Xen crystal in Black Mesa East

Polaris

Polaris

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In laboratory of Eli Vance is some device with typical yellow Xen mineral and source of rays (I think its small anti-mass spectrometer). Probably this crystal is not GG-3883 (famous sample from Anomalous materials) but it could be a EP-0021 (weak sample mentioned in report of Collete Green - in HL1 manual) or other Xen crystal. What is function of these machine and crystal? Maybe is element of teleportation technology (teleport is based on some crystalline anomaly) or something different?
 
Xen has loads of crystals like it. The vortiguants could have brought some, or some may have come to earth during the portal storms. Eli had plenty of opportunities to get this crystal.

In real life, a mass spectrometer use Nuclear Magnetic Resonance on the material being analysed to find the energy values of it's resonance peaks and hence determine the structure of the material.


I have no idea what an anti-mass spectrometer is, I'm guessing it's just pseudoscience, but my interpretation is they want to analyse this crystal's structure, but conventional methods yield null results.
So they use this high tech, and high energy analyser, but by resonating the atoms in the sample they cause some kind of disturbance which excites the atoms too much and they do this resonance cascade scenario etc etc.
Looks like Eli is analysing the crystal using a similar spectroscopy, but there's no resonance cascade this time.
Maybe the sample in the Black Mesa lab was sabotaged?

Of course it's all pseudoscience (ie BS) so don't look too much into this, it's just a story.
 
Maybe the sample in the Black Mesa lab was sabotaged?
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To my knowledge, the crate that you push into the big sparkling thing was placed there by the Combine...or was is Xen? I know for sure that the substance being analyzed was placed there as a sabotage.
 
To my knowledge, the crate that you push into the big sparkling thing was placed there by the Combine...or was is Xen? I know for sure that the substance being analyzed was placed there as a sabotage.
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It was niether, they were testing it out, if there was anyone who sabotaged it it was Dr Breen, who was repeatedly pushing for it to be examined
 
The reason there was a resonance cascade, I'm guessing, is because 1) the sample was so pure and so large and 2) they used so much power. I got the distinct sense in HL1 that Gordon had pushed things into the spectrometer before.

I bet the sample was just there to be studied. That's kinda what scientists do. :dozey:
 
I read some Resonance cascade Theory on teh interweb...

Basically, The crystal was too pure, and retained the majority of the energy that flowed into it, and there is some negative feedback of some sort (you hear the scientists say "its probably nothing" during the experiment). Also, breen pushed to run the equipment at a higher power than they had planned to.
This theory was preceded by a little on a nuclear bomb, so im assuming that when the energy reached its 'critical mass' it dispersed outwards at speed, starting off the portal storms.
We know that breen purposefully caused the resonance-cascade as a part of a deal with the combine, so all this seems to make sense to me (theres some reference to breen setting up a satelite to amplify the portal storms in the hl timeline website, y'know which one).

These machines are not directly related to teleport technology, but they allowed the scientists to analyse what makes basic teleport stuff work.

...

Probably. :p
 
ok. go back to the area where u find this "anti-mass spectrometer" and examine the area more closely.

If you look to the top of the machine you'll see it connects to the teleport thingo. so im guessing that these crystals allow the "xen relay" that mossman talks about on the lift down, without them teleports would be limited to inter dimentional travel not local travel like vance and kleiner and alyx have been able to do, again as mossman says.
 
I know EXACTLY why the Crystal is important.

In the Half-Life Manual, it tells us that Gordon's Thesis paper was written on "Observation of Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen Entanglement on Supraquantum Structures By Induction through Nonlinear Transuranic Crystal of Extremely Long Wavelength (ELW) Pulse from Mode-Locked Source Array."

In other words, the Crystals are what enable teleportation. With at thesis title like that, its no wonder Eli thought you would be interested in observing the Transuranic Crystal.

This is probably why Xen has so much in the line of natural teleporters, because Xen is so rich in the crystal. Apparently, the conditions to create a portal where exactly right when they tried to merely analyze the crystal, and thus, the Resonance Cascade.
 
