PHL Delay Editorial

[Feath]

Originally posted by Steelwind
Official statements?! What official statements? If there were official statements they'd be posted all over the web. There would be an official website for HL2. At the very least there would be a section for HL2 on www.valvesoftware.com. Give me a break, these guys in the interviews dance around the subject, giving you guys just enough to believe HL2 will be in stores on the 30th. Their official statements have been "No comment." "Valve's working hard to meet the Sept. 30th deadline." "At this point everthing seems on track for Sept. 30th." etc, etc, etc.

Actually, lack of a website would not be evidence that Half Life 2 is delayed. It would actually be evidence that Half Life 2 doesn't exist.

Valve have already said that they prefer the fans to make the websites.

Any interview with a Valve employee is official. Lombardi said repeatly(to different magazines) that Half Life 2's release date will be September

Us "no delayies" aren't just delusional idiots. We actually don't believe there's a delay because there is no evidence for a delay.

Yes, it still may be delayed. But it's unlikely now, as it's so close to the release date.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Originally posted by el Chi
Far be it from me to post something off-topic but it comes from the phrase "Word Up"

Well, that doesn't quote make sense, since "Word Up" doesn't really work as a response to something.. it's more of an opening..

I'm guessing "Word" derived itself from something being "The Word," IE. Like in religion.. Supposedly undisputable.

But I might just be full of it

Sincerely,
Jeremy Dunn

 

[el Chi]

Nope, pretty sure it derives from Word Up - such my Dictionary of Slang would have me believe. I forget who it's published by...

 

[Feath]

I'd like to mention something.

A release date is NOT:

• An opinion
• Something that people have to estimate based on the available evidence

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by Steelwind
Official statements?! What official statements?

You're new here, aren't you? Valve's very own Doug Lombardi has recently said at a major consumer electronics show that Half-Life 2 will make its September 30 release date. It really doesn't get much more official than that, unless you're willing to believe that Valve has spent the last six months lying through their teeth. Seriously, they have absolutely nothing to gain by unambiguously stating the game will be released on time if they know that it is going to be delayed. Or perhaps you think they have the world's worst P.R. department.

And you have to admit, Fagmaster (not a typo) has a pretty weak argument when his only rebuttle to official Valve statements is, "They're lying." Once again, it's that burden of proof thing. He can say they're lying, but it's his responsibility to prove his statements, not ours to disprove him.

 

[Steelwind]

No I'm not new at all, thanks. So he made a comment at an electronics expo, so why wasn't it officially released to all major news sites and magazines? Why haven't they had an official press release? And did he really say "...without a doubt, HL2 WILL indeed, for sure, be released Sept. 30th"?

 

[Logic]

Originally posted by Steelwind
No I'm not new at all, thanks. So he made a comment at an electronics expo, so why wasn't it officially released to all major news sites and magazines? Why haven't they had an official press release? And did he really say "...without a doubt, HL2 WILL indeed, for sure, be released Sept. 30th"?

Valve have been doing things a little differently to most companies. Rather than setting up a website, and posting impersonal press releases, they have taken the unique approach of talking directly to the community instead. All of what we know about the game (other than what's been seen in the videos obviously) has come from either interviews, or answered e-mails. By communicating with people on this much more personal level, they have helped keep the community alive and buzzing.

Just because there are no official press releases doesn't mean there is no official information. Essentially, every e-mail reply by a Valve member is a press release.

Valve have stated that the official release date is this Sept. 30th, and they have maintained that this date has not changed. No company can say "...without a doubt, the game WILL indeed, for sure, be released on blah blah..." because no matter how prepared the company is, or how far ahead of schedule everything seems to be, it's always possible that something can go wrong.

In this sense, Valve have given as much confirmation about the release date as any company possibly can. What more do you want?

 

[Feath]

Originally posted by Steelwind
No I'm not new at all, thanks. So he made a comment at an electronics expo, so why wasn't it officially released to all major news sites and magazines? Why haven't they had an official press release? And did he really say "...without a doubt, HL2 WILL indeed, for sure, be released Sept. 30th"?

It was part of an interview. What do you expect them to do? Make a press release every few days saying that nothing has changed?

And no developer in the world will say that "without a doubt our game will be released on blah blah". There's still a chance Half Life 2 may be delayed, that doesn't mean that it IS delayed.

Fragmaster isn't say the game MAY be delayed. He's claiming that the game IS delayed. Using stupid arguments.

