Always bet on Duke

[bam23]

Except OB was made for PC THEN ported to consoles. When it's the other way it's like trying to play after cutting your index finger off.

And 2 weapons only is bullshit. If Gearbox had brains they'd make the swap button open up a selection wheel. You're gonna tell me that DUKE can chew gum for hours but can only hold 2 GODDAMN WEAPONS WHAT THE ****.

 

[Stigmata]

Except OB was made for PC THEN ported to consoles. When it's the other way it's like trying to play after cutting your index finger off.

And 2 weapons only is bullshit. If Gearbox had brains they'd make the swap button open up a selection wheel. You're gonna tell me that DUKE can chew gum for hours but can only hold 2 GODDAMN WEAPONS WHAT THE ****.

DING DING DING. We have a winning alternative.

 

[Barnz]

I've played Duke Nukem 3D on PS1...

that was a shitty port...




...damn, can't forget playing the ****ing game in front of my parents. I think it was censored, but you could still give money to japanese women, or something.

 

[Vegeta897]

I agree that they should use the d-pad or something, as obviously there are better ways to do 3+ weapon selection than a simple toggle. But to say that the controller doesn't impose restrictions on these sorts of design decisions is simply wrong.

What is so different about PC controls that makes it so much easier? In PC games weapon selection is almost always done with the mouse wheel. That's 1 input, 2 if you want to get technical (up and down). So all you'd need is 2 buttons on the controller for next/previous weapon. What is so wrong about this? There's also many other methods that work better with controllers, such as a button that opens up a selection wheel.

 

[Stigmata]

The mouse wheel is ostensibly the same, but it has two benefits over a button. One, its function outside of games is analogous to how most weapon list-toggles work - you scroll down a web page, and you scroll through a weapon list, whereas a button on its own is more abstract. And two, it's much easier and faster to spin the mouse wheel than it is to hammer on a button an equal number of times.

All I'm saying is that the controller presents a limitation to be worked around, and it's folly to just toss that notion aside because "a button is a button". With a mouse and keyboard, you have over a hundred buttons to do basically any and every thing you want. With a controller, you have fourteen buttons and two joysticks, and that's it.

 

[Remus]

Here's a novel idea. Make 2 versions, one designed around the limitations of the console, and one to benefit from all that the PC has to offer. But why do that when you can just use the same version on all platforms catering to the lowest common denominator. :|

 

[T-6000]

Although I lost the damn thing somehow, almost 11 years ago I had bought a game from "CDRom Access" and in it had a promotional pamphlet. I don't remember what the card said today exactly, but I think I remember reading in there that L.A. got Nuked by Dr. Proton. The story's probably changed by now, but I can't help but wonder if he'll make an appearance at all in DNF?

 

[Bad^Hat]

Uhh, is everyone forgetting a little game called Red Dead Redemption? ****ing weapon wheel, dudes. Worked like a charm.

To those who don't know the Duke Nukem Forever story, the game might seem like a standard first-person shooter with a few technological gimmicks and a more absurd, played-for-laughs attitude than today's more straight-faced but equally gruff shooter games. For those who know the DNF tale, this is the king returned as if through a time machine, a playable time capsule of one of gaming's wrongest icons.

So basically "it's a typical FPS with no real stand-out features that don't involve bodily fluids but WOOOOOOO DNF!!!!!!!!11"

omg day 1 purchuse lol alwayz bet on dook

 

[Wanted Bob]

In terms of story, I'm really just hoping for the twist they had in the E3 2001 trailer:

"Duke, it seems the situation has escalated. The aliens have kidnapped the President"

 

[Nomad]

The Ratchet and Clank series seemed to have it in the bag imo. You hold down triangle and you get a quick select screen with 8 weapons or gadgets that you chose out of the 40 or so weapons and gadgets on the menu. It's basically an on the fly loadout screen.

 

[TwwIX]

Give me a ****ing break. Plenty of console shooters, old and new, give you the ability to carry an entire arsenal at once. It has nothing to do with the "limitations" of the controller. This is a just piss poor design decision. If this were a realistic shooter, i would understand. But, it's not. You can't get any more arcade than Duke Nukem.

 

[Krynn72]

Look at all the game developers here, knowing anything and everything about how easy it is or is not to figure out a GUI for controllers and PCs. So many game development gurus here!

