Why HL2 sucks: Invulnerability of NPCs

[Foebane]

Honestly, here I am back in 1998 battling my way through the hordes of Xen aliens on Earth, and every time I encounter a friendly human scientist or Barney, I have to make sure I don't put my finger anywhere near my trigger, for either Mr. Scientist dies and I fail the whole mission or Barney pops me to heaven or hell, depending on what a naughty boy I've been.

Imagine my surprise when, in HL2, all those rules go out of the window, and in a scene where the Combines are harassing the poor Civs in Blue, I could happily spray fire over the entire scene and be certain of killing the former, whilst the latter remain very much alive!

Honestly, it kills a game when you fire your gun off straight at a friendly NPC and it doesn't affect them at all. The number of times I have fired my guns off at such NPCs and they notice nothing wrong, I feel like deleting the game.

OK, so in HL anyone in a chair seemed to be invulnerable to friendly fire, even if Barney in a chair did splatter blood and make threats, HE NEVER DIED! The scientists didn't notice anything at all.

It was only the scientists standing around who ran for their lives upon being shot, until you chased them down and finally killed them.

One other thing: Why can't you GIB the enemies in HL2? Everytime I've battered a headcrab or Combine after death it's always been the same thing - the body moving upon impact on the ground due to physics! BORING! When a body is dead I want to be able to chop it up! For those raised on HL, I'm sure I'm not the only one!!

Why is it so bad to be able to kill friendly NPCs? It worked in the first HL: If you shot Barney, he would shoot you until you were dead, and if you shot a Scientist, you would not be able to proceed. So why not in HL2?

I can only suppose they couldn't be bothered to program animations to the NPCs if one of their number died in close proximity, because of the heavily-scripted scenes.

Hmm. Maybe scripted scenes are the problem. Replace them with TRULY INTELLIGENT NPCs who can choose what to do if a certain thing happens and then we'll be away.

I should point out that the NPC behaviour is easily circumvented, too: In Nova Prospect, when Mossman has just buggered off with Eli in the transporter, I decided to do nothing when the Combine came bashing on the doors whilst Alyx activated the transporter again. True, I left one Combine alive, but he was hiding most of the time we waited for the transporter to warm up, and I managed to hold him off Alyx. Finally we were ready to go.

As an experiment, I then decided to stand around whilst the lone Combine shot at Alyx, thinking that she would never die due to the scripted sequences...

...but this time I was wrong, she was shot dead and I lost the game.

So, the scripted sequences are not so hopeless. But you still can't shoot friendly NPCs and liven the game up a little, unlike the first game.

God, I'll miss those scientists in HL running around like headless chickens once I'd shot one of their mates!

 

[westie]

Yes shooting scientists was fun i especially liked guass gunning them so they explode laying trip mines was fun too. oh and snarks.

 

[Zeus]

Dude there is a friendly fire mod here

http://www.pcgamemods.com/9738/


Assuming you know how to install mods.. in case you don't

Extract the mod folder to your steam/xxyouremailxx/sourcemods folder

BTW to make load times faster (it will be really slow) copy the all the files from hl2/maps/soundcache into friendly fire mod/maps/soundcache

SURPRISE Half life 2 no longer sucks


Gotta love the hl2 mod community for bringing us stuff like this

 

[Asknoone]

Bah, i don't see this as bieng a big issue. I mean it would interfere with the story generally, i mean what type of hero is Gordon? He'd be topping off resistance fighters left and right much like he does Combine? So much for the one free man.

Although, using the story is a bit of a poor excuse not to, but i still think it makes little difference. Theres loads of other things to shoot...even if its a chair.

 

[diluted]

So the fact that you can't kill friendly NPCs makes the whole game suck? Okay then..

 

[Goalie31]

I hate how people take the stupidest little things and make a mountain out of a molehill

Plus, HL2 was too fun to even waste breath complaining about that

 

[Somefool]

Do you know the reason why Valve even decided to take off FF? It is because people tend to kill every npc, including those that give useful information. There are parts in the game where if the npc is dead, you won't really know what to do.

 

[Zeus]

Yes and if you kill some npcs the game can not continue (with the friendly fire mod I posted above) because the game didn't expect you to kill them and there is no black ending mission screen.

