Two New HL2 Videos At E3 2004

[noah]

Yay, can't believe it was almost an year since we saw first HL2 footage. Looking forward to seeing something new, plus playing HL2 itself this summer (hopefully).

OT: Noah, eh, are you a taffer from ION forums ? This month sure is exiting for a thief fan

Busted! Heh, yep that's me. I can't wait to play Thief 3.

 

[philterlecki]

gooooood question.

What was the whole thing about "SDK coming out around E3" was this just a rumour or what? Any link to someone saying that?

ya didnt they say the sdk is going to be released before e3??

 

[Lobster]

last year they were on the net by midnight, i expect the same this year, lol, although steam may host them instantly , who knows.

 

[Seppo]

"To finally sum this all up, let me put it this way: There was another game shown at this show. It was called Doom something. I dunno at this point. I forgot."
? ActionTrip.com

I love that comment! He really thinks HL2 will own DOOM3...and i agree.

I hate it when critics say things like that. Firstly, id hasn't actually done much to maintain the hype. I don't think they even care. Secondly, it seldom happens that a game owns the E3 two times in a row. The first time Doom3 was shown, there wasn't any game to even come close to it. The media's reaction to Doom 3 has generally been quite biased. It was always like "Well yes the graphics are good but how will the actual gameplay be and yeah whatever who cares lol".

 

[OnboardError]

There's been some misinformation spreading through the community and on other game sites regarding the HL2 booth at E3. There is only ONE booth which will hold the HL2 theatre presentation/demo. In addition, there will be the ATI, Vivendi, HL2, and Valve booths. Since Vivendi is HL2's publisher, they might have some HL2 related info as well, but cerntaly not the theatre demonstration.

We at Half-Life Source and HL Radio will be on location at E3 during next week

Whats up with this?
found that here: http://halflifesource.com/

 

[Lobster]

Yeah hl-source isnt exactly known for there accuracy

 

[Seppo]

This is getting too complicated again. Why can't anything be simple. Yeah this year they have two booths but only the other has HL2 movies and the other has some other info but they're both new info and yeah something who knows you have to quess which one to choose


Sorry, but I just played Halo and got seriously owned... and the game was lagging and there was this GODDAMN warping all the time and it PISSES ME OFF because it happens every time!! I'm gonna go to sleep

 

[tokin]

I'm certain TF2 will be shown in some booth, just wait and see...this is the time.

 

[chris_3]

first video - singleplayer
second video - multiplayer

 

[Wilco]

Valve have said SOOOO much they aint showing multiplayer until its out, I'll eat my hat if they show it at this E3

 

[Spiffae]

Valve have said SOOOO much they aint showing multiplayer until its out, I'll eat my hat if they show it at this E3

you don't even have a hat!

 

[Dougy]

you don't even have a hat!

ill buy him one.
then he can pay me back after he eats it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I think the 2 videos will be cool becuase Valve needs to realy get the hype wagon going again..... (only the hard core fans ie. us! are hyped at the moment)

1. Own E3 & Set release date
2. Couple screens here, preview there....
3. Release mid-late summer

 

[Sai]

well what ever quite a bit of our questions will be answered in about 3 days and 18 hours

 

[Spiffae]

I just hope the videos knock our socks off.

 

[MindCrafter]

I hate it when critics say things like that. Firstly, id hasn't actually done much to maintain the hype. I don't think they even care. Secondly, it seldom happens that a game owns the E3 two times in a row. The first time Doom3 was shown, there wasn't any game to even come close to it. The media's reaction to Doom 3 has generally been quite biased. It was always like "Well yes the graphics are good but how will the actual gameplay be and yeah whatever who cares lol".

-If ID don't care then they can't expect the same hype as HL2.

-I've played the Doom3 alpha and the HL2 alpha, hl2 > doom3.

-There is NO story in doom, just run around and slaughter the different kinds of freaks ( Painkiller anyone? )

-The gameplay is just as important ( If even more ) than the graphics.

 

[SMT]

-If ID don't care then they can't expect the same hype as HL2.

-I've played the Doom3 alpha and the HL2 alpha, hl2 > doom3.

-There is NO story in doom, just run around and slaughter the different kinds of freaks ( Painkiller anyone? )

-The gameplay is just as important ( If even more ) than the graphics.

To me, none of that means both games won't be fun. Heck, I loved Painkiller and I'm playing through it again right now.

 

[Sergio]

Don't be a moron mindcrafter.

If ID don't care then they can't expect the same hype as HL2.

It isn't about hype. They aren't showing the PC version because they are finalizing the game now and don't want to take time out of finishing Doom3 to put together a demonstration for e3.

-I've played the Doom3 alpha and the HL2 alpha, hl2 > doom3.

The so called Doom3 "alpha" is just a few hastily put together maps made specifically for e3 and aren't even a part of the game. they were a technology demonstration for e3 2002. You can't compare this to the so called hl2 "beta", which was actually a large chunk of the actual game, character development/story/actual gameplay all intact.

