New Aftermath Screenshots

[Pi Mu Rho]

Well then you obviously forgot or didn't play System Shock 2, No One Lives Forever 1 & 2, Deus Ex, Far Cry, Call of Duty, Chronicles of Riddick, etc. The list goes on and on.

And those are examples of what? Games that you favour over HL2? That doesn't exactly make it a definitive nor even objective list

Speaking of Far Cry, how can you even compare HL2's static environments to Far Cry's dynamic environments where trees sway in the wind and you can see life everywhere.

Dynamic environments? Swaying in the wind? Boy, were you taken in.

Not to mention the dynamic lighting and shadows, superior AI and open ended gameplay. I've seen many people play HL2 and guess what -- they all played it EXACTLY the same way. Why? Because there is just one way to complete each level. On the other hand, I've seen people play Far Cry and all of them had different approaches to completing a level. Now that's what I call a cohesive and superior gaming experience.

Funny, it's what I call dull and repetitive. It's still as linear as HL2, you just have a little more flexibility in how you go in a straight line from A to B

And HL2's physics are exciting? So you get to throw some barrels around. Yippee... the novelty wore off after 5 minutes. Adds nothing to the gameplay except some stupid and time consuming "lets put the blocks on the ramp" puzzles. Please, if I wanted these kind of puzzles I would play a Disney game geared for 3 year olds.

HL2's physics were an integral part of the gameplay, hence the gravity gun. As a counter to your "physics were done way before HL2", it works remarkably well.

As far as "3-4 year old" look, just play any game based on the Quake 3 engine, or games like NOLF2 or Chaser. HL2 doesn't look much better except for the water effects maybe.

Then you need your eyes or brain testing.

I am not saying the HL2 is bad, but I am not a sucker to media hype either. HL2 is nothing but an average shooter.

Funny, I'm also not a sucker to media hype. My opinion of HL2 comes from my experiences with it.

 

[Hoopla]

oh really
most here seem to think that hl2 is the best fps ever
it must be doing something right

so explain this were all the game reviewers wrong in saying that not only was this game above average it was the best by a good bit?

This should explain it:
http://mirrors-av.club-internet.fr/pub/games/nofrag/halflife2/videos/hl2_nofrag_us.avi

 

[Sulkdodds]

I also didn't say that Aftermath will be 'lame', I said that I guessed that it was the reason for the delay. Read more carefully next time

Yes you did. You said "Valve realized that they have a crappy expansion that will be lame after people just played F.E.A.R and Quake4." How do you know it will be lame if you've never played it? And please, enough of the patronising, trying-to-prove-superioity-with-sarky-sarcasm 'read more carefully' stuff. Okay, I realise that sounded really patronising and sarky, what I just said. Bah!

Well then you obviously forgot or didn't play System Shock 2, No One Lives Forever 1 & 2, Deus Ex, Far Cry, Call of Duty, Chronicles of Riddick, etc. The list goes on and on.

Are these examples of games graphically better than HL2 or examples of games with better physics? None of them actually used physics to the extent that HL2 does (Call of Duty? No One Lives Forever? What? Both great games, but I don't remember any physics in them...). Out of all of those games (barring Riddick which I haven't played - but I never heard anything about the physics in that) only Far Cry actually had believable and not weird physics. And Far Cry, apart from a few instances, didn't really use them to their full effect. There were a few moments where you could shoot chains and drop crates on monsters or mercs but that was usually pretty contrived and that was it. Now don't get me wrong: I love Far Cry. It's an awesome game. I like it as much as HL2. But did it really use its physics to full effect? I don't think so...

Half-Life 2 did the opposite of 'throwing barrels around for the novelty of it'. Even without the manipulator, you can throw crates and use barrels as riot shields and block doorways. I have not played any other game where I could grab a barrel, run backwards using it as a shield, drop it as I run round a corner, pull an explosive barell into position, retreat behind a desk and knock it over, waiting for the enemies to run in and then blow them all up. I have not played any other game where such improvised tactics are possible. Hell, you can throw their grenades back. Even if that was done in DoD, that's got to be worth something.

Isn't it enough that the game provides a completely coherent, believable, in-depth, lifelike world with an amazing story and apcing that's still ahead of most other FPS games out there, introducing new concepts all the time? The turret defence sections? Building bridges on sandtraps? Super gravity gun? The frequency at which they completely flip the gameplay and pace on its head is pretty amazing.

Perhaps HL2's originality lies not so much in individual features but in the way it meshes them all together perfectly to create a game when you never think 'hang on a second, that's not right!'. There are no cracks.

Anyway. That HL2 redefines could be debatable. But this is what you said:

Why the delays anyway? My guess is that the delay happened because Valve realized that they have a crappy expansion that will be lame after people just played F.E.A.R and Quake4. So now they are scrambling back to the drawing board.