Pai-Mei said:
I know EXACTLY why the Crystal is important.

In the Half-Life Manual, it tells us that Gordon's Thesis paper was written on "Observation of Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen Entanglement on Supraquantum Structures By Induction through Nonlinear Transuranic Crystal of Extremely Long Wavelength (ELW) Pulse from Mode-Locked Source Array."

In other words, the Crystals are what enable teleportation. With at thesis title like that, its no wonder Eli thought you would be interested in observing the Transuranic Crystal.

This is probably why Xen has so much in the line of natural teleporters, because Xen is so rich in the crystal. Apparently, the conditions to create a portal where exactly right when they tried to merely analyze the crystal, and thus, the Resonance Cascade.
Click to expand...

Nods, the thesis is also probably the reason why Mossman talks about being a fan of Gordon's work even before he joined Black Mesa.
 
And also states why I'm right in saying the Combine had no control over Xen. If they'd controlled Xen, they'd be fart-assing about with crystals all day long, teleporting in and out of women's locker rooms as they please.

Or something. Still, if the Combine controlled Xen, they'd have all of the local teleportational tech they'd need from the Controllers.

-Angry Lawyer
 
not really. just because the crystals were there doesnt mean that the combine knew about their properties and how to use them to their advantage.

Its generally known now that the combine had control over xen during the time gordon visited and killed nihilanth.

damn i wish i had actually bought half life and then i would have the manual with all this cool stuff. how bad is it that half life 2 has no manual besides a piece of orange plastic!
 
Its generally known now that the combine had control over xen during the time gordon visited and killed nihilanth.
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Then where were the Synth? The Citadels? The Combine symbols they assign their troops? It's not known who controlled Xen, as there was no evidence in either game. Just because one fan created an 'official storyline' page, everyone believes it.

I'm sorry, but saying that the Nihilanth was controlled by the Combine simply because he was controlled by something is wrong. There needs to be more proof either way.
Using most people's theories on the subject, if any Alien were to be controlled, by default it's gotta be the Combine. There's no supporting evidence, other than a few Nostradamus style ramblings by the Vortigaunts.

So what if the Nihilanth had slave manacles? Using that sort of logic, then the genie in Alladin must have been under Combine control, because he wore similar ones.

Yes, the Nihilanth was probably not a natural creature. But it had a large chunk of Xen crystal in its skull - and if the Combine controlled Xen, but didn't know localised teleportation, why did they build a massive teleporter in Nihilanth?

Oh, and for people saying that the Thumpers in Xen were evidence of Combine habitation...
0930.jpg


Stuff that hits the ground (or in Xen's case, seems to drill into it) is not a Combine thing.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Wow.

--bows to Angry Lawyer--

That's pretty funny and pretty accurate as well. Although I don't agree with you, I guess there is no PROOF that it was the COMBINE that controlled Xen, although I think that it is pretty obvious that they were controlled by something. "Slaves... we are slaves... we are." says the Nihilanth to you.

You do make the case however, that we like to assume quite a bit.

I think the logic is that--
The Black Mesa incident did not seem to be an accident. It was forced by the Administrator for SOME reason. "The administrator just would not listen." Humans had come into contact with Xen, this much we know. Then, the COMBINE invades! Somehow, by establishing contact with Xen, the Combine invades! Maybe you are right that at first it was whoever controlled Xen used them to invade earth, was then defeated, and then the Combine used this as an opportunity invade Earth. I think this is evidence that the Combine at least went through Xen to get to us.

It seems odd that the Combine, who obviously like to enslave other races, also had access to Xen, while (or shortly after) Xen was enslaved, yet were NOT the ones enslaving Xen? True, its POSSIBLE, but why create another big bad group that likes to enslave things like your theory, just to complicate things?

Then where were the Synth?
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I seem to recall alien "dropships" and laser turrets that remind me of Synth. Besides, the Combine did not need to physically suppress the Xen folk, Vortigaunts, in order to control them. They only needed to control their leader, the Nihilanth, in order to control them. I think that the Synth are on Earth only to fight, which was unnecessary in Xen, at least by the time Gordon got there.

