Question on ethics

[poseyjmac]

haha no, not like the ps2 and xbox. comparing ps2 and xboxs protection against what palladium is going to do is absurd and laughable. i suggest you read more, unless you want to stay with the blind masses that say 'oh they will find a way, they always have'.

but of course i see the partial advantages of thinking that way and being hopeful, its less depressing. its the same reason people turn to religion so that the thought of dying isn't so harsh. the future looks bleak in terms of respect of privacy. its a shame that computing has to come to this. but again you can thank piracy for lack of privacy and options.

 

[Fixed]

There's always a way, your obvious deeper understanding of the issues is truely humbling.

As an aside, you know you're an arrogant and overall quite stupid fu*kwit, right?

 

[poseyjmac]

no actually im very open-minded. the arrogant point of view would be the 'oh they'll find a way' mindset, dismissing every kind of attempt to stop piracy in the future. you remind of those in the early 1900s that said space travel would be impossible.

'theres always a way' can be defeated by simply mentioning steam. theres no way you can legitmately play CS on steam unless you have registered a valid cdkey. with this fact and the fact that eventually to even operate windows you will need to be connected to the internet, its not so out there.

 

[SimonomiS]

Well, personal anecdote time: I have a Steam account and so does my Dad, me being the much bigger HL Fan, downloaded *deep breath* HL, Op4, CS, DoD, TFC, DMC, Ricochet (dont even know why i did that) Codename Gordon and NS, using my HL Cd-Key. Later my Dad tried to do the same for his Steam account, but i had already used the Cd-Key which technically he bought but i play HL a lot more. Luckily he isnt that much of a HL fan anyway (More into CoD) but if he was i guess this would cause a problem. Unless we shared an account but isnt that illegal? If it isnt then people could share their account with 50 others etc. I understand why this CD-Key system is in place and it works. Cept for couples or families who play VALVe games.

 

[Letters]

Well, personal anecdote time: I have a Steam account and so does my Dad, me being the much bigger HL Fan, downloaded *deep breath* HL, Op4, CS, DoD, TFC, DMC, Ricochet (dont even know why i did that) Codename Gordon and NS, using my HL Cd-Key. Later my Dad tried to do the same for his Steam account, but i had already used the Cd-Key which technically he bought but i play HL a lot more. Luckily he isnt that much of a HL fan anyway (More into CoD) but if he was i guess this would cause a problem. Unless we shared an account but isnt that illegal? If it isnt then people could share their account with 50 others etc. I understand why this CD-Key system is in place and it works. Cept for couples or families who play VALVe games.

It's perfectly legal... but those 50 people you shared it with? Only one would be able to play at a time.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

There's always a way, your obvious deeper understanding of the issues is truely humbling.

As an aside, you know you're an arrogant and overall quite stupid fu*kwit, right?

Wow! I just got woken up by my irony-o-meter going off at ful tilt!

Cease the personal attacks, kiddo, or find yourself another site.

 

[Fixed]

Cease the personal attacks, kiddo, or find yourself another site.

Consider me suitably chastised, I'll play nice. Play nicer at any rate.

The observation was accurate, as such I don't feel it necessary to edit the post - however I won't repeat it.

 

[MrD]

no actually im very open-minded. the arrogant point of view would be the 'oh they'll find a way' mindset, dismissing every kind of attempt to stop piracy in the future. you remind of those in the early 1900s that said space travel would be impossible.

'theres always a way' can be defeated by simply mentioning steam. theres no way you can legitmately play CS on steam unless you have registered a valid cdkey. with this fact and the fact that eventually to even operate windows you will need to be connected to the internet, its not so out there.

Not quite. It all depends on what you're trying to protect.

Take videos as an example. You'll never prevent video piracy for the simple reason that people can't watch encrypted content. No matter what fancy shenanigans you employ. You'll always have to decrypt it so the user can actually watch it. Et Voila! Hard work done! The pirate just needs to record the decrypted stream.

Same with music. In fact, I use this very technique to "re-record" songs from iTunes into a more suitable MP3 format. A format i can actually use. Up until someone else found a quicker way that is.

Pallidium is the worst thing that could ever happen. Take iTunes as an example. You can download songs to an iPod with considerable ease, but anything else requires some serious hoop jumping. With pallidium, you can basically kiss goodbye to your mix&match gadgets.

 

[poseyjmac]

well were not talking about music and videos right now, so i dont see how that information is relevant.

 

[MrD]

well were not talking about music and videos right now, so i dont see how that information is relevant.

Single Player

 

[smsKONG]

Well, if I download HL2 with my steam account, then logged off, and then go to another computer and log in with my steam account and download HL2.... take them both offline and hook up a LAN game... ? Sounds like it will work.

Sub-lon: If u already got steam why not give it a whirl on counter strike or HLDM, try running a LAN between those 2 computers and if it works then you'll have definitive evidence (since it's steam which does the authenticating and not the game-if it works for cs it'll work for HL2)
:thumbs:

 

[wonkers]

(Taking this into off-topic.) Prove it. If there's a God, he certainly doesn't need your approval, it's the other way around. Can't prove it? Not surprising.