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by Steelwind
No I'm not new at all, thanks. So he made a comment at an electronics expo, so why wasn't it officially released to all major news sites and magazines? Why haven't they had an official press release?

They did. Six months ago. Don't you remember all the major gaming sites and magazines with their Half-Life 2 previews? Since nothing has changed since that time, Valve obviously feels no compelling reason to release another press release saying the exact same thing they've previously said.

And did he really say "...without a doubt, HL2 WILL indeed, for sure, be released Sept. 30th"?

He didn't say "Cross my heart, hope to die, stick a needle in my eye" either, but his meaning was perfectly clear: Half-Life 2 will be released on September 30.

September 30 is the only consistent piece of information we have concerning the release date, yet people are finding it the hardest to believe, preferring instead to throw their lot in with ambiguous rumors and ill-founded speculation.

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Mountain Man
They did. Six months ago. Don't you remember all the major gaming sites and magazines with their Half-Life 2 previews? Since nothing has changed since that time, Valve obviously feels no compelling reason to release another press release saying the exact same thing they've previously said.

He didn't say "Cross my heart, hope to die, stick a needle in my eye" either, but his meaning was perfectly clear: Half-Life 2 will be released on September 30.

September 30 is the only consistent piece of information we have concerning the release date, yet people are finding it the hardest to believe, preferring instead to throw their lot in with ambiguous rumors and ill-founded speculation.

Meh, I dont believe you. My Grandma said that HL2 is delayed and I believe her... screw Valve.

 

[Steelwind]

I just don't think there's solid proof for or against the release date. My only argument thus far is that everyone is slamming this guy for stating his opinion that HL2 will be delayed. As if it's the end of the world or something. I want it to make the Sept. 30th release date, I'm just extremely skeptical about it. I've stated my reasons, and that's the way I see it. Most of you don't, what a wonderful world we live in. Too bad most people don't acknowledge other people's right to a difference of opinion.

What more proof do I need? I guess it would be an announcement that HL2 is shipping. We'll just have to wait and see. If it's delayed I'm certainly not going to say "I told you so" though I suspect most people will happily inform those who were skeptical that we're "Idiots, morons, fags, etc, etc,."

 

[Feath]

Originally posted by Steelwind
I just don't think there's solid proof for or against the release date. My only argument thus far is that everyone is slamming this guy for stating his opinion that HL2 will be delayed. As if it's the end of the world or something. I want it to make the Sept. 30th release date, I'm just extremely skeptical about it. I've stated my reasons, and that's the way I see it. Most of you don't, what a wonderful world we live in. Too bad most people don't acknowledge other people's right to a difference of opinion.

What more proof do I need? I guess it would be an announcement that HL2 is shipping. We'll just have to wait and see. If it's delayed I'm certainly not going to say "I told you so" though I suspect most people will happily inform those who were skeptical that we're "Idiots, morons, fags, etc, etc,."

A release date is NOT an opinion. Do you think Valve have any interest in not telling us the release date if it was delayed?

I'm arguing against Fragmaster because his argument is the worst I've seen since creationism.

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Steelwind
I just don't think there's solid proof for or against the release date. My only argument thus far is that everyone is slamming this guy for stating his opinion that HL2 will be delayed. As if it's the end of the world or something. I want it to make the Sept. 30th release date, I'm just extremely skeptical about it. I've stated my reasons, and that's the way I see it. Most of you don't, what a wonderful world we live in. Too bad most people don't acknowledge other people's right to a difference of opinion.

What more proof do I need? I guess it would be an announcement that HL2 is shipping. We'll just have to wait and see. If it's delayed I'm certainly not going to say "I told you so" though I suspect most people will happily inform those who were skeptical that we're "Idiots, morons, fags, etc, etc,."

The problem isnt that he is showing his opinion, its the fact that hes being an ass hole about it.

 

[Steelwind]

How is he being an ass about it? He's got a huge 'disclaimer' at the top of the editorial for this very reason. And yes, he's voicing his opinion on the release date. No one knows for sure when HL2 will be out, he's just stating his opinion on the matter. What's so hard to understand?

Do you think Valve have any interest in not telling us the release date if it was delayed?

Yes I do. Look how much hype is being created off this whole release date debacle. They're fueling the fire. They're getting incredible media attention all over the web.