 

[Wanted Bob]

This here, this is what I would love to see with modern graphics:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHU3sq8Wfjs

 

[Vegeta897]

Look at all the game developers here, knowing anything and everything about how easy it is or is not to figure out a GUI for controllers and PCs. So many game development gurus here!

wat


Why does anyone have to be a professional game developer to say anything that anyone has said here?

Weapon wheels worked in other console games, why can't they work again?

Oh wait why am I asking you, you're not a game development guru either. Shit guys, let's all just stop talking about this because we all obviously know nothing.

 

[kupocake]

Here's a novel idea. Make 2 versions, one designed around the limitations of the console, and one to benefit from all that the PC has to offer. But why do that when you can just use the same version on all platforms catering to the lowest common denominator. :|

Because what Duke Nukem Forever really needs more of, is time in development.

Duke Whokem molike amirite shirley bindun?

 

[Rico]

Here's a novel idea. Make 2 versions, one designed around the limitations of the console, and one to benefit from all that the PC has to offer. But why do that when you can just use the same version on all platforms catering to the lowest common denominator. :|

It's Duke Nukem... doesn't it already cater to the lowest common denominator?

From the previews: "OMG YOU START THE GAME PISSING IN FPS IN AN URINAL. RIGHT TRIGGER TO PISS! REVOLUTIONARY!!! IVE ALWAYS WANTED TO KNOW WHAT ITS LIKE TO PISS STANDING UP LIKE A MAN!"

"OMG REVOLUTIONARY WHITE BOARD PENIS DRAWING ACTION!!"

I seriously don't understand why people get so hyped up for this game. Seeing that ridiculous-looking guy in those gameplay videos say how this game would change his life forever... ugh.

I grew up and played Duke Nukem 3d. Fun? Sure, just like a lot of other games. Amazing enough to warrant all this drama and hype? Not in my book.

Enjoy your FPS piss/stripper simulator guys, I think I'll skip this one.

 

[Remus]

It's Duke Nukem... doesn't it already cater to the lowest common denominator?

You're missing my point. By lowest common denominator I meant the consoles, when they develop the game for multiple platforms.

 

[taviow]

Yeah, blame us for it if you want. It may change in the future and I don't know what will happen with it, but it was us. I stand by it too, as you cannot discount designing games for a modern world and part of that world is consoles where the bulk of the sales can be. And on those consoles you have a controller. We tried for a long time to support lots of guns but we simply could not find a nice way to map it to a controller, despite trying 4-5 designs. We gave it enough time and decided to stop swimming against the current and adopt what was basically the "standard".

It's not 1996 anymore.

Source

 

[Lucid]

A+ work Gearbox.

 

[Remus]

Yeah, blame us for it if you want. It may change in the future and I don't know what will happen with it, but it was us. I stand by it too, as you cannot discount designing games for a modern world and part of that world is consoles where the bulk of the sales can be. And on those consoles you have a controller. We tried for a long time to support lots of guns but we simply could not find a nice way to map it to a controller, despite trying 4-5 designs. We gave it enough time and decided to stop swimming against the current and adopt what was basically the "standard".

It's not 1996 anymore

Yeah... OK... I hope he realises the same argument could be used to justify not making this game at all.

As for the weapon limit, fine whatever do that. I'm 100% sure there will be a mod to remove the limit shortly after release.

 

[Eejit]

That's funny, I've played console shooters where you can carry quite a few weapons...

 

[taviow]

Yeah... OK... I hope he realises the same argument could be used to justify not making this game at all.

As for the weapon limit, fine whatever do that. I'm 100% sure there will be a mod to remove the limit shortly after release.

From what we've been hearing, I really wouldn't expect modding tools to be released.

 

[Remus]

That's funny, I've played console shooters where you can carry quite a few weapons...

Yeah but 2 weapons are the standard now. God forbid they should stray away from the standard!

 

[DEATH eVADER]

You're missing my point. By lowest common denominator I meant the consoles, when they develop the game for multiple platforms.

Updated photo of receipt. It's so brown now. This is glorious.

Jesus, you had this pre-ordered since 2001, they probably have it wiped off their databse by now

 

[Ren.182]

lol at 2 weapons. I used to love Duke 'cause he had so many different weapons at his disposal.

I can see this maybe being underwhelming after all this time. I'll give it chance though.

 

[TwwIX]

Source

"We have also added automated actions and attacks ala MW2 and the recent AvP game.
Don't forget about quick time events. The game will practically plays itself."

 

[Wanted Bob]

This was another responce by him:

This is general and not pertaining to dnf...