The Citadels?
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I would say that the structure that you were climbing in right before you get to the Nihlianth, where all of the barrels-o-bad guys are being made, was the equivalent of the Xen Citadel.

But it had a large chunk of Xen crystal in its skull - and if the Combine controlled Xen, but didn't know localised teleportation, why did they build a massive teleporter in Nihilanth?
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See, I think that the Combine were only able to control localized teleportation using an entity that was already naturally "attuned" to the crystals (or some bullshit like that). So while they could control the Nihilanth who could control teleportation, they never learned to control teleportation directly. And why would they need to with such an effective teleporter as Nihilanth?

Good arguments, though.
 
Well, in my humble opinion, I think that on Xen, the Controllers are the real folks in power. Which is why Nihilanth looked so much like one - rather than a god creating them in its image, they created a god in their image. There's no outside force, simply the Controllers dominating their own weaker relatives.

I theorise that the Combine merely capitalised on an already weakened Earth. I mean, if the Xenians were under Combine control, you would have seen them serve under their ranks. Controllers - miniature versions of Nihilanth, would be providing localised teleportation. The Combine aren't stupid; they'd have capitalised on such local talents, and enlisted them on Earth.

The Xen dropships reminded me more of human manta-rays than anything, and they weren't dropping anything, but acting as relays for Xenian teleporters.

Although the Administrator did fudge the experiment, I'm thinking it's more trying to advance in research too quickly, rather than a deliberate attempt to create an unstable portal. You could step through each and every sample, one at a time, following the strictest safety principles, taking decades, or you could just shove the largest one in there, and hope for the best, learning all you could ever need in a single test.

And yes, maybe the factory in Xen did look a little like the Combine one, but it didn't look like a skyscraper. I think it had it's height more because the Controllers had a lot of ease moving up and down unaided.

And there are local teleporters inside the Xen factory.

Besides, if you had an extraterrestrial observer look at a normal Earth factory (albeit a very large one), and then looked at the Citadel, they'd probably say that we've always been under Combine control.

Besides, very few Xen things used ANYTHING truly mechanical, and everything Combine embraces mechanics in some form, including the 'Advisor', what we surmise as 'true Combine'.

The Universe is a big place - too big for just one superpower. Besides, the Xen weren't exactly a force as strong as the Combine - they're like a European country compared to something like the US. Pretty powerful, but not nearly as powerful as some of the others.

Oh, and besides, where is there evidence they had access to Xen? Our teleportation and the Combine tunnelling teleportation work on different theories; didn't Mossman say something about the fact the Combine hadn't figured out how to use Xen as a relay/slingshot?

-Angry Lawyer
 
Good points.

Although the Administrator did fudge the experiment, I'm thinking it's more trying to advance in research too quickly, rather than a deliberate attempt to create an unstable portal.
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The only defense that I have against that is that the Administrator later became Earth's secretary to the Combine... almost as though he had been in contact with them before the incident. And BMRF was in contact with Xen, at that time.

Oh, and besides, where is there evidence they had access to Xen? Our teleportation and the Combine tunnelling teleportation work on different theories; didn't Mossman say something about the fact the Combine hadn't figured out how to use Xen as a relay/slingshot?
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I guess you're right. I guess the only thing I have to back myself up is the temporal sense... that the Combine "attacked" when Earth had just contacted Xen.


You know, I think you ARE right. Based on what Mossman said, the Combine don't know a damn thing about Xen at all... apparently not even how to get from there to here. I'm guessing that when Earth fell victim to the Portal Storms and everyone was suddenly in danger of being eaten by bullsquids, the Combine used this opportunity to step in and asked to provide "protection" to humans in return for their "service." Earth refused, the Combine attacked, won in seven hours or less, but the resistance never died.
 
Lawyer, i think you best email Marc Laidlaw on the matter, i am sure he would be happy to supply you with the truth :D
 
Laidlaw stated that, when making the original Half-Life game's storyline, he didn't have Half-Life 2's storyline planned. And Laidlaw has said that he's not going to cave in to people's request for storyline information, except for stating the fact that Race X aren't playing a part in the current storyline.