 

[Logic]

Think of it this way:

Valve say they're going to release september 30.
Rumours arise about delays, for whatever reason.
Valve : despite rumours, we'll release the game sept. 30, as intended.
Fragmaster : No, you won't!
Valve : Yes, we will!
Fragmaster : No, you won't!

Don't you see the arrogance in what this guy is doing? He's entitled to his oppinion, sure, but what he's basically doing is telling Valve that they are wrong about the release date of their own game.

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Steelwind
How is he being an ass about it? He's got a huge 'disclaimer' at the top of the editorial for this very reason. And yes, he's voicing his opinion on the release date. No one knows for sure when HL2 will be out, he's just stating his opinion on the matter. What's so hard to understand?

Before the editorial you moron, he always went around in the PHL Forums saying that crap and gave no 'disclaimer' for it. So yea, he is being an ass hole about it.

 

[Feath]

Originally posted by Steelwind
How is he being an ass about it? He's got a huge 'disclaimer' at the top of the editorial for this very reason. And yes, he's voicing his opinion on the release date. No one knows for sure when HL2 will be out, he's just stating his opinion on the matter. What's so hard to understand?

Yes I do. Look how much hype is being created off this whole release date debacle. They're fueling the fire. They're getting incredible media attention all over the web.

A release date is not an opinion.

Also, it makes NO sense whatsoever for Valve to lie about it. So what if more people talk about the release date, they'll just end up with a lot of angry people on the 30th of September if the game is actually delayed.

 

[Steelwind]

Originally posted by Deadline
Before the editorial you moron, he always went around in the PHL Forums saying that crap and gave no 'disclaimer' for it. So yea, he is being an ass hole about it.

And this is where I end my discussion with you. Here I am merely providing my own opinion on the matter, and discussing my take on the subject when you come along and stoop below the infantile level of calling me a moron. Good game to you sir.

 

[Guest]

Come on guys. Fagmaster (not a typo) has a theory that is full of holes. There is no problem with expressing his opinion, but he acted like a total jerk about it. He also contradicts himself so many times during his article. He say that HL2 will be delayed but earlier on in his article he states that he has NO SOLID PROOF!! The guys is a retard and his credibility is nonexistent. Do you really think Valve would delay a game so close to its projected release?They would be shooting themselves in the foot. Let's think back to a little event called E3. Did Valve not keep HL2 under tight wraps until they got there? And that was only a preview and look at its sucess alone. Think what lengths they are going through to keep the release under wraps. THis is probably why you havent seen any new vids or gotten any info on multiplayer. So as far as Fragmaster is concerned, HE CAN BITE ME AND EVERYONE ELSE. I'm just looking forward to the 30th.

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Steelwind
And this is where I end my discussion with you. Here I am merely providing my own opinion on the matter, and discussing my take on the subject when you come along and stoop below the infantile level of calling me a moron. Good game to you sir.

LOL Im just pissed off with people agreeing with fragmaster, sorry

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Killa_TJ
I'm just looking forward to the 30th.

Me too man, me too :cheers:

 

[Steelwind]

Originally posted by Logic
Think of it this way:

Valve say they're going to release september 30.
Rumours arise about delays, for whatever reason.
Valve : despite rumours, we'll release the game sept. 30, as intended.
Fragmaster : No, you won't!
Valve : Yes, we will!
Fragmaster : No, you won't!

Don't you see the arrogance in what this guy is doing? He's entitled to his oppinion, sure, but what he's basically doing is telling Valve that they are wrong about the release date of their own game.

I think Valve's not going to make the release date, but does that make me arrogant? I understand what you're saying, but a journalist/news writer/whatever focuses on topics that draw the public's interest and inspires debate. He's done his job. Look how many people are clamoring over PHL and his editorial. There are plenty of articles questioning our own President's actions, so are they arrogant as well? No, they're targeting a subject of debate and publicity, stating their opinions on the subject at hand. It's called 'freedom of speech'.

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by Logic
Think of it this way:

Valve say they're going to release september 30.
Rumours arise about delays, for whatever reason.
Valve : despite rumours, we'll release the game sept. 30, as intended.
Fragmaster : No, you won't!
Valve : Yes, we will!
Fragmaster : No, you won't!

Don't you see the arrogance in what this guy is doing? He's entitled to his oppinion, sure, but what he's basically doing is telling Valve that they are wrong about the release date of their own game.

