These animal rights activists are crazy.

[CptStern]

does no one ever read anything I post? why do I even bother?

for the last time ..THEY DONT FUND ANYONE ...the gave money to be used in the legal defense fund ...NOT TO BUY BOMBS

 

[Raziaar]

does no one ever read anything I post? why do I even bother?

for the last time ..THEY DONT FUND ANYONE ...the gave money to be used in the legal defense fund ...NOT TO BUY BOMBS

You actually buy into that?

I'm sorry Stern. Truely, deeply, sorry.

In their defense of these people, throwing money at them in whatever way it will be used(you can't prove its only used for defense), they're promoting violence.

 

[CptStern]

maybe you'd like to put your money where your mouth is?

ah ffs forget it ...it's like ****ing arguing with a 2 yr old

 

[Angry Lawyer]

There's a difference between animal rights activists and animal rights terrorists, by the ways.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Raziaar]

maybe you'd like to put your money where your mouth is?

ah ffs forget it ...it's like ****ing arguing to a 2 yr old

That's your only response to the fact that PETA has funded more than 150 thousand dollars to support burglary, arson(firebombing), and even attempted murder? Insult?

Some double-edge you have there, my friend... You bitch about corporations who do bad stuff like this, yet you defend another one for doing the exact same thing, and in some scenarios worse, because it involves violence, not just things like fraud.

 

[gick]

A good friend of mine is in PETA, and she's sure as hell no psycho, and neither are any of her PETA friends. Just because some members of an organization are total nutters doesnt mean that the rest of them are. Im a paid-up member of Amnesty International, but that doesnt mean I have to agree with everything they say.

Anyhoo, I've got a slightly odd stance on these things. I dont wear leather because it all comes from big corporate owned farms, and I cant tell for sure whether what i'm wearing was taken from a cow living in awful conditions. I eat meat, but only the stuff that I've bought myself from a local farm, for the same reasons. I have no problem with eating meat, because its natural. Its just the unnesescary cruelty that I can't abide.

 

[Raziaar]

Here's one of your beloved PETA members Stern. A higher up official, too, mind you.

PETA Vegetarian campaign director Bruce Friedrich apparently according to this website(yes i'm taking it mostly word by word).

http://www.consumerfreedom.com/downloads/reference/audio/010501_bruce_friedrich.wav

He advocates violence, and destruction!


And By the way gick, I explicitly said not all members are psychos. Many are though. Sorry, I can't change that fact.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Not all animal rights activists are terror agents in the same way that not all Christians are creationists

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Raziaar]

Not all animal rights activists are terror agents in the same way that not all Christians are creationists

-Angry Lawyer

Agreed. But those ones who are terror agents, or who support terror agents, are obviously supported as a whole by praise.

 

[CptStern]

The Center for Consumer Freedom

"The Center for Consumer Freedom is a nonprofit coalition of restaurants, food companies, and consumers working together to promote personal responsibility and protect consumer choices.

The growing cabal of "food cops," health care enforcers, militant activists, meddling bureaucrats, and violent radicals who think they know "what's best for you" are pushing against our basic freedoms. We're here to push back."

"The Center for Consumer Freedom (CCF) (formerly called the "Guest Choice Network") is a front group for the restaurant, alcohol and tobacco industries. It runs media campaigns which oppose the efforts of scientists, doctors, health advocates, environmentalists and groups like Mothers Against Drunk Driving, calling them "the Nanny Culture -- the growing fraternity of food cops, health care enforcers, anti-meat activists, and meddling bureaucrats who 'know what's best for you.' "

It describes its mission as defending the "right of adults and parents to choose what they eat, drink, and how they enjoy themselves." Stressing individual responsibility over government legislation, CCF opposes compulsory warning labels on food, bans on smoking in restaurants, lawsuits against obesity, and similar activities. It runs media campaigns and gives out annual "Nanny Awards" to "those groups and individuals who would protect us from ourselves."


