Half-Life2, Your IP Address and the DMCA

[pHATE1982]

Oh, and bittorrent is GREAT for new releases.

Especially if you are a member of a private BT forum which isn't full of leechers.

Anyway, my point is, all these networks havn't been targetted.


p.s edonkey/emule network isn't just for kids. Its great for old stuff. Gotta admit it's crappy for new stuff though...

 

[pHATE1982]

"Don't tell people to install garbage like Peer-Guardian. You are mis-guided, and mis-guiding others as well. This "program" of yours wont help you on P2P networks. Even a firewall. Please don't make me explain it, because you know I will."

It does work on some P2P networks actually. Especially bittorrent (which is where most people are getting this beta from... thats why i mentioned it)

 

[Gunner]

Originally posted by sPaG
Wazi, while I respect your opinion, that was not the intent at all. I am so sick and tired of all the uneducated, ignorant, flaming posts all over these boards. I wrote a novel.. sure, but is that what it will take to help people 'understand'?

I am not proclaiming i'm intelligent or better than anyone. Only those that think they are completely invulnerable to the world (childish mentality) and those who make comments about issues where they have no leg AND ground to stand on.

I gave you all facts. I gave you all links and information to read. I did my research, did you do yours? I'm not unsure of myself.. I have nothing to prove to myself. I am comfortable with what I know.

But thanks for expressing your opinion. It IS valued.

Hey buddy you basically took my post and spat the same stuff out. And what's with the "kid" thing? does it make you feel tough? Anyway you seem to have a problem with the whole beta issue, allow me to take a pompous style of writing and lecture you for a minute:

I don't give a hoot about their laws, they could trace the IP just LIKE I SAID IN MY ORIGINAL POST but what the hell can they do with it? absolutely NOTHING. VALVE can NOT do a god-damn thing about it. You don't get this do you? you're so mindnubbingly stupid you could almost qualify for the short-bus.

 

[Gunner]

Originally posted by sPaG
It sure would be nice to see the look on your face when you were officially taken to court by VALVe, and saw I was right. But that probably wont happen.

Oh and by the way we live in a different world. I'm in France, and the goverment here doesn't give a **** about software piracy. So the RIAA and your DMCA will never reach the other side of the Atlantic.

 

[Wilson502]

u realize valve is prolly putting their effort on getting the hacker that stole the stuff, and the major distributors,

 

[sPaG]

Do I need to quote you again?
And maybe you should follow the news.. I am not proficient in law but companies in Israel are being nailed now.. and they are clear around the world. How or why this happened, I don't have the foggiest. I'm sure only a very few people know.

My post was directed right at you. An ignorant, clueless child. Does it make me feel tough? No, I am making sure you get what you deserve..

Recognition for being an idiot.

Again, your opinions are "baseless" with no facts what-so-ever. I provided you with backed up proof that it is possible (and happening) to get get your personal information from an IP. You make a strong argument about being overseas... but don't kid yourself.

Shit happens.

 

[jb2002smg]

If the Beta did send information such as IP, etc. Any information gained by Valve would be inadmissible in a court of law. While the user may have illegally obtained the beta, any information obtained from the users computer would be done so without their knowledge or consent. This is the electronic equivalent of wiretapping without a warrant.

Yes stealing the beta is wrong but if valve is logging IP's via HL2 (A VERY UNLIKELY, and UNFOUNDED RUMOR) in hopes of prosecuting, they will have sunk to the level of those who stole their information to begin with.

 

[EinsteinsBrain]

I like spag's post it seems insightful.

Somone a few posts up stated that they will simply get a new IP number. I doubt this will help. They can simply use the IP number obtained together with the date/time and your ISP will be able to track you.

I am sure there are ways to fake an IP number but that need to be set-up before hand and not after the fact.

 

[FriScho]

The day the lawsuit starts, the ppl will already have bought the offical version

 

[Gunner]

Again with the "kid" thing...

Listen, I'm probably older than you since at least I have the decency to post the correct info in my profile, you should at least show me some respect. And I think I know the law better here than you would since I live here. Israel is not France. Europe doesn't give a **** about your laws and don't give me that Interpol crap because that's nonsense. The rare occasions when US authorities work with foreign police on cyber-crime is on pedoephilia cases.

And by the way you provided no proof to backup your claims, all you did was copy/paste an article.

I'm not even sure what the whole point of this thread is: to let people know that they can be prosecuted for possession of illegally obtained software? "OMFG" stop the press! You taught me so much! Gee gosh I guess I'll uninstall Kazaa right away!

Hah! Eat me you mongoloid!