Well said man. The guy lost the battle when he opened his mouth. How much more proof does he need that Valve is serious? They adressed the rumors head on. There should be no speculation about the release date.

 

[Steelwind]

Don't get me wrong Deadline, I'm not trying to argue for the sake of arguement. I only hope that people think about what they're saying before letting it spew forth from their mouth. All of you guys bring up great points, but to deny someone else of their suggestions/beliefs is worse than anything Fragmaster has discussed/posted.

I can't wait till the 30th either. If infact if they do get this thing shipped, I'll be as excited as a child molester on a playground.

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Killa_TJ
Well said man. The guy lost the battle when he opened his mouth. How much more proof does he need that Valve is serious? They adressed the rumors head on. There should be no speculation about the release date.

Maybe reality will hit him once he gets in that Gordon costume and starts to hand out free copies of HL2

 

[Deadline]

Originally posted by Steelwind
I can't wait till the 30th either. If infact if they do get this thing shipped, I'll be as excited as a child molester on a playground.

LMAO

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by Steelwind
I just don't think there's solid proof for or against the release date.

There most definitely is proof for the release date. Seriously, how many times does Valve have to specifically say, "The game will be released September 30" before people will believe it? Deny the release date all you want, but it's not for want of evidence.

 

[Steelwind]

Originally posted by Mountain Man
There most definitely is proof for the release date. Seriously, how many times does Valve have to specifically say, "The game will be released September 30" before people will believe it? Deny the release date all you want, but it's not for want of evidence.

Fair enough. Now can you accept that fact that the game could possibly slip beyond the Sept. 30th date?

 

[Guest]

Mountain Man, I wouldn't waste my time with the fools who believe in the delay. HOW MANY TIMES DOES IT HAVE TO BE SAID? VALVE SAID DESPITE THE RUMORS OF DELAY, THE RELEASE DATE WAS UNCHANGED. THE FACT THAT THEY EVEN ACKNOWLEGED THE ACCUSATIONS MAKES ME BELIEVE IN THEM MORE!! VALVE WOULD KNOW BETTER THAN ANYONE WHEN THE GAME IS GOING TO BE RELEASED BECAUSE THEY SORT OR MADE IT!!!

 

[Feath]

Originally posted by Steelwind
Fair enough. Now can you accept that fact that the game could possibly slip beyond the Sept. 30th date?

We all accept that it could slip. But we're saying that it hasn't sliped yet. That's the point.

Fragmaster has been convinced that it's delayed since July.

 

[Mountain Man]

-

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally posted by Steelwind
Fair enough. Now can you accept that fact that the game could possibly slip beyond the Sept. 30th date?

It's not impossible, just highly improbable.

 

[Logic]

I stand by what I said.

Originally posted by Steelwind
I think Valve's not going to make the release date, but does that make me arrogant?

Not at all. You may disbelieve something someone sais, that's your oppinion. But when you start telling people that what someone has said is wrong, when you have no proof of it, then you're not only potentially misleading people (and there are always people who will believe you without reasoning it for themselves), but insulting the person in question.

Originally posted by Steelwind
a journalist/news writer/whatever focuses on topics that draw the public's interest and inspires debate.

It should be a journalist's goal to bring factual information to people to let them form their own oppinions. Yes, he's talking about a relevant issue, and sparking debate, but not for the right reasons. He is stating his oppinion and the implication is that he's defying anyone who disagrees with him, including Valve (which is rediculous).

Originally posted by Steelwind
There are plenty of articles questioning our own President's actions, so are they arrogant as well? No, they're targeting a subject of debate and publicity, stating their opinions on the subject at hand. It's called 'freedom of speech'.

He's not questioning Valve's actions. He's basically stating that they're wrong. You won't find many respected published articles that say "President Bush is Wrong", because that would be bad journalism. You have to give the people a chance to decide for themselves. Yes, he's entitled to say whatever he wants, but by essentially calling Valve liars, he's not making any friends.

 

[Steelwind]

Originally posted by Mountain Man
This would be an incredible gamble, to say the least. Valve is banking a considerable portion of their reputation on the release date of September 30. To delay the game this late in developement could potentially cost them a lot in sales as their reputation would take a massive nosedive, especially if word got out that they knew the game was going to be delayed but lied about it for marketing reasons. I'm sorry, but I don't believe Valve is that stupid.