Created in 1995 as the Guest Choice Network by Richard Berman, executive director of the public affairs firm Berman and Company, it was initially funded by the Philip Morris tobacco company, but now has a number of corporate sponsors, such as Monsanto, the Coca-Cola Company, and Wendy's International, Inc. The concept of the group, according to a letter to Barbara Trach, then Philip Morris' senior program manager for public affairs, was "to unite the restaurant and hospitality industries in a campaign to defend their consumers and marketing programs against attacks from anti-smoking, anti-drinking, anti-meat, etc. activists ..."

ya real unbiased source there raziaar :upstare:

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Center_for_Consumer_Freedom
http://www.consumerfreedom.com/about.cfm
http://www.organicconsumers.org/organic/anti_organic_consumer_group.cfm


there sponsors, almost every last one of them in the Meat and dairy industry:


Coca-Cola Company
Excel/Cargill
Monsanto
Tyson Foods
Wendy's International, Inc.
Outback Steakhouse
Pilgrim's Pride Corp.
HMS Host Corporation
RTM, Inc.
White Castle System
Perdue Farms, Inc.
Hatfield Quality Meats
Brinker International
Quantum Foods
Standard Meat
Applebee's International, Inc.
Coldwater Seafood
P.F. Chang's China Bistro
Performance Food Group
Rare Hospitality
Marie Callender Pie Shops
Advantica Restaurant Group
National Steak and Poultry
Packaging Corporation of America
T. Marzetti Company
Trinchero Family Estates
King and Prince Seafood
Paradise Tomato Kitchens, Inc.
Michigan Turkey Producers Cooperative
Fired Up
Restaurant Concepts
Rosemount Estates (Southcorp Wines)
TriOak Foods
Armour-Swift Eckrich
Darifair Foods
Dean Foods Company
Ken's Foods Inc.
Simmons Foods, Inc.
Sugar Foods Corporation
Casual Restaurant Concepts
LTP Management Group
Anton's Airfoods, Inc.
Cameron Mitchell Restaurants
Chart House Enterprises
Max & Erma's Restaurants, Inc.
Royal Cup
Pro Edge
Comarco Products
Save-on Seafood
Sun Orchard, Inc.
Custom Cuts
Good Humor-Breyers (part of Unilever)
Harrah's Entertainment, Inc.
Pro Clean
Worldwide Restaurants Concepts
Bestfoods Foodservice (now Unilever Foodsolutions)
Kagome, Inc.
Campagna-Turano Bakery, Inc.
Carlson Hospitality Worldwide
Country Kitchen International
Daisy Brand
Eli's Cheesecake Company
Jeff's Gourmet Pies
John Soules Foods
KPR Foods
Raising Cane's Chicken Fingers
Revolution, Inc.
Ruth's Chris Steak House, Inc.
John R. Daily Company
Mexican Restaurants
Not Your Average Joe's
Buca, Inc.
Louise's Trattoria
National Everclean Service
North American Enterprises
Real Food Marketing
Ruby Tuesday, Inc.
Syracuse's Italian Sausage
China Mist
KorBert, Inc.
Crystal's International
4 B's Restaurants
North American Provisioners
Coffee Reserve, Inc.


btw I cant listen to the audio file cuz I'm at work

 

[Yuri]

for the last time ..THEY DONT FUND ANYONE ...the gave money to be used in the legal defense fund ...NOT TO BUY BOMBS

Uhh.. one way or another, stern, they are funding terrorists.

If you give a terrorist money, you're funding them. Why would they bother associating themselves with a lunatic if they didn't support him, let alone giving them money?

 

[Raziaar]

ya real unbiased source there raziaar


btw I cant listen to the audio file cuz I'm at work

Who the **** cares if its biased, okay? The audio is the WHOLE POINT. Bias does not matter when it comes to THE GUY's SPEECH.

Here, i'll type it out word for word. My comments are in parenthesis.


"These animals do have the same right, the same right to be free from pain and suffering at our hands." (I agree with this to some extent, but not to the extent that we're disallowed to eat them)

"Then of course, we're going to be... as a movement blowing stuff up, and smashing windows. Uh, for the record I don't do this stuff, but I do advocate it. I think its a great way to bring about animal liberation. Uh, and considering the level of atrocity in the level of the suffering, uh I think it'd be a great thing if, you know all of these fast food outlets and these uh, these slaughterhouses and these labratories and the banks that fund them uh, exploded tomorrow. And uh, I think its perfectly appropiate. *lots and lots of applause as he tries to finish* And I think its perfectly appropiate for people to take bricks and toss them through the windows and uh, you know everything else along the line. Hallelulah to the people who are willing to do it."



