Avatar: FernGully 2: Pocahontas Dances With Smurfs In Space In 3D On Ice

CptStern said:
Avatar has no chance of winning Best Picture. best specialfx sure but to even entertain the notion that avatar will win an oscar for best picture is ludicrous. it wont even be nominated in that catagory and if it is it'll be mostly ceremonial to go with it's other nominations
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I hope your right, but he will very likely to get nominated, especially since the number of nominations for best picture this year has gone up from 5 to 10. And the fact Cameron got a Golden Globe for best picture/director.
 
CptStern said:
Avatar has no chance of winning Best Picture. best specialfx sure but to even entertain the notion that avatar will win an oscar for best picture is ludicrous. it wont even be nominated in that catagory and if it is it'll be mostly ceremonial to go with it's other nominations
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It will definitely be nominated because not only do they need ten nominations this year (where the **** are they going to get ten best picture nominations from?) but it's also been winning other industry awards that always serve as indicators of best picture nominations.

It won best picture and director at the Golden Globes, if it doesn't even get nominated it'll be an outrage to many people. Which is a shame because Hurt Locker deserves best picture far more than Avatar or any other U.S. made film of 2009.
 
sry if old but http://www.slashfilm.com/2009/12/21/the-buzz-filmmakers-react-to-avatar/

Moon director Duncan Jones: “:| I that’s my concerned face. That’s how I feel after seeing Avatar. It’s not in my top three Jim Cameron films. Am I alone here?” … “at what point in the film did you have any doubt what was going to happen next? Or were you ever surprised how it happened?” … “and did you ever wonder to yourself why they didn’t just bombard shit from orbit?” … “Would have appreciated the barest bit of explanation for the floating mountain islands in Avatar… Pumice stone full of helium? Something!”
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My god I respect that man even more than I already did :D
 
Bad^Hat said:
Way to lose credibility in your first paragraph.
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Internet credibility loss. Sleepless nights will ensue.

Does anyone remember a film called Shakespeare in Love? How it won the oscar for best picture? Woh...what a worthy film. The human psyche has really adopted that classic.....

Star Wars would never win best picture but it has had a million times more of an influence in our lives and cultures than the 1977 best picture Annie Hall. Annie Hall? What the hell.



The hurt locker... Yes you'll watch it once, think "oh that's so poetic and deep". Then that's it. Contemporary film that will die in your heart after the first watch and our societies will forget about it and it will fade into oblivion like all the other forgetful oscar best picture winners.

Avatar will live on far beyond it with sequels and culturual influences in everything we do henceforth. Pop culture will reference it, there will be parodies, cosplay fanatics, expanded universe, you name it people will drench themselves in it ...with pleasure.. Humanity as a collective will take this piece of film with them into the future -> Grasp the profundity.

Annie Hall, yeah.
 
And Best Picture is meant to mean something other than "Gets lots of pop-references on TV". It's supposed to be about the standard of the film, and Avatar is at most a quite good film, if you don't wanna think for a few hours and look at pretty lights. District 9 and Moon are two brilliant Sci-fi films that came out last year and that both deserve more acclaim than Avatar does. Not saying they deserve the Oscar or nothing (actually, I am- District 9 deserves it for Best Visual Effects) but neither does Avatar.

Actually, **** it- maybe I am saying District 9 deserves Best Picture. That film ****ing rocked.
 
The Academy Awards, while entertaining, are nothing more than members in the entertainment industry patting each other on the back. The films aren't nominated or voted by a group of highly respected film scholars and critics. Its all Hollywood. So when films like Crash or Shakespeare in Love win Best Picture, I don't get upset like everyone else, I just keep in mind that its what Hollywood thought was the best picture. And while I don't think Avatar will/should win, I wouldn't get butt hurt if it did.

edit: found this good article that basically argues the same point
 
I liked Crash too, but apparently a lot of people were pissed because they felt that Brokeback Mountain should have won. That's why I used that example.
 
Avatar is a brilliant movie with no real flaws. District 9 is a brilliant movie too.

Every criticism levied against Avatar can be just as easy levied against District 9 or any other high budget sci-fi movie in existence.

In the meantime, I'll go and secure me some tickets for a fourth Avatar IMAX showing.
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Every criticism levied against Avatar can be just as easy levied against District 9 or any other high budget sci-fi movie in existence.
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It had blue smurfs? It was Dances with Wolves in Space? It had a worn out, overly simplistically presented plot? It presented the good and the bad guys in a retardedly black-and-white fashion? These are criticisms that can be levied against any other sci-fi movie?
 