 

[sPaG]

Originally posted by jb2002smg
If the Beta did send information such as IP, etc. Any information gained by Valve would be inadmissible in a court of law. While the user may have illegally obtained the beta, any information obtained from the users computer would be done so without their knowledge or consent. This is the electronic equivalent of wiretapping without a warrant.

Good points but there are some faults in your reasoning.
For one, the evidence wouldn't be inadmissable in the court of the law. VALVe would be required to prove the game wasn't officially out, (which is very easy at this point in time) and that an IP from so-and-so officially acquired the game. (If it's true Half-Life2 is already broadcasting data packets to steam) No company, including VALVe would be obtaining information from your computer but a simple IP address.

Now, the interesting thing you bring up is the equivalent of wiretapping without a warrant.. and this is what makes the DMCA so politically "incorrect". Essentially, the RIAA has more power than the FBI using the "DMCA Clause" to invade your privacy, force info out of your ISP, take you to court, and charge you with theft. That is exactly why this is causing such a stir in the music industry abroad.

 

[Wilson502]

thats why i deleted it and ur right jb2002 i forgot that it would be thrown out of court because of illegal means of obtaining information

 

[pHATE1982]

eVo has a point.

The English police have a big enough problem working with the Scottish police on Peadophile cases, because they all have slightly different laws. I hardley think the UK is suddenly gonna let a bunch of loud mouthed yank mavericks come in guns a blazing over a few "borrowed" files.

 

[Stryyder]

Originally posted by jb2002smg
If the Beta did send information such as IP, etc. Any information gained by Valve would be inadmissible in a court of law. While the user may have illegally obtained the beta, any information obtained from the users computer would be done so without their knowledge or consent. This is the electronic equivalent of wiretapping without a warrant.

Yes stealing the beta is wrong but if valve is logging IP's via HL2 (A VERY UNLIKELY, and UNFOUNDED RUMOR) in hopes of prosecuting, they will have sunk to the level of those who stole their information to begin with.

Actually you are wrong and there is case law to support that you are wrong about that.

Using the stolen software offers no protection nor should the user expect any protections therfor any information provided by the illegal use of the software would be allowed.

The FBI does this all the time they offer bandwidth to 0-day sights under the guise of being a warez dude, they track the IP addresses of the traffic on the bandwidth they provide to lead them where the content is. They make arressts and get convictions from this information.

 

[sPaG]

Originally posted by )[eVo]( Para

And by the way you provided no proof to backup your claims, all you did was copy/paste an article.

I wrote that entire thread just for your ignorance. I provided links to the DMCA for your viewing pleasure. Here you go again, with your flaming.. so who looks older? Me or you? Who provided more information with backed up facts? Me or you? Besides living France and calling me a "mongoloid" (rofl).. what have you provided?

I rest my case.

 

[pHATE1982]

Both of you have raised points with mistakes...

You are just more argumentative sPaG.

eVo's only mistake was rising to it.

 

[pyro]

If valve goes against the people who play it, it goes against their buyers, and against any profit.

 

[sPaG]

No, No.. he does make one good point. And I gave him credit for that.
He's in France.. and well, not a lot can be done. If he was downloading illegal "music" on a P2P network, the RIAA would have to roll over.

But the point of the thread wasn't about arguing between countries, more so about whether or not your IP was useless and "anonymous" like Evo spat in his post. I quoted it, you saw it, enough said.

I, however, am willing to argue. Maturely. Don't act like a child and start flame wars. Make your argument, hit me with facts, and I am a great guy to talk with. I promise.

 

[Gunner]

Rest your case? what case? are you dumb? this isn't a court of law! lol!

Anyway we could sit here and play the "you-quote-me-I-quote-you" game but I don't have the time. I have a life and I've wasted enough time reading your nonsense.

 

[pHATE1982]

You can do alot of stuff to keep your IP safe... Peer gaurdian is effective for this to a point.

But simple, common-a-garden users like us DO NOT have anything to worry about. Does everyone at least agree on that?

We are not the big fish in the sea of illegal downloads.

 

[shermen]

do you relly think that valve r going to spend $$$ to find some 13 yrs old kid playing the leak? (who is probebly a big fan of hl2 and counting the days) that beta version is probebly crap anyway.... so i do know one thing that kid is going to buy hl2 anyway and so will the rest of the fans...
and if you dont mind i would like to tell you all why all this sh*t is happening:
delay... think about it if valve wouldn't be greedy and relese hl2 in the first relese date(that if they did have the game redy yet...) non of this would have happened. but since they probrbly thought about the money before they thought about their fans....
i'm not saying that they deserve it but also keeping the source code on a net connected computer?! i'm not surprised all of this happend + gabe said that he saw that his computer was "acting wierd".... right than he should shut down all of valves computers and find out what happend....
thats my opinin anyway so dont judge me...

