Benchmark and Update

[Frost]

I feel it would be great if Valve would release that benchmark that was thought to be coming on Sept 30th. I feel releasing it would help people make important hardware buying decisions as we are getting closer and closer to the holiday season and the newest ATI and Nvidia refresh cards are close to being in everyone's hands (Ati Radeon 9800XT, 9600XT, and that "other " Nvidia card ) I'm waiting on the new benchmark to decide whether to get a 9800 Pro or 9800XT there is a big difference between the two in price... Also, Valve was very active in talking to the community, by E-mail, steam, ect... now there are in silence. I hope that this is a sign that they are working even harder now to get it out sometime this year. But it would be nice to hear a status update on the game now. Just something informative but without a deadline, such as "We are completely done with all the content and coding, we are just play testing and tweaking" or "We are reworking the code and are about 90% done with it, everything else is already in place"

Everyone is waiting to hear, they have our attention...

If anyone from Valve reads this, best of luck finishing the game and finding out who was responsible for stealing the unfinished code and content. I can't wait for the game, I know its going to be great!

*Also, how about a new video, possibly make them available on steam again too

 

[Cheetarah654]

its doubtful it will be comming out the holiday season, but it is a good idea since people will likely be getting hardware for x mas

 

[L33731]

errr... I have my HL2 copy pre-orderd for 3 months and this pushback only enrages consumers like myself.. I am personally tired of CS 1.6, BF1942, Spearhead, and MOHAA.. I have played these games through and through, and if I don't see my damn copy of HL2 this year I am going to go insane.. ERRRRRRRRRR>...

 

[Goombatommy]

Just bought Max Payne 2. Game is definitely worth a shot. It's very action orientated, but it's kinda short =/.

 

[Cheetarah654]

on a side note, i met balls|nuts, the old tribes guy last night...ive hung out with hima nd never knew it wa shim!

 

[Gaemon82]

Originally posted by Goombatommy
Just bought Max Payne 2. Game is definitely worth a shot. It's very action orientated, but it's kinda short =/.

You've finished the game? It's been out since yesterday!!! Man, you're too fast.

 

[Asus]

The benchmarks results they released show exactly how those cards perform in HL2. All the benchmarks for the XT, from review sites, should show you how the XT compares with the Pro. The desision for what is more important (price/performance) is yours. 9800XT 256mb <500$ USD, 9600XT ~200$ USD although Powercolor is, I believe, releasing a 9800XT 128mb ~400$. But you have the information, especially on 9800/9600 Pro and Nvidia cards.
HL2's release us unknown so that could be why you are unsure.
If it is coming in April, best to wait til it is actually out and buy one of the new gen gfx cards then rather than a 9600XT for christmas and then be disapointed like the "valve told me to buy this card now" people.

 

[Frost]

I currently have a GeForce 4 Ti 4400 128 card. This is the oldest piece of hardware in my new Intel P4 2.8GHz C system. Having a benchmark I can run on my specific system will allow me to assess its current performance in the game. I am in need of a new card soon as HL2 isn't the ONLY game I'm looking forward to (It is my MOST looked forward to but I have others I want to play) Review sites say that the benchmark is also a great DirectX9 benchmark for future games but the current benchmarks offered don't really match up with actual gameplay performance. Hard|OCP is trying to do this with their new benchmark techniques and I feel it is a great step forward in better more accurate benchmarks. The release of a Valve Half-Life 2/Source Engine benchmark would help people make much more informed decisions and allow people to create a database of results showing a wide verity of hardware configurations and how they effect the performance as more than a graphics card could change the outcome.

 

[ferd]

just wait for the game

 

[Frost]

ferd: Thanks for your (lack) of input, if you read the first post you will hopefully understand that I as well as many others are trying to make the best informed decisions about what graphic card I should spend my money on, as stated above, I'm not just buying it FOR Half-Life 2, but for many games, the most important game being Half-Life 2. That is why I feel that releasing the Half-Life 2 benchmark would benefit a great deal of people.

 

[Asus]

Wasn't the benchmark only to be first released to review sites and not to the public like yourself? You can make a purchase/keep desision with the info you have available to you now.

 

[Davis]

nvidia and ati will probably make alot of driver optimizations for hl2 because not only will it be a popular game, it will probably be the premiere dx9 benchmark for quite a while. so any figures posted before the game is released will probably be irrelevent, but right now nvidia's driver team needs to pull something spectacular out of their arses to even get close to ati when it comes to dx9.

 

[Demonmerc]

doom3 will most likely replace hl2 for the best graphical benchmark.

[edit]I don't see why you care so much honestly. ATI and NVIDIA make good cards, get either one. By the time HL2 comes out the drivers will be optimized enough so both cards will give you an excellent visual experience. If you want it to play OTHER games, find out which card is best for those OTHER games.

Otherwise, I refer to Ferd's comment, wait for HL2 to come out. There will be better cards and better drivers, trying to find the best this second is a crap-shoot.

 

[Skeeze]

Wrong...Doom 3's graphics are so gay and fake...look like unskinned models...and the shadows blow, too.

 

[Demonmerc]

I think time will change your mind.

 

[marksmanHL2 :)]

Me too.


DOOM3 graphics are not gay. They are