Mikael Grizzly said:
Avatar is a brilliant movie with no real flaws. District 9 is a brilliant movie too.

Every criticism levied against Avatar can be just as easy levied against District 9 or any other high budget sci-fi movie in existence.

In the meantime, I'll go and secure me some tickets for a fourth Avatar IMAX showing.
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I see nature had to balance out your great taste in gaming with an awful taste in movies.

That's not to say I didn't like Avatar but claiming it's a brilliant movie with no real flaws is just.. Wow.

Kudos for standing up for your own opinion though.
 
Aw don't be sad it was the juggernaut thing! C'mon I don't have to link to youtube do I
 
AJ Rimmer said:
It had a worn out, overly simplistically presented plot? It presented the good and the bad guys in a retardedly black-and-white fashion? These are criticisms that can be levied against any other sci-fi movie?
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Yeah, just like District 9.
 
Polaris said:
Yeah, just like District 9.
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Really? It presented the good and the bad guys in a retardedly black-and-white fashion? The main protagonist performs a mass-abortion about fifteen minutes into the film, all of the aliens who are supposedly the good guys, or at least meant to be the target for the audience's sympathy are violent, stupid, lazy junkies. The other protagonist, while very much a good guy, still is a bit of an asshole to Wikus with the whole three years thing. I'll admit that captain Crazy McGun-Nut was an over-the-top military bad guy, but at least he showed emotion and wasn't sipping coffee while ****ing over the prawns just to emphasize how big a douche bag he was.

And how was the plot of District 9 overly simplistic? Worn out?
 
Avatar is an appalling piece of modern cinema; it's incredible to me that there are people defending its colossal shortcomings and failures. In what way can one actually spring to the defence of that plot, and those characters?

Steven Spielberg:

“The most evocative and amazing science-fiction movie since Star Wars.”
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It's the kind of moronic statement like this that explains why you haven't made a good film since 1993.
 
Just got back from seeing it. Incredible, in many senses of the word.
 
"Hey guys, we built an awesome mech suit for you! It's totally awesome, got loads of firepower and can stand a lot of punishment!"
"Why does it have a canopy made of glass? That's the one bit of this thing that actually needs to have the most amount of armour possible!"
"Yeah, but come on, it's really, thick glass."
"Ah, so it's bullet-proof?"
"Well... not really. It'll stop a normal-sized arrow. Probably. So unless they have like, pfft, I dunno, big arrows-"
"-or guns?"
"Yeah, or guns- then you should be fine."
"Why does it have arms that need to hold a gun?"
"Duh, how else are you gonna have a gun?"
"Seeing as how it's a mech suit, why not just build a gun into its arm?"
"...boy is my face red."

Sorry, that's a nice piece of work, but the mech suit design is beyond stupid in that movie.
 
The AMP suit is pretty generic, but-

AJ Rimmer said:
"Why does it have arms that need to hold a gun?"
"Duh, how else are you gonna have a gun?"
"Seeing as how it's a mech suit, why not just build a gun into its arm?"
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One would assume that it had other purposes such as lifting cargo, carrying different weapons, repairing damage to large ships, moving large pieces of rubble, and scaling terrain; so replacing it's hand with a huge ****ing gun would probably limit it in doing you know.... just about everything.
 
AJ Rimmer said:
It had blue smurfs? It was Dances with Wolves in Space? It had a worn out, overly simplistically presented plot? It presented the good and the bad guys in a retardedly black-and-white fashion? These are criticisms that can be levied against any other sci-fi movie?
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Y'know...

If I had to pick one gripe from here that specifically grinds my beans, it would have to be the complaint that a clear distinction was drawn between the heroes and the villains.

Not every god damn movie needs to get mired in some ambiguous tale of ethical uncertainty and moral gray zones. Sometimes I just want a god damn villain.

Oh yeah, the villain in District 9 certainly didn't overemphasize his bastard nature with his whole "GRRRRR I HATE PRAWNS AND LIKE TO SMASH THEM" angle. While Koobus' villainy in D9 stood in stark contrast to the rest of the well-thought film, Colonel Quaritch consciously played to stereotype and reveled in it, which made him all the more badass and fun to watch.
 
