Rumoured used game ban for next Xbox "Fantastic" according to Volition employee.

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Gargantou

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http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/121/1218051p1.html

Excerpts from article:

Last month, rumors began circulating that the next Xbox will block the play of used games. Saints Row: The Third designer Jameson Durall has spoken out about the rumor, calling the idea "fantastic."

In a blog post on #AltDevBlogADay, Durall writes, "Personally I think this would be a fantastic change for our business. Even though the consumers would be up in arms about it at first, they will grow to understand why and that it won't kill them."
 
Is Gamestop fighting this at all? I imagine a pretty hefty percentage of their income comes from selling used titles.
 
Atleast 90% of my games are used. This would literally kill the system for me and make it not even worth buying.
 
I understand the business model at work here. How to make more money.

I think they lose money on console sales and make up for that (in vast amounts) through new game sales. They don't get jack from used games so essentially they want to get rid of customers like Dog-- if they don't convert to buying all new shit.
 
I think consoles should die anyways and this new DRM method should help things along nicely.

Small minded developers like this guy should really stop for a moment and think who it is that actually buys their games. That's right, the customer. You want your customers to be happy about your products and not 'up in arms'.
 
I'm feeling very ambivalent when it comes to Volition. On one hand they made 2 of my favorite game series (red faction & saints row), but on the other hand they practically killed off the red faction series themselves, and then you've got shit like this. WTF Volition?
 
DEAHTMASTER, yes but if they go this route then I think they should just abandon physical copies altogether and fully embrace the Microsoft "Games on Demand" system.
 
DEATHMASTER said:
I understand the business model at work here. How to make more money.

I think they lose money on console sales and make up for that (in vast amounts) through new game sales. They don't get jack from used games so essentially they want to get rid of customers like Dog-- if they don't convert to buying all new shit.
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Well, I guess Im in that boat with Dog--. While i understand all the 'make more money' reasoning, it would pretty much kill my gaming. Almost all of my games are used, and as for 'converting to buying all new', well, then the amount of games I buy will fall drastically. £45-50 for a new game? are you ****ing joking me? I just wouldnt be able to play like I do now.

So again, **** you jameson with your shitty opinions.
 
I'm pretty sure someone will make a work around for the used game issue. I for one buy used games all the time and have never stolen a game nor would I download a copy unless paid for
 
DEATHMASTER said:
I understand the business model at work here. How to make more money.

I think they lose money on console sales and make up for that (in vast amounts) through new game sales. They don't get jack from used games so essentially they want to get rid of customers like Dog-- if they don't convert to buying all new shit.
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Everyone knows why they would do it, but there are so many reasons why they shouldn't.
 
Just because one dude at some company says something daft, don't necessarily assume the entire company think that way.
 
Small mindedness really. But at this point it sounds like you giving them $60 for a game once a year is acceptable to them than you getting many games for the same amount but none of that dough going to them directly. Yeah there's a list of reasons how that's NOT beneficial to them but that's how idiots work. Just have to hope it's not the guy in charge making those decisions.
 
They should start banning used books too. :V

Yet another reason why the Ebert crowd still wins the "art" debate.
 
morgs said:
Everyone knows why they would do it, but there are so many reasons why they shouldn't.
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Like what? The ONLY people who profit from used game sales are places like Gamestop. Buying used does nothing at all to support the industry.
 
Gets the game out int the public more than it would if the game cost $60. Get's fans of the game and/or fans of the company.. Could get lots of sales that way. Now most people aren't gonna play certain games until they go down in price like a year after release.
 
Fans who don't contribute to the financial well-being of the company they're a fan are worthless fans." Herp derp, I love u *game company* but ima give mah money do this other dude so you don't get none. Luv ur games tho!"
Bullshit. And "Getting the name out there" is primarily a factor of advertising and hype building before the game is released. The majority of game sales happen in the first couple weeks, not after people see their friends playing it a couple weeks later.

