Possiblity: Human evolution is getting faster

[Eejit]

Not necessarily. According to many studies, particularly concerning adopted children, IQ is primarily genetic.

Weren't most of them from that really respected British psychologist and it then turned out he was publishing fraudulent articles with no testing?

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Weren't most of them from that really respected British psychologist and it then turned out he was publishing fraudulent articles with no testing?

Thats the one. He's a pretencoius prick alright. He made a big discovery in genetics like, 40 years ago, and now believes he has the authority to make claims without using the scientific method. All he is is a bigot who twists science to serve his racist needs.

Also, RepiV, what your saying is borderline racist. You do know that right?

All humans are the same, seperate races aren't different species, it depends largely on the envrioment. People in Africa are bound to be "less smart" - they have no bloody education!

 

[repiV]

Weren't most of them from that really respected British psychologist and it then turned out he was publishing fraudulent articles with no testing?

Thats the one. He's a pretencoius prick alright. He made a big discovery in genetics like, 40 years ago, and now believes he has the authority to make claims without using the scientific method. All he is is a bigot who twists science to serve his racist needs.

I've never looked into it, it was posted up here of all places - and I think by Solaris. It had nothing to do with race, it was a study demonstrating that the IQ of adopted children much more closely mirrored their biological parents than their adopted parents. Nothing at all to do with race, but everything to do with genetics.
Like I said though, it's pretty irrelevant. But making an assumption that genetics and, by extension, race, has nothing to do with IQ is just plain ignorant.

Also, repiV, what your saying is borderline racist. You do know that right?

Of course it isn't.

All humans are the same, seperate races aren't different species, it depends largely on the envrioment. People in Africa are bound to be "less smart" - they have no bloody education!

All humans aren't even remotely the same. Each race is built quite differently and you can identify someone's ethnic background from their skeletal remains. Some races are more susceptible to certain illnesses than others, likewise some diseases only affect some races. Some ethnic groups are physically stronger and fitter than others. What logical reason is there to believe that racial differences would magically stop at the brain?
Personally I believe that race in itself has very little to do with IQ, but that's not the point - you can't just claim that it doesn't. You can't possibly know that.
This discussion was never about race, Solaris turned it into that. I said that IQ is critical to economic success, and to some extent economic success encourages high IQ, I never said anything about any other causes of high or low IQ.
That being said, you do have to wonder how North Korea has an average IQ of 106, and a more recent study puts China's average at 105. It does call the effect of prosperity upon intelligence into question.

 

[mindless_moder]

note sure if someone has beaten me to it but darwin's conversion on his deathbed is an outright fabrication.
"The "Lady Hope Story", published in 1915, claimed that Darwin had reverted back to Christianity on his sickbed. The claims were refuted by Darwin's children and have been dismissed as false by historians.[121] His daughter, Henrietta, who was at his deathbed, said that he did not convert to Christianity.[122] His last words were, in fact, directed at Emma: "Remember what a good wife you have been."[123]"

source:# Padian, Kevin (n.d.), The Darwin Legend, National Center for Science Education, <http://web.archive.org/web/19980119234102/natcenscied.org/PADREV.HTM> Retrieved on 2006-12-15

 

[Solaris]

Not necessarily. According to many studies, particularly concerning adopted children, IQ is primarily genetic.
In any case, I don't see that it's relevant - we're discussing the impact of intelligence on wealth. Intelligent people are more successful, and by the same token, intelligent societies are too.
It seems like you're just looking for an excuse to feign outrage.

So you believe then that people in third world countries are genetically inferior. If that's not racist then I don't know what is.

 

[Eejit]

I've never looked into it, it was posted up here of all places - and I think by Solaris. It had nothing to do with race, it was a study demonstrating that the IQ of adopted children much more closely mirrored their biological parents than their adopted parents. Nothing at all to do with race, but everything to do with genetics.
Like I said though, it's pretty irrelevant. But making an assumption that genetics and, by extension, race, has nothing to do with IQ is just plain ignorant.

It's the same principle though...