That may be true, I just have a hard time believing that anyone who keeps up with HL2 on the net, will refuse to buy it for the sole purpose that Valve has stuck with the Sept. 30th date for marketing reasons. Let's be honest, the majority of people who play Half-Life will buy Half-Life 2, even if it's several months after the release. I don't think they're really risking much at all. Would you pass up on HL2 if they did infact stick to the Sept. 30th date for marketing reasons? And I mean forever, not for the first few weeks.

 

[Logic]

Steelwind: Why exactly do you doubt Valve? What are the reasons behind your belief that they won't release on time?

 

[Direwolf]

If something comes up and they have to change the date after they said they were on schedule it's not actually a lie, merely bad luck.
If the game's any good I doubt it will matter to anyone though.

 

[Steelwind]

Not at all. You may disbelieve something someone sais, that's your oppinion. But when you start telling people that what someone has said is wrong, when you have no proof of it, then you're not only potentially misleading people (and there are always people who will believe you without reasoning it for themselves), but insulting the person in question.

I completely agree. In fact I've made no comment to anyone telling them that they're wrong. I'm merely stating my personal view on the situation. Let's be honest though, with all the name calling and abusive post towards Fragmaster, are they any better than what he himself has posted?

It should be a journalist's goal to bring factual information to people to let them form their own oppinions. Yes, he's talking about a relevant issue, and sparking debate, but not for the right reasons. He is stating his oppinion and the implication is that he's defying anyone who disagrees with him, including Valve (which is rediculous).

I didn't get from his article that he's defying anyone who disagrees with him. Maybe he did. He's stated time and time again that he personally doens't believe it will make the date.

He's not questioning Valve's actions. He's basically stating that they're wrong. You won't find many respected published articles that say "President Bush is Wrong", because that would be bad journalism. You have to give the people a chance to decide for themselves. Yes, he's entitled to say whatever he wants, but by essentially calling Valve liars, he's not making any friends.

Again, I don't see him saying Valve is wrong. He's questioning the circumstances on which the release dates have been announced, and the lack of other various attributes that could contribute to the delay of the game. I think he's merely giving everyone the 'flip side of the coin', so to speak.

 

[Hectate]

Yeh know what... People who're in denial and ambigious and finds every retort of not having the game to come out in its planned release date are getting quite awfully pathetically desperate.

''There are no plans of having the initial release date change.''

~Well dooih, why didn't he say 'it'll be release in september 30th.'

''The date September 30th is still the targeted date.''

~Dooiihh, well why didn't he shove a hot scolding poker up my ass and convince it to me.

::shoving hot poker up bored-attention-deprived-lackwit's ass::

~Still not convince, nope--move a little to the left, ah there you go.


Comes September 30th 2003, the world's in a tumultuous glee and ecstasy over a holy grail in a form of Half Life 2 causing insurmountable panic in society for men and women alike took days off just to play.

~It's still not out. Nope.

Ye' know what, list down all the people's name who're still fractitiously against the word of the DEVS themselves. And let's laugh at pronouncing it come the end of the month. This is ridiculous, with utmost respect--if they find debating in a basis of maladroit ill-concieve reason just to not read the insinuation of the Valve's proposal in the release date--they'll still keep their heads inside a hole in the ground, while the earth's on fire, muttering everything is a-okay, and i'm a beautiful person.

 

[Logic]

Originally posted by Steelwind
Again, I don't see him saying Valve is wrong. He's questioning the circumstances on which the release dates have been announced, and the lack of other various attributes that could contribute to the delay of the game. I think he's merely giving everyone the 'flip side of the coin', so to speak.

To an extent, you're right, but he remained insistant in his 'proclamation' that Valve won't make the date, no matter how many times they reassure that everything is on track. He isn't specifically "defying" anyone in this article, but that certainly is the implication if you look at everything he's said on the issue. To me, he seems like a child, defending what he's said until the bitter end, who simply won't back down and acknowlege that people who have much more likelyhood of knowing the truth about the issue are saying the opposite to him. His "journalism" is revolving more around defending his honor (he has to stick by what he's said now that he's made such a deal about it) than letting the truth be known. If Valve weren't insisting that everything is on track, I wouldn't consider Fragmaster to be being arrogant, but clearly by maintaining that Valve won't make the date, when they are stating that they will, he's saying (or at the very least, strongly implying) that Valve are wrong.

 

[Mountain Man]

Not to mention he flat out called Valve's Doug Lombardi a liar.