WoW forums new policy outs members

[T-6000]

PC Gamer thinks this is a bad idea, too:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/07/07/why-blizzard’s-new-forum-plan-is-an-epic-fail/

I myself am not too crazy about this new rule, even though I don't post on there. My sister use to go online alot in her teen years, and she made the mistake of posting her real name a couple of times. A couple of people were able to track down where she lived and would constantly harass her. Ever since then, we were all more strict with her going online. And there have been a few cases where a madball poster would get angry with another poster and track them down, to either beat them badly or even murder them. It's because of these few nuts that go online why I usually think twice before disclosing my real name.

 

[VirusType2]

This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. All they have to do is create a unique string of numbers matched to each account: 8342432632253211

Couldn't that work? I haven't looked at the policy or anything. Also, that would be more unique than: John Smith

 

[Krynn72]

I mean even if someone knows John Smith is posting this on WoW... what can they do with this information? Find the millions of John Smiths in the world and send them all angry letters? People just like to whine.

Exactly. There are so many people with your name that its impossible for anyone to actually find the right one. Who cares if completely innocent people are harassed by angry internet idiots. Not my prob.

 

[Absinthe]

I'm always entertained by people who think that it is their right to have a game the way they want it. Like if Blizzard decides "hey we don't want you to be anonymous while posting on our forums," that their civil rights and liberties have been violated.

I mean even if someone knows John Smith is posting this on WoW... what can they do with this information? Find the millions of John Smiths in the world and send them all angry letters? People just like to whine.

How about... it's just a bad idea and not one I want to take part of? Hey, that was a much simpler explanation.

I understand how easy it can be to dismiss the backlash against this as your run-of-the-mill, sensationalist, internet whinging. But what I'm reading in the EU and US topics pertaining to this announcement has very little to with civil rights. I think everybody's more concerned about the practical consequences of having a disheveled WoW goober Pipl'ing their information and learning more than they're comfortable with. It would help if Blizzard wasn't whitewashing these changes as something that will clean up the forum. It might, but there are other ways to do so that are just as effective and without the privacy concerns. They have an ulterior motive at work, likely in line with their new "social networking" makeover for Battle.net.

Thanks, but there is that other social networking site that already exists, and I've long since deactivated my account on it.

Regarding the argument that "no one will reasonably be able to find anything about you":
http://seewhatyoudidthere.com/2010/...ry-real-ease-of-stalking-in-the-internet-age/

Coworker: Hello?
Me: Hello, could I please speak with So-And-So?
CW: Um, sure, hold on.
Me: Thank you.
::hold music::
(a new person, female, answers)
Manager: Hello, this is Kimberly SomeLastName, can I help you?
Me: Yes, I was wondering if I could please speak with So-And-So?
Manager: :ause:: Sure. Please hold.
Me: Thank you.
::hold music, five minute wait::
:Male Voice)::
MV: Hello?
Me: Hello, is this So-And-So?
MV: Yes.
Me: First and foremost, I want to apologize for calling you at work, and I also apologize if this doesn’t make sense, but are you Sikketh, from Thunderlord?
MV: :ause:: Yes.
Me: So yeah, that took me about 20 minutes and it was pretty easy.
MV: Wow. Ok.
Me: Also, just for shits and giggles, is your address ?
MV: yep.
Me: Phone number 555-555-5555?
MV: yep.
Me: I know your parents’ names are Name1 and Name2, I know your room is painted blue and I know you have a cute dog. I know where you were on the 4th of July and I know when you got back. Don’t worry, I’m not a crazy, I’m not going to do anything with it, and I’m not going to post your address or anything anywhere. I just wanted you to know that what I did was very easy and very free, from just your name and toon’s name. You have a good day, and thanks for being a good sport about it.
MV: Hey, I did basically ask for it – thank you. I was wrong about RealID.

Suggesting that people with names like "John Smith" don't have anything to worry about is silly because, 1) That only applies to a number of people. 2) It's not a genuine solution to security threats. 3) It's not really true.