This guy believed that intelligence was primarily controlled by genetics and so he made up experiments and studies proving this and published them. Because he was already well respected for other work people didn't look too hard at these papers for decades.
As far as I remember he was more concerned with inherited intelligence with regards to class rather than race, and it helped shape the British Governments schooling policies for a long time.

I'd have to look into it more it was only touched on briefly during lectures last year but I was told that more recent studies (which actually took place -.-) have shown that genes are a relatively small factor in determining intelligence.

So you believe then that people in third world countries are genetically inferior. If that's not racist then I don't know what is.

It's racist if it isn't proven. It's not racist to think about racial differences if they have been studied and shown to be true, such as Asians generally having lower alcohol tolerance than Europeans.
In this case he thinks it's been proven but it hasn't really so I don't think he's intentionally being racist

 

[repiV]

So you believe then that people in third world countries are genetically inferior. If that's not racist then I don't know what is.

No, actually I quite explicity stated otherwise. You make yourself look like an idiot when you comment without even reading my posts.

 

[repiV]

It's the same principle though...

This guy believed that intelligence was primarily controlled by genetics and so he made up experiments and studies proving this and published them. Because he was already well respected for other work people didn't look too hard at these papers for decades.
As far as I remember he was more concerned with inherited intelligence with regards to class rather than race, and it helped shape the British Governments schooling policies for a long time.

I'd have to look into it more it was only touched on briefly during lectures last year but I was told that more recent studies (which actually took place -.-) have shown that genes are a relatively small factor in determining intelligence.

Which proves what I said - noone knows either way.

It's racist if it isn't proven. It's not racist to think about racial differences if they have been studied and shown to be true, such as Asians generally having lower alcohol tolerance than Europeans.
In this case he thinks it's been proven but it hasn't really so I don't think he's intentionally being racist

No I don't, I never said anything of the sort. I said it's possible that genetic differences are involved, and noone here is qualified to comment either way. I did specifically point out that dismissing the idea as false is completely ignorant and faith-based.
I also said that this discussion is not and never was about race, and that Solaris should quit with the tedious race-baiting bull.

 

[Gray Fox]

So wait if intelligent people are more successfully and you are in thousands of pounds in debt while solars is sipping away overpriced star bucks coffee and generally doing fine. Doesn't that make him more intelligent then you?

 

[Eejit]

Yes. I am using my super-powers to prevent any random occurances from happening.

 

[Saturos]

Evolution is constant everywhere except for America, where incest is forcing evolution to go backwards.

That's all that article was referring to.

Uggh. I'm getting sick of europeans stereotyping all Americans as a bunch of dumb hillbillies. Cut it OUT.

 

[Eejit]

Uggh. I'm getting sick of europeans stereotyping all Americans as a bunch of dumb hillbillies. Cut it OUT.

Why would we do that when we're finally starting to get a reaction? Hick.

 

[Pesmerga]

Racism is when you regard all of the race to be inferior based on their race alone.

If anything, we're discriminating against the poor.

As for average IQ scores well... China, Japan, and other Asian countries put a huge emphasis on education. This means parents put their children under a lot of stress to learn and think creatively- China has a very rigid business community, using its citizens as cheap manual labor so China can continue being an exporter.

China's population is just so massive that most citizens, despite education, have no choice but to fill menial positions.

 

[repiV]

So wait if intelligent people are more successfully and you are in thousands of pounds in debt while solars is sipping away overpriced star bucks coffee and generally doing fine. Doesn't that make him more intelligent then you?

Umm, Solaris still goes to college and lives off his parents. He doesn't have any economic success whatsoever yet. I can't work because I'm physically unable to.
I was earning the equivalent of about 25 grand a year when I was working, so... no.

 

[Gray Fox]

Oh and what college did you go to?

 

[repiV]

Oh and what college did you go to?

I assume you mean university. I didn't, it's a total waste of time.

 

[Saturos]

Why would we do that when we're finally starting to get a reaction? Hick.

