I have a theory on the source code leak (stolen)

[dream431ca]

This is just my opinion and I don't care if you :flame: :flame: :flame: flame :flame: :flame: :flame: me for it. Some people may not like what I say (or you read) so here it goes:

In MY opinion if not for the stolen source code HL2 may not be as good as it is today. I am NOT Praising the theft or anything like that..What I am saying is because of the the source code theft Valve had to re-write some of the code and by doing so..could have improved the game. I read some time ago a interview with a valve employee and the date was Oct. 28th 2003..after the source code theft. I remember reading that the people at valve improved the physics system alot compared to in the past..(E3 2003). By re-writting some of the source code, they also decreased the possibility of hackers, hacking into the game..even for the people who look at the stolen (old) source code.

I truly believe that Valve improved the game drastically after the source code theft...I did not want the theft to occur, but there is always a bright side to everything and this is the bright side I see with the theft.

Remember this is MY opinion and you didn't have to read this or (for some of you) to not take my opinion too seriously.

 

[P43.2/1Gig/X800P]

This is just my opinion and I don't care if you :flame: :flame: :flame: flame :flame: :flame: :flame: me for it. Some people may not like what I say (or you read) so here it goes:

In MY opinion if not for the stolen source code HL2 may not be as good as it is today. I am NOT Praising the theft or anything like that..What I am saying is because of the the source code theft Valve had to re-write some of the code and by doing so..could have improved the game. I read some time ago a interview with a valve employee and the date was Oct. 28th 2003..after the source code theft. I remember reading that the people at valve improved the physics system alot compared to in the past..(E3 2003). By re-writting some of the source code, they also decreased the possibility of hackers, hacking into the game..even for the people who look at the stolen (old) source code.

I truly believe that Valve improved the game drastically after the source code theft...I did not want the theft to occur, but there is always a bright side to everything and this is the bright side I see with the theft.

Remember this is MY opinion and you didn't have to read this or (for some of you) to not take my opinion too seriously.

I agree Never thought about that thanks it was worth the wait

 

[koopa]

I think you're probably right (we don't know how much, if at all, the theft was used as cover for extra development time). I still don't know how much source code was stolen (physics SDK? renderer? AI?) though.

 

[Feath]

This is just my opinion and I don't care if you :flame: :flame: :flame: flame :flame: :flame: :flame: me for it. Some people may not like what I say (or you read) so here it goes:

In MY opinion if not for the stolen source code HL2 may not be as good as it is today. I am NOT Praising the theft or anything like that..What I am saying is because of the the source code theft Valve had to re-write some of the code and by doing so..could have improved the game. I read some time ago a interview with a valve employee and the date was Oct. 28th 2003..after the source code theft. I remember reading that the people at valve improved the physics system alot compared to in the past..(E3 2003). By re-writting some of the source code, they also decreased the possibility of hackers, hacking into the game..even for the people who look at the stolen (old) source code.

I truly believe that Valve improved the game drastically after the source code theft...I did not want the theft to occur, but there is always a bright side to everything and this is the bright side I see with the theft.

Remember this is MY opinion and you didn't have to read this or (for some of you) to not take my opinion too seriously.

I disagree. Valve are famous for spending a large amount of time on games despite whatever deadlines they have. Any changes that have occurred in the last year probably would've been made anyway, due to Valves extensive testing process. And the game would've come out sooner.

This theft has no bright side.

 

[MoD]

It's just lke people saying if it wasn't for the holocaust (no basis for comparison of course) there was no state of Israel. I'd rather not having a state of israel if that was the matter.

 

[Feath]

It's just lke people saying if it wasn't for the holocaust (no basis for comparison of course) there was no state of Israel. I'd rather not having a state of israel if that was the matter.

Slight difference in seriousness of the theft and the Holocaust, but I get your point.

 

[MoD]

I really should start using less extreme examples

 

[RooM]

well lets say we wouldnt have the source converted games like CS and HL ...

 

[Hectic Glenn]

What?

(Welcome to the forums!)

 

[koopa]

well lets say we wouldnt have the source converted games like CS and HL ...

I thought that CS:S was with the leak, so odds are it would have been completed anyway. Likewise, I think HL:S was finished a long time ago.

 

[RooM]

koopa i think HL:S still isnt finished and CSS wasnt in beta :O
it was only showed during e32k4

What?

(Welcome to the forums!)

oh thx :]

 

[koopa]

koopa i think HL:S still isnt finished and CSS wasnt in beta :O
it was only showed during e32k4

If HL:S isn't finished, you'd wonder what on earth is taking them so long. They were showing screenies from it months ago, so surely it's finished by now. Then again, this is Valve, so maybe they put the source code somewhere and a dog ran off with it and now they can't find the backup and it made Gabe cry, or something.

Edit:I've no idea whether I'm right or wrong about CSS/etc being with the leak now. Waiting for more opinions!

Iced_Eagle:Usually when you lose code (as someone who's been there too many times) you write it a lot faster the 2nd time, since you have a better understanding of what works and what doesn't.

 

[Iced_Eagle]

Yup I remember people saying that CS:S was in the leak. I don' think that HL:S was though.

I agree with you. Although I would have preferred another way than the leak, them patching everything up is good, however you must keep in mind that when the programmers were first programming the game (before the leak) they were doing everything as best as they could, so after the leak, they had to redo it, and probably had a bitch of a time re-writing some code as they already tried really hard the first time and now they had to produce the same or better effects a second time.

I hope the engine will have less flaws though Well, once VAC 2.0 is released that is... Right now the hacking scene is already spreading in CS:S

 

[mattgirv]

I remember one of the VALVe team members mentioning that the leak had made them work even harder, as they then had more to prove (after a lot of people had seen HL2 content)

edit: yes HL:S was also with the leak.