 

[Bad^Hat]

Heh, came across this. I'd take it with a grain of salt, but it's an interesting possibility...

http://watchingthewatchers.org/indepth/1365085/korean-law-driving-policy-blizzard

Found it on the Kotaku post (which I won't bother linking since it doesn't add anything new). Also enlightened me to another pretty obvious consequence of this change: female players getting ousted. Yeah. They're uhh... kind of popular in WoW. :|

 

[flamingdts]

Heh, came across this. I'd take it with a grain of salt, but it's an interesting possibility...

http://watchingthewatchers.org/indepth/1365085/korean-law-driving-policy-blizzard

Found it on the Kotaku post (which I won't bother linking since it doesn't add anything new). Also enlightened me to another pretty obvious consequence of this change: female players getting ousted. Yeah. They're uhh... kind of popular in WoW. :|

You are right actually.

Could you imagine if an internet fight occurred between a girl and a nutcase? I could already imagine this nutcase calling the girl, threatening her and saying "Bitch I will ****ing rape you and kill you after I track you down."

This is just not a good idea at all.

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

I honestly think they were just tired of, you know... defamation. They're developers who regularly participate in and read their forum boards, which have (particularly as of late) become an utter cesspool of spam, baseless accusations/complaints and harassment. It does add accountability, a frightening amount of accountability that will result in a lot of intelligent and insightful posters to reconsider adding their comments, which blows.

 

[Danimal]

Hey Danimal have you played WoW? You'd be interested in all the 'eye' symbolism.

Oh yeah, I played from release until 2008. A lot of roleplaying, too! Though I wasn't aware of what's going on in the world back then.

Just because you find a symbol in something doesn't immediately mean it's creator is associated with occultism - You need to sell the fact that you have a game with warlocks, demons, etc. by putting these symbols in, in the first place.

It's like putting an American flag on the arm of an American soldier in a war-game. It doesn't mean that the person who made the texture is American or believes in American-based ritual etc.

Exactly. There are so many people with your name that its impossible for anyone to actually find the right one. Who cares if completely innocent people are harassed by angry internet idiots. Not my prob.

Googling my name, my Facebook page is the first hit. My very young cousin's, second.

 

[Bad^Hat]

^ Pretty sure Krynn was being facetious.

You are right actually.

Could you imagine if an internet fight occurred between a girl and a nutcase? I could already imagine this nutcase calling the girl, threatening her and saying "Bitch I will ****ing rape you and kill you after I track you down."

This is just not a good idea at all.

Well, that, or much more likely:

Spoiler

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

Ironically, on anonymous image boards those posts could easily all be the same guy.

 

[StarBob]

I think if people want to stay hidden in the world they should stop posting so much shit on the internet. If your facebook is wide open or your linkedin (as mine is), people are going to be able to find you no matter what's going on. I mean it's your own discretion what you make public to the world and knowing your name is the least of your problems. It's not like the internet magically accumulates data about you... It's all there because you put it there.

 

[Absinthe]

Nobody except for maybe some people I know personally is going to bother looking up my name on Spokeo or some other engine. The information may be out there, but it's not what I'd consider particularly at risk. What becomes worrisome for me is having somebody actively seeking that information out if my actions rub him the wrong way. Contextual information like knowing I play with friends from a certain area or divulged an ISP issue on a tech support forum is meaningless with an anonymous handle. But a name attached to all that can make me easier to identify. Everybody on this forum moans about WoW and how - among other things - it turns some people into disgruntled, imbalanced wretches. Do you honestly think some of these people wouldn't stoop to harassing you over a PVP beatdown or sly ninja roll if they were afforded the ability? That's just one of the problems with the change. Saying "Ha! You shouldn't have ever made a Facebook or Linkedin account!" is just stupid since those sites already existed" and are generally only seen by those you allow to. A far cry from exposing myself to the entire WoW community if I just want to make a post on an exclusive board my subscriptions pays in part for.

Why force that risk on the most vocal part of your community, is all I'm asking. There's no need for it.

 

[CptStern]

I think if people want to stay hidden in the world they should stop posting so much shit on the internet. If your facebook is wide open or your linkedin (as mine is), people are going to be able to find you no matter what's going on. I mean it's your own discretion what you make public to the world and knowing your name is the least of your problems. It's not like the internet magically accumulates data about you... It's all there because you put it there.

hey look it's michael jackson:

that's not michael jackson, this is:

look it's Mike Myers:

oh wait that's not mike myers, this is:

I'd hate for my name to be jeffery dahmer or david berkowitz

oh wait that's not david berkowitz. THIS is david berkowitz

 

[CyberPitz]

1.) Does not affect me at all. Yes, I have a pretty damned unique name and I'm still not worried. If someone wanted to find me, they would have.