So what you're saying is that F.E.A.R. and Quake 4 have changed what people expect from an FPS. That they've moved the goalposts, right? That after they've done their stuff, Aftermath seems crap (much like Quake 2 and Unreal kind of withered when the first HL came out)? So what exactly have they done that's so incredible? And how is Half-Life 2 so backwards in comparison?

As far as "3-4 year old" look, just play any game based on the Quake 3 engine, or games like NOLF2 or Chaser. HL2 doesn't look much better except for the water effects maybe.

Personally, I think these graphics are better than this or this.

Oh yeah: what do you have against linear games anyway?

Of course, as Angry Lawyer said, to each his own. Everyone has their own opinion. /shrug

 

[$kelet0r]

well i'll download it
btw you know that you are trolling - this is a game fan site and while you are entitled to your opinion because democracy rocks, you are being quite belligerent in doing so and doing so in the wrong community
if you want to complain about something you don't do go to the unconverted
tone it down a bit - we like it friendly here

 

[Asknoone]

You know, I loved the first game and I think that HL2 is pretty good too. But I am tired of people treating Valve like they are the lords of the universe. They made two decent games, that's all.

Now Valve delays a game (AGAIN) and everyone is all of a sudden so forgiving. Makes me want to puke.

Why the delays anyway? My guess is that the delay happened because Valve realized that they have a crappy expansion that will be lame after people just played F.E.A.R and Quake4. So now they are scrambling back to the drawing board.

Also, the Lost Cost looks like crap because Source is now an old engine. A little HDR effect won't help it. Textures still look flat, no dynamic lights and shadows, same old cartoonish looking models. The only reason that HL2 looked good was because the level designers and sound effects crew managed to bring life to this bland engine. Amazing work if you ask me. They need to receive a gaming design Oscar.

I'm sure that I'll be flamed by all the fanboys here or even banned for not agreeing with the consensus, but I am just saying it like it is.

Yawn..

 

[$kelet0r]

i fail to see the point of the video - yes the ai(especially the metrocops) is not perfect but is that your only gripe?

if you feel you have played better games than hl2 when then you have experienced something we havent

you have to also understand that we have all played the games you named deus ex, far cry, fear etc. and while they have their merits i can still vouch for hl2 being the more enjoyable sp game

 

[diluted]

Far Cry... dynamic environments? Superior AI? Are we talking about the same game? Far Cry was just as scripted as HL2 was. And as far as superior AI goes, you've got to be kidding. Enemies that can spot you from a mile away when you peek over a rock, enemies that will blindly run into a room to their deaths as you mow them down one by one, enemies that look straight at you but choose to ignore you if the "stealth meter" (or whatever it is) doesn't reach full, enemies that will stand around clueless while you pick them off from afar. No, Far Cry's AI is NOT superior to HL2's. Enemies are definately harder to kill, and more dangerous because it doesn't take much bullets to kill you, but their AI is not superior.

 

[Sulkdodds]

Personally I never experienced any of the stuff in that video. I've barricaded doors before and it's held them off (for a time, at least). O_O

 

[$kelet0r]

same i remember even in lost coast when i picked up a 'shield' with the grav gun having them try and get around it to fire at me, use their melee attack to dislodge it and fired at it

 

[Hoopla]

Are these examples of games graphically better than HL2 or examples of games with better physics?

No, just brilliant gameplay that surpasses HL2 in some cases (IMHO).

Now, I'm sorry if I sound like I am trolling but that's not the purpose. I just think that there needs to be some reality check to the hype that surrounds Valve. Yes, HL2 is a very good game but after 5 years in development I expected more.

It's just ridiculous how everything that Valve dishes out is treated like the second coming when in fact it's mostly not that impressive (see The Lost Coast demo as an example). Are people here so excited about the fact that they have direct communication to the Valve development team that they are afraid to critisize them?

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying these things to be negative; I am saying them because I want more out of Valve. Like a new engine, better and more open gameplay, and innovation instead of sticking to the "safe and proven".

 

[Space Farm]

Hoopla is right, pictures are worth a thousand words. Call of Duty:UO (with Quake3 engine built in 1999)::

http://img462.imageshack.us/img462/1185/coduosp14mg.jpg

http://img462.imageshack.us/img462/9004/coduosp20ex.jpg

So yeah, I'm sorry if the Source engine doesn't impress Hoopla and I.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

I think you're kind of overstating things just a tad there.
It's not exactly using the Quake 3 engine, is it? In fact, it's got a brand new renderer, written just for CoD. It's like saying that HL2 is using the Quake engine, because it reuses parts of it.

 

[^Ben]

Why are you even entertaining the troll?