-There is NO story in doom, just run around and slaughter the different kinds of freaks ( Painkiller anyone? )

It seems you are basing this off the technology demonstration from 2002. Doom3 actually does have a rather involving story. Id software has stated that they are not trying to make another pure actiuon game with little attention to story, similar to games they have done in the past. This time their goal IS to make a story driven horror game. And that is what they are doing.

The gameplay is just as important ( If even more ) than the graphics.

True. Whats your point? Both games have excellent graphics AND gameplay.

 

[Curator]

Doom ]|[ has slightly better graphics while HL2 has a much more detailed storyline and far more interaction with the environment.

This should be quite obvious by now.

 

[nicrd]

I think one of the HL2 demos at e3 will be the PC version and the other the XBox version, or else whats the point of having 2 demos ? and they didn't even say a word about the xbox version so far, so they have to start talking about it someday.

btw, why are you guys comparing doom3 and hl2 ? they are games, not simple product that is evaluated with numbers and calculations. none is going to "beat" or "own" the other, unless you are too hopelessy nerd to play more than one game this summer. its if someone would say "I dont want to watch The Lord of the Rings because Star Wars was better", it just makes no sense comparing games like this. a game is a piece of art after all.

Anyways, i'll buy both even if everyone says they suck.

 

[Curator]

I think one of the HL2 demos at e3 will be the PC version and the other the XBox version, or else whats the point of having 2 demos ? and they didn't even say a word about the xbox version so far, so they have to start talking about it someday.

There will be one demonstration at the ATI booth consisting of one or more new videos and another at the VU booth showing a completely different video/s. Valve will also be holding a demonstration to the press that shows the videos from both booths at the same time.

I know this for fact.

 

[PvtRyan]

It seems you are basing this off the technology demonstration from 2002. Doom3 actually does have a rather involving story. Id software has stated that they are not trying to make another pure actiuon game with little attention to story, similar to games they have done in the past. This time their goal IS to make a story driven horror game. And that is what they are doing.

Not to flame or anything, I'm not anti-Doom, but I remember a certain thing from Carmack comparing game storylines to porn storylines, you expect it to be there, but it doesn't have to be good.

 

[nicrd]

There will be one demonstration at the ATI booth consisting of one or more new videos and another at the VU booth showing a completely different video/s. Valve will also be holding a demonstration to the press that shows the videos from both booths at the same time.

I still have the feeling we will see the xbox version at e3, of course not at the ATi booth, nor at VU's since they said they won't publish it, unless they changed their minds, but maybe at microsoft's booths since they are the prime candidate to be publishing HL2 at VU's place.

 

[blahblahblah]

Not to flame or anything, I'm not anti-Doom, but I remember a certain thing from Carmack comparing game storylines to porn storylines, you expect it to be there, but it doesn't have to be good.

Finish thinking about that quote you just wrote...good. Now think about the storyline that the original Half-Life had...A nerdy scientist killing aliens and marines with his trusty crowbar. Can you understand why Carmack calls game storylines to porn storylines?

Now mind you gameplay is completely different then a storyline, so please don't flame me.

 

[SMT]

Not to flame or anything, I'm not anti-Doom, but I remember a certain thing from Carmack comparing game storylines to porn storylines, you expect it to be there, but it doesn't have to be good.

Maybe what he really meant is that Doom 3 will be a Martian porn-fest. Pinky-demon, anyone? :naughty:

 

[Sergio]

I remember a certain thing from Carmack comparing game storylines to porn storylines, you expect it to be there, but it doesn't have to be good.

Where did you get this from? I have never seen this quote, and I have followed id for years. Even if he did say this, there are 3 things that make it insignificant:

1. This isn't necessarily untrue. Infact, I agree with it. Most story lines are rediculous if taken on their own merit. Including the half life story. If taken on it's own it is simply a rehash of age old story lines that have been around since this FPS thing started. You could even call it a copy of the story from the old dooms. Replace aliens with demons in the hl story, and you have DooM. What makes a story "good" is how believeable it is in the game, and how much it matters inside the game world.

2. Carmack is the programmer, not the game designer. He doesn't have the last word on the game design or story. He doesn't even own half of the company.

3. Every statement from ever developer points to the fact that story is a major focus in this new rendition of Doom, and that is isn't another pure action/no story game like their past games.


If you do not provide the source for this quote, I will consider it untrue simply because I have never seen it and I have been following id fairly closely for quite a while. If you do provide a source and it is true, then it doesn't affect Doom3 anyway.

 

[Styloid]

"Story in a game is like story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important." -John Carmack
I found the quote but I can't find the whole original interview.

 

[Sergio]

"Story in a game is like story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important." -John Carmack
I found the quote but I can't find the whole original interview.

Thats amusing if it is true. Sounds like something Carmack would say. Still doesn't apply to Doom3, however, as Carmack isn't responsible for the story elements of the game.

 

[PvtRyan]

Thats amusing if it is true. Sounds like something Carmack would say. Still doesn't apply to Doom3, however, as Carmack isn't responsible for the story elements of the game.

Still it's odd, even if Carmack has nothing to say about story, a game being programmed by someone who has a different vision of the game than the rest.

What makes a story "good" is how believeable it is in the game, and how much it matters inside the game world.