2.) I really don't understand why this change is taking place. Kind of confusing....seems useless.

 

[Gargantou]

I think if people want to stay hidden in the world they should stop posting so much shit on the internet. If your facebook is wide open or your linkedin (as mine is), people are going to be able to find you no matter what's going on. I mean it's your own discretion what you make public to the world and knowing your name is the least of your problems. It's not like the internet magically accumulates data about you... It's all there because you put it there.

That's why I don't use shit like facebook

 

[StarBob]

Spokeo is worthless. It has like 5% accuracy at best for anyone and is just made up of what I speculate are guesses or regional demographics. If you can manage to find yourself amongst a sea of similarly named people (or you have a really really unique name), you're going to see pretty much just information you've shared. Oh well this is a pointless argument. Blizzard can do whatever they want with whatever information you willingly give them. They could delete everyone character in WoW tomorrow if they wanted to and turn the game into My Little Pony on ice. People need to realize that they don't own anything related to Blizzard or WoW and accept what they deliver or go do something else.

 

[CptStern]

cyberpitz, if I'm not mistaken you work as a mechanic/body shop? what if I you're a dick to me (I know it's a stretch of the imagination ) and I decided to get back at you by tracking you down, finding your place of work, calling your manager and telling him that I'm mad at you for neglecting to tell me you're HIV positive before we spent the weekend together in a sweaty gay man embrace

 

[CyberPitz]

If I did work at that Mechanic/body shop, then I'm quite sure I can look at my boss and tell him that some weirdo is stalking me.



That's actually one of the cool things I like about it though. HELPING STOP RETARDED TROLLS. One day, the internet will be clean of those vile creatures. Until then, I SHALL NOT REST!!!

 

[Absinthe]

Spokeo is worthless. It has like 5% accuracy at best for anyone and is just made up of what I speculate are guesses or regional demographics. If you can manage to find yourself amongst a sea of similarly named people (or you have a really really unique name), you're going to see pretty much just information you've shared. Oh well this is a pointless argument. Blizzard can do whatever they want with whatever information you willingly give them. They could delete everyone character in WoW tomorrow if they wanted to and turn the game into My Little Pony on ice. People need to realize that they don't own anything related to Blizzard or WoW and accept what they deliver or go do something else.

So paying customers can't voice their displeasure about anything Blizzard does.

Gotcha.

 

[Mogi67]

This is terrible, what a shitty forum this would be if trolling wasn't possible.

 

[StarBob]

So paying customers can't voice their displeasure about anything Blizzard does.

Gotcha.

Anyone can say anything they want... just don't expect anyone else to care.

 

[CptStern]

If I did work at that Mechanic/body shop, then I'm quite sure I can look at my boss and tell him that some weirdo is stalking me.



That's actually one of the cool things I like about it though. HELPING STOP RETARDED TROLLS. One day, the internet will be clean of those vile creatures. Until then, I SHALL NOT REST!!!

nah loss of anonymity doesnt stop the trolls:

it just gives the more vocal ones the spotlight they crave. while discouraging non trolls from posting

 

[Krynn72]

lol Starbob is a mormon.

http://www.lds.net/starbob

 

[Absinthe]

Anyone can say anything they want... just don't expect anyone else to care.

Okay...? I'm really trying to figure where exactly you're coming from on this. "Blizzard is a company, you sign an agreement with them, etc..." That is all perfectly understandable. I think a lot of people realize that Blizzard can pretty much do as they see fit so long as their customers allow it. That is why you are seeing a backlash against the impending change. Sounds to me like you're just suggesting apathy.

It's like you're arguing about everything around the main issue here: the security and privacy of Blizzard's customer base. Do you think this implementation of RealID it's a good idea or a bad one? I can't tell because you instead seem intent on just belittling any concerns.