 

[alehm]

I wish Valve allowed you to kill NPCs, even like Alyx but then, even though you can continue playing the game for hours and hours , it is impossible to complete the game because a main character you need to win has died.

That way I could laugh at people whining that they can't kill whoever they want yet still want characters essential to the story, because I am mean.

 

[The Mexican]

I never did like it how you can kill npc in hl. it was really annoying having all the barney in the area shot at u for accidently shooting someone else.

I remeber having real problem in opposing force in one area while i was fighting black op. Four marine were with me and i know i didn't kill them but i did accidently injure them but after the fight they all decided to shoot me. This happen alot in the same area and it really pissed me of for surviving a battle only to get shot by your own teammate.

 

[siorai]

Do you know the reason why Valve even decided to take off FF? It is because people tend to kill every npc, including those that give useful information. There are parts in the game where if the npc is dead, you won't really know what to do.

Wwwwaaahhhh.. Too bad for the trigger happy fools then. They kill an important NPC, the mission ends and they restart. How is that so bad?

FF should be on. It's ridiculous to not accidentally (or purposely) kill NPCs. Therre were so many times that I really really wanted to kill my teammates because Valve has no clue how to code proper pathfinding/team tactics so the moronic NPCs would trap me in a hallway or something similar. So what if I have to restart the level? I want to whip out my shotty and blow that guys head off for his insolence. But, no. We can't have that can we? They tried to make HL2 such a realistic world and fail completely on this point.

I'm not saying this ruins the game for me, but it is a rather annoying point to add to the list.

 

[Vegeta897]

Valve just basically made the game lose-proof.

Like if you had to use an object to get somewhere, they would make that object indestructible.

It's too bad.... C'mon Valve, why didn't you ask us before making it this way? We are the community!

 

[Hectic Glenn]

hehe i nailed cubbage to the wall by his neck with a crossbow

thats all i have to say

 

[StAtiC]

Hmmm, ive never heard this argument before. Oh well, more wasted complaints.....

 

[PvtRyan]

Jesus H. Christ, is it really beyond your comprehension that when you can f**k up the entire flow of a game by killing friendly NPC's, it's a bad thing? And ultimately even becoming frustrating because you accidentally killed someone friendly? And why on earth would you want to implement something you shouldn't be doing in the first place? You shouldn't be shooting NPC's, and when you do, it will **** up the game. Ruined the believability of a real world? Please, are you trying to say shooting teammates is a profound element of a believable world? Please stay out of my world then.

NPC's in HL1 were disposable, cardboard cutouts. When they were in positions where you could harm them, they were useless for the further flow of the game. It was manageable then.

 

[BattleRoyaleX]

you poor thing, delete the game and get a life OH NO YOU CANT KILL SCIENTIST big deal.

 

[WaterMelon34]

I say: Delete the gawd awful game and make sure it ends up on the curb. Maybe someone intelligent will grab it before the garbage truck comes.

 

[Foebane]

Maybe I should've pointed out that sometimes NPCs shoot at you FOR NO REASON, especially in squad-based games.

Sometimes, when I played Star Trek Voyager: Elite Force, at one point in that game, I ended up with two friendly NPCs shooting at me for no apparent reason. Yes, we were all Feds; No, I didn't shoot them.

The point is, I needed their help to proceed and thanks to a stupid bug they turned on me. And if I remember correctly, when I finally did shoot them, the game ended.

That killed a perfectly reasonable game for me stone dead, because how can you proceed because of such a fatal bug?

All I'm saying is that at least the ST programmers made the effort to create NPCs that were BETTER than the HL2 ones, and that there was the risk of you shooting them by accident, which added to the challenge.

Something the Valve people decided was too much trouble.

 

[BlackDahlia]

Way to waste ammo. :hmph:

 

[Laivasse]

In what way does the capacity to shoot allies make it more real? If HL2's scenario was transposed to a real world setting, and you *really were* Gordon Freeman fighting to free humanity, then how "real" is it for you to decide to blow a guy's head off because he's decided to stand in front of you in a narrow hallway?

As for friendly fire, I instinctively avoid shooting allies in firefights. Seems to me like some ADD sufferers have trouble engaging with the game.