Your just doing what you were taught to. Like a helper monkey who can remember phraises. How many people these days find god. Your parents & family likely found it for you.

Now it's a crutch for your weaker moments. Plus I don't give a damn about your thoughts, rules, or beliefs. Preach all you want. There are other humans who have a mind of their own. No one is right. Everyone is what they are.

 

[wonkers]

(on topic) You people have no idea. Look at the facts. EVERY. I mean EVERY good game or peice of software has been pirated. That's no lie or exaggeration.

Xp was Cracked before it was available to BUY. & Microsoft is one of the leaders in anti-piracy. So you people need to get off your high-horse and realise that it's not safe. Just child proof.

Valve has to try and keep it "safe" for as long as possible to increase sales. That doesn't mean it's not going to be stolen.

So get it through your tiny pee-brain skulls, IT's GOING TO BE STOLEN. Cry to mommy that the bad men stole the game you had to PAY for.

Support Valve by buying the game & they will keep making games.

 

[McFace]

Doubtful. Doom 3 hasn't and it looks like it won't leak before it hits retail stores.

It all depends on the security measures taken at the production facilities

I was right! Technically doom 3 is released august 3rd, but it's got leaked today! :naughty:

 

[wonkers]

Like I said....End of Disscussion...

 

[Falcon(Nate)]

Palladium is going to be a lot tougher to crack since most likely it would require a bypass in hardware, not software (if they implement it correctly).

In other words, you're not going to have all the people that just download something off of their favorite p2p program to get whatever it is they want anymore. This requires opening up the case and doing something to the HARDWARE. Not downloading some piece of software somebody else made to do most of the work for you... It may not completely stop piracy but it sure as heck will put a dent in it. The script kiddies are going to be out of luck unless they can find someone else to make the changes they need.

Palladium is kind of a scary thought if it ever got used incorrectly. Talk about abuse of power by someone like the RIAA... I guess you could always just go Linux and AMD.

 

[wonkers]

Palladium is going to be a lot tougher to crack since most likely it would require a bypass in hardware, not software (if they implement it correctly).

In other words, you're not going to have all the people that just download something off of their favorite p2p program to get whatever it is they want anymore. This requires opening up the case and doing something to the HARDWARE. Not downloading some piece of software somebody else made to do most of the work for you... It may not completely stop piracy but it sure as heck will put a dent in it. The script kiddies are going to be out of luck unless they can find someone else to make the changes they need.

Palladium is kind of a scary thought if it ever got used incorrectly. Talk about abuse of power by someone like the RIAA... I guess you could always just go Linux and AMD.

What the hell are you talking about. & for the record. Nothing (hardware) or otherwise stops people from copying games. Xbox was Cracked pretty fast to.

Bigger harddrive that games get copied onto with programs that make it easy as copy & paste.

Hardware stops nothing.

 

[poseyjmac]

What the hell are you talking about. & for the record. Nothing (hardware) or otherwise stops people from copying games. Xbox was Cracked pretty fast to.

Bigger harddrive that games get copied onto with programs that make it easy as copy & paste.

Hardware stops nothing.

xbox wasn't designed around security. longhorn and palladium will be. its a whole other ballgame. read up on it yourself, and you wouldn't post such a dumb comment.

 

[arma_uk]

There are three of us in our house who play SoF2 online at the same time and we all had to have our own copies, our 1.5mbit connection copes nicely. Granted, only one was bought at full price as the others bought the game on "budget" for £10 but we didn't have a problem with it. We could have gotten away with playing on non-PB servers but that would narrow the options down a lot.

I think a "family" licence would be a good idea, say 1.5x (perhaps a bit more) the cost of a single player licence. You can generally get family tickets to see a movie or a theme park at a discount on individual prices so why not extend it to video games? To the server the IP address would appear to be the same, the router sorts of where each player's data is sent to / from. Authentication could be an issue as IP addresses have a habit of changing, even for people on ADSL / cable if they reboot the PC or reset the router etc. Someone mentioned proxying the connections to get round the "one family licence = several connections from one household" issue though, so I dunno... surely there would be some way of preventing that??

Until or unless family game licences exist then I'd have to agree that 1 original copy per PC is fair and just. If the game is good enough to play then it's good enough to pay for - if you get enjoyment out of a product then reward the artist / author.

 

[Sub_Lon]

There are three of us in our house who play SoF2 online at the same time and we all had to have our own copies, our 1.5mbit connection copes nicely. Granted, only one was bought at full price as the others bought the game on "budget" for £10 but we didn't have a problem with it. We could have gotten away with playing on non-PB servers but that would narrow the options down a lot.