Of course, I know that was probably lePobz's aim, but still, not everyone in the U.S. is associated with that stereotype. Oh, bother.:dozey: I'm not about to go into another political debate, that always seems to do no good other than to make enemies. For the record I think both political parties here are lacking and voted for neither Bush or Kerry. Not that it's revelent to the thread. BTW:I don't eat squirrel brains or hunt or fish,OR am I an auto mechanic that likes huges 4x4 pickups. So how am I a hick?

 

[Gray Fox]

Well I thought it would have been funny if you two did the same study.
Well I guess thats it then.

 

[repiV]

Racism is when you regard all of the race to be inferior based on their race alone.

If anything, we're discriminating against the poor.

As for average IQ scores well... China, Japan, and other Asian countries put a huge emphasis on education. This means parents put their children under a lot of stress to learn and think creatively- China has a very rigid business community, using its citizens as cheap manual labor so China can continue being an exporter.

China's population is just so massive that most citizens, despite education, have no choice but to fill menial positions.

This is true. That doesn't explain why India's average IQ is 84 though - maybe the provision of education isn't as widespread in India as it is in China?
I know China has compulsory education of a similar length to our own, despite their poverty, but India may not.
Certainly Indian parents are amongst the pushiest, and British-born Indians are generally the most successful people in British society in both education and work.

 

[repiV]

Well I thought it would have been funny if you two did the same study.
Well I guess thats it then.

Well I applied for both psychology and aerospace engineering, but didn't bother with either as psychology is a fat waste of three years and 15 grand and I have far too much of an intuitive mind to be any good at engineering.
Solaris will probably do a joint degree in Distribution of Wealth Studies and Oppression Science.

 

[Eejit]

I assume you mean university. I didn't, it's a total waste of time.

Depends on what you want to do...

This is true. That doesn't explain why India's average IQ is 84 though - maybe the provision of education isn't as widespread in India as it is in China?
I know China has compulsory education of a similar length to our own, despite their poverty, but India may not.
Certainly Indian parents are amongst the pushiest, and Indians are generally the most successful people in British society in both education and work.

There are still huge numbers of Indians living in extremely basic villages.
The cities have good education and are quite modern but out in the countryside it's a very different story. And that is a significant proportion of the population so /shrug

 

[repiV]

Depends on what you want to do...

If making money is your primary goal, higher education is not the way to accomplish that. I work in sales where degrees are pretty much irrelevant, and there's no other field of work that makes 40k+ a year a possibility when you're just starting out.

There are still huge numbers of Indians living in extremely basic villages.
The cities have good education and are quite modern but out in the countryside it's a very different story. And that is a significant proportion of the population so /shrug

China is similar. There are a few truly wealthy cities (and China has so many huge cities you couldn't possibly remember them all) with a pretty high quality of life, like Shanghai and Shenzhen, but most of the country is a poverty-stricken, mostly rural hellhole where life is very tough indeed.
Yet the national average IQ still sits at 105. :|
Shanghai's average is apparently 110.

 

[Eejit]

If making money is your primary goal, higher education is not the way to accomplish that. I work in sales where degrees are pretty much irrelevant, and there's no other field of work that makes 40k+ a year a possibility when you're just starting out.

Sure, but I want to do research.

China is similar. There are a few truly wealthy cities (and China has so many huge cities you couldn't possibly remember them all) with a pretty high quality of life, like Shanghai and Shenzhen, but most of the country is a poverty-stricken, mostly rural hellhole where life is very tough indeed.
Yet the national average IQ still sits at 105. :|
Shanghai's average is apparently 110.

One thing communist governments are generally quite good at is ensuring free education for everyone.
Many Indian villages are practically in the dark ages when it comes to health care and education.

 

[repiV]

Sure, but I want to do research.

Which is cool. But you have to be doing something very specific like that in order to make a degree worthwhile. I would go so far as to say the vast majority of graduates completely wasted their time and money. Going to uni can be after all an excellent excuse not to go and get a job.

One thing communist governments are generally quite good at is ensuring free education for everyone.
Many Indian villages are practically in the dark ages when it comes to health care and education.