Play GTA or something and stop whining.

 

[NJspeed]

OMG why did they make this game with GRAPHICS?? It just doesn't look good enough!

Why can't my crobar make anyones head explode?? Last time I tested this on my neighbor it worked! (Don't tell anyone)

I tried swimming out to sea but it didn't work?? THEY SHOULD GIVE U THE OPTION OF GOING SWIMMING. Even Gordon needs to relax! WTF cant I relax on the beach if I want to??

Worst of all, they won't let me take off Alyx's clothes! Maybe if they gave her artifical intelligence she'd be able to respond to what I say! They should let you speak into a mic and Gordon should say it in the game!!1 I tried talking to some chick in the beginning but she always tells me that shes waiting for her husband! WTFFF this game sucks because she wont ever hook up with anyone else! The game is SOOO unrealistic!!1

WHy the hell can't you jump on gunships and hijack them?? That would be SOO0O0O0O0Oo0o0O0O COOL!! This game stinks because u can't, I almost felt like deleting it!!!

OMGHAX I crashed the car into a wall but it didn't explode!! Whats gonig on, I thought this was a real phsiks engine.. WTFFF such bs.

A GRAVITY GUN?? NO such thing!!!1 how could a "gun" pick up heavy stuff and throw it?? thats stoopid!!~~!

And howcome you can just pick up like INFITE AMMO AND HEALTH, I mean if you had a field of medikits and hundreds of Combine coming at u, you could just keep fighting forever and never die cuz medkits heal u instantly. How LAME.. it doesnt take Gordon time to pick them up and use them, not only that but ammo too!

How does the stupid car have an infinite ammo box on the back! tHATS JUST RETARDED, as is this stupid post. Nitpicking the game to death is just corny. WTF is wrong with you. It's a game. If you want real life you got it. You can't expect a game to be real life, loser. I hate people like this who actually sit there and make a huge list of TINY things wrong with the game and then say it sucks because of dumb stuff.. Plain and simple this is the best game ever developed, IF ANYONE OUT HERE CAN MAKE A BETTER GAME, GO FOR IT, CUZ YOU'LL BE A GODDAMN MILLIONAIRE. In the meanwhile just stop whining!

 

[[46] pushit [2]]

...So what if I have to restart the level? I want to whip out my shotty and blow that guys head off for his insolence. But, no. We can't have that can we? They tried to make HL2 such a realistic world and fail completely on this point...

So you're method of releasing your anger with a computer game is to blow some guy's head off....yeah, that's real healthy. maybe it's good VALVe didnt allow people to do this.

i would have liked NPCs to at least take damage, that way, as mentioned by the OP, you couldnt just spray or nade/rocket areas where NPCs where and not have to worry about hurting them. adds a little realism. but valve is basically between a a rock and a hard place because if they did indeed allow NPCs die (wherein you would have to restart/reload whatever) we could get people trolling the forums wiht comments like "GOD I HAT E THIS GAEM NCPs alwWAYs in My WAY and i alwys kill dem cuz i suck and cnt tink for myself..." so either way you get complaints. And anyway, NPCs die so often (they are really only good for "tanking" aka taking the hits) i dont think it would matter. what bugs me is that sometimes i want an NPC to stay hidden so some strider doesnt blow him away...or i want the rebel citizen to come with me, but not FIRE at the strider/combine and get his dang attention! i usualyl just end up using htem as distractions...but usually i feel bad and F9 it...haha

and, on a seperate note, I am really tired of how gaming forums seem to be shaping up. i have never heard so much whining/complaining/trolling in one place. the ratio of good, thoughtful posts to the usual rant/troll/complain "GOD HL2 SUXZ" is 1:10. thankfully, there are some intelligent, mature posters (and mods) who try their best to contribute to the community.

at least this place doesnt have it as bad as World of Warcraft forums...that place is troll heaven.

EDIT: fixed quote error...

 

[DEATH eVADER]

Yes shooting scientists was fun i especially liked guass gunning them so they explode laying trip mines was fun too. oh and snarks.

I liked the demo when Barney says, "I bet your glad I've got this good ol' sidearm on me aren't you?"