 

[RooM]

we would need another hack for CSS hitboxes rofl

 

[jonnyapps]

This is just my opinion and I don't care if you :flame: :flame: :flame: flame :flame: :flame: :flame: me for it. Some people may not like what I say (or you read) so here it goes:

In MY opinion if not for the stolen source code HL2 may not be as good as it is today. I am NOT Praising the theft or anything like that..What I am saying is because of the the source code theft Valve had to re-write some of the code and by doing so..could have improved the game. I read some time ago a interview with a valve employee and the date was Oct. 28th 2003..after the source code theft. I remember reading that the people at valve improved the physics system alot compared to in the past..(E3 2003). By re-writting some of the source code, they also decreased the possibility of hackers, hacking into the game..even for the people who look at the stolen (old) source code.

I truly believe that Valve improved the game drastically after the source code theft...I did not want the theft to occur, but there is always a bright side to everything and this is the bright side I see with the theft.

Remember this is MY opinion and you didn't have to read this or (for some of you) to not take my opinion too seriously.

i think you're right but it's an obvious statement.
we could've delayed going to the moon by ten years and eventually got there quicker. delay anything and technology'll help us eventually. i'd've preferred not to have the leak and have had hl2 released to a more welcoming and less judging crowd and then let modding and updates carry us further

 

[iamaelephant]

The game wasn't even close to finished when the source code was leaked, so of course it has been improved.

 

[muka3d]

I agree. Being a programmer myself, I have discovered from experience that starting code from scratch always produces a better product. You have already got the logic part thought through, churned out some code that does everything well, but being human, we make errors. Code is rarely perfect, unless the program is extremely simple. There is pretty much always room for improvement. And starting over is the best way to maximize your code's efficiency and stability.

 

[Neutrino]

This is just my opinion and I don't care if you :flame: :flame: :flame: flame :flame: :flame: :flame: me for it. Some people may not like what I say (or you read) so here it goes:

In MY opinion if not for the stolen source code HL2 may not be as good as it is today. I am NOT Praising the theft or anything like that..What I am saying is because of the the source code theft Valve had to re-write some of the code and by doing so..could have improved the game. I read some time ago a interview with a valve employee and the date was Oct. 28th 2003..after the source code theft. I remember reading that the people at valve improved the physics system alot compared to in the past..(E3 2003). By re-writting some of the source code, they also decreased the possibility of hackers, hacking into the game..even for the people who look at the stolen (old) source code.

I truly believe that Valve improved the game drastically after the source code theft...I did not want the theft to occur, but there is always a bright side to everything and this is the bright side I see with the theft.

Remember this is MY opinion and you didn't have to read this or (for some of you) to not take my opinion too seriously.

Sure they improved it more over the last year, but I don't see what the theft had to do with it. Fact was they just were no where near completing the game last year. So of course it's going to improve some in the last year of production. The theft had very little to do with the delay so I don't think it was responsible for any improvements.

The game wasn't even close to finished when the source code was leaked, so of course it has been improved.

Edit: Ya, what he said.

 

[Asuka]

I agree. If it wasnt for the stolen build game would probably be out already. Wont look as good etc.

 

[groovy]

I know friends that are playing CS:S online, but without cdkeys... they don't even need them. Valve haven't got a clue, and steam is pathetic and keeping cheats out when the program itself gets hacked.

 

[cadaveca]

I disagree. Valve are famous for spending a large amount of time on games despite whatever deadlines they have. Any changes that have occurred in the last year probably would've been made anyway, due to Valves extensive testing process. And the game would've come out sooner.

This theft has no bright side.

yeha, a year ago there woulda been PS2.0...

 

[TheOriginalEvil]

Without periodic rebellion that fail, governments would never evolve and get better.

 

[GWalker]

I think you're probably right (we don't know how much, if at all, the theft was used as cover for extra development time). I still don't know how much source code was stolen (physics SDK? renderer? AI?) though.

I read somewhere that it was the full HL2 code (some playable levels) with the tools they used and it was about 4GB. They are only now working on the SKD tools as we will come to know.

 

[Tropico]

Maybe the reason why there is no real multiplayer in HL2 and in Vampire Bloodlines for that matter is that the code is not ready for multiplayer or isnt secure enough

 

[cadaveca]

Maybe the reason why there is no real multiplayer in HL2 and in Vampire Bloodlines for that matter is that the code is not ready for multiplayer or isnt secure enough

server-side physics are too demanding for current systems. the Source is way ahead of it's time...should be good for about 10 years, before a major rewrite, i think.

 

[ukfluke]

i disagree, the source code theft didnt stop the game being finished becuase the game was nowhere near done anyways. Theft or not it still wouldnt have been out before now.

 

[Feath]

i disagree, the source code theft didnt stop the game being finished becuase the game was nowhere near done anyways. Theft or not it still wouldnt have been out before now.

Yes it would, because the Source code theft had effects on the teams morale (and very little work was done in the weeks/months following it). Also, they had to re-write some of the code. I do believe it would be out now.

 

[Feath]

Maybe the reason why there is no real multiplayer in HL2 and in Vampire Bloodlines for that matter is that the code is not ready for multiplayer or isnt secure enough

If that was the case, CS: Source wouldn't exist.

 

[ukfluke]

ok the moral thing set them back a couple of months. but still it wasnt going to be out sept 2003 ;p

 

[RooM]

cs source doesnt use at all the havok : on a german vid wez saw a guy pusinhg a table to block a door on italy : if you try you cant -> sucky bstrd

 

[Feath]

ok the moral thing set them back a couple of months. but still it wasnt going to be out sept 2003 ;p

But it would be out by now.

 

[Varsity]

If the game was released last year, it would still be like it is in it's unreleased state today. We would just have had access to it earlier.