Unless you're indirectly implying that Laidlaw replied with a direct answer - if so, could you post a transcript, and I'll shut up.

I'm not trying to prove or disprove anything here. I'm just trying to state that, in the current storyline, there is too little evidence for either Combine control, or Xenian independance.

As Nihilanth probably said 'The truth...you can never know...the truth'

-Angry Lawyer
 
The local teleporters in the Xen factory were most likely controlled by the Nihlanth who acted as a sort of bridge to allow this.
 
True, but as the Nihilanth is likely a created creature, wouldn't that imply that the Combine knew what the Crystals did, and so put one in it's cranium?

-Angry Lawyer
 
No, i was wanting you to email him :P . Oh well, it was worth a try...i guess we will just have to keep at each others throats until theres some definitve evidence for either argument :)
 
Or wait for an expansion pack to clarify it, which it probably will.

The only reason I get so heated about this is because people spread the 'Combine control' idea like it's gospel. To me, it's like saying 'Oh my God, Myanmar is run by dictators! And everyone knows that Hitler was the original and biggest dictator, so Myanmar is controlled by Nazi Germans! Look, there's loads similar - they're both abusive to the citizens, and rely on fear to keep the population under control!'

Or with the Xenian mining thingies and the Combine thumpers, it's more like 'Look at this! It's got a label - 'Tuning fork'. It's called a fork, and it's made of metal, so it's gotta be used for eating! Hell, it's even got prongs to poke food with!'

People should take an objective view on things, rather than follow like sheep. Never assume anything.

And the only reason I skirt around the subject is so that, when I make my mod's campaign mode, I don't tread on any developer toes and have my story proven really wrong by an expansion.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Hahaahaha, very true, its nice to know someone has an alternate opinion, and yes, i do agree about that site dedicated to the storyline, its all pure speculation to begin with, people seem to think it was written by marc laidlaw himself :P
 
Like some obfuscated Chinese Whispers.

'Yeah, I had an idea, maybe the Combine controlled Xen at one point'

Turns to

'I heard from a reputable source that Xen is under Combine control'

Turns to

'Laidlaw said himself, the Combine control Xen'

Ends at

'OMG, Angry Lawyerz! j00 n00bx0r! Itz 1n d@ mAnUaL!!'

I'm thinking of putting a subsection on my up-and-coming mod-site about how I'm right, and everyone else is wrong.

Either that, or provide a nonbiased evaluation.

-Angry Lawyer
 
well

i GUESS your right angry, if u just totally forget that nihilanth has massive metal structures coming out of his body, much the same as the combine do to all the slaves they capture, as seen in nova prospekt with the combine soldier who has all the pipes and stuff there.

Thats probably the clearest indication that the combine did have control over xen

Also, you should note that the combine themselves did not have human looking combine soldiers in their arsenal until they invaded earth with what they had at the time: the vortigaunt slaves. They dont wear that stuff just to look pretty you know.

Geezus its stupid even trying to comprehend where your coming from, how could the combine have not been controlling xen or at least the creatures that lived on it??

The vortigaunts : In Half life 1 they were trying to kill you because Nihilanth or the combine were controlling them. when you killed nihilanth, the creature who had been a slave to the combine, the vortigaunts were freed and now they are friendly! sheesh-kababs

What? so you think that one day the combine just ZAAPED their way into earth and starting shooting stuff? no way!
the xen force came over and started harrassing people, and probably under the instructions of breen some people were rounded up and turned into the combine protection force and others into real combine soldiers.
 
the only reason that you dont see the combine advisors in half life 1 is because laidlaw hadnt invented them yet, but the combine were still present in the form of the vortigaunt slaves! in the manual it even calls them slaves!
 
OMG, Angry Lawyerz! j00 n00bx0r! Itz 1n d@ mAnUaL!!'
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Wow. You couldn't have predicted these fuc|<tards posts closer.

