**** labor unions. (Flamethrower video)

Solaris said:
So? I don't care if some fat cat only gets 10million instead of 20. I'm intrested in the welfare of societys poor.
Click to expand...

I'd see your point, except that society's poor are doing somethiing very violent and detestable.
 
The working class aren't exactly "oppressed". There's such a thing as universal suffrage in South Korea. Everyone in South Korea, as far as I know, gets to vote as soon as they turn 19. Every one of those votes has equal weighting. Every one of those "oppressed" working class people has the oppertunity to vote for the government they want.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Angry Lawyer said:
The working class aren't exactly "oppressed". There's such a thing as universal suffrage in South Korea. Everyone in South Korea, as far as I know, gets to vote as soon as they turn 19. Every one of those votes has equal weighting. Every one of those "oppressed" working class people has the oppertunity to vote for the government they want.

-Angry Lawyer
Click to expand...

Shhhhhhhh
ssh.gif

Logic is bad.
Quick let's hate the government!
HATEHATEHATEHATE!
 
Seems solaris is completely misunderstood on how SOUTH korea works.
 
I don't think you could ever justify a flamethrower as self defence.

Unless the police were Nazis, firing off Uzis everywhere.

South Korean workers aren't living in sub-standard conditions, as far as I'm aware. No, South Korean workers are taking their vacations in Hawaii, Europe, etc.
 
Seems solaris is completely misunderstood on how SOUTH korea works.
Click to expand...

Actually, he's kinda correct.

NORTH Korea is a workers paradise. They all get teh ssame amount of money, and starve all together, except for the more equal ones.


SOUTH Korea is a capitalist paradise. Free trade and innovation is the key to prosperity. However, some people think that they don't get what they deserve, and form 'unions'. Those 'unions' go around and strike every year, demanding more pay. Of course, if the company refuses, they grab their iron sticks. Then the Combat Police Divisions came in and try to stop them from destroying stuff.

Bam.

Full clash. Street warfare. The Union members get way more money than other workers because they intimidate users to give them more pay.
 
like a freakin mantra numbers ...go tell child laborours the world wide why Unions arent important. Go tell pregnant mothers that they have to go back to dangerous work (while pregnant) for the "good of the company"


unions are effective at the best of times and detrimental at the worst times ...there is no either or
 
15357 said:
Actually, he's kinda correct.

NORTH Korea is a workers paradise. They all get teh ssame amount of money, and starve all together, except for the more equal ones.


SOUTH Korea is a capitalist paradise. Free trade and innovation is the key to prosperity. However, some people think that they don't get what they deserve, and form 'unions'. Those 'unions' go around and strike every year, demanding more pay. Of course, if the company refuses, they grab their iron sticks. Then the Combat Police Divisions came in and try to stop them from destroying stuff.

Bam.

Full clash. Street warfare. The Union members get way more money than other workers because they intimidate users to give them more pay.
Click to expand...

I was pointing towards more of Solaris thinking of South citizens being mistreated.
 
15357 said:
SOUTH Korea is a capitalist paradise. Free trade and innovation is the key to prosperity. However, some people think that they don't get what they deserve, and form 'unions'. Those 'unions' go around and strike every year, demanding more pay. Of course, if the company refuses, they grab their iron sticks.
Click to expand...

That's where the story differs from what most of us are used to. I'm part of a union at the grocery store I work at. Last year when they were in talks about pay raises and such there was one day where no one was to work, as part of the strike. However, violence doesn't even enter the mind of anyone. No one would ever grap iron sticks or any other weapon and attack the police.. Who have absolutely nothing to do with it at all.

It's just a bit hard for some of us to grasp I guess.
 
15357 said:
Actually, he's kinda correct.
Click to expand...

His mistaking South Korea for North Korea.

15357 said:
NORTH Korea is a workers paradise. They all get teh ssame amount of money, and starve all together, except for the more equal ones.
Click to expand...

