively large impact. I mean, the scripted forces in HL themselves did a whole duck and cover routine.

Maybe these lack of smarts are just part of the demo, but I personally would find it a deep and devasting shame and a big impact on tactical gameplay if the majority of enemies have a lacking in AI structure.

Which is a shame, because I had read articles pre-HL2 E3 which stated from the Horses mouth; Valve: That the AI in HL2 would be very impressive and the AI would act in a tactical and realistic fashion which would be far more impressive that scripted AI constructs.
The articles more or less were saying: if Gordan pulls out a nade they duck for cover. Or the Combine would regroup and try and flank Gordon using realistic and impressive tactics.

So far, I've only ever seen Halo's covenant AI to be diverse and tactical.
I remember many a good fire fight with the Elites.

Don't worrry about it. It's good.

I know this because I have played the game all the way though at Valve's offices. Can't get into details though. Suffice to say they are excellent tactically and work together in ways I have never seen before. Totally dynamic kinda stuff.

 

[MaDMaXX]

Because i played a fair bit of HL2 the week before the RC was submitted to Vivendi.

 

[PvtRyan]

Because i played a fair bit of HL2 the week before the RC was submitted to Vivendi.

Go on... :E

Has NS anything to do with "the two mod teams" that were testing the SDK of HL2 with Valve?

 

[MaDMaXX]

Go on... :E

Has NS anything to do with "the two mod teams" that were testing the SDK of HL2 with Valve?

Heh, i wish

We need to see the SDK before we go further....


I mainly hung out with the DOD guys.

 

[Bait]

I don't think any review has stated anything against the AI at all. As stated before, the only AI-con I've seen is that fact that allies get in the way occasionally.

Heck, so long as it's better than when Barney gets in your way while opening fire on a zombie, I'm happy.

 

[Slime]

I'm too tired to quote it myself, but Gabe says that the A.I. was dumbed in the E3 2003 ( At least there), according to Valve info thread.

 

[jverne]

so why is getting in your way so strange? look at Counter Strike for instance, where live people get in your way in a firefight! hehe, it's quite funny to head shoot two teammates, not intentionaly of course! for that door issue, you can always order them to move or let them wait somewhere while you scout ahead! it happend lots of times in HL1, but never really bothered me!

 

[MaDMaXX]

Thats right, they had stay put flags on in those vids, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to demonstrate the other gameplay mechanics.

I experienced nothing like that in the full game.

 

[Brian Damage]

Heh, another funny thing that kinda points out that the original E3 2003 vids were merely made to show off what things were eventually going to be like: At the start of traptown, the first Combine you can see appears out of nowhere, slightly above the ground. Watch closely.

 

[Exodin]

Madmaxx made me drool

Can.. can.. I touch you?

 

[Lobster]

Aslong as the combat experience is as good as say, Call of duty (which from what ive read in the reviews it surpasses) im happy, the general feeling has been, if it isnt perfect, its still better than anything currently released, which is saying somthing!

 

[Eat Fresh]

so why is getting in your way so strange? look at Counter Strike for instance, where live people get in your way in a firefight! hehe, it's quite funny to head shoot two teammates, not intentionaly of course! for that door issue, you can always order them to move or let them wait somewhere while you scout ahead! it happend lots of times in HL1, but never really bothered me!

When they stand in a doorway and you get too close they automatically move. It's not a big dead

 

[InnerDemon]

Thanks for the information and the backup. I really was just curious as to the A.I. strengths.
But obviously I was holding the wrong end of the stick and look even more forward to playing. Only 29 days left. x .x

 

[madog]

The AI is not quck enuf to react

 

[BRODIEMAN2k4]

AI improves depending on what dificulty you have it on

Yeah, maybe the people who made the binks just played it on the easiest setting


It wouldnt look to good if you die in the middle of the video (Even though they kinda did in the strider one)

 

[DigitalAssassin]

Yeah, maybe the people who made the binks just played it on the easiest setting


It wouldnt look to good if you die in the middle of the video (Even though they kinda did in the strider one)

That was done on purpose. And we've seen in other ones that you don't necessarily die, your ears ring and your screen blanks for a second. (Yes, you lose a lot of heath).

 

[UmbrellaMaster]

One thing about AI is no matter how smart you make it, if you're running around on God mode like the Valve employees, there's nothing it can do to stop you. Most videos I saw hardly gave the combine enough time to flank or stop Gordon at all. The one time they did have time, (Coast video) Gordon hid behind a wall for a second and around the wall came a grenade... which he promptly picked up with the grav gun and threw back.

Looks to me like the AI is going to be about the same if not a bit better than HL1. Here's for hoping that the AI has multiple things it'll do under situations built into it like Valve said it does year ago. Not very descriptive, but yeah, here's to hoping.