Question about the advisors

Laivasse - I apologise for my arrogance, you make a strong argument. A few comments:

-Thanks for the briefs on aforementioned physics concepts. It appears you do know what you are talking about, and I apologise for implying that you didn't.

-I don't think Eli or Kleiner are aware of the Advisor's abilities or even of the advisors at all. Thus anything said by Kleiner would be a narrative foreshadowing but not an indication that the character knew anything. To make Eli's death more disastrous and indeed to serve the purose of foreshadowing, it is beneficial to first explain the worst case scenario - Eli is both useful to the rebellion as a leader and also has the most knowledge of the rebellion. This is learned from the aforementioned conversation and via Half Life 2 - Ep 1. Thus, when Eli dies, the two worst possible things have happened - his knowledge has been captured and a great leader is no longer available. If it were true, it would mean that the two worst case scenarios had been foreshadowed, and then put into effect.

I doubt anyone in the rebellion knows about the advisors (except for the vortigaunts) and they have, as is mentioned, been in a larval state in the citadel until recently. Otherwise they would have been cruising around killing rebels from the start.

If they could have brain sucked breen, they wouldn't have. He is the human face of the combine and serves their propoganda well.

The advisors abilities are not explained because there is no character to explain them to you, especially not via summaries of actual scientific experiments. They can only be alluded to by various narrative devices, and foreshadowing.

Of course human sacrifice served a purpose, it just wasn't to ensure a good harvest. You're forgetting that much of the human brain developed to accommodate the capacity for deceit - people have been lying for thousands of years. The Aztecs, for example, used human sacrifice as a socially acceptable way of getting rid of people they didn't like. They also used their ability to predict eclipses (and the withholding of this knowledge from the public) as a way to scare the public and also to invent invisible gods who had absolute authority.

No living creature has ever done anything that did not serve a purpose.

If you see Advisor's as actually advising Breen on the Combine directive, then fine, perhaps their name isn't that relevant.

Valve could avoid the brain-sucking conclusion by calling them slug-kings, having them eat livers, and having no mention of "how terrible it would be if the combine got Eli's knowledge".
 
For what it's worth, my impression of the barn scene was:

- Advisor gets rudely awakened (and injured)
- Advisor incapacitates everybody until it can figure out what's going on
- Advisor grabs first humanoid at hand (the dead guy); probes it; finds it dead; discards it
- Advisor moves on to Gordon, but has to abort the probe as it's injured (I think Alyx said as much, from memory. Could be wrong.)

Also, if they could glean information telepathically without the probe, surely it was close enough to Alyx and Gordon to collect theirs?

The 'how' of it all doesn't matter that much to me. Half Life is squarely science fiction, so I'm okay with the suck brain = knowledge thing personally.

(btw sorry if I'm intruding here - feel free to ignore.) :)
 
Yes I think it was close enough to listen in on Freeman's and Vance Subprime's thoughts, even before it opened the shell.
Thinking about it though, the dark rays that project from the Advisors reach out and touch all of the humans don't they? I think that's just as likely a mechanic as the tente-probe.
 
Like I say, one interpretation can be as valid as the next until Laidlaw collapses the probability wave~

Until then it comes down to a subjective assessment of what you see fits based on how the story feels to you. So to you it's:
Valve could avoid the brain-sucking conclusion by calling them slug-kings, having them eat livers, and having no mention of "how terrible it would be if the combine got Eli's knowledge".
But to me it's: 'Valve could have confirmed the knowledge-theft by having the vorts mention the ability in warning, or have Alyx say something about dark goings-on in the citadel, or having someone scream "OMG! They know everything now!" or something to that effect at the end, and any other references to their obtaining info is a euphemism for torture or interrogation.'
Laivasse - I apologise for my arrogance, you make a strong argument.
No worries, seasoned internet types like us are used to giving eachother rough treatment ;)

BTW I didn't mean to try and make myself look like I knew any hard science about those terms (just in case someone takes me up on butchering their summary). I essentially wiki'ed them back when other people here were talking about how cool it was that they popped up in the Mossman speech.
 