Yeah I know all about the more equal ones. My parents had to live through shit like that.


15357 said:
However, some people think that they don't get what they deserve, and form 'unions'. Those 'unions' go around and strike every year, demanding more pay. Of course, if the company refuses, they grab their iron sticks. Then the Combat Police Divisions came in and try to stop them from destroying stuff.
Click to expand...

Like I said before that's exactly what happened here. The miners in my town were spending all their money on booze and now they were demanding more money (like they weren't being payed enough already:rolleyes: ). After that they went on a rampage all the way to Bucharest destroying public property and looting houses on the way. The police were sent to stop them but they weren't allowed to use deadly force so many were badly injured and some killed. The miners didn't only beat up police officers but also innocent bystanders, you could get killed just by being outside. I wish Solaris could've been here for that shit maybe then he would stop with the stupid support for violence.
 
I was pointing towards more of Solaris thinking of South citizens being mistreated.
Click to expand...

Ah, k.

like a freakin mantra numbers ...go tell child laborours the world wide why Unions arent important. Go tell pregnant mothers that they have to go back to dangerous work (while pregnant) for the "good of the company"


unions are effective at the best of times and detrimental at the worst times ...there is no either or
Click to expand...

Making children work is illegal. Making pregnant women work is illegal. I respect the laws. However, I don't see what unions have to do with this.

Unions are effective as well as detrimental, no matter the time.

That's where the story differs from what most of us are used to. I'm part of a union at the grocery store I work at. Last year when they were in talks about pay raises and such there was one day where no one was to work, as part of the strike. However, violence doesn't even enter the mind of anyone. No one would ever grap iron sticks or any other weapon and attack the police.. Who have absolutely nothing to do with it at all.

It's just a bit hard for some of us to grasp I guess.
Click to expand...

We're extreme, I guess.

Like I said before that's exactly what happened here. The miners in my town were spending all their money on booze and now they were demanding more money (like they weren't being payed enough already ). After that they went on a rampage all the way to Bucharest destroying public property and looting houses on the way. The police were sent to stop them but they weren't allowed to use deadly force so many were badly injured and some killed. The miners didn't only beat up police officers but also innocent bystanders, you could get killed just by being outside. I wish Solaris could've been here for that shit maybe then he would stop with the stupid support for violence.
Click to expand...

Woah. Our unions only beat up the police.

Yeah I know all about the more equal ones. My parents had to live through shit like that.
Click to expand...

Poor guys.

I researched Romania a bit, and it seems that you had a revolution against (forgot name). The army turned on him and his Securitate, and shot him 230+ times.

He must have been really evil.
 
15357 said:
Ah, k.



Making children work is illegal. Making pregnant women work is illegal. I respect the laws. However, I don't see what unions have to do with this.
Click to expand...

there was a time when it wasnt illegal ..Unions have pretty much created workers rights ..without unions exploitation is inevitable
 
CptStern said:
there was a time when it wasnt illegal ..Unions have pretty much created workers rights ..without unions exploitation is inevitable
Click to expand...

Well, I guess you're right on that.
 
Nothing wrong with Unions, or any other organised protest.

But there's no excuse for violent thugery.
 
Exactly. Even if they were using clubs or something to defend themselves, I might have a little pity. But flamethrowers? That's crossing the line. And then shitting all over it.
 
15357 said:
Poor guys.

I researched Romania a bit, and it seems that you had a revolution against (forgot name). The army turned on him and his Securitate, and shot him 230+ times.

He must have been really evil.
Click to expand...

They killed him on Christmas Day. "Marry Christmas you filthy animal":P
No, I don't think he was evil. He was so retarded that he honestly thought he was doing what was right and was shocked when the revolution started. I was only 3 years old when that happened.
 
Aye. Nicolae Ceausescu. I went to Romania when I was six (to adopt my younger brother) and the state of the place impacted me to this day. I mean, here's Ceaucescu's palace, enormous and grand, and then every building around it is full of 15-year-old bullet holes. Crazy.
 