Well, he said "retardedly black-and-white." I'd have to agree. People divided very neatly into totally evil or ultimately good, and those characters that were evil were never well-drawn. Sure, the Colonel was badass. But he was also one-dimensional, unintelligent and charmless. I think somewhere in this thread someone said he was a villain worth hating, but I just mostly felt nonplussed about him except at the specific moments where he does some awesome fightin'.
 
Samon said:
It's the kind of moronic statement like this that explains why you haven't made a good film since 1993.
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Oh yeah. Amistad was such shit. So was Saving Private Ryan. Minority Report? Garbage in absolutely every single aspect. I think his comparison with Star Wars is fairly apt.

Nobody can objectively review A New Hope today and give it aces across the board. The dialogue is nothing great. The acting isn't stellar. And - whaddya know - you have a big ****ing line drawn right through the middle of the universe between the Dark Side and the Light Side. And yet it exploded into a cultural phenomenon, gained countless fans, and is still celebrated and enjoyed today.

Why is this so, Samon? How is it that the original Star Wars trilogy, which was nothing terribly original or nuanced to begin with, manage to become to most recognizable thing in Sci-Fi today?

Time will tell if Avatar can actually follow in those footsteps. And I don't want to absolve the movie of its flaws, necessarily. It has them. But sometimes the experience amounts to more than the sum of its parts, which surely you accept from time to time. If you didn't like Avatar, then hate it until your heart explodes for all I care. But the rest of us really could do without the arrogant presumption that we're clueless nimrods who wouldn't know a good film if it bit us in the ass.

I'm sure I can expect a reply about how wrong I am, which I guess can be expected since people have different opinions about films. But if I want you take away a single point, it's this:
It's hard to take your comment about Avatar being a colossal failure seriously when that's pretty much the same charge you would level at a film like Transformers 2. Avatar, for all its shortcomings, is surely of higher calibre than the kind of shit Bay and Bruckheimer pump out every summer, yes? Save it for a movie that really deserves it, please.
 
Never saw it. D: Heard good and bad.

Spielberg isn't always on the ball with his films. He tends to stray into sappiness. And I know we were all disappointed with Indy 4. But to say he's made nothing of merit in over a decade... well, I don't know how to respond to you. His worst failures stand head and shoulders above what most other films offer.

I guess I just don't understand how people can act like these movies are absolute disasters when we all know deep down that's a load of bullshit. There have been bigger wastes of time and money in this year alone. The vitriol can be saved for larger offenders.
 
AJ Rimmer said:
"Hey guys, we built an awesome mech suit for you! It's totally awesome, got loads of firepower and can stand a lot of punishment!"
"Why does it have a canopy made of glass? That's the one bit of this thing that actually needs to have the most amount of armour possible!"
"Yeah, but come on, it's really, thick glass."
"Ah, so it's bullet-proof?"
"Well... not really. It'll stop a normal-sized arrow. Probably. So unless they have like, pfft, I dunno, big arrows-"
"-or guns?"
"Yeah, or guns- then you should be fine."
"Why does it have arms that need to hold a gun?"
"Duh, how else are you gonna have a gun?"
"Seeing as how it's a mech suit, why not just build a gun into its arm?"
"...boy is my face red."

Sorry, that's a nice piece of work, but the mech suit design is beyond stupid in that movie.
Click to expand...

http://www.pandorapedia.com/doku.php/amp_suit_amplified_mobility_platform

Here's some details.

Unlike fanciful designs in which weapons were integrated into limbs, the AMP suit is a multi-purpose machine, able to duplicate all functions of the infantry soldier.
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Multi-purpose is the operative word. Machwarrior and other games made us accustomed to limb-integrated weaponry, but in terms of actual plausibility and efficency, a powersuit like the one in Avatar is much more viable. One simple point: the gun gets destroyed, the powersuit can pick another and fight or at least go and punch a bitch. A classic mech can only flail what remains of the arm and make a sad face.

And an armoured glass canopy is a very logical design choice - instead of having to install an expensive and complicated sensor suite, which will be easy to damage or disable (hell, it happens in Avatar with the remote dozers), you simply add in armoured glass. Hell, we have sufficently strong armoured glass now, like the front glass plate in the Mi-24 Hind cockpit.
 