He he, you make me sound like a religious zealot - obviously God exists, they could have done so much to discount the theory!
 
If they can control you're brain, why cant they just take out the info while they are controlling it? I think they just suck out brains because...they're hungry? :)
 
If they can control you're brain, why cant they just take out the info while they are controlling it? I think they just suck out brains because...they're hungry? :)

They aren't really controlling you.. it's more like telekinesis than telepathy. All they're doing is moving you with whatever powers they possess.
 
It certainly appears to be what we would label as a tk ability. I assume they use the same method to power their flight
 
Well, I don't know much about physics myself, but even I had a bit of a laugh at the fact that Dr. Magnusson had a clipboard titled, "Conservation of Momentum" on his computer console in the rocket silo. The genius that is Dr. Magnusson needs a refresher course on physics 101?

ep2outland110000dj9.jpg


Also, how many rockets are really drifting in "gravity free" space? Things in orbit are weightless because they are in freefall... not because there is no gravity in space.
 
Also, how many rockets are really drifting in "gravity free" space? Things in orbit are weightless because they are in freefall... not because there is no gravity in space.

It says 'Imagine a rocket drifting in gravity free space' i.e 'in a space without gravity', not 'in Space with no gravity'

Space, as far as i know is the stuff outside the earth's atmosphere, or all the black empty stuff. A space on the other hand is just an ideal place in which to show a theory, i.e the conservation of momentum. It doesn't technically exist in the context it is being referred to.
 
why's it got a picture of companion cube on it :[

I haven't read every post but.. It did definately hint at eli's knowledge being taken (They may have meant interrogation, but it hints at suckysucky) So it's like, oh eli you can't go because if they get you we're fqcked. And conveniently before he sees you off, 'they' (the combine) go jiggle with his head.
 
massive objects like planets and stars warps spacetime, things that orbit around it are simply following the curves of this warping in spacetime.

a good examplepicture:
http://www.astronomynotes.com/evolutn/grwarp.gif

in a black hole this warping is so heavy that it reaches the breakingpoint, just like putting a very heavy ball on a piece of paper, spacetime rips apart and the laws of physics come to an end.
 
It says 'Imagine a rocket drifting in gravity free space' i.e 'in a space without gravity', not 'in Space with no gravity'

Space, as far as i know is the stuff outside the earth's atmosphere, or all the black empty stuff. A space on the other hand is just an ideal place in which to show a theory, i.e the conservation of momentum. It doesn't technically exist in the context it is being referred to.

I see what you're saying... for some reason I was approaching it from the point of view that it was a guide specifically for what Dr. Magnusson was trying to accomplish...

Your completely right. I misread that.
 
It says 'Imagine a rocket drifting in gravity free space' i.e 'in a space without gravity', not 'in Space with no gravity'

Space, as far as i know is the stuff outside the earth's atmosphere, or all the black empty stuff. A space on the other hand is just an ideal place in which to show a theory, i.e the conservation of momentum. It doesn't technically exist in the context it is being referred to.


space is not outside our atmosphere (that would mean time exists only outside our atmosphere because its spacetime) , it is everywhere within the visible universe.
 
space is not outside our atmosphere (that would mean time exists only outside our atmosphere because its spacetime) , it is everywhere within the visible universe.

Well i don't do Astrophysics :|
 
That would be "outer" space...

Sorry for launching this thread WAY off topic.
 
I agree with Sedako.

As lame as it may sound, I think the Advisor was extracting information from Eli. When Dog attacked, the Advisor was so deeply focused on Eli it didn't notice until its companion was scrambling away. They didn't even attempt to fight (although perhaps Dog is immune to their telekinesis) and earlier in the game the Advisor fled at the first sign of danger. A group of them overseeing the Combine forces could easily neutralise the resistance but they stay safely hidden in the Citadel or their pods. Desperate times call for desperate measures, and now that they are completely cut off the Advisors risk their precious selves to kill Eli and learn from him at the same time.

This is Half-Life so perhaps what they gained from him is more subtle than a reel of thoughts and knowledge.
 
Desperate times call for desperate measures, and now that they are completely cut off the Advisors risk their precious selves to kill Eli and learn from him at the same time.

