Scripted sequence

[Axyon]

I'd seriously doubt Valve would go far to make Half-Life 2 so damn realistic and advanced, but they make it so that enemies/allies are invincible during 'scripted' sequences.

 

[Lifthz]

If it's truly A.I. it will happen like if it was real life. That's all I have to say about that.

Originally posted by dawdler
Not having scripts is like trying to make a movie without a camera. You can do it, but no one would see it

Btw, triggers and scripts are the same thing. They are just the scripts controlling the script

Movie vs Simulation. Or a mix. Hmm... I choose a mix.

Having a completely predictable game is boring after you play it the first time.

 

[Interl@ce]

i remember one thing....

in half-life 1, when you just exited the train and entered black mesa, the security guard from behind the desk starts talking to you "i had a bunch of messages for you blabla", if, on the other hand, you push the alarm button next to him, the alarm would go off, he'd stop talking and say "hey! stop that!" and the alarm goes off.

Kinda like when you knock over the monitor and kleiner says "ow, do be careful", but it's more interactive because he continues his work (or script) instead of stopping. that's kinda cool, a script that pauses another script, plays, then lets the other script continue where it left off.

(i call it scripts because i don't think the AI is that much advanced that kleiner decides to say "ow do be careful" by his intellegence, but although it is a tiny (interactive) scripted thing, it's pretty cool and only increases the fun and quality of the gameplay.

So basically what i'm trying to point out is the difference between scripted sequences in HL1 and HL2 (from what i've seen so far ), and that scripts aren't always annoying, bad, or degrading gameplay. They can be neccesary for the story to be told and fun too ! :bounce:

 

[grompl]

Originally posted by dawdler
Not having scripts is like trying to make a movie without a camera. You can do it, but no one would see it

You can´t make a movie without a camera. that´s not a good comparison.
without scripts that make the environment (objects, NPCs etc.) around the player acting, it would be like a movie in which you only see main actor walking through manhattan, for example, and there were no other persons in the background which would be totally unrealistic. it would be like only what´s connected directly to the story would move, or be interactive n stuff. the virtual world would be...lifeless and sterile

 

[Axyon]

Originally posted by Interl@ce
i remember one thing....

in half-life 1, when you just exited the train and entered black mesa, the security guard from behind the desk starts talking to you "i had a bunch of messages for you blabla", if, on the other hand, you push the alarm button next to him, the alarm would go off, he'd stop talking and say "hey! stop that!" and the alarm goes off.

Kinda like when you knock over the monitor and kleiner says "ow, do be careful", but it's more interactive because he continues his work (or script) instead of stopping. that's kinda cool, a script that pauses another script, plays, then lets the other script continue where it left off.

(i call it scripts because i don't think the AI is that much advanced that kleiner decides to say "ow do be careful" by his intellegence, but although it is a tiny (interactive) scripted thing, it's pretty cool and only increases the fun and quality of the gameplay.

So basically what i'm trying to point out is the difference between scripted sequences in HL1 and HL2 (from what i've seen so far ), and that scripts aren't always annoying, bad, or degrading gameplay. They can be neccesary for the story to be told and fun too ! :bounce:

I think Kleiner may have had several "barks" for if that happened, instead of saying just "Oh, do be careful", he could have a randomly placed choice between others like "Watch it, Freeman!" or "That's expensive, watch it!" etc.

Just to add some variation.

 

[Dagobert]

Well in HL1 what would have happened is you'd shoot him, but he wouldn't die until he'd acted out his script.

Nope, you can flag a scripted_sequence so it's interruptable or not.

 

[dawdler]

Originally posted by grompl
You can´t make a movie without a camera. that´s not a good comparison.
without scripts that make the environment (objects, NPCs etc.) around the player acting, it would be like a movie in which you only see main actor walking through manhattan, for example, and there were no other persons in the background which would be totally unrealistic. it would be like only what´s connected directly to the story would move, or be interactive n stuff. the virtual world would be...lifeless and sterile

And the reason it isnt a good comparison is...? My point was that the camera is the movies way of relaying everything, from terror to tension to action to love. Without using a camera, you get absolutely nothing. Without using scripts you get absolutely nothing.

But what you are forgetting is that the objects, NPC and the rest are not scripted, not neccesarily. It can be part of the AI, in which case it isnt something the director (aka map editor) can alter. They can walk around just fine, even say hello, it still isnt a script, the AI is instructed to say hello to a friend. Objects arent scripted either. The scene in the tunnels where the multiple manhacks come toward you would be a MASSIVE script in an old game (dont even want to think about animating all that). In HL2 you probably either let them spawn from the start (they cant see you, wont move) or you spawn them when entering the area (a trigger script, but you need em to make the game, its not an option), and just let em at the player.

Edit: Yeah it sounds contradictive, but even though the AI can do alot on its own together with the physics, you still need pure scripts. A game would still be boring without fancy preset camera movement and characters doing specific stuff

 

[The Duke]

Originally posted by Anwar
I dont see how scripted events hurt replay at all.

They probably help it. Just like when you watch a good movie for the second time you notice the little details that you missed the first time.

Certain events must exist for a story to exist... otherwise you are shooting at AI for no reason at all.

Script is a way for the author to tell his story.

Of course there have to be some scripts, but look at it like this: Each time you play through (after the first), you'll know exactly when you'll be attacked, and by what. You'll know when the striders pop out, and you'll which wall they pop out of.