"kekek I just registered to say that HL2 sux0rz the b0x0rz and far cry is ZOMG TEH OWNAGE!"

 

[Asknoone]

I find it hugely laughable that someone can call Far cry less linear than HL2. Far cry might have larger enviroments, but they aren't as varied. Don't contain as much detail. It also has a bland, horribly acted story and to top it off - very little gameplay variation.

 

[DiSTuRbEd]

So yeah, I'm sorry if the Source engine doesn't impress Hoopla and I.

Yeah source engine is teh shitty!

You try and say tweaked quake 3 engine is better? I laugh in your face.

 

[Hoopla]

"kekek I just registered to say that HL2 sux0rz the b0x0rz and far cry is ZOMG TEH OWNAGE!"

No, you are trolling by posting a comment like that. I am presenting hard facts strong arguments. If that's your best comeback then my point is made.

 

[^Ben]

No, you are trolling by posting a comment like that. I am presenting hard opinions. If that's your best comeback then my point is made.

*

.....

 

[Angry Lawyer]

I am presenting hard facts strong arguments.

Don't you mean hard opinions? Everybody looks for something different in a game. If you don't see what you want in a game, then you don't have to get it. However, you're unlikely to sway the opinions of people on a messageboard devoted to the aformentioned game.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[^Ben]

I'm presenting hard facts.

Half life 2 rules, you do not.

And if you disagree with me, you are wrong. Because i'm presenting "hard facts" thank you.

 

[Hoopla]

I find it hugely laughable that someone can call Far cry less linear than HL2. Far cry might have larger enviroments, but they aren't as varied. Don't contain as much detail. It also has a bland, horribly acted story and to top it off - very little gameplay variation.

What? Environments aren't varied and don't contain as much detail? Are you sure that you played Far Cry? Maybe you should try again because the game oozes with detail.

Now, is Far Cry a point A to point B kind of game? Yes, it is like any other shooter, but at least you are not on a rail and being handheld the entire time. Most of the time you have options to take different routes, use different vehicles, use stealth or go in shooting.

Also, the events are not as scripted and you can control the outcome of some battles. For example, if you shoot a radio then the mercs won't be able to call a helicopter for backup.

I agree that the voice acting sucked in Far Cry and that the story was not all that, but then again, what story is there in HL2? You wake up, shoot some aliens and go back to sleep. No story development or insight to any of the main characters. We know nothing new about Gordon Freeman or the G-Man. Does anyone know what the heck is going on? No. It's Valve's lame attempt to keep you guessing. Does that make for better storytelling? No.

 

[^Ben]

*yawn*

Why are you here? Your not going to sway anybodys opinion, because freankly your opinion is worthless.

 

[Asknoone]

You wake up, shoot some aliens and go back to sleep. No story development or insight to any of the main characters. We know nothing new about Gordon Freeman or the G-Man. Does anyone know what the heck is going on? No. It's Valve's lame attempt to keep you guessing. Does that make for better storytelling? No.

I know exactly whats going on in HL2 - not every fine detail, but what game does shed all of its skins in one go? Its not down to you to determine who knows what and who doesn't. You might be unable to understand, but thats the sad fact that can either immerse yourself in or understand the world of HL2. Its actually Valves innovative attempt to take story telling to the next level.
And in my opinion, its the best out there. Your not presenting an argument, your presenting troll like behavior with a distorted opinion.

Its also sad to think you tried to narrow the game down to about three points. Name me any game, and I'll do it.

 

[^Ben]

Farcry:

Go to an island, shoot bad guys, kill retarded head boss.

End.

 

[Hoopla]

*yawn*

Why are you here? Your not going to sway anybodys opinion, because freankly your opinion is worthless.

I see. So when you cannot counter someone's arguments you call them a troll and just hide in the crowd with everyone's opinion but your own.

Safety in numbers. Brilliant strategy..

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

I see. So when you cannot counter someone's arguments you call them a troll and just hide in the crowd with everyone's opinion but your own.

Safety in numbers. Brilliant strategy..

Because, honestly, you are. And about LC not being impressive? It wasn't meant to be. As many have said so many times " Its a freakin' tech demo".

I have a feeling this is gonna turn into a flame war. :flame: :x

 

[^Ben]

I'm still waiting on the evidence that you don't suck.

And it looks like your also dodging.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Farcry:

Go to an island, shoot bad guys, kill retarded head boss.

End.

End of thread too, I hope.

Listen, Hoopla:
Whatever your boring opinion of the game and whatever tired reasons you might have for complaining, you are in the minority and frankly no-one cares agrees with you except Crisis King, who is irritating in his own right.

Long before the game came out, the board was flooded with maybe fifty people calling DOOM 3 the best game.
Then maybe ten people showed up calling Farcry the best game.
After Half-Life 2 came out, I have seen Five people, maximum declaring another FPS better.
Fear and Quake 4 have both come out, and the declarations have been minimal, if non-existent.