Absinthe said:
Oh yeah. Amistad was such shit. So was Saving Private Ryan. Minority Report? Garbage in absolutely every single aspect. I think his comparison with Star Wars is fairly apt.

Nobody can objectively review A New Hope today and give it aces across the board. The dialogue is nothing great. The acting isn't stellar. And - whaddya know - you have a big ****ing line drawn right through the middle of the universe between the Dark Side and the Light Side. And yet it exploded into a cultural phenomenon, gained countless fans, and is still celebrated and enjoyed today.

Why is this so, Samon? How is it that the original Star Wars trilogy, which was nothing terribly original or nuanced to begin with, manage to become to most recognizable thing in Sci-Fi today?

Time will tell if Avatar can actually follow in those footsteps. And I don't want to absolve the movie of its flaws, necessarily. It has them. But sometimes the experience amounts to more than the sum of its parts, which surely you accept from time to time. If you didn't like Avatar, then hate it until your heart explodes for all I care. But the rest of us really could do without the arrogant presumption that we're clueless nimrods who wouldn't know a good film if it bit us in the ass.

I'm sure I can expect a reply about how wrong I am, which I guess can be expected since people have different opinions about films. But if I want you take away a single point, it's this:
It's hard to take your comment about Avatar being a colossal failure seriously when that's pretty much the same charge you would level at a film like Transformers 2. Avatar, for all its shortcomings, is surely of higher calibre than the kind of shit Bay and Bruckheimer pump out every summer, yes? Save it for a movie that really deserves it, please.
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You sire, are a liar. The only thing that aged in A New Hope was Luke's haircut (and the special effects). Other than that, it still maintains its powerful storytelling through, yes, dialogue. Dialogue, characters, and atmosphere. Also, nothing original? Star Wars invented the Bender archetype. Yeah yeah, I'm doing exactly what you said someone would do. BUT I'M RIGHT. If you mean that Star Wars was unoriginal because of how it followed the structures and age-old concepts of good storytelling, then you have a point.
 
I think Star Wars' greatest strength doesn't lie in its plot or dialogue, but its expansive and colorful universe. I don't think the original trilogy had a bad plot or anything. But if we're gonna have such a hard-on over originality, then no. There's nothing in its structure that hadn't existed before it.

Actually, I shouldn't have even bothered with the comparison since Samon probably hates Star Wars too. :|
 
Samon loves Star Wars, he just pretends to hate it. He told me once.



He's going to be so mad.
 
Does Avatar deserve to win the Oscars ? In my opinion, no. Will I lose sleep if Avatar does win ? No. Oscars have lost all credibility as an event celebrating movie excellence. It's more of an event imo, pandering to the box office hits or the populist option.

To add to AJ Rimmer I would like to see District 9 wing for SFX. Goddamn that movie had some good effects for $30 million.
 
So Avatar doesn't deserve SFX Oscar because it cost more?
Full of shit much?
 
unozero said:
So Avatar doesn't deserve SFX Oscar because it cost more?
Full of shit much?
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Avatar cost a shit load of money and made something pretty. District 9 had the budget of a romantic comedy and made something utterly believable (as opposed to ****ing night elf smurf cats). District 9 is the greater accomplishment.

Hell, we have sufficently strong armoured glass now, like the front glass plate in the Mi-24 Hind cockpit.
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And yet, an arrow pierces right through it.
 
Look at Paranoia.

Made millions at the Box Office, and costed (I think) all of, what, $15,000 to make?

They were raking it in.
 
AJ Rimmer said:
Avatar cost a shit load of money and made something pretty. District 9 had the budget of a romantic comedy and made something utterly believable (as opposed to ****ing night elf smurf cats). District 9 is the greater accomplishment.



And yet, an arrow pierces right through it.
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I have to agree on both counts. The alien FX in District 9 looked much more believable in my opinion.

As for the mech design, I agree it looks stupid. If the arms and separate weapons, however silly can be reasonably explained. The glass covered cockpit is just stupid. Almost all mech designs I've ever seen have the pilot completely covered with armor plating, but no here they had to use glass, for easy arrow access.:rolleyes:


Also it's ****ing 150 years into the future. They could have used something like a nano bomb. Program it to atack the specific DNA of the Navi, and eradicate all of them without any effort.
 
Seeing as how they have the technology to remote control alien bodies, I have no idea why the mechs need to be piloted at all. Remote controlling a mech suit should be easy compared to making an Avatar.
 
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