Scripts are a necessary evil, though.

 

[Anwar]

I’m sorry but that is pretty misinformed.

It can’t be a different game every time you turn it on. That’s why it will ship with multiplayer.

I think all of this fuss is pointless.

 

[commando]

remember KLIENERS LAB..

well you can hit the pc over and he says something, now that makes a change in the script really, because the scientist says like be careful.
and u see alyx look shocked. now if u didn't do this they would jus continue what they did.


also with the combine. Aylx is saying "OH NO" to the tenticles not the combine.

he appears after she says it and see's the tenticles.

if you shoot him, the tenticle would jus kill u.

when i watched the 10min preview vid from PCGAMING WORLD. well it showed all 12 but only bits of each and also a lady was talking the whole way through telling you all about it.

and she said "no scripted scene" "can be changed by the way u play"

 

[Rabid Llama]

There is a game already with no scripted sequences. It's called Quake 3 (Or UT2k3, I suppose).

Scripted sequences will be necessary until technology advances to the point where you can have AI with actual personalities. Then you can create several AI characters and have them actually *interact*. Infinite replayability, there, and very "real," assuming the AI is perfect.

This level of AI is a LONG way off -- right now getting a computer to show even rudimentary emotion is cutting-edge, so having it form throughts based on opinions, feelings, and its own point-of-view is nowhere near possible yet.

So, the best that can be done right now is to have a scriptwriter figure out what's supposed to happen, and have that story be told through some sort of hard scripting. The EVENTS have to be scripted.

HL1 used a method where anything that had to happen for the story to progress actually HAD to happen -- you couldn't stop it. I think HL2 will follow a very similar method, but with a bit more flexibility. The combine trooper will always climb down the ladder, the tentacles will always appear, but it won't be a completely "you just watch it happen" experience.

And I bet if you kill Alyx, it gives you a game over. "Subject failed to make full use of the human resources available to him."

 

[commando]

maybe.....but did that happen in hl1??

the game never said game over if u killed someone?

so why would they make a gameover in this one if u kill an allie..

MAAAAAAAAAYBEEEEEEEEEEE.

if u kill allies too much, you will end up being on the bad side with GMAN!


HAHAAH THAT WOULD SOOO ROCK! complete change of story.

 

[Rabid Llama]

Originally posted by commando
maybe.....but did that happen in hl1??

the game never said game over if u killed someone?

so why would they make a gameover in this one if u kill an allie..

MAAAAAAAAAYBEEEEEEEEEEE.

if u kill allies too much, you will end up being on the bad side with GMAN!


HAHAAH THAT WOULD SOOO ROCK! complete change of story.

Yes HL1 did that in certain places, and came up with a black screen saying something pretty close to the quote at the end of my post ^
Like when you had to have a barney open a gate or something -- if you killed him or he was killed, game over. I mean, it only makes sense -- he's the only way you can get that door open, after all.

I suppose HL2 could offer up alternate routes or ways to open the door or somesuch, but I have a feeling that Barney, Kliner, Alyx, etc. play a more important role than just punching in keycodes.

 

[Chris D]

Commando, if you killed a scientist or a barney or failed to protect them if they needed to open a door to an important area and you progressing in the game depended on that character opening the door for you then you would get Game Over.

Don't you remember?

 

[commando]

yea i know aylx prob won't be able to die.

hmm well hl2 did say no scripted scenes.

hmm i dunno we will all see what happens.

if u can kill the main characters and still play on, i would say hl2 are jus WOW.

can't explain.

but if it said like gameover, then well hay that is still V cool

 

[Mac84]

Originally posted by The Duke
Well, that's yet to be seen. We can hope though.

in the interview with gabe, he said the scripted sequences will be much more interactive. so although it has yet to be seen, it can be confirmed

 

[Chris D]

commando - there'd be no point in letting you play on without Alyx. she's an integral part of the storyline and it'd be a 100% different game, and a very unique game, if the story could evolve itself around her absence. And she won't be invincible if you try to kill because that'd be unrealistic. I'm guessing it'd be the Game Over screen - which I always thought was cool.

 

[Mountain Man]

I get the impression that Gabe Newell means no rigidly scripted sequences. In other words, there are scripted sequences throughout the game, but you can interrupt them in a number of ways or, depending on how advanced the scripting is, actually cause the sequence to progress in a different manner. This is what he means by "not like Half-Life."

In Half-Life, you couldn't interrupt any sequence short of killing someone if they were talking to you (which occasionally had the side effect of ending the game right then and there). For instance, when the scientest is eaten by the swimming creature, you couldn't save him by shooting the creature.

 

[Guest]

Well the final game will have only a small portion of scripted AI, the big part of AI is relay on calculation technology.

 

[Interl@ce]

Basic Grunt AI: Freeman + manipulator gun = run like hell

 

[Lifthz]

Could kill him before he comes down the ladder. Unless they programmed it so that you can't interact with him at all, which would be dumb.

 

[@bel]

read this:

"In a SCRIPTED sequence..."

 

[Styloid]

I'd like the story parts to be scripted/authored.
But the action should be all AI.

 

[Chris D]

Scripted sequences still exist but they're much more interactive. Pay attention!!

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

this is a rather sily thread. Of course parts of the game such as the alyx talking to you are scripted. The thing is valve has made them interactive.
thats the key point