True, but China hasn't been communist for some time now. It's more...laissez-faire capitalism mixed with authoritarianism. If you want to see the future of China, just look at Hong Kong. It's a democracy which has the most capitalist economy in the world and is extremely wealthy, although the wealth is concentrated in relatively few hands.

 

[Eejit]

It's still very socialist with regards to state provision of health care, education and all that jazz.

I'd agree with you about a lot of university degrees being a waste of time though, esp. things like Business or Arts there are so many people with that kind of degree it won't help them get jobs at all. (Generally, a friend who went to Oxford knows some guys who went straight into City jobs for merchant banks but that's the exception )
Uni is pretty important for a good job in the sciences, engineering and a few other things like law though.

 

[repiV]

It's still very socialist with regards to state provision of health care, education and all that jazz.

Yeah, but no moreso than the UK. In comparison to India though, I see your point.

I'd agree with you about a lot of university degrees being a waste of time though, esp. things like Business or Arts there are so many people with that kind of degree it won't help them get jobs at all. (Generally, a friend who went to Oxford knows some guys who went straight into City jobs for merchant banks but that's the exception )

I worked in recruitment for a while, and I never paid any attention at all to educational background. Well, I had one client who demanded to see only applicants with degrees, for her 14k basic telesales jobs (conferences/corporate sponsorship). But her company sucked and were tightwad ****s who paid us shit fees and had a very high turnover.
In reality it means jack shit, in business you want someone who's shrewd and driven with real-world smarts. No form of academic education can teach you those things, you either got it or you don't. Moreover, you can tell whether someone is intelligent or not just by talking to them for a while.
Of course another route into investment banking is to spend a couple of years in some other kind of sales role and then move into it from there. You'll earn a lot more money than you would at uni and get more of a running start into your new job.

Uni is pretty important for a good job in the sciences, engineering and a few other things like law though.

Oh, absolutely. It's stuff like English degrees and, worse, media studies degrees I don't get - what's the point?
Outside of those specialist fields, a degree only becomes relevant in a tight labour market where there are so many people to choose from and then that's only when you're starting out (for example, the PR and marketing industries). After that, work experience is far more important.

 

[Phobie]

Oh, absolutely. It's stuff like English degrees and, worse, media studies degrees I don't get - what's the point?
Outside of those specialist fields, a degree only becomes relevant in a tight labour market where there are so many people to choose from and then that's only when you're starting out (for example, the PR and marketing industries). After that, work experience is far more important.

I study English literature and Theatre, because I've always been into writing, and more recently, scriptwriting. I get opinions like yours thrown at me all the time, but I'm doing something that I'm ridiculously into, and I'll be getting a degree out of it. I also want to go into teaching, and I don't know shit apart from literature and the arts, so I figure this will help .

If I had loved science, I would have done a degree in that.

 

[nurizeko]

likewise some diseases only affect some races.

Fabrication, false. Unless of course you can prove it, I admit to not being an expert on disease, but my understanding of human biology dictates to me that its a crock of shit TBH.

Each race is built quite differently and you can identify someone's ethnic background from their skeletal remains.

Barely. Again I am no forensic expert, but my guess (albeit) is that the differences in human skeletal development are so insignificant as to only be noticeable by forensic experts. I would have suggested the height of the skeleton, but, without the fleshy bits, a human skeleton to most eyes is just that, human.


While its just stupid to pretend there are no differences between populations, they are hardly compelling enough to be stressed. Until such a time as you or I can no longer go to the furthest corners of the world and procreate with the females there, humans we are, race is just a crude way of essentially describing the grand diverse pool of human genetics.

As for population packages effect on IQ, well, considering the whole notion of IQ has been questioned, let alone our still extremely poor understanding of "intelligence" in biology, and there being no real noticeable variation in intellect based on race alone, its hardly a cutting issue.

Most of the third (and coloured) world have the total lack of reliable efficient education as a fairly obvious explanation for the poor IQ performance of those regions, and Occam's razor wins in that regard.


And as folk have often said, stupidity is hardly the preserve of a particular group.

I would like to point you towards the fundamental Christian movement in the United States, as an example, seeing as this nest of inexplicable retardation exists in the heart of arguably one of the most scientifically and intellectually developed nations.