 

[sPaG]

You chose to join in. Don't blame me for that one. You wasted your own time then. I rest my case yes. I posed an argument with facts to back it up.. all you could argue was "you are dumb", "mongoloid", and "i'm french". Ok, good for you! I'm so proud of you!

Anyway, i'm all for a mature argument. But you need maturity and wisdom for that. You don't appear to have any. But good luck, have fun with HL2, and I really do wish you the best in life.

 

[inevident]

ok I'll be the jury.. umm... I find you innocent ! YES ! bye bye

 

[Necro]

i understand getting the leaker, but the thousands and thousands of eager fans who just want a sneak peak? naa.

 

[Benji]

there is an interesting read about this very subject here :

click here

 

[sPaG]

Good read, Benji. Thanks for the post!

 

[Tlaloc]

interesting article... puts things in perspective -- real nice

 

[kidrock540]

Originally posted by shermen
do you relly think that valve r going to spend $$$ to find some 13 yrs old kid playing the leak? (who is probebly a big fan of hl2 and counting the days) that beta version is probebly crap anyway.... so i do know one thing that kid is going to buy hl2 anyway and so will the rest of the fans...
and if you dont mind i would like to tell you all why all this sh*t is happening:
delay... think about it if valve wouldn't be greedy and relese hl2 in the first relese date(that if they did have the game redy yet...) non of this would have happened. but since they probrbly thought about the money before they thought about their fans....
i'm not saying that they deserve it but also keeping the source code on a net connected computer?! i'm not surprised all of this happend + gabe said that he saw that his computer was "acting wierd".... right than he should shut down all of valves computers and find out what happend....
thats my opinin anyway so dont judge me...

AGREED

 

[Jaspion]

Even a kid can use Zone Alarm or any other FW to block any outgoing net connection...

 

[DeathMark]

Ip's are easily found. Even the forum admins here can access your IP. How else would they ban you.

EDIT: A lot of servers track your IP as well and the vast majority of them don't inform you of this. I think Steam might also be able to track your IP. I can't confirm this but i'm pretty sure.

 

[unsane]

Originally posted by )[eVo]( Para
Europe doesn't give a **** about your laws...

Depends on where you are.
I live in Denmark, and we have the Anti Piracy Group; a bunch of lawyers who has made a career out of nailing schoolkids at LAN parties for the last 10-15 years or so. They'd *love* something like this. They show up in press making random threats now and then, and have recently tried to force ISP's to give out information on customers 'on the fly', so to speak. Needless to say, the ISP's weren't too happy about that :afro:

 

[Mr. Redundant]

sPaG, no offense but why do you feel the need to validate your point by trying to shoot someone you dont even know down?

if I were you, (and if you were an intelligent mature individual with an interesting point to convey) I wouldnt need to "debate" or contrast my point against someone elses.. let alone create an entire thread that starts off by attacking another person's views.

I hear your point, its quite valid. but you handled it in an utterly immature fashion.. if you wanted to have an open debate, you should have pmed Evo. You destroy the validitidy of your point by attacking someone else.

and seriously guys, it just comes down to "whats done is done" if you were gonna get the beta, you would. If there are consequences theres no beating around the bush or rationalizing "I was going to buy it anyway" since thats not the point.. the point is you shouldnt have it now, thats theft. plain and simple.
but thats their business, no need to be self righteous, no need to put anyone down, live and let live.

 

[Gunner]

Thank you Mr. Redundant; my abusive reaction was provoked by this 78 year old software programmer.

In his first post he clearly said that I am an "ignorant [...] kid [who makes] stupid assumptions". Now I'm not a master-debater but that's obviously a flame-bait.

 

[pakotlar]

Originally posted by sPaG
Another ignorant poster. Re-read my post. It is legally within their bounds to do it. Do I think they will? No.

Get the facts straight kid.

U are a stupid bastard. And stop calling everyone "kid". Why do you have to be so condescending? No, Valve is not going to be able to do anything with your IP address, and the RIAA is NOT losing money due to file trading. Cd sales have been declining due to outrageous prices. Don't you suppose that the recent lawsuits on downloaders have curtailed downloading? I do. Then where is the data that correlates between the decline of file sharing and rise of cd sales? There is none. So get your facts straight ki... No I won't go there :afro: Oh and btw do you think the artist is suffering off of declining cd sales? Yes? Then how about giving the artist more than 1 dollar/cd?