Geezus its stupid even trying to comprehend where your coming from, how could the combine have not been controlling xen or at least the creatures that lived on it??
Click to expand...

the only reason that you dont see the combine advisors in half life 1 is because laidlaw hadnt invented them yet, but the combine were still present in the form of the vortigaunt slaves! in the manual it even calls them slaves!
Click to expand...

C'mon, fuc|<tards, look past your own ignorance and what everyone else thinks. Just because the Vortigaunts were slaves does not mean that they were slaves to the combine! Yes, we know that they were slaves to the Nihilanth, but how do we know that he was enslaved to the combine? If the combine were in control of Xen, they would surely know that they could use it as a relay/slingshot to Earth and teleport anywhere they wanted? Mossman SPECIFICALLY states that they don't know how to do this! So... they are in control of Xen but they don't know that they can go through it to teleport? How stupid are the Combine?

The obvious answer is that the Nihilanth was enslaved, but not to the Combine.

In my opinion, He was probably enslaved to another alien species, like the G-Man's species or something. In fact, now that I think about it, they have OBVIOUSLY mastered teleportation, and doesn't the G-Man even tell a scientist that the experiment mustn't be halted at the beginning of the original Half-Life? Then, Gordon Freeman comes along, kills Nihilanth, and screws up their plans. So the G-man, rather than let all of this go to waste, offers a job to the one man more powerful than Nihilanth, Gordon. Earth is already weakened by the fact that tons of Xen wildlife are teleporting in, so the Combine takes this opportunity to sweep in and take control, against the G-Man's race's wishes. Now they need to fight the Combine just to get earth! Doesn't Breen speak of 'unleashing something you cannot imagine' and all of that stuff? I bet, in foresight, that the Combine will prove to be better masters than what the G-Man's race does to us.

Play the games, fuc|<tards, and make your own opinions, not just what other people tell you.
 
But doesnt gman at the end of half life 1 thank you for giving him control of xen or somthing?

Anyways, i always felt as if the floaty guys were in control, xen is realy weird. What about the alien grunts? anyone have any thaughts on those?
 
FireCrack said:
What about the alien grunts? anyone have any thaughts on those?
Click to expand...

I believe Alien Grunts are fairly similiar to Vortigaunts, they're just slaves to the Nihilanth
 
FireCrack said:
What about the alien grunts? anyone have any thaughts on those?
Click to expand...
The Alien Grunt appears to be the main army unit of Xen (since Vortigaunts were really only slaves and Xen Masters were there to control the slaves).

Alien Grunts are artificially made. They are produced in large numbers in the Xenian factories, by Vortigaunts. Since the Vortigaunts are now free, there are no more slave labourers to work in those factories, therefore the production of Alien Grunts would've ended. There are also theories that Gargantuas were artificially created as well.
 
I think it's pretty obvious that Xen was under someone's control, and that someone is most likely the Combine. Or Race-X.

Here's my evidence why:
1. Nihilanth had chains. Chains usually denote bondage.
2. Nihilanth had evidence of massive surgical trauma, with scars, and his entire lower body being replaced with a flying platform. That seems like the Combine's MO, doesn't it? The Advisor has scars all over its body.
3. Vortigaunts in HL1 had those green gauntlets and the slave-collar. Combine enslaved Vortigaunts in HL2 have the same. (The Vortigaunt sweeping the street and the one tortured to death in Nova Prospekt)
4. It can't be the G-Man because at the end of HL1 he said "The Border World, Xen, is in our control, for the time being..." And you see lots of dead marines and a gutted tank in Xen. When Gordon killed Nihilanth, Gman saw a chance to capture Xen, and he used the US Marines to do it.
5. At one point, Nihilanth says "Slaves, we are all slaves, we are" or something to that effect. Why would he say that if he wasn't being controled by someone? And who has shown to have a perchant to enslave hapless sentients? The Combine!
6. Who else is there? We've only got three major players in the HL saga. The Combine, G-Man (and his proxy the US government) and Race-X. We know that it wasn't G-Man who controled Xen, because he captured it when Gordon killed Nihilanth. So that leaves Race-X and the Combine. And since Laidlaw said that Race-X plays no major part in the current HL story, That leaves the Combine to have controled Xen.