Yeah, that's basically how I saw it too. Isolated, they really had no other choice. They have been after Eli for some time though. They call Alyx "Vance subprime."
 
They aren't really controlling you.. it's more like telekinesis than telepathy. All they're doing is moving you with whatever powers they possess.

Well how can they make you have tunnel vision and sepia tone vision if not by getting in you're mind?
 
The Advisors are essentially chickens from what we have seen. Every time one has been damaged, they've run.
The first one is damaged by the explosion (not just running at the sign of danger), the second legs it if you shoot him from the top of the silo and the last two head for the hills when Dog gets his groove on.
The basic principle of tk would seem to preclude Dog being immune, although I guess anything is possible.
As you say though just because they seem to have read his mind doesn't mean they know everything he knew. The extent of the damage dealt by Eli's death will surely feature in Ep3. One thought, who will take his place? He didn't just lead the resistance but also the scientific effort. Kliener and Magnusson can barely discuss a theorum without it devolving into an argument apparently.
 
I don't think dog is immune, I think he just caught the one advisor off guard. I mean, they can break glass, make wood splinters into a tornado formation, why wouldn't they be able to push back dog?
 
Well how can they make you have tunnel vision and sepia tone vision if not by getting in you're mind?

Maybe because it wasn't exactly a pleasant experience? You saw what it did to the barrel and the dead resistance guy. Tunnel vision can be caused by extreme fear or distress as well as a lack of blood flow to the brain. I think that sounds about right, considering you were pretty much helpless as your whole body was being "squeezed".
 
Valve actually refered to the Advisor's attacks as "mind blasts" in Ep. 1's commentary, so they're most likely telepathic in nature.
 
Valve actually refered to the Advisor's attacks as "mind blasts" in Ep. 1's commentary, so they're most likely telepathic in nature.

Oh yeah, I forgot about those. I thought he was talking about the barn scene. Perhaps they do possess limited telepathy and telekinesis. I still don't believe they can read your mind directly though. If that were the case they could just hold you there snap your body when they were through with you.

The other evidence against this is the duration of time they spent "probing" the dead guy vs Eli. The advisor quickly realized that it's first potential victim was already dead, and cast him aside to move on to Gordon. When they grabbed Eli, they spent much longer attached to him, so I think it's pretty obvious that it was going through his thoughts.
 
Except we've been through this argument. See it how you want to see it of course but it's equally arguable that dead guy brains simply don't taste as nice as live genius brains.
Yes if they can read your thoughts whilst in close proximity then they could read your thoughts and then just break you but if you recall the barn scene they probed the dead guy and still broke him afterwards. They just seem to like causing pain and terror and destruction.
 
Maybe because it wasn't exactly a pleasant experience? You saw what it did to the barrel and the dead resistance guy. Tunnel vision can be caused by extreme fear or distress as well as a lack of blood flow to the brain. I think that sounds about right, considering you were pretty much helpless as your whole body was being "squeezed".

If you body is going through so much stress that your fear starts to cause tunnel vision (which I don't even think is medically correct) you won be able to have fluent conversations like Alyx and Dr.Eli did.

Oh yeah, I forgot about those. I thought he was talking about the barn scene. Perhaps they do possess limited telepathy and telekinesis. I still don't believe they can read your mind directly though. If that were the case they could just hold you there snap your body when they were through with you.

The other evidence against this is the duration of time they spent "probing" the dead guy vs Eli. The advisor quickly realized that it's first potential victim was already dead, and cast him aside to move on to Gordon. When they grabbed Eli, they spent much longer attached to him, so I think it's pretty obvious that it was going through his thoughts.

This was done on the already dead resistance fighter in the barn scene.

And as for your last part. If the advisors only probed to get info, then why cast aside the dead rebel so quickly? I'm pretty sure a dead rebel has alot of valuable information about the resistance. Which supports my point that they only do it for food, the advisor was hungry so he probed the dead guy, and maybe didn't like him because he was stale? So casted him aside. I also think the eli probe took longer simply for dramatic effect, valve really wanted to hammer it home that we where losing a big character so they made a dramatic scene.
 