 

[repiV]

I study English literature and Theatre, because I've always been into writing, and more recently, scriptwriting. I get opinions like yours thrown at me all the time, but I'm doing something that I'm ridiculously into, and I'll be getting a degree out of it. I also want to go into teaching, and I don't know shit apart from literature and the arts, so I figure this will help .

If I had loved science, I would have done a degree in that.

Well if you're doing it because you love it, fair play. A lot of people (most, even?) just go to university because it's the "done thing". They rarely stop to realise that in all likelihood, it won't actually help them at all, it will leave them in massive debt and take three productive years out of their life, during which time they could have built the foundations of a successful career.
At college everyone was always telling me I should go to uni, but at the end of the day I'll be earning a shitload more than they will be when they graduate and I won't have 20 grand of student debt either. Plus, I detest studying. So it's all good.

Fabrication, false. Unless of course you can prove it, I admit to not being an expert on disease, but my understanding of human biology dictates to me that its a crock of shit TBH.

Only black people are susceptible to sickle cell anemia.

Barely. Again I am no forensic expert, but my guess (albeit) is that the differences in human skeletal development are so insignificant as to only be noticeable by forensic experts. I would have suggested the height of the skeleton, but, without the fleshy bits, a human skeleton to most eyes is just that, human.

Yeah, and black women don't really have huge arses. Asian chicks don't have tight pussies and small breasts. It's all in the imagination.

To take two ends of the spectrum, black people and Chinese people could not be more different in appearance.

With regards to facial features, east Asians look almost like another species compared to every other ethnic group. Damn hot though.
It's actually very difficult to tell one person from another if they're from an ethnic group you aren't overly familiar with.

While its just stupid to pretend there are no differences between populations, they are hardly compelling enough to be stressed. Until such a time as you or I can no longer go to the furthest corners of the world and procreate with the females there, humans we are, race is just a crude way of essentially describing the grand diverse pool of human genetics.

As for population packages effect on IQ, well, considering the whole notion of IQ has been questioned, let alone our still extremely poor understanding of "intelligence" in biology, and there being no real noticeable variation in intellect based on race alone, its hardly a cutting issue.

Most of the third (and coloured) world have the total lack of reliable efficient education as a fairly obvious explanation for the poor IQ performance of those regions, and Occam's razor wins in that regard.

Who stressed anything? All I said was that it's ignorant to dismiss the possibility of IQ being partially race-based. If anything, you should be slating them for their closed-minded, faith-based beliefs. The religion of political correctness.

And as folk have often said, stupidity is hardly the preserve of a particular group.

I would like to point you towards the fundamental Christian movement in the United States, as an example, seeing as this nest of inexplicable retardation exists in the heart of arguably one of the most scientifically and intellectually developed nations.

Highly intelligent people can still be deeply religious. Think again.

 

[PortalStormzzzz]

Why are religious people always seen as dumb? I'm religious and I'm damn smart. Just won 2 scholarships for college and I'm pretty much awesome at math.

 

[Druckles]

Why are religious people always seen as dumb? I'm religious and I'm damn smart. Just won 2 scholarships for college and I'm pretty much awesome at math.

You don't seem to curb your ego, however.

 

[RidleyRockets]

Why are religious people always seen as dumb? I'm religious and I'm damn smart. Just won 2 scholarships for college and I'm pretty much awesome at math.

You forgot to add modest too.

I can only speak for myself here but i can say that i don't think that all those with religious convictions are dumb.

Also just out of curiosity which colleges are the scholarships for? Liberty University?

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

I don't think all religious pepople are dumb. Theres plenty of smart religious people.

Irratoinal? Yes. Dumb? No.

 

[Eejit]

Fabrication, false. Unless of course you can prove it, I admit to not being an expert on disease, but my understanding of human biology dictates to me that its a crock of shit TBH.

Not entirely false no...