Now, as for why the Combine wouldn't have local teleportation if they captured Xen long ago: They could have relied upon the Nihilanth for local teleportation. Once Nihilanth was killed, they're up the creek without any way to teleport around. It's entirely possible that the Combine doesn't realize the properties of the Xen crystals, and that Nihilanth did but he failed to tell his masters of their power.

Nihilanth witholding information from the Combine wouldn't be entirely unprecedented in HL. In HL2, Breen basically says "Now that I've got you and Doctor Vance in my possession, I can make any deal I want with the Combine!" Breen was using Gordon as a bargaining chip, much as Nihilanth may have used his knowledge of teleportation for a bargaining chip with the Combine.

I mean, the Combine certainly seemed to want the ability to teleport around locally, and Nihilanth could have provided that service until he was terminated. Hell, he could have just told the Combine that it was a natural ability that he started with, not that it was the result of the ever plentiful crystals present in Xen.

Meh, that's just my theory.
 
In my opinion, its the Alien Controllers - the flying little things, that are in control. Alien Controller parilaiment -> Nihilanth -> the lesser things. It's a hell of a lot easier keeping a race in check if you create a false front for youself. And if you look at the Alien Controllers, they've all got similar crystals implanted in their skulls - teleportation crystals. So, each Controller can gate himself, and likely a small radius around him, whilst the Nihilanth could do it on a larger scale.

Not all of the Controllers were eradicated in Freeman's escapades. You would have thought that the Combine would have used them to gate stuff around short distances, or at least teleport themselves into installations as a shock attack.

Xen WAS controlled, but it was more likely controlled by an internal force. Sort of like having a minority sieze power in an Earth country. Like the Taliban in Afghanistan.

The metal thing has a Combine feel to it, being black shiny metal, but just doesn't seem to quite fit. It looks like it's made of the same stuff Grunt Armour is made of - and anybody who's looked into these things will know that the Grunt armour is actually a natural carapace that grows on them. The Combine DO have creatures that grow armour on them - the Synth - but you can definately see the differences in material.

The 'Humans invading Xen' seems more likely simply a vision overlaid by the G-Man, using Half-Life 1's poor technology. Compare it to the first sequences of Half-Life 2: did he actually transport you to places like the Black Mesa antimass spectrometer thing, and the Citadel's slave pod things during the first few moments of the game? I think not - they were images he implanted in your head.

Oh, and it could be the fact that Half-Life 1 could only support one sky texture at a time. But that doesn't give Valve much credit, does it.

In my opinion, Xen was a civilisation dominated by the Xenian Controller flying things, and was an isolationist state, obsessed with their own protection, like Switzerland in the Middle Ages.
It's quite probable the only reason the Xenians struck Earth was as retaliation for our scientists stealing their crystals, and embalming their creatures in study-bottles.

Admitted, the Advisor has lots of stitches, similar to Nihilanth... but again, lots of things have stitches. Like the manikin thing in Nightmare Before Christmas. Just because both have stiches doesn't mean that they're related. I'll point at my tuning fork example, again.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Real-time strategy, in the Half-Life extended universe. Eventually, it'll have single-player campaigns for each main race, based parallel to the events in the actual game. That's where I've gotta be careful, story-wise, though. I hate writing something story-wise, and then realise the base facts I used were speculation.

-Angry Lawyer
 
I am busy starting up my singleplayer mod as well, with This is Tea and Mechagodzilla, writing the story has been the hardest, keeping in the constraints of whats already there.
 
when your doing the experiment did anyone notice what the beams were shooting at?i took a look and saw a huge crystal any one else notice?
 
Yeah, it's a small chunk of what appears to be Xenian crystal.

Samon, you're best bet with a storyline is to avoid the position of Xen as much as possible, just like they did in the actual game. Either that, or set it at a time beyond HL2, state the Combine now control Xen, but leave it vague.

-Angry Lawyer
 
Yeah, i have ran through alot of idea's and am quite happy where i have ended up, avoiding much of the heavier plot details.

The stories main purpose is to give people are view of the outside world beyond the combine city's and so on.
 
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