Now tell me that doesn't scream of extremism and support of violence and destruction of property, destruction of the livelyhood of people who aren't into all the political bullshit of it all and who just like eating meat?

 

[jondy]

Oh, and jondy, I'm confused about what that link shows us?

Haha, it wasn't anything about PETA, or animal rights, I was just confused over why these random animal liberation people kept 'liberating' the same wild boar

The link shows the news stories over the past couple days or weeks or whatever about what's been going on
EDIT: hehe @

"These animals do have the same right, the same right to be free from pain and suffering at our hands." (I agree with this to some extent, but not to the extent that we're disallowed to eat them)

 

[CptStern]

Who the **** cares if its biased, okay? The audio is the WHOLE POINT. Bias does not matter when it comes to THE GUY's SPEECH.

Here, i'll type it out word for word. My comments are in parenthesis.


"These animals do have the same right, the same right to be free from pain and suffering at our hands." (I agree with this to some extent, but not to the extent that we're disallowed to eat them)

"Then of course, we're going to be... as a movement blowing stuff up, and smashing windows. Uh, for the record I don't do this stuff, but I do advocate it. I think its a great way to bring about animal liberation. Uh, and considering the level of atrocity in the level of the suffering, uh I think it'd be a great thing if, you know all of these fast food outlets and these uh, these slaughterhouses and these labratories and the banks that fund them uh, exploded tomorrow. And uh, I think its perfectly appropiate. *lots and lots of applause as he tries to finish* And I think its perfectly appropiate for people to take bricks and toss them through the windows and uh, you know everything else along the line. Hallelulah to the people who are willing to do it."



Now tell me that doesn't scream of extremism and support of violence and destruction of property, destruction of the livelyhood of people who aren't into all the political bullshit of it all and who just like eating meat?

ooooooh he advocates throwing bricks through windows ..oh god the inhumanity ..since when is inanimate corportate owned property more important than real pain and suffering ..you're not much of a christian if you can put corporate property over pain and suffering


and it matters a great deal that they're made up of Meat industry insiders ..they have a direct stake in publishing disinformation so as to protect their livelihood ..if you cant see that you're either naive or refuse to admit what's painfully obvious ...I tend to believe the latter rather than the former

 

[Angry Lawyer]

There are workers at the factory that don't need to live in fear of being mugged, though, and in England, we've had quite a number of incidents where people (often not even the top-level guys of companies) have their families targeted, and their properties damaged, and arson attacks on them.

That doesn't strike me as the best way of seeking better rights for animals. Just like anything, it should be peaceful, like your hawt lawyer syster-in-law.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Direwolf]

Animal Rights groups are subject to the same risks that come along with extremism in any other field (be it religous, political, etc). For instance we had a group running around up here of ELF members a while back, spray-painting newly built houses, vehicles, and setting fires. Thats insanity and barely even makes rational sense.

However, I'm no stranger to PETA members. Hell, my girlfriend's a supporter of them. However most PETA members, her included, are simply against the unethical treatment of animals and the like. They don't want animals to be abused and mistreated, but they're hardly different from anyone else.

 

[Raziaar]

ooooooh he advocates throwing bricks through windows ..oh god the inhumanity ..since when is inanimate corportate owned property more important than real pain and suffering ..you're not much of a christian if you can put corporate property over pain and suffering

Bricks... firebombs. They want to ****ing blow up buildings. It has nothing to do with ****ing corporate property. I am the little ****ing guy okay? I am far removed from anything corporate, and I don't like corporation. But i'm also against terrorism, blowing things up , burning places down where people can get hurt. Its about safety, not ****ing property you insensitive lout. And quit ****ing bringing religion into this shit.

and it matters a great deal that they're made up of Meat industry insiders ..they have a direct stake in publishing disinformation so as to protect their livelihood ..if you cant see that you're either naive or refuse to admit what's painfully obvious ...I tend to believe the latter rather than the former

I don't defend companies. But I don't ****ing believe in the defense of scare tactic terrorists either.

This has NOTHING to do with meat industry insiders or any of that bullshit. You know why? Because I don't defend them. I don't have anything to do with them. I'm thinking of the individuals, the employees. The people eating in a burger king or a wendy's or whatever the hell else other place that stands danger of being involved in something scary and dangerous as these lunatics try to blow the place up/burn it down/throw bricks through the window etc.