Hell yeah, whack him one in the head and grab his pistol.

I do have to admit, for a game and company that is trying to bring forward more realism, it doesn't exactly follow the rules does it when the NPC's do a Matrix and reflect any incoming object especially a crowbar hit?

Ah snarks (sigh), I remember the gool old days when gaming was actually fun :thumbs:

 

[Foebane]

Well, if that is the moronic attitude I have to put up with from you lot of HL2 obsessed fanboys, SO BE IT! **** OFF, **** OFF the lot of you you bunch of morons who sit in their ivory towers and think their game is better than all the others out there!! MY GOD, WHAT ARROGANT BASTS!!

BTW, I got rid of my copy of HL2 days ago as it was NEVER REALLY MINE, thanks to rancid Steam and all it implies!

You hear me? PISS OFF, and I am outta here! ****ing fanboy pisstakes. You won't hear from me from now on!

Oh, and you can delete my account to, Admins, as I will not be on this HL-[TWO] board any longer.

My allegiance is to HL1!

Farewell!

 

[VirusType2]

Jesus H. Christ, is it really beyond your comprehension that when you can f**k up the entire flow of a game by killing friendly NPC's, it's a bad thing? And ultimately even becoming frustrating because you accidentally killed someone friendly? And why on earth would you want to implement something you shouldn't be doing in the first place? You shouldn't be shooting NPC's, and when you do, it will **** up the game. (VIRUSTYPE2:"I LIKE THIS PART"---> lmfao)Ruined the believability of a real world? Please, are you trying to say shooting teammates is a profound element of a believable world? Please stay out of my world then.

NPC's in HL1 were disposable, cardboard cutouts. When they were in positions where you could harm them, they were useless for the further flow of the game. It was manageable then.

Ruined the believability of a real world? Please, are you trying to say shooting teammates is a profound element of a believable world? Please stay out of my world then.

lmfao. I like this cat! that's smart.

 

[VirusType2]

Jesus H. Christ, is it really beyond your comprehension that when you can f**k up the entire flow of a game by killing friendly NPC's, it's a bad thing? And ultimately even becoming frustrating because you accidentally killed someone friendly? And why on earth would you want to implement something you shouldn't be doing in the first place? You shouldn't be shooting NPC's, and when you do, it will **** up the game. Ruined the believability of a real world? Please, are you trying to say shooting teammates is a profound element of a believable world? Please stay out of my world then.

NPC's in HL1 were disposable, cardboard cutouts. When they were in positions where you could harm them, they were useless for the further flow of the game. It was manageable then.

QUOTED FROM PvtRyan "Ruined the believability of a real world? Please, are you trying to say shooting teammates is a profound element of a believable world? Please stay out of my world then."

lmfao. I like this cat! that's smart.

 

[PvtRyan]

Well, if that is the moronic attitude I have to put up with from you lot of HL2 obsessed fanboys, SO BE IT! **** OFF, **** OFF the lot of you you bunch of morons who sit in their ivory towers and think their game is better than all the others out there!! MY GOD, WHAT ARROGANT BASTS!!

BTW, I got rid of my copy of HL2 days ago as it was NEVER REALLY MINE, thanks to rancid Steam and all it implies!

You hear me? PISS OFF, and I am outta here! ****ing fanboy pisstakes. You won't hear from me from now on!

Oh, and you can delete my account to, Admins, as I will not be on this HL-[TWO] board any longer.

My allegiance is to HL1!

Farewell!

Why did you post this? Do you think we care even the slightest? If it's still unclear to you (which I suspect) the answers is a clear NO.

Don't like the game? Cool, but why on earth register to a fansite, and to post why you don't like it? There's a billion games I don't like, do you see me going to those forums, post some retarded rant and then yell they're all fanboys ("oh noes, people on a fansite like the game, FANBOYS!!") and leave acting we would give a flying f**k.

 

[Asknoone]

Maybe I should've pointed out that sometimes NPCs shoot at you FOR NO REASON, especially in squad-based games.

Sometimes, when I played Star Trek Voyager: Elite Force, at one point in that game, I ended up with two friendly NPCs shooting at me for no apparent reason. Yes, we were all Feds; No, I didn't shoot them.

