What Bush got right

[kmack]

Two of the greatest business institutions on the planet. What could you possibly have against them?

wal-mart, the ones who continually keep women out of management. The ones who outsource everything to china. The ones who are accused of using child labor. The ones whose starting yearly salary for a fulltime employee is $13,000. Try to disagree with all those points, not just one and ignore the rest...as usual.

 

[GhostFox]

The ones whose starting yearly salary for a fulltime employee is $13,000.

And this is wrong how? If people want a better paying job, they can seek employment elsewhere. The first goal of a business is to make money. Not overpay it's employees.

 

[No Limit]

And this is wrong how? If people want a better paying job, they can seek employment elsewhere. The first goal of a business is to make money. Not overpay it's employees.

I love this "just get another job that pays more stupid" theory you people have. Let me ask you, what do you do?

 

[GhostFox]

Let me ask you, what do you do?

I'm a photographer. And I make a hell of a lot more then minimum wage. When I was 15 I worked for minimum wage. Once I grew up I realized that was stupid and got a real job.

 

[PickledGecko]

I dont understand this US politics. In the UK many many people who voted for Labour made their feelings about the war clear. They attacked Tony Blairs motives and decisions, and will probably vote for Labour again anyway. We seem to have a feeling that you can criticize the decisions of the Government without it being seen as an attack on the Parties general stance (i.e. left wing/center/right wing).

When I hear Liberal Democrats and Republicans go at it, it seems to me that they form their political opinions based purely on what the Party in question has decided.

Eg. George W Bush says at the start of his first term that he will not interfere with other countries, that its not Americas business to sort the worlds problems. Republicans cheer. George W Bush says he will attack Afghanistan to get the terrorists behind the 9/11 attack. Everyone cheers, seems fair enough, its not like Afghanistan was going to do anything about it themselves. George W Bush attacks Iraq, claiming a link between Al Qaeda and the possession of WMDs... Republicans cheer, everyone else asks for proof. America attacks Iraq, WMDs not there, no link between Saddam and Al Qaeda, George W Bush claims that giving Iraq democracy justifies the whole thing. Republicans cheer.

Lets look at that first sentence, "...its not Americas business to sort the worlds problems.", then the 2nd last "...giving Iraq democracy justifies the whole thing." And not a single Republican seems to disagree with either statement, it makes no sense.

I'm not just talking about Republicans either. According to "Stupid White Men" by Michael Moore, Clinton was the most Republican President in a long while. And the Democrats loved him too.

It makes no sense at all.

 

[No Limit]

I'm a photographer. And I make a hell of a lot more then minimum wage. When I was 15 I worked for minimum wage. Once I grew up I realized that was stupid and got a real job.

Oh ok, so you walked out said, **** it, and just like that started making more money? I'm sure your rich parents had nothing to do with it. How much is minimum wage in your area BTW?

 

[GhostFox]

Oh ok, so you walked out said, **** it, and just like that started making more money?

Pretty much.

I'm sure your rich parents had nothing to do with it.

Actually for your information I only have a mother, and we were dirt poor. I never lived above the poverty line in my life until I made the money myself.

How much is minimum wage in your area BTW?

I think it just went up to $7.25 CAD.

 

[No Limit]

Pretty much.

OK, no point in arguning with you. All people on minimum wage are stupid because all they need to do to make more money is go out and do it.

Actually for your information I only have a mother, and we were dirt poor. I never lived above the poverty line in my life until I made the money myself.

So why didn't your mother just go out and make more money like you did?

 

[GhostFox]

All people on minimum wage are stupid because all they need to do to make more money is go out and do it.

Not true at all. Only that a place like Wal-Mart should not be expected to pay more then minimum wage. That's why it is a "minimum wage job". If you think that minimum wage should be raised, that is a whole seperate issue. But no one should expect Wal-Mart to pay over minimum wage.

So why didn't your mother just go out and make more money like you did?

See my above point. It sucks that people have to be poor. Trust me, I know. But to blame businesses for it is asinine.

 

[No Limit]

See my above point. It sucks that people have to be poor. Trust me, I know. But to blame businesses for it is asinine.

Cut the crap. You just said all you had to do to make more money was go out and do it. Why didn't your mother do this if it's so easy?

 

[GhostFox]

Why didn't your mother do this if it's so easy?

Some people just don't do it I guess. I don't know why. I've never known why. You'd think she would be capable of it.

 

[No Limit]

Some people just don't do it I guess. I don't know why. I've never known why. You'd think she would be capable of it.

Come on, are you listening to yourself?