Just because i'm against PETA and ALF, doesn't mean I support the people those groups are against. But obviously you can't get it through your skull, that fact. I think of the little guy.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Amazing, I'm the only person supporting both sides and none of you have even read my posts. This should be in politics.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[jondy]

Amazing, I'm the only person supporting both sides and none of you have even read my posts. This should be in politics.

There is no middle ground! You're either with the food corporations, or you support the terrorists!

I should've seen this coming, didn't think at the time a random story about setting boars free in the southwest of England would end up as an animal welfare debate though D:

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

They released the boars and then the cars ran over them...

 

[CptStern]

Animal Rights groups are subject to the same risks that come along with extremism in any other field (be it religous, political, etc). For instance we had a group running around up here of ELF members a while back, spray-painting newly built houses, vehicles, and setting fires. Thats insanity and barely even makes rational sense.

However, I'm no stranger to PETA members. Hell, my girlfriend's a supporter of them. However most PETA members, her included, are simply against the unethical treatment of animals and the like. They don't want animals to be abused and mistreated, but they're hardly different from anyone else.

yes thank you


oh and AL people do read and people do listen to what you have to say

raziaar:

Just because i'm against PETA and ALF, doesn't mean I support the people those groups are against. But obviously you can't get it through your skull, that fact. I think of the little guy

conversely; then why isnt the same true for me?

 

[Angry Lawyer]

oh and AL people do read and people do listen to what you have to say

That was a pity-read ;(

-Angry Lawyer

 

[CptStern]

jebus! I cant do anything right can I?

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

 

[CptStern]

ya too bad it actually looks like this

and this

 

[Yuri]

Amazing, I'm the only person supporting both sides and none of you have even read my posts. This should be in politics.

-Angry Lawyer

On the contrary, I think that your posts have been the most informative and true of any in here. There's just nothing much to add, I'd say.

 

[Nat Turner]

Any creature with any sort of intelligence deserves at least some dignity during its life. What is happening to animals is pretty horrible. :|

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Which is why you should buy Free-Range foodstuffs when possible. Beat them economically, not violently.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Flyingdebris]

Its a sad state of affairs but humanity as a whole is reliant on animals. Its not pretty but its true. I hate needless cruelty as much as the next person, but seriously, shock tactics propaganda, firebombing, vandalism, and other assorted acts of crime commited on behalf of animals is not the right way to go about this.

How would you feel if you were just some guy that made your living working on a farm and then some crazy bastards shouting "animal liberation now!" or something showed up and screwed over your livelyhood. Or if you were some shlub working at a slaughterhouse preparing the meat making a meager living when some crazy ALF guys end up burning the place down overnight and thusly you lose your job.

Goddamn crazies

 

[Ome_Vince]

I must say when i visited one of the farms myself, and saw the chickens piled up , with mutilated feet because they stood on pieces of iron, pooping eggs out on small conveyor belts and plukking each other bald because of their missery...
i kinda was ashamed to be part of humanity...

 

[CptStern]

Its a sad state of affairs but humanity as a whole is reliant on animals. Its not pretty but its true. I hate needless cruelty as much as the next person, but seriously, shock tactics propaganda, firebombing, vandalism, and other assorted acts of crime commited on behalf of animals is not the right way to go about this.

How would you feel if you were just some guy that made your living working on a farm and then some crazy bastards shouting "animal liberation now!" or something showed up and screwed over your livelyhood. Or if you were some shlub working at a slaughterhouse preparing the meat making a meager living when some crazy ALF guys end up burning the place down overnight and thusly you lose your job.

Goddamn crazies

peta:

people for the ETHICAL TREATMENT of animals

 

[Solaris]

I support the ethical treatment of animals as well Stern. Thoose pictures you posted are horrific, and I have no doubt that such treatmeant of animals is widespread.

But the group also opposes research on animals, and advocates violence against Laboroteries. I could just as easyly post some pictures of people dying from aids, something without animal research couldn't be treated.

Yes abusing animals is wrong but imo, trying to prevent research that will cure millions of people and save millions of lives, is a worse crime, and one which Peta is responcable.