The point is, I needed their help to proceed and thanks to a stupid bug they turned on me. And if I remember correctly, when I finally did shoot them, the game ended.

That killed a perfectly reasonable game for me stone dead, because how can you proceed because of such a fatal bug?

All I'm saying is that at least the ST programmers made the effort to create NPCs that were BETTER than the HL2 ones, and that there was the risk of you shooting them by accident, which added to the challenge.

Something the Valve people decided was too much trouble.

Yeah, that certainly adds to the challenge. Not only does it completley tick gamers off when they accidently shoot them, and they shoot back, and you shoot them, and you fail, but its a completley ridiculous idea for any game to implement because its putting boundries in front of the player, who hasnt actually done anything wrong other than shoot a stray bullet.

 

[Zeus]

Good god, if you really want to kill your teammates for whatever reason just DOWNLOAD THE MOD I POSTED ON PAGE 1!! Stop trolling up the boards when I just showed you another option that can control your teamkiller cravings (at least you'll stay off counter strike while playing hl2 killing teammates)


BTW don't let the door hit you on the way out

 

[VirusType2]

DAAAAMMM! I realize you guys had great points, and it was funny and true, but, you guys just teamed up on him. Thats not cool. did you have to completely pwned him?
woww that was cold. He was just trying to make some friends. That was his one thing he felt like typing.

here comes the trench coats and school shootings!
lol
all your base are belong to us.

 

[CookieCuttah]

I hope you didn't make him cry, cuse I was expecting more then that!

 

[Foebane]

Sorry, and Farewell

OK, sorry if I come across as mean and rude, but your replies didn't help.

NO, I don't normally shoot NPCs just because they're there, it's just that I feel there's more believability in a game if they could be shot, that's all.

But I did have to get rid of my game, as I am staging a formal protest against Steam. As I said before, I like the idea that once I buy a game, that I can do what I like with it and not have to set up an account at all. But HL2 comes along with Steam, and I have to do just that. And sign online as well. Well, that sucks. I only hope V&V did this out of a sense of paranoia about the code theft a year before release, because if all games follow their lead from now on then I, and I'm sure many others, will boycott them.

I say boycott, when I already bought it. OK, but I didn't KNOW how draconian Steam had become by then. I was aware of Steam when buying CS: Condition Zero, but it seems to have mutated into a Big Brother-style dictator, as my recent post suggested.

So I am leaving the world of HL2, and possibly Valve as well, until they see the error of their ways and consign Steam to the bin. There are, after all, better ways of d/l'ing game content and patches - at least in theory.

So, farewell, and sorry for the rudeness! :cheers:

 

[VirusType2]

my posts landed really late. oh well, I wanted to tell him when you point your gun at a friendly NPC, gordon lowers his weapon! THATS more realistic to me!

The only time Gordon doesn't lower his draw when pointed at a friendly NPC is during a firefight right? when that makes sense. and also, they don't just stand there when they get shot by you!

They show blood flying out with crippling poses and agonizing screams, although it doesn't seem to hurt them, It doesn't take away from the realism for me.

So you are wrong, wrong, and lets see... wrong!

I wanted to argue these points to him, but I am too late, so instead I will post them and move on.

 

[gordons_crowbar]

my posts landed really late. oh well, I wanted to tell him when you point your gun at a friendly NPC, gordon lowers his weapon! THATS more realistic to me!

The only time Gordon doesn't lower his draw when pointed at a friendly NPC is during a firefight right? when that makes sense. and also, they don't just stand there when they get shot by you!

They show blood flying out with crippling poses and agonizing screams, although it doesn't seem to hurt them, It doesn't take away from the realism for me.

So you are wrong, wrong, and lets see... wrong!

I wanted to argue these points to him, but I am too late, so instead I will post them and move on.

i thought the lowering of the weapon was a very nice touch...

and Foebane: basing your love or hate solely on NPC killing is kind of limiting, isn't it?

/late to the thread.

 

[T.H.C.138]

If VALVe sucks so bad,why don't you build your own game engine(from scratch),create game,make it so badass it recieves many awards...etc.,etc...then come tell us how much VALVe/HL2 sucks...might make for a stronger argument that way..