Situation over. 130 arrests. 2,500 got away though.

$200 million profit loss.

21074532393_61000040.jpg
 
I don't care about the profits... I care about people getting hurt, whether police, or rioters.
 
3 officers, 3rd degree burns to the hands/arms
15 officers, 2nd ~ 1st degree burns
15 officers, moderate cuts on faces/body

Unknown number for union members.


Damn it. I lost a lot on that Posco stock. :/
 
Taking over private property and occupying buildings is not striking. These were criminal acts.

Solaris I'll take off my avatar given your PM's if it 'offends you so badly' as soon as you remove the avatar of the child killer.
 
He never killed children.

And,
The union was attacked by the police officers after the workers tried to cease hold of the tools of production as marxism demands. I have no problem with that, the police came in trying to hand over these machines back to the rich and the workers fought back.

Seems like these unions of your's numbers are pretty revolutionary, I applaud them and am going to write into socialist worker about it.
 
Wait... that avatar offends Solaris? Why is he always bashing christianity then? Or is another one of those complete and total lopsided situations of his?
 
Raziaar said:
Wait... that avatar offends Solaris? Why is he always bashing christianity then? Or is another one of those complete and total lopsided situations of his?
Click to expand...
It doesn't directly offend me.
Just having an avatar drawn and published by complete biggots that offends all Muslim people is disgusting. It's like having an avatar of a jew hoarding money or something...
 
Or all those "Jesus lol" images and the other various more offensive things out there you're always laughing at? You need to lighten up... free expression exists, no matter how much you wish to quash it.

And for the record, I find many of those "jesus lol" things funny.


You praise the torching of human beings with flamethrowers... yet you're aghast at a drawing? My god man, where are your priorities in life!
 
Raziaar said:
Or all those "Jesus lol" images and the other various more offensive things out there you're always laughing at? You need to lighten up... free expression exists, no matter how much you wish to quash it.

And for the record, I find many of those "jesus lol" things funny.
Click to expand...
Me too, but they arn't suggesting that all christians are lols.
 
Solaris said:
He never killed children.
Click to expand...
Yes, he did.
A Cuban gentleman named Pierre San Martin was also among those jailed by the gallant Che. A few years ago he recalled the horrors in a El Nuevo Herald article. "32 of us were crammed into a cell" he recalls. "16 of us would stand while the other sixteen tried to sleep on the cold filthy floor. We took shifts that way. Actually, we considered ourselves lucky. After all, we were alive. Dozens were led from the cells to the firing squad daily. The volleys kept us awake. We felt that any one of those minutes would be our last."

"One morning the horrible sound of that rusty steel door swinging open startled us awake and Che's guards shoved a new prisoner into our cell. His face was bruised and smeared with blood. We could only gape. He was a boy, couldn't have been much older than 12, maybe 14.

"What did you do?" We asked horrified. "I tried to defend my papa," gasped the bloodied boy. "I tried to keep these Communist sons of b**tches from murdering him! But they sent him to the firing squad."

Soon Che's goons came back, the rusty steel door opened and they yanked the valiant boy out of the cell. "We all rushed to the cell's window that faced the execution pit, " recalls Mr San Martin. "We simply couldn't believe they'd murder him!"

"Then we spotted him, strutting around the blood-drenched execution yard with his hands on his waist and barking orders – the gallant Che Guevara." Here Che was finally in his element. In battle he was a sad joke, a bumbler of epic proportions (for details see Fidel; Hollywood's Favorite Tyrant). But up against disarmed and bloodied boys he was a snarling tiger.

"Kneel Down!" Che barked at the boy.

"ASSASSINS!" We screamed for our window. "MURDERERS!! HOW CAN YOU MURDER A LITTLE BOY!"

" I said: KNEEL DOWN!" Che barked again.