 

[el Chi]

Stern, some - and I know the emphasis is on some, so I'm not transposing this onto all animal rights activists - animal rights protesters have done some horrendous things to further their cause.
Some have specifically targetted people who work at animal testing clinics and their families. One group dug up a scientist's mother's corpse, stole it and demanded the closure of the facility in exchange for the body.

Like I said, this is extreme, but then there are the people on the street stalls handing out flyers with pictures of mutilated fox corpses etc. Not pretty, but one could say - "Well, we're just showing you how gruesome things really are"
Personally I see little difference between that and the pro-life campaigners who show graphic pictures of aborted foetuses - would you not agree that that's utterly wrong?

Now animal testing. Anyone who claims to be against animal testing should - and I really cannot stress this enough - refuse all drugs and treatment that has ever been involved with any institute that conducts medical trials on animals before humans. They should insist upon this, do their own research and then see just how drastically their options for medical treatment narrow.
Then, the next time they get seriously ill, yet can be treated through drugs/methods developed through animal testing, they can decide whether animal testing in order to save human lives is a good or bad idea.

Then we get down to animal rights charities which, to be quite frank, infuriate me. Not because of the organisations unto themselves, but because of the sponsorship they get. Here in the UK animal rights organisations - like the Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds, to name but two examples - get far more support than human rights charities, like say Oxfam or the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children.
You could say "Well, it's the public that's making the donations, it's not the animal rights charities."
To a point, this is true, except the animal rights charities know this fact, and they know how to manipulate the public and do so shamelessly.
Much easier to show a cute puppy and then ask for money than show an abused child/wife and then ask for money.
I'm not saying the RSPCA should donate money to Oxfam, or cut down on its campaigning, but I do get the feeling that they're verging on ruthless in this respect.

In spite of all this, I absolutely abhorre cruelty to animals, to a point.
However it infuriates me that the public care more about animals than their fellow humans; that organisations would manipulate people's affections away from their fellow human beings; that people would denounce animal testing when various treatments that may have saved them or their loved ones owe their very existence to animal testing.
It's ridiculous.

 

[CptStern]

why does everyone assume I support radical or extremist animal rights groups? I've never given any indication that I do, I'm not affiliated with any group, any organization I"M JUST LIKE EVERY ONE OF YOU except I've seen first hand the cruelty that goes on in CORPORATE OWNED FARMS ..I've never said it's not ok to eat meat, I never said that parents should not be giving their children animal milk, I've never said the ends jutify the means ...you all just pulled that out of thin air because to most of you there are NO degrees of animal rights activism ...you either support firebombing or you eat meat ..which is absolutely absurd ...even if you dont care what happens to animals, even if you dont care about ethical treatment surely you can still recognise that factory farming is dangerouis for the health of humans ..tell me .where did avian flu come from and where does it mostly start?

 

[Angry Lawyer]

I read in the paper something about the recent beached whales. It read something like

"If you're trapped on the banks of the Thames, injured, and unable to get home, and you're a whale, you'll get the whole country trying to save you. If you're a human, though..."

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Nat Turner]

I read in the paper something about the recent beached whales. It read something like

"If you're trapped on the banks of the Thames, injured, and unable to get home, and you're a whale, you'll get the whole country trying to save you. If you're a human, though..."

-Angry Lawyer

I like that quote.

 

[Solaris]

We all agree that Abuse to animals is wrong.

Its Petas other policies that we hate.

 

[el Chi]

Stern, you're right about the factory farming issue - can we say BSE, anyone?
Sorry that rant wasn't intended to be a rant so it kind of got targetted at you.
Apologies

Still, though... I f*cking hate animal rights charities.
/el Chi runs off to torture kittens for fun whilst eating veal and eggs from battery hens.

 

[CptStern]

yes thank you for your apology (although I expected no less from you)

I get tired of people over reacting and jumping to conclusions on everything I say ..I'm willing to bet half of my 16,000 posts are probably me defending myself for some misunderstood statement

 

[Solaris]

Stern, you're right about the factory farming issue - can we say BSE, anyone?
Sorry that rant wasn't intended to be a rant so it kind of got targetted at you.
Apologies

Still, though... I f*cking hate animal rights charities.
/el Chi runs off to torture kittens for fun whilst eating veal and eggs from battery hens.

I know what you mean.
Was behind a lady in a shop and she put 50p in a box for horses. Instead of one to help earthquake victims.