Plus if developers/publishers got more sales that actually pertained to them, they could stop charging $60 for them. Not that companies like Activision would, but many others probably would.
 
No others would. Every single game released is the exact same price, they'll stay that way.

And I didn't say fans buying used games I meant a person buying a cheap used game and becoming a fan, therefore more likely to buy the next one they make when it's new.
 
Dog-- said:
And I didn't say fans buying used games I meant a person buying a cheap used game and becoming a fan, therefore more likely to buy the next one they make when it's new.
Click to expand...

Like this guy?

Dog-- said:
Atleast 90% of my games are used. This would literally kill the system for me and make it not even worth buying.
Click to expand...

Or is he just not a fan of anything?
 
Krynn72 said:
Like this guy?



Or is he just not a fan of anything?
Click to expand...

The other 10% are games I bought new because I support the dev. Skyrim/Oblivion/Morrowind/Fallout 3 + Vegas - Bethesda. Portal 1, 2, HL2, EP1, EP2 - Valve. Starcraft, Starcraft 2, Diablo 1, 2 + LoD, WoW, Soon D3 - Blizzard. Although they don't exist anymore - Looking glass Studios with System Shock 1, 2, Thief 1, 2. Bioshock 1, 2 soon to be Infinite, SWAT 4 + SS, Tribes - Irrational. These are all games I bought because I support these developers. I bought Morrowind second hand and that got me into Bethesda, bought HL2 in bargain bin on a whim got me into valve (obviously), Diablo 1 second hand got me into Blizzard, SS2 with Thief 1 for LGS, and SS2 with Irrational, I bought all the other games brand new.

So yea, like this guy.
 
Great, now that used games sales are out of the way, we can drop new releases to $30... right guys? Guys? hello?...
 
Krynn72 said:
Plus if developers/publishers got more sales that actually pertained to them, they could stop charging $60 for them. Not that companies like Activision would, but many others probably would.
Click to expand...

You have fair arguments, but believing they might stop charging $50 and $60 for new titles is unlikely.
 
I think this makes perfect sense for the developers, because an used game makes them as much money as a copied game. Tying a game to a person should be fine, not tying a game to a machine though.

If you want games to be less than $60 just invest some money in a (cheaper in the long term) PC which has no fees from the console builder. The Xbox 360's price is a horrible trap with the money you have to pay for online play/games.
 
Dog-- said:
The other 10% are games I bought new because I support the dev. Skyrim/Oblivion/Morrowind/Fallout 3 + Vegas - Bethesda. Portal 1, 2, HL2, EP1, EP2 - Valve. Starcraft, Starcraft 2, Diablo 1, 2 + LoD, WoW, Soon D3 - Blizzard. Although they don't exist anymore - Looking glass Studios with System Shock 1, 2, Thief 1, 2. Bioshock 1, 2 soon to be Infinite, SWAT 4 + SS, Tribes - Irrational. These are all games I bought because I support these developers. I bought Morrowind second hand and that got me into Bethesda, bought HL2 in bargain bin on a whim got me into valve (obviously), Diablo 1 second hand got me into Blizzard, SS2 with Thief 1 for LGS, and SS2 with Irrational, I bought all the other games brand new.

So yea, like this guy.
Click to expand...

That's a great policy assuming enough people buy said games new that they even get a sequel.~
 
Its pretty obv that the next gen consoles will be more geared towards digital distribution. Esp after the success of steam etc. second hand game sales dont really work in a digital format.

I'm personaly not a big fan of second hand game sales and if I want a game will always buy new. Second hand just takes money away from the dev's and stops them making games in the future. But I can see how trading in games helps off set the £40 price tag. The best system I feel is the Dice style VIP code system. If you buy second hand you pay a small fee to get online. This gives the Dev the cash they disurve for developing a game wile still making the game cheap.