The boy stared Che resolutely in the face. "If you're going to kill me," he yelled. "you'll have to do it while I'm standing! MEN die standing!"

" COWARDS! – MURDERERS!..Sons of B**TCHES!" The men yelled desperately from their cells. "LEAVE HIM ALONE!" HOW CAN...?! "And then we saw Che unholstering his pistol. It didn't seem possible. But Che raised his pistol, put the barrel to the back of the boys neck and blasted. The shot almost decapitated the young boy.

"We erupted. We were enraged, hysterical, banging on the bars. "MURDERERS! – ASSASSINS!" His murder finished, Che finally looked up at us, pointed his pistol, and BLAM!-BLAM-BLAM! emptied his clip in our direction. Several of us were wounded by his shots."
Click to expand...

Solaris said:
And,
The union was attacked by the police officers after the workers tried to cease hold of the tools of production as marxism demands. I have no problem with that, the police came in trying to hand over these machines back to the rich and the workers fought back.
Click to expand...

Then they need to be forced out. Perhaps they should've just handled it Waco style.

Solaris said:
Seems like these unions of your's numbers are pretty revolutionary, I applaud them and am going to write into socialist worker about it.
Click to expand...

You would applaud it. You applaud child killers.
 
Waco?
Surrounding a church and just killing everyone inside?
And got a source for that quote?
 
Solaris said:
Your source is a blog?
Click to expand...
Did you even READ what Paquito D'Rivera said? He's a famous sax players and it's commonly known that he was imprisoned while in Cuba. His cousin was executed there at Che's concentration camp, The Cabana.

That quote is all over and verified by him, you can check it if you want. I assure you I didn't just write that and make it all up in the two seconds since your post. :rolleyes:

You can find it in many more places than just the URL I posted.

BTW, From Wiki, to ruin your sig's quote Solaris how about you put this one on.


According to some soldiers present at the capture, during the skirmish as they approached Guevara, he allegedly shouted, "Do not shoot! I am Che Guevara and worth more to you alive than dead."
 
I don't know why this has gone to Che... but I wanna continue it.

I am curious why Solaris idolizes che... they say he excuted peasants and forced people to work in labor camps, and invented cuba's labor camp which later enslaved gays and AIDS victims, etc.

How is this better than what the US is doing, which you speak so openly against?
 
Whether or not Ernesto Guevara murdered a 14 year old boy isn't important. He murdered dozens of people. Your source sucked, by the way - it's like linking to Protest[censorblock]Warrior as a source about John Kerry. The point is, people do not idolize Che for what he did. Most people who admire him do NOT admire him because his hands are stained with blood or because he helped instate Fidel Castro as a leader of Cuba.

You admire him for his fierce resolve, passion, and spirit. Particularly during his earlier years. I've read two huge biographies on him - and as you all know, I'm a rabid pacifist - so it's his earlier years, the ones the Motorcycle Diaries are based off of, that I particularly care about. It's also that most people don't really know all that much about Che, they just admire the revolutionary spirit he stands for (though that's been bastardized beyond belief by this time).
 
I'd take some of that with a grain of salt ..most of the criticism being leveled at him is from the far right (his enemies) ...it says as much in the wikipedia article that you guys seem to be quoting word for word


oh and Rakurai, careful where you fling mud ...your beloved country has trained/armed/supported death/torture squads that would make Che look like a freaking boyscout ...google Dan mitrione, UNITAS, SAVAK, bolivia's Black Hand, Orden and Ansesal of El Salvador (El Mozote), School of the Americas, guatemala's La Mano Blanco, Haiti's FRAPH, Battalion 3-16 etc etc etc
 
You launch the claim that the people resisting him are on the far right and thus their information not to be trusted? Exiled cubans are the ones with these claims and opinions... and you just write off what they say about him just like that, just because you have your trump card in your mind that says "Conservative = not to be trusted"? How do you know they're far right?

Man...
 
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