There is a whole variety of genetic diseases who's prevalence varies by >1000x depending on ethnicity.
Like Europeans are by far most likely to contract Cystic Fibrosis, PKU is most common in Irish, and sickle-cell anaemia is extremely common in the 'malaria belt' of africa. That's just the few examples that pop into my head I've got a whole list somewhere I can look for it if you're really interested.

This is because being heterozygous (only 1 copy) for these disease genes will not affect you adversely but can give protection from other diseases. e.g. people with 1 sickle-cell allele and 1 normal allele are much more resistant to malaria, heterozygous cystic fibrosis individuals are thought to be more likely to survive cholera, and PKU has been linked to resistance to some fungal toxins.
This means that there is actually selective pressure for these genetic diseases as the presence of heterozygosity 'helps' the population more than the few homozygotes.



Don't say people are lying if you don't know what you're talking about please.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

If I had loved science, I would have done a degree in that.

Don't worry, I am doing science, and I get things thrown at me at how pointless science is anyway. Thats why I never say it to anyone else :hmph:


Art is pointless

 

[PvtRyan]

I like how repiV is being told he's a racist even though he's also saying Asians are smarter than Caucasians, and as far as I know, repiV is white. He's being as "racist" towards his own race as he is to others.

I see no need to panic when someone suggests that maybe Africans are on average less intelligent than Europeans who are in turn on average less intelligent than Asians. I don't know if that's truly the case, but if it is, no one should feel insulted. Because the difference in intelligence between individuals is greater than the difference between races. If Africans turned out to be on average less intelligent, it doesn't say anything about the individual, just that when all scores are added together and divided by the populace, Africans score less. It's entirely possible that you're black and have an IQ of 140 while an Asian next to you has an IQ of 80.

I'm not insulted by Asians being on average smarter than Europeans, because as an individual, I know I'm smarter still than the average Asian.

Again, such a statement says absolutely nothing about individuals and doesn't even give grounds for discrimination. The knowledge that Africans are on average less intelligent is of no practical use when applied to individuals; when interviewing people for a job, you cannot hire the Asian over the black guy based on a knowledge of averages because the black person might be twice as intelligent as the Asian.

I doubt the races have evolved the exact same intelligence despite very different living conditions and needs, but the difference won't be huge. Again, the difference between individuals is far greater than any difference between races. I also think we're forgetting nutrition here, while we all agree that nutrition in your youth plays an important part for your body for the rest of your adult life, we all seem to forget the effect it has on the development of your brain.

 

[nurizeko]

Only black people are susceptible to sickle cell anemia.

Wrong.

Sickle-cell disease occurs more commonly in people (or their descendants) from parts of the world such as sub-Saharan Africa, where malaria is or was common, but it also occurs in people of other ethnicities.

I woulda gave you leniency if you had bothered to state the particular population it mostly occurs in, but instead you made a blanket cover all catch all claim that it only effects black people. False.

I knew as much, looked through my biology text books, didn't even mention black only, I had to go to the wiki article to just get that much.

Yeah, and black women don't really have huge arses. Asian chicks don't have tight pussies and small breasts. It's all in the imagination.

To take two ends of the spectrum, black people and Chinese people could not be more different in appearance.


With regards to facial features, east Asians look almost like another species compared to every other ethnic group. Damn hot though.
It's actually very difficult to tell one person from another if they're from an ethnic group you aren't overly familiar with.

False, again your mistaking enviromental factors with genetic. While overall Asians are more petite, this can mostly be attributed to dietary intake and cultural preferences, your placing too much on the genetic factors and ignoring glaringly obvious enviromental ones. Of course the stereotypical image of African Americans is gonna be big and fat assed when they have a high calorie high fat high everything type of diet, while east Asians generally have fat sparse diets. In Japan food was so poor nutritionally that vitamin deficiency was a wide spread problem.

The short stature, the chronic occurence of beri-beri caused by vitamin deficiency, the almost total lack of descriptions of food or meals in Japanese literature, all bespeak a fairly frugal and unexciting fair.

Taken from the Cambridge encyclopedia of Japan

Your comment about them looking like another species is almost humorous, without even having to try, I can point out that Asian and black faces are overall fairly similar, the noses are, size aside, rather similar in shape .