I was raised piss poor, my father made $7.00 /hr in an assembly line while my mother made $6.00/hr at a taco bell. I would never dare say they kept us poor because they wanted to; something you just said.

The fact that you would say your mother didn't want a good life for you is total disrespect to your mother and I am ashmed of you for even saying it.

Another example of you not using logic in your postings.

 

[GhostFox]

The fact that you would say your mother didn't want a good life for you is total disrespect to your mother and I am ashmed of you for even saying it.

I never said that. She did want a good life for us. She just never had the drive to go out and sieze it. She honestly thought she was doing her best. I know that she was capable of so much more though.

 

[No Limit]

I never said that. She did want a good life for us. She just never had the drive to go out and sieze it. She honestly thought she was doing her best. I know that she was capable of so much more though.

:dozey:

Whatever makes you sleep at night. I'm sure living in poverty made her think she was doing her best. Did the thought that she couldn't do any better because she had to feed you instead of going to school or getting training ever cross your mind?

 

[GhostFox]

Did the thought that she couldn't do any better because she had to feed you instead of going to school or getting training ever cross your mind?

I know she thought that. She honestly thought she was doing her best. I don't blame her in any way. But I also know that she is smart and could have gotten us into a better situation if she had thought long term instead of short. I know that can be very hard. I also know that poor people don't want to be poor. But you can't blame it on Wal-Mart for paying minimum wage. The only thing you can do is make damn sure that your kids will have a better life then you had. If everyone does that, we will go a long way towards eliminating poverty.

 

[No Limit]

I know she thought that. She honestly thought she was doing her best. I don't blame her in any way. But I also know that she is smart and could have gotten us into a better situation if she had thought long term instead of short. I know that can be very hard. I also know that poor people don't want to be poor. But you can't blame it on Wal-Mart for paying minimum wage. The only thing you can do is make damn sure that your kids will have a better life then you had. If everyone does that, we will go a long way towards eliminating poverty.

You are trying to change the topic and I won't let you as I took great issue with what you said as I've been poor and I know for a fact it wasn't because my partents wanted us to stay poor or because they were lazy but it was because the system didn't let them do better.

So again, I ask you, did the thought that she couldn't do any better because she had to feed you ever cross your mind?

Just out of curiousity what did your mother do?

 

[GhostFox]

but it was because the system didn't let them do better.

The system isn't great, but blaming the system is part of the problem. If people took more personal responsibility, there would be less poverty.

did the thought that she couldn't do any better because she had to feed you ever cross your mind?

Of course. And I am sure she thought that was true. But at the same time we were not eating well anyway, and if she had the ambition and self-confidence to get a job where should could advance in the world, instead of a string of dead-enders, we would have been much better off.

Just out of curiousity what did your mother do?

A long string of minimum wage jobs.

 

[No Limit]

The system isn't great, but blaming the system is part of the problem. If people took more personal responsibility, there would be less poverty.

No it is not part of the problem. My parents never blamed the system, they did all they could and are finally doing fine now. I blame the system that didn't want to help me and my brother and sister (I was 8, my sister was 7, and my brother was 2) when we were poor because of republicans that said the only reason we were poor was because my parents were lazy (as you are trying to say).

Of course. And I am sure she thought that was true. But at the same time we were not eating well anyway, and if she had the ambition and self-confidence to get a job where should could advance in the world, instead of a string of dead-enders, we would have been much better off.

So you really do believe that all you have to do in this world is apply for a better job and you will get that job; sad.

 

[GhostFox]

when we were poor because of republicans that said the only reason we were poor was because my parents were lazy

Come on. You blame yourself being poor because of the republican party?

So you really do believe that all you have to do in this world is apply for a better job and you will get that job; sad.

I believe life is what you make it.

 

[No Limit]

Come on. You blame yourself being poor because of the republican party?

No, I blame people like you who say we were poor because my parents were lazy so we shouldn't receive any support; this is part of the republican policy.

I believe life is what you make it.

Ok, then you are so distant from reality it's sad. With that said I just appplied to be the CEO of microsoft, by your logic I should get the position *fingers crossed*

 

[GhostFox]

so we shouldn't receive any support; this is part of the republican policy.

Welfare is probably the biggest cause of povery in NA, so I fail to see your point.

With that said I just appplied to be the CEO of microsoft, by your logic I should get the position

No, with my logic, if you want to be the CEO of a major corporation, you can be. It's not magic, just drive and hard work. You're telling me that you could never be the CEO of Microsoft? Do you think rich people are just lucky or something?

 

[Bodacious]

This thread delivers.

 

[No Limit]

Welfare is probably the biggest cause of povery in NA, so I fail to see your point.

I know you fail to see my point as you fail to see that some people are poor because they have no other choice. With that said you just proved my point, this is exactly what republicans were saying about my family and why we shouldn't get help.

No, with my logic, if you want to be the CEO of a major corporation, you can be. It's not magic, just drive and hard work. You're telling me that you could never be the CEO of Microsoft? Do you think rich people are just lucky or something?

No, I could never be the CEO of microsoft, I live in the real world and I know this. For some weird reason only about 1% of this country becomes rich; if everyone can do it I wonder why more people aren't. And yes, Bill Gates was very lucky. He found someone with an operating system (dos) bought it for $50 and sold it to IBM for millions. If that isn't luck I don't know what is.

 

[GhostFox]

I know you fail to see my point as you fail to see that some people are poor because they have no other choice. With that said you just proved my point, this is exactly what republicans were saying about my family and why we shouldn't get help

You obviously don't understand welfare.

No, I could never be the CEO of microsoft, I live in the real world and I know this. For some weird reason only about 1% of this country becomes rich; if everyone can't do it I wonder why more people aren't. And yes, Bill Gates was very lucky. He found someone with an operating system (dos) bought it for $50 and sold it to IBM for millions.

I hope for the best for you and your kids someday, because with that attitude you probably won't go far in this world. A lot of rich people aren't lucky. They just want it more then the rest of us.

 

[No Limit]

You obviously don't understand welfare.

You are right. I lived in poverty for 10 years, many of my close friends are still piss poor, and I am the one that doesn't understand welfare. You on the other hand believe that anyone in this world can grow up to be the CEO of Microsoft and because of this you are expert on poverty.

I hope for the best for you and your kids someday, because with that attitude you won't go far in this world. A lot of rich people aren't lucky. They just want it more then the rest of us.

Yup, it's all about wanting it more than someone else. The poor people in this world simply don't want to be rich, they like their life of minimum wage and not being able to properly feed their children.

Also, I appreciate your concern but I think my kids will be fine as I am the one living in the real world. Instead of waiting to become a millionare I am in the real world working with what I can making a decent living. If anything it is your kids I worry about as you seem to have this idea that nothing could ever go wrong in your life as long as you don't allow it to happen. A lot of things in this world you can't control and it is sad you don't understand that and because of this I hope nothing bad ever happens to you as you wont be able to get out of it as you won't understand it.

 

[GhostFox]

You are right. I lived in poverty for 10 years, many of my close friends are still piss poor, and I am the one that doesn't understand welfare.

That is correct. Welfare creates a cycle of poverty, making it worse. Workfare is the only answer.

Yup, it's all about wanting it more than someone else. The poor people in this world simply don't want to be rich, they like their life of minimum wage and not being able to properly feed their children.

I'm not saying that people don't get tough breaks in life, but it is what you do with them that counts. You want the world to be handed to you. You fail to realize that it is sitting there waiting for you to take it.

If anything it is your kids I worry about as you seem to have this idea that nothing wrong could ever go in your life as long as you don't allow it to happen.

I didn't say that. Only that I refuse to let the world beat me. I've had a lot of hardship in life, and instead of being broken I've come out stronger. You have to make your own destiny. Why not strive for greatness?

 

[No Limit]

That is correct. Welfare creates a cycle of poverty, making it worse. Workfare is the only answer.

You have no idea how idiotic you sound if you honestly believe I know nothing about welfare.

I'm not saying that people don't get tough breaks in life, but it is what you do with them that counts. You want the world to be handed to you. You fail to realize that it is sitting there waiting for you to take it.

You know nothing about me and that is 100% wrong. I never ever claim I want things handed to me. I said when shit isn't going well for me I would appreciate a little help from the government to get me back on my feet. My parents never got any social help because of people like you that ran this country and said the only reason I was poor was because my parents were lazy; which was completely false.

I didn't say that. Only that I refuse to let the world beat me.

You just said it again. You have this dream that you can control everything in this world. When you lose your job, when you lose your spouse, when you get cancer, or when something awful happens to you you will see that things aren't as easy as they seem. And I feel bad for you, I really do, as you do not want to understand the hardships so many people face in this world. All you want to do is play it off as those hardships were brought on to themselves because they wanted them and because of this nothing bad will ever happen to you (I can gurantee you that the sad fact is something really bad will).

And you talk about these hardships that you faced. How old are you and do you have any of your own family?

 

[bliink]

This has degenerated into the usual flaming rubbish.