 

[StarBob]

nah loss of anonymity doesnt stop the trolls:

*big images*

it just gives the more vocal ones the spotlight they crave. while discouraging non trolls from posting

I think there's a difference between Trolls and Asshole Celebrities. People like Perez Hilton and Glenn Beck (one of my favorite Celebrity Assholes) are famous because people agree with them. Trolls say things just to be something like devil's advocates except the most asshole way possible. Things they'd never say if someone could point at them and say "hey you, you're a 12 year old prick who will never amount to anything." They rely on the anonymity factor to establish the small amount of credibility needed on the internet to piss someone off. Once they lose that and thus their potential crediblity, they will avoid posting just as people in public places tend to avoid saying prickish things.

I mean no random dude is going to run into a construction site and scream obscenities while breaking windows and playing with power tools... but in a virtual world of anonymity that occurs pretty much constantly. There's no fear of reprisal. There's no direct consequence. Obviously knowing someone's name doesn't stop this, but without anonymity, there's a lot less courage/will to do these things. I can't say it will help all that much, but I think it will have some effect.

edit: Yep and apparently I'm now 31 and only have one friend named Heather. Really I'm more surprised you didn't find StarBobs on porn sites and forums... I don't even use this name anymore. I wouldn't use it here if I didn't make this account in 2004.

Also, yes I am for RealID. I don't care if anyone knows my name and I don't believe it will hurt anyone to use theirs. I'm not sure if it's going to stop trolls and assholes, but I hope it has some effect. I really don't use Blizz forums (I didn't when I played WoW either) but I do hate trolls.

 

[Krynn72]

Hey Rob, whats your last name?

 

[CptStern]

I think there's a difference between Trolls and Asshole Celebrities.

they were trolls before they became celebrities. that's the point. anonymity would have regulated them to just another faceless troll

 

[StarBob]

Hey Rob, whats your last name?

LIFE

Have fun.

 

[Absinthe]

Also, yes I am for RealID. I don't care if anyone knows my name and I don't believe it will hurt anyone to use theirs. I'm not sure if it's going to stop trolls and assholes, but I hope it has some effect. I really don't use Blizz forums (I didn't when I played WoW either) but I do hate trolls.

But this has very to do with cleaning up trolling. That might be incidental, but this is an incremental change towards Facebook integration that allows your information to be sold for targeted advertising. They are not being honest with their intentions when explaining this to their customers, and that is bullshit regardless of whether or not you support RealID.

Even if we look at it as a trolling deterrent, this is too much. Blizzard could have linked all your characters or reserved all posting privileges to a single global account name and achieve practically the same kind of accountability they say they want. By forcing you to use your real name, Blizzard is basically implying that they want the community to be able to police itself ("I won't say anything bad because now my real name is tagged to everything I post"). I find that to be ethically unsound. I shouldn't have to divulge my anything from my real life on a message board for a video game. You said it yourself that this will likely have little effect on flaming or trolling, so what the hell is the point?

Just because you're comfortable with posting your name for all to see doesn't mean everybody else should be. I have my own reasons and other people have theirs, the substance of which should not matter.

 

[Krynn72]

Oh, you're black? Nevermind then. I don't want any trouble.

 

[StarBob]

That's the thing though, you don't have to divulge any information because you don't have to post.

edit: Yep, didn't you see my picture in that image post?

 

[Krynn72]

That's the thing though, you don't have to divulge any information because you don't have to post.

edit: Yep, didn't you see my picture in that image post?

What image post?

Is this familiar?

 

[Absinthe]

That's the thing though, you don't have to divulge any information because you don't have to post.

It's a service that I pay for with my subscription. My name is not necessary in any forum conversation and I shouldn't have to give it out just because I want to talk about the game. There have also been a few times when Blizzard's phone tech support has redirected me back to the forums for assistance. When you consider what they're asking from you versus what you are actually getting out of their forum experience, this whole thing is just unreasonable. And mark my words, you'll probably end up seeing this get shoehorned into the game at some point down the road.

I guess I just want to hear a coherent explanation as to why this is at all necessary, rather than just platitudes about how it won't be so bad or cop-outs like "lol just dont post". I don't think there's any good reason for the situation to be like that in the first place. Less arguments about what Blizzard can do and more about what they should do.

 

[StarBob]

What image post?

Is this familiar?