I also think the eli probe took longer simply for dramatic effect, valve really wanted to hammer it home that we where losing a big character so they made a dramatic scene.

Yeah, it could yet be either effect. Even assuming that any kind of mind reading went on at all.
 
I guess we'll have to wait until either official word or Episode 3. I'd be happy to end this discussion now, as it doesn't seem too be going too far. :p
 
Hmmm, there's a number of perceivable discrepancies about Advisers and their head tentacle stab. I'm going to try a quick narrative from my perspective to see if anything suggests itself.

Half Life 2, we don't see Advisers face to gas-mask. Breen only communicates with them via screens in the citadel. This suggests that, save the one assigned to, er, advise Breen, all the Advisers are in some sort of stasis. This itself answers a few questions. Since the big grubs are doing... whatever it is they do, I doubt Overwatch forces are going to wake them up just to brain read some poor Resistance schmuck they happened to pick up. This means they resort to more... traditional means of information extraction, leading to those wonderful bits of narrative Gordon stumbles across everywhere. This also means that humanity has absolutely no idea that Advisers are capable of whatever they did to Eli. It is likely the Vorts knew beforehand, but considering how difficult it is to get a straight answer out of them, that information probably never passed to the Resistance.

I'm also in the boat that Advisers don't actually remove the brain from the body to gain memories. Considering the nature of their freaky little appendage, I rather believe it just forces itself through the base of the skull into the brain stem and "interfaces" from there. In fact, this may explain why the Adviser didn't notice Dog until he was finished. If he were "plugged" into Eli's noggin and reliving his long term memories, I imagine the process would take him out of current events. This suggests a sequence in Episode 3, where you can possibly get the drop on an adviser while he's brain probing.

And finally, I think I have an idea why the widdle baby grub tried to plug a barrel and a dead guy before getting to Gordon. The Vorts mention that they are trying to find Advisers before they hatch. I think it is fairly well implied that the Adviser we encounter is, in fact, barely a newborn, what with the lack of robot arms and the fact that it is somewhat smaller than other advisers.. It doesn't know what humans look like, nor how they're supposed to act. Thus, upon being rudely awakened, it simply grabbed the 4 most prominent things in the room, and then proceeded to examine them in order.
 
The Vortigaunts certainly don't let humanity in on everything they know, for instance they didn't tell Eli about Alyx being injured.
 
The Advisors flee from Dog for two reasons: They did the most important thing, killing Eli, and he completely takes them off guard. If Dog had stayed with us into the hangar, the Advisors could probably have ripped him apart, snapped his wires, whatever; turned him into a scrap pile if they were sufficiently determined.
 
Plus the fact that he wounded one of the Advisors sufficiently enough to flee, perhaps unnerving the other one.
 
It sure was ****ing hilarious seeing it get all scared and trying to crawl away.

That proves they gotta concentrate to do their business.
 
In my opion, the first Advisor (rebel one) tounge-thing was just so you Knewwhat was going to happen to Eli.
 
It sure was ****ing hilarious seeing it get all scared and trying to crawl away.

That proves they gotta concentrate to do their business.
That was hideous. They were a lot less maggot-like until that one started squirming for its life on the ground. Yuck.

I'm on my third round through the game, and I just noticed that the Vortigaunt says that they will be hunting (searching for?) the Advisors. Tough nuggets those vorts are.
 
The Advisors flee from Dog for two reasons: They did the most important thing, killing Eli, and he completely takes them off guard. If Dog had stayed with us into the hangar, the Advisors could probably have ripped him apart, snapped his wires, whatever; turned him into a scrap pile if they were sufficiently determined.

An advisor seems to only have the capacity to restrain two humanoid forms - notice how the single advisor pinned Gordon and Alyx but was free to be smacked by Eli. It wasn't until the second one arrived that they had total control.

Now, when dog attacks one of the advisors, he renders it incapable of using its abilities either because it is too damaged or too distressed. The remaining advisor could have only restrained two of them, and been vulnerable to the third.
 
Sure, as long as you ignore the fact that in the barn a newly-hatched one holds up four items.
 
Back
Top