Your "dem Asians all look the same" argument made me smile. The Asian you showed is Ziyi Zhang, I could pick her out of a crowd, she's actually quite memorable. Not to mention other Asian people I've known.

If your argument is "I can't recognize strangers", well...DUH. I probably couldn't pick you out of a crowd of Caucasians unless I knew what you looked like first, like everyone else. I've been to Japan, and I can assure you, once you note a face, its quite possible to pick it out of a crowd.

While you do have some point in there that, get this, there is diversity in facial, body and height features of the human race, your over emphasizing it, and made a wild unsubstantiated claim to boot.

Who stressed anything? All I said was that it's ignorant to dismiss the possibility of IQ being partially race-based. If anything, you should be slating them for their closed-minded, faith-based beliefs. The religion of political correctness.

Fair enough, but you failed to notice that the reply to the comment answered your very response.

There is no admissible proof that "race" is in any way a serious effector on human IQ, and thats ignoring the fact, that again, the IQ system has been argued to be unsuitable and not a full completely reliable indicator of human intellect.

Again, I will state, thats almost including the fact that we are yet to fully understand the biology behind intelligence.

AGAIN, I am not saying that there is no such thing as genetic diversity of the human population, nor am I saying everyone can be a rocket scientist or a Nobel prize winning mathematician, no matter how much they try.

What I am saying is that overall, these differences are, as a rule, insignificant to the massive weight of similarities, our ability to breed with anyone anywhere as long as they are fertile being the biggest one.

Finally, the science and understanding of what constitutes intelligence is still not fully understood, and there is no massive difference between intelligence between a whitey from London and a Black man from Rawanda that can't be argued to be primarily the result of enviromental factors.


The problem comes when the whole issue is muddied and over-emphasized to the point of illogical stereotyping. There are black men who are smarter then me (theres this black physicist that often appears on astronomy and physics documentaries, but I can't remember his name, damn he knows his stuff...). Just as there are people of all colours and ethnicities. Likewise theres people dumber then me.

In conclusion, I think the grand genetic lottery of diversity far outweighs most ethnically genetic factors to honestly make race based intellect a non-issue.

As far as I am aware, any child from anywhere can be brought up in a developed western life with a full western education, and perform no less then the general average for most kids going through that.

Not entirely false no...

There is a whole variety of genetic diseases who's prevalence varies by >1000x depending on ethnicity.
Like Europeans are by far most likely to contract Cystic Fibrosis, PKU is most common in Irish, and sickle-cell anaemia is extremely common in the 'malaria belt' of africa. That's just the few examples that pop into my head I've got a whole list somewhere I can look for it if you're really interested.

This is because being heterozygous (only 1 copy) for these disease genes will not affect you adversely but can give protection from other diseases. e.g. people with 1 sickle-cell allele and 1 normal allele are much more resistant to malaria, heterozygous cystic fibrosis individuals are thought to be more likely to survive cholera, and PKU has been linked to resistance to some fungal toxins.
This means that there is actually selective pressure for these genetic diseases as the presence of heterozygosity 'helps' the population more than the few homozygotes.



Don't say people are lying if you don't know what you're talking about please.

No. He claimed that genetic diseases can only occur to particular ethnic groups. Its false. They can happen to anyone. The fact that they occur more frequently among certain ethnicities does in no way suddenly validate the statement that certain diseases effect only certain races.

Don't say I don't know what I am talking about when I do, when someone makes massive generalizations and downright false statements please.





:cheers:

I'm finished. :imu:

 

[repiV]

I like how repiV is being told he's a racist even though he's also saying Asians are smarter than Caucasians, and as far as I know, repiV is white. He's being as "racist" towards his own race as he is to others.

Quite.

Wrong.

I woulda gave you leniency if you had bothered to state the particular population it mostly occurs in, but instead you made a blanket cover all catch all claim that it only effects black people. False.

I knew as much, looked through my biology text books, didn't even mention black only, I had to go to the wiki article to just get that much.

It's as true as it ever needs to be.