Ya that's the shitty apartment I used to live in like 6 months ago. Bleh... hate that place. I didn't even live on that side

Ya know people probably said the same thing about phone books when they first came out. "You guys are gonna put my PHONE NUMBER, NAME, and ADDRESS in a PUBLIC BOOK!?" and everyone paniced. The only person it ever worked out poorly for was Sarah Conner and she did all right. But seriously, everyone's got weak arguments against it. Yeah it's true it doesn't seem to have a place on the Internet, but it's what Blizzard wants and if it improves anything they do then I'm for it. I don't care if it's 100% beneficial to me as long as it makes Blizzard do what they do better... whether it's solving issues faster or becoming more efficient in some way. It would be nice if they did (and I'm sure they will sometime) give a clear expanded explanation of the pros of this change.

 

[Absinthe]

I'm sure it will be something along the lines of how Infinity Ward tried to convince everybody that IWnet would be awesome.

I don't think this has anything to do with being better or efficient, or at least not in any way towards their customers. It will just help them make more money off of ads.

 

[Bad^Hat]

I mean no random dude is going to run into a construction site and scream obscenities while breaking windows and playing with power tools... but in a virtual world of anonymity that occurs pretty much constantly. There's no fear of reprisal. There's no direct consequence. Obviously knowing someone's name doesn't stop this, but without anonymity, there's a lot less courage/will to do these things. I can't say it will help all that much, but I think it will have some effect.

Also, yes I am for RealID. I don't care if anyone knows my name and I don't believe it will hurt anyone to use theirs. I'm not sure if it's going to stop trolls and assholes, but I hope it has some effect. I really don't use Blizz forums (I didn't when I played WoW either) but I do hate trolls.

The random dude running into a construction site isn't due to a lack of anonymity, it's due to a lack of brain activity. Trolling on the internet isn't destructive in nearly the same sense, it isn't illegal (cept maybe in Korea), and it certainly doesn't take some kind of mental illness for people to type bad words into a computer.

Why are you still saying it won't harm anyone? It has already been shown that you can track people down with this. Saying "oh well if the information is out there it's really that person's fault" is completely missing the issue: this is as much about people having the means to track someone down as it is about having a motive. [some] WoW players are ****ing nutters. Fact.

And as Absinthe stated, you often have to post technical issues on the WoW boards for Blizzard to sort them, so yeah, it can't be avoided so easily. Also yes, the realid thing is in-game already, but people can only see your name if you give it out willingly afaik.

Ya know people probably said the same thing about phone books when they first came out. "You guys are gonna put my PHONE NUMBER, NAME, and ADDRESS in a PUBLIC BOOK!?" and everyone paniced.

Local phonebooks which only contain the house owner's initials. Totally the same thing.

But seriously, everyone's got weak arguments against it. Yeah it's true it doesn't seem to have a place on the Internet, but it's what Blizzard wants and if it improves anything they do then I'm for it. I don't care if it's 100% beneficial to me as long as it makes Blizzard do what they do better... whether it's solving issues faster or becoming more efficient in some way. It would be nice if they did (and I'm sure they will sometime) give a clear expanded explanation of the pros of this change.

Hey Krynn hurry up and find a photo of Starbob so I can photoshop Blizzard's cock onto it.

 

[BabyHeadCrab]

In related news: Blizzard has scrapped RealID altogether and will be forcing U.S. subscribers to post under their Social Security numbers--while subscribers in Europe, the Oceanic Territories and most of East Asia will now be required to feature photographs of their identifying passport page.

Accountability, folks.

 

[organizedcrime]

Blizzard wouldn't have to deal with this utter PR nightmare if they weren't so damn lackadaisical with the moderation of their forums. It's downright laughable compared to other forums.

I had thought about the idea of removing anonymity as a punishment, but that would require good judgment (and thus moderation) in the first place.

 

[Ravioli]

Source (german) http://www.gamona.de/games/activision-blizzard,blizzards-bashiok-ist-erstes-opfer-der-real-id:ne
ws,1769743.html

4chan is going gearing up on raiding blizzard employees atm, sad i wont be able to witness it as i will be without internet for a few weeks

EDIT:

Funny

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MZSxawAnQA

 

[Bad^Hat]

Since people here and otherwise have been so eager to post that "Greater Internet ****wad Theory" comic, you might be interested to hear what the creator has to say on the matter.

The MetaFilter post he links is long-winded as **** but does an immaculate job of explaining the plight of your average WoW girl ~IRL OMG~ as well as some other things. I've known a few (including the female type person I'm now with) and the ones I've talked to about it basically echo this sentiment.