Also this attitude that £40 is a lot of money for games is total rubbish and annoys the crap out of me. Video games are FANTASTIC value for money. The price you pay per hour of entertainment is tiny compared to so many other activitys. The cinema is now £8 for 2 hours! A night at the pub is £30! A meal out in a decent restaurant is £20! So 40quid for 10 hours+ at least? Or real awesome games... battlefield 3 for example I've hit 120 hours! Thats just fantastic value for money.
 
Ease of use is pretty much the only good reason to buy an Xbox or PS3 (unless you really, really love Metal Gear Solid or Halo). Good job Microsoft (if this rumour is true).
 
ZT said:
You have fair arguments, but believing they might stop charging $50 and $60 for new titles is unlikely.
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PC versions of multiplatform games are typically $10 cheaper because they dont have to pay Microsoft or Sony to release their game on it (again, not talking about games from publishers like Activision). Thats because they see an increased percentage of that purchase as profit, and thus willing to charge less. I dont see why that same principle is so unlikely to play out in this scenario.
 
Stormy said:
Its pretty obv that the next gen consoles will be more geared towards digital distribution. Esp after the success of steam etc. second hand game sales dont really work in a digital format.
Click to expand...

Digital games have flourished on PC in part because there's multiple competing retailers. Who's going to be selling the games digitally for Xbox? Microsoft... aaaaand that's it. Hope you like paying RRP!~
 
Steam has had this business model for years so what's the problem?
 
You'd think this is against some kind of Consumer Protection Law...it should be anyways.

Lucid console gaming is a another world though...all my buddies are always selling their games to buy new ones etc.If anything this would hurt new game sales.
 
Perhaps. But £40 quid is still RRP..

I dont think prices will change much but it will still have some kind of dvd/blue ray drive. Consoles are just big media centres which is very unlikly to change.
 
Stormy said:
I dont think prices will change much but it will still have some kind of dvd/blue ray drive. Consoles are just big media centres which is very unlikly to change.
Click to expand...

80% the reasoning behind why I bought a PS3 last year. And I have to join the band-wagon on used-game buying, here. 5% of why I bought a PS3 is for playing games, which I mostly buy used. You essentially never will buy a "too scratched" used PS3 disk since Blue-Ray discs have some sort of scratch resistance surface tech. The other 15% is for homebrew (not for pirating reasons, btw).

But, that's not to say I do not buy new games. If a title interests me, I will buy it upon release; or even preorder it. This is the case mostly for the PC platform, though. The exception here is when there is PS3 exclusives (such as Uncharted 3). In these cases, I want as much of my money to go to, for example, Naughty Dog as possible, so I will buy upon release and pay the full $60.
 
Lucid said:
Steam has had this business model for years so what's the problem?
Click to expand...
Well what's the point of buying a console if it's not going to be any easier than playing your damn game on the PC?
 
Used game sales DO benefit the industry. Where do people think a lot of the money received from turning in 2nd hand games goes? Straight back on new titles. Eliminate the 2nd hand games market and it won't just be consumers like Dog who duck out - it'll be plenty of people who pay full release price, confident in the knowledge they can sell on a game once they beat it or if it stinks. Then there's the prevalence of DLC nowadays which means 2nd hand users are still being monetised. Durall's soundbyte is pure greedy shortsightedness.

I consider all of that fairly irrelevant to the more significant principle, anyway, which is this: why should companies be able to dictate the terms of the market purely to maximise their own profits? What god-given right do they have to selling goods that consumers don't also have? Granted, that question applies less to digital distribution, since it's just a fact that games companies control that marketplace.
 
Second-hand titles aren't quite a zero-sum game for games publishers as the retailers take a cut each time, but it can't be that big a loss as Laivasse explains above.
 
Yeah, when I say they benefit, more accurately I mean they don't simply represent $60/*insert typical RRP here* down the drain for the dev & publisher.
 
I wonder what effect this will have on console modding / piracy and such. I can imagine if people can't even save some money on used games they'll just pirate everything.

A bit of a leap in logic, but I wouldn't be surprised.
 
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