That's a valid path if you can swallow the development effort to design two systems and maintain them. There are still issues with everything filtering down to a controller with 14 buttons and how to map the game to that, even on pc, where people may play with a controller. Sometimes you get mutually exclusive problems that are hard to solve. What if you need the dpad for weapon selection ala Orange Box, or Gears or something? What if you are using the dpad to select inventory items? Ok so you do a radial menu where you hold right bumper and then select guns with the left stick. But, right bumper was off hand grenades and that's the best place for it? It's a house of cards, so imo, unification is the best path. Some call it dumbing down, but really in most cases, it's just good design.

Beyond that there are design issues. IMO, combat encounters are more interesting and fun if you are given an arena and lots of weapon choices. As you move around the arena you can pick and choose what you like. The key is to offer the player lots of choices so that all play styles are supported. The player should not be frustrated at having to leave their favorite gun behind as long as you offer it again in the near future, so they can get it again. In fact, in lots of cases that's a win because you create this little feedback loop of addiciton and reward as you give them their fix

In the second paragraph, it really sounds like he is all for having unlimited weapon slots, I'm confused.

 

[Ren.182]

I think in the last paragraph he means the enemies will use a variety of weapons to allow duke to be able to use different guns, rather than him being able to hold them all in the first place.

And it is dumbing the game down by restricting us to two weapons. The D-Pad is used for the sole purpose of drinking beer. Stick that on D-Pad up and stick weapon selection on D-Pad left/right. Sorted.

 

[Wanted Bob]

Or better yet, beer could use the Y button while weapon selection uses the D-Pad.

EDIT: And what you said about the last paragraph makes sense Ren, didnt think of it that way.

 

[Acepilotf14]

Why would someone make a PC game with a controller in mi-
oh.

 

[Krynn72]

wat


Why does anyone have to be a professional game developer to say anything that anyone has said here?

Weapon wheels worked in other console games, why can't they work again?

Oh wait why am I asking you, you're not a game development guru either. Shit guys, let's all just stop talking about this because we all obviously know nothing.

I'm not a guru, but I've dealt with this issue before, in an actual development pipeline. We had designed a game for use on a PC, using keyboard and mouse, and then when it was decided we had to accommodate a controller as well, all sorts of shit was stirred up. Mouse input > analog stick controls do not convert nicely, at all. Theres a whole lot of work that has to be done for it to work, and people here act like its no big deal "cuz another game did it." You don't know the state in which they received the content from 3D Realms, nor do you know what kinds of inputs are required for other gameplay elements. Control issues spiderweb across the whole interface and all gameplay mechanics, so its not a trivial issue, and one can't simply do it the same way as another game, because DNF isn't that other game, and has different things going on.

 

[Vegeta897]

You hold a button and the wheel pops up and you use one of the analog sticks to select a weapon. How does this interfere with anything else in the game, at all? This is a professional game studio, what exactly is stopping them from implementing this? Do you really think they lack the ability to code this?

 

[Krynn72]

Money. It took our programmers 2 months to fix all the shit that got broke when we threw a controller into the mix, and our game was way, WAY simpler than a FPS.

 

[Vegeta897]

... You're talking about the situation that they're in right now, with the game already mostly developed around the weapon swapping system. It's obvious that it's too late to implement a weapon wheel and bring back infinite inventory. I'm saying, they shouldn't have done that in the first place.

 

[Krynn72]

And I'm saying maybe they didn't have a choice. They got all their shit from 3DR, they haven't had much time to do their own thing with the game, I really doubt they re-did the entire control scheme from the ground up in the handful of months they've been working on it.

 

[Vegeta897]

Whoever DID come up with this idea is just a big poopy head. I don't care if it was gearbox or 3drealms.

 

[Krynn72]

Perhaps, but perhaps it was unavoidable even then, depending on other gameplay mechanics.

 

[Acepilotf14]

It's an FPS, how complicated can it really be?

 

[Vegeta897]

Perhaps, but perhaps it was unavoidable even then, depending on other gameplay mechanics.

Why didn't they just model their mechanics off of Duke 3D, which is what everyone expected and wanted? The weapon wheel is only a method of selecting weapons, nothing more. It would have worked fine in that game.

 

[TwwIX]

Why didn't they just model their mechanics off of Duke 3D, which is what everyone expected and wanted? The weapon wheel is only a method of selecting weapons, nothing more. It would have worked fine in that game.

Don't argue with him. He's a big time game developer. Your opinions are mute.