True. But the way Carmack makes it sound like it's nothing more than a way to tie levels together in a logical fashion and a short explanation on why you're killing demons on Mars. But we'll see, he made more strange comments, like that physics are just a gimmick (which is not true in Doom 3 as far as I know)

 

[OCybrManO]

If you have really followed id Software for as long as you say you have you would know by now that John Carmack is a graphics man... and anything else takes a back seat. He doesn't like complex stories. He didn't want to put a complex physics engine (it took a while for him to be convinced to even add ragdolls) in Doom 3. If it were up to John Carmack id Software would probably just make video game renderers to liscence to other companies.

Luckily, as has been said already, he doesn't have full control over Doom 3.

 

[Wolf]

Seems pretty typical of Carmack to me. There are all sorts of uncharitable quotes he has made in the past about gaming design and technology that isn't part of id software's direction - ie. whatever way they are currently doing things to build simplistic forgettable arcade games. Off the top of my head there's been stuff said about use keys, ragdoll physics, skeletal animation systems, shader material systems, story elements etc etc...

Fundamentally he is not a game designer though so I guess we shouldn't be too harsh on his rather unimaginative ideas about the direction of gaming (apparently he doesn't even play games anymore, he just likes coding and engine building because of the problem solving)...

Anyway that probably sounds a bit like tall-poppy syndrome but it's not. I have a huge respect for Carmack's ability at coding and his role in building and popularising the FPS genre - taking PC gaming on to a new level. However, that doesn't mean I have any particular love of id's games and his thoughts on game design. The people I have the most respect for are Illusion Softworks, Troika, (RIP BIS), Pyranha Bytes, Monolith, Bioware, Ion Storm (before IW) and Valve - they actually make games I want to play built on design before tech....

 

[Lobster]

Everyone has there own styles and preferences.

Me personaly i like immersive games, half-life was the first I found to really focus on creating a speed of gameplay and continuous play style combined with a script incorperated into every moment in the maps, down to the placement of enemies and the intensity of the action, Another game to really do it well was Deus Ex, its the fact from the moment the game fades in, to the moment it fades out, you are in control, this is why i cannot stand game loading screens that pull you out of the game to some dumbass progress bar with a low res picture of a gun!.

I have this terrible feeling Doom3 will have a quake 3 style loading cut, which would really ruin it for me, fingers crossed though, HL2 is just good by default for me, cause its my favorite game x2 lol.

 

[Sergio]

I think you guys just misunderstand the man. He is the type of guy that wants everything simplified as much as possible. It's not that he wants things simple, he just wants everything that isn't absolutely necessary to get the point across to be removed from the equation. And he tends to feel action is the driving force in games, not story. So to him story is secondary.


About the ragdolls, he just said he felt they were a gimmick because they added nothing to the game. But once he saw that they were a crowd please he admitted he was wrong. He has his own ideas, but he also realises when to let go of them and build a game for the gamers.

Sometimes his simplifying pays off though, as in the case with the use key. He felt he could achieve the same functionality without an extra button to bind, and he always favors the simpler approach if it doesn't sacrifice functionality. So he put in the new system and it turns out that it works just as good as the use button, but now it's simpler.


But this discussion stemmed from his comment on the importance of a story in a game, which isn't relevant to Doom3 since he sin't the game designer or the story guy. So don't worry about it.

 

[Styloid]

We've seen a glimpse of the E3 clip by one of the flanger vids right? Does anyone else think that the clip they are releasing looks less interesting than the tool shed or the traps? I really want to see the tool shed in high res. Valve seems to have strange decision making strategies in releasing media.

 

[Apos]

I really hope Doom3 will be a return to SP form from id. I think they've learned a lot from games like Half-life about the importance of making the game environment full of custom elements, putting events and setpieces into the game so that you don't just have a series of monsters and levels. This was the major failing of the Quake series; it lacked what gamers had come to expect in terms of depth and complexity, and it definately lived out that Carmack quote (he may not have a title beyond designing the engine, but you're fooling yourself if you think he isn't heavily involved in what the game will be like).

They are obviously really trying this time, with both scripted sequences and quick "through the helmet" cutscenes (which are done really well, allowing them to tell a story without taking a player too far out of the game). We have yet to see their datapad and browser stuff, but it should add a lot too (though part of me worries that it's too much of a crutch, back to the old "here's your plot: in unintelligible text!" style). I expect great things.

 

[tokin]

I'm telling you people, valve is going to shock the hell out of us showing off TF2...i bet that second pass will lead to a TF2 preview....i can feel the excitement.

 

[famas_man]

That would indeed make me happy in the pants if the second demo was a tf2 demo. I can only wait and hope

 

[Xtasy0]

nevAR!!!!!

 

[Shuzer]

Gee, Sergio sure reminds me of a certain someone that's been banned about 45 times :angel: (If it's not him, ignore me, I'm paranoid )

Anyhow, E3 couldn't come any sooner.. I doubt we'll see TF2, but ya never know.

 

[Apos]

The timing, the postcount, and everything else sure fits...

 

[hollowgam]

SDK in 3 days? Or we got the wrong idea....or....Valve lied again...?