You're not unique in your opinion, and you're free to express it in a way that is civil and mature.
But the one key fact that applies to all the people such as yourself on any forum you can name is that they always go away and they are always forgotten except as abstract memories of childish whining.

Go somewhere you're wanted before you end up remembered.
You don't want to be remembered as the guy who no-one liked.

 

[yadalogo]

End of thread too, I hope.

Listen, Hoopla:
Whatever your boring opinion of the game and whatever tired reasons you might have for complaining, you are in the minority and frankly no-one cares agrees with you except Crisis King, who is irritating in his own right.

Long before the game came out, the board was flooded with maybe fifty people calling DOOM 3 the best game.
Then maybe ten people showed up calling Farcry the best game.
After Half-Life 2 came out, I have seen Five people, maximum declaring another FPS better.
Fear and Quake 4 have both come out, and the declarations have been minimal, if non-existent.

You're not unique in your opinion, and you're free to express it in a way that is civil and mature.
But the one key fact that applies to all the people such as yourself on any forum you can name is that they always go away and they are always forgotten except as abstract memories of childish whining.

Go somewhere you're wanted before you end up remembered.
You don't want to be remembered as the guy who no-one liked.

Pwned

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

Pwned

Truly.

 

[Hoopla]

Pwned

Hardly, I haven't seen one good counter argument or anyone that actually understood what the point of my posts were.

Oh well, good night y'all.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Oh, everyone understood. They just didn't care.

As for counter-arguments, there were many. You just refuse to see them.

 

[Space Farm]

First thing is first. I personally like Half-Life 2. I own the Gold Edition. I've been a member of this forum since May 2004 and I bought HL1 back in 1999. I am a Half-Life fan. But...

What I'm trying to say and what Hoopla was trying to say a couple of pages back is that there are too many people that think Valve are gods, that HL2 is the best game ever made and that the source engine is the most advanced game engine on the planet. None of that is true.

Whenever somebody picks a fault with HL2 or get's annoyed when Valve delays a game there are a bunch of users on this site that immediatley flame the original poster with immature comments and everyone starts defending Valve and it's all just so ignorant.

That's the problem, so is it that too hard to understand? I don't think I can explain it any clearer than that.

 

[Sulkdodds]

Everybody is so mean! D:

Still, I don't see how you can slate HL2 for being linear and scripted while praising Call of Duty, the most linear and scripted game ever.

what story is there in HL2? You wake up, shoot some aliens and go back to sleep. No story development or insight to any of the main characters. We know nothing new about Gordon Freeman or the G-Man.

That's kind of like saying 'what story is there in Alien? She wakes up, runs from an alien and goes back to sleep.' Talk about oversimplification. Talk about...well, ignoring the entire plot.

 

[Space Farm]

Everybody is so mean! D:

Still, I don't see how you can slate HL2 for being linear and scripted while praising Call of Duty, the most linear and scripted game ever.

I'm sorry, but I didn't praise or slate any game for being linear or non-linear. I posted those screenshots to show what an engine that was designed and built 6 years ago could do.

This thread is really going nowhere, so goodnight folks.

 

[Sulkdodds]

I was talkin' to that Hoopla dude, foo'!

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Interesting that, for a second time, you ignore the fact that CoD doesn't actually use the version of the Quake 3 engine that was designed and built 6 years ago.

 

[^Ben]

But lolz source is the sux!

 

[Hoopla]

Interesting that, for a second time, you ignore the fact that CoD doesn't actually use the version of the Quake 3 engine that was designed and built 6 years ago.

Yes, it's a modified version of the engine. Just like Lost Cost is a modified version of Source. It's still the Quake3 engine underneath.

 

[Hoopla]

First thing is first. I personally like Half-Life 2. I own the Gold Edition. I've been a member of this forum since May 2004 and I bought HL1 back in 1999. I am a Half-Life fan. But...

What I'm trying to say and what Hoopla was trying to say a couple of pages back is that there are too many people that think Valve are gods, that HL2 is the best game ever made and that the source engine is the most advanced game engine on the planet. None of that is true.

Whenever somebody picks a fault with HL2 or get's annoyed when Valve delays a game there are a bunch of users on this site that immediatley flame the original poster with immature comments and everyone starts defending Valve and it's all just so ignorant.

That's the problem, so is it that too hard to understand? I don't think I can explain it any clearer than that.

Very nicely said.

 

[$kelet0r]

but whats you're point
life isn't perfect and neither is a valve game
so grow up and stop acting like troll
you've made your point - you find other games superior to hl2 - wonderful
now either contribute positively in other threads and forums or get lost