I think a "family" licence would be a good idea, say 1.5x (perhaps a bit more) the cost of a single player licence. You can generally get family tickets to see a movie or a theme park at a discount on individual prices so why not extend it to video games? To the server the IP address would appear to be the same, the router sorts of where each player's data is sent to / from. Authentication could be an issue as IP addresses have a habit of changing, even for people on ADSL / cable if they reboot the PC or reset the router etc. Someone mentioned proxying the connections to get round the "one family licence = several connections from one household" issue though, so I dunno... surely there would be some way of preventing that??

Until or unless family game licences exist then I'd have to agree that 1 original copy per PC is fair and just. If the game is good enough to play then it's good enough to pay for - if you get enjoyment out of a product then reward the artist / author.

No chance in hell I'm going to "reward" the author 3 times by buying 3 copies of his game. If security truley is that tight, I think it will turn people towards piracy. I'm all for the author getting what they're due, but not to the point where a family of 5 has to fork out $150 -$200 so the kids can play. f-that.

 

[wonkers]

NOTHING STOPS PEOPLE FROM COPYING GAMES OR SOFTWARE. Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and see the bigger picture. Over and Over people seem to think something is copyproof.

Like I friggen said before. XP was cracked before it was out to purchase. So before you come here spewing the filth you call intelligent conversation maybe you should think first. Longhorn is just the codename for their new OS called .NET I knew about .NET a year ago, when the codename was broken and info leaked. Just like all "top secret" BS people find out sooner or later.

If people can crack XP they will crack .NET It's a matter of time. It's something your going to have to understand. For every well paid Programmer there is ten crackers with something to PROVE.

 

[poseyjmac]

NOTHING STOPS PEOPLE FROM COPYING GAMES OR SOFTWARE. Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and see the bigger picture. Over and Over people seem to think something is copyproof.

Like I friggen said before. XP was cracked before it was out to purchase. So before you come here spewing the filth you call intelligent conversation maybe you should think first. Longhorn is just the codename for their new OS called .NET I knew about .NET a year ago, when the codename was broken and info leaked. Just like all "top secret" BS people find out sooner or later.

If people can crack XP they will crack .NET It's a matter of time. It's something your going to have to understand. For every well paid Programmer there is ten crackers with something to PROVE.

the ramblings of a desperate pirate.. you forgot about palladium and DRM though.

 

[Scotchy]

That's a really really really sad, depressing outlook on life.

wowow... that actually rigns true to me. Now I love people, and im a VERY very generous person (to a fault most of the time), but even I am confortable acknoledging that selfless acts are not 100% selfless... or often even 10% selfless. You are nice so people will be nice to you, you give so that you may either receive of be thought well of, so on and so forth. Now there are plenty of times where you want to do something good for someone else with the motivation being seemingly selfless... but dig deep... people are complex monkies... we almost invariable have ulterior motives.

This kind of thing comes out of observing children. If a child does something wrong, they arent sorry because they did something wrong, they are sorry because they are caught. When a child chooses to not do a ba thing, it isn't because it's bad, it's out of a desire not to be punished. That's basic psychology.


Now about this whole ordeal, Lan parties should be quite easily done, and people on a router could do internet play easily since they are all masked under the router.

 

[poseyjmac]

yea scotchy, i believe in similar things, although i believe even if you sacrafice your life for a stranger, as selfless at it seems, it in turn makes you feel good before you die that you thought you did a good thing, thus its not a truly selfless act. basically if you do anything for another person and it makes you feel good about yourself in the slightless, its part selfish. now thats depressing!

 

[kevinb456]

so basically, its impossible to do anything for someone else!

now THATS a really really really sad, depressing outlook on life. (weve done a full u-turn and back to where we started lol!!)

 

[smullin]

wow, I just looked at this. Didn't read the whole thing, but I'm surprised to see other people who believe nothing is truly selfless. We can get close, but, yeah... Most people disagree with me strongly on that, cool =)

 

[wonkers]

I am not a pirate. I don't steal games that deserve to be baught. I don't crack games. I am not a programmer. I just see the truth. I don't care how smart people think they are. Show me a piece of software that hasn't been stolen & I will shut up. (discluding stuff people don't know about or don't want to steal)

In essance there is no right or wrong. Just want and want not. Majority or minority are just consequence of and average feeling in the mass of humans.

 

[poseyjmac]

so basically, its impossible to do anything for someone else!

now THATS a really really really sad, depressing outlook on life. (weve done a full u-turn and back to where we started lol!!)

well it actually i take that back, it shouldn't be too depressing. i mean if we all coexist to make each other happy, life is good

 

[B.Calhoun]

One time I got pissed at my sister and picked up the nearest thing (half life CD) and threw it at her. Unfortunately, it broke. She laughed at me and I wrote a letter to Sierra explaining what I did. They replaced it for me.

lol thats funny as hell, i cant believe they would replace it for you. Because after all it was your fault, next time just punch your sister in the face with your fist.....nah dont do that on second thought.

 

[wonkers]

Doom 3 is "out there" Complain to me that "bad things" don't happen.