According to pubmed (a government run medical website) only 2 white people have been diagnosed with sickle cell. It was caused by a random mutation in their genes. For a white person to get sickle cell they must have a 1 in a trillion genetic mutation because there is no genetic history of sickle cell in white people.

Link

False, again your mistaking enviromental factors with genetic. While overall Asians are more petite, this can mostly be attributed to dietary intake and cultural preferences, your placing too much on the genetic factors and ignoring glaringly obvious enviromental ones. Of course the stereotypical image of African Americans is gonna be big and fat assed when they have a high calorie high fat high everything type of diet, while east Asians generally have fat sparse diets. In Japan food was so poor nutritionally that vitamin deficiency was a wide spread problem.

Bullshit. Even Western-born and raised east Asians are tiny, and likewise the opposite with black people.
Hell, there's even a poster about heart disease or some shit in my local GP and says if your waist circumference is over a certain amount then you're at risk of it - there are four separate measurements they give, one for caucasian men, one for caucasian women, one for asian men and one for asian women. Obviously it's a genetic thing, otherwise the risk would be equal at the same measurement for both asians and caucasians.

Also, the Japanese diet is one of the healthiest and most nutritious in the world. Apart from some tiny country in the Mediterranean, Japanese people live longer than any other nation. If you were right, they would also be amongst the tallest people. But you're wrong.

Your comment about them looking like another species is almost humorous, without even having to try, I can point out that Asian and black faces are overall fairly similar, the noses are, size aside, rather similar in shape

They aren't similar at all. The shape of the eyes in east Asian people is completely different from any other, for a start, not to mention the size of the lips and the shape of the face.

Your "dem Asians all look the same" argument made me smile. The Asian you showed is Ziyi Zhang, I could pick her out of a crowd, she's actually quite memorable. Not to mention other Asian people I've known.

I know who it is. And she couldn't look more different to Queen Latifah or any other black woman for that matter.

If your argument is "I can't recognize strangers", well...DUH. I probably couldn't pick you out of a crowd of Caucasians unless I knew what you looked like first, like everyone else. I've been to Japan, and I can assure you, once you note a face, its quite possible to pick it out of a crowd.

Er, no. I didn't say anything about recognising strangers. If you have no exposure to Japanese people - you've never met any, you don't see them on TV, etc. they will be very very difficult to tell apart from one another until you get more familiar with them. It's a well documented thing.

Your post is just too goddamn long. You don't really add anything in the remainder of it, so I can't be arsed to reply to the rest.

 

[Eejit]

The fact that they occur more frequently among certain ethnicities does in no way suddenly validate the statement that certain diseases effect only certain races.

When the difference in frequency is in the order of thousands or tens of thousands - sometimes more - you're nitpicking when you try to say it can occurs in all ethnic groups.
Yes it does, but so rarely for it to be a very noteable exaception with a lot of these diseases, as repiv showed to be the case with sickle cell among caucasians.

 

[ríomhaire]

Of course it makes them inferior. They don't learn any of the skills necessary for success in today's world, or for constructing a more advanced and enlightened society. What other definition of inferior can there possibly be?

You might aswell say that the people who grew up in tenth century Britain learned very different skills to those growing up today - they weren't inferior, just different. Clearly that's nonsense, and it's an apt comparison because tenth century Britain was arguably more civilised than many African nations today.

You're being a hypocrite - I'm sure you have little respect for people who study mickey mouse subjects at university. I'm sure you despise chavs that possess none of the skills necessary for success in our society, but who actually have a lot of other skills that you and I don't. Are they not inferior either? Just different?

So if someone has grown up and lives in a difference culture and has adapted the skills nessisary to survive in that culture he is inferior because he doesn't have the skills to live in "today's modern world"? The world isn't uniform, dumbass. Different places have different cultures were people live different lives and have different skills.

Maybe if you dropped someone from some random tribe in Africa into New York, they'd be pretty ****ed, but if I dropped you into some random tribe in Africa you'd probably be just a ****ed.

The inability of someone from another culture to survive in yours doesn't make them inferior, asshole.