 

[DarkStar]

It didn't bother me at all.

 

[[46] pushit [2]]

OK, sorry if I come across as mean and rude, but your replies didn't help.

NO, I don't normally shoot NPCs just because they're there, it's just that I feel there's more believability in a game if they could be shot, that's all.

But I did have to get rid of my game, as I am staging a formal protest against Steam. As I said before, I like the idea that once I buy a game, that I can do what I like with it and not have to set up an account at all. But HL2 comes along with Steam, and I have to do just that. And sign online as well. Well, that sucks. I only hope V&V did this out of a sense of paranoia about the code theft a year before release, because if all games follow their lead from now on then I, and I'm sure many others, will boycott them.

I say boycott, when I already bought it. OK, but I didn't KNOW how draconian Steam had become by then. I was aware of Steam when buying CS: Condition Zero, but it seems to have mutated into a Big Brother-style dictator, as my recent post suggested.

So I am leaving the world of HL2, and possibly Valve as well, until they see the error of their ways and consign Steam to the bin. There are, after all, better ways of d/l'ing game content and patches - at least in theory.

So, farewell, and sorry for the rudeness! :cheers:

thank you for going out with some dignity...no all-caps, swear words (excusing your last post ), or rude comments. have fun with your gaming!

oh, and btw, HL2 is the best game ever. no doubt. and that's not a fanboy speaking, that's the fact.

 

[Asknoone]

OK, sorry if I come across as mean and rude, but your replies didn't help.

NO, I don't normally shoot NPCs just because they're there, it's just that I feel there's more believability in a game if they could be shot, that's all.

But I did have to get rid of my game, as I am staging a formal protest against Steam. As I said before, I like the idea that once I buy a game, that I can do what I like with it and not have to set up an account at all. But HL2 comes along with Steam, and I have to do just that. And sign online as well. Well, that sucks. I only hope V&V did this out of a sense of paranoia about the code theft a year before release, because if all games follow their lead from now on then I, and I'm sure many others, will boycott them.

I say boycott, when I already bought it. OK, but I didn't KNOW how draconian Steam had become by then. I was aware of Steam when buying CS: Condition Zero, but it seems to have mutated into a Big Brother-style dictator, as my recent post suggested.

So I am leaving the world of HL2, and possibly Valve as well, until they see the error of their ways and consign Steam to the bin. There are, after all, better ways of d/l'ing game content and patches - at least in theory.

So, farewell, and sorry for the rudeness! :cheers:

Well, your going to be gone awhile, because Steams going no where. Enjoy missing out !

 

[VirusType2]

OK, sorry if I come across as mean and rude, but your replies didn't help.

NO, I don't normally shoot NPCs just because they're there, it's just that I feel there's more believability in a game if they could be shot, that's all.

But I did have to get rid of my game, as I am staging a formal protest against Steam. As I said before, I like the idea that once I buy a game, that I can do what I like with it and not have to set up an account at all. But HL2 comes along with Steam, and I have to do just that. And sign online as well. Well, that sucks. I only hope V&V did this out of a sense of paranoia about the code theft a year before release, because if all games follow their lead from now on then I, and I'm sure many others, will boycott them.

I say boycott, when I already bought it. OK, but I didn't KNOW how draconian Steam had become by then. I was aware of Steam when buying CS: Condition Zero, but it seems to have mutated into a Big Brother-style dictator, as my recent post suggested.

So I am leaving the world of HL2, and possibly Valve as well, until they see the error of their ways and consign Steam to the bin. There are, after all, better ways of d/l'ing game content and patches - at least in theory.

So, farewell, and sorry for the rudeness! :cheers:

What is so bad about Steam? Is it so bad they are trying to prevent from having games stolen from them?

Steam rules! you get a company dedicated to increasing the experience for people that bought the game. They release levels, upgrade the game engine, patches, etc., in a idiot proof manner.

Hell, you buy games from other companies, you are on your own. All you get is 1 patch in most cases, and they don't let you know when or where it is.

 

[Sieg]

Ok,lets not be mean to a person who just posted his thoughts that diden't agree with most of us.

I agree with you guys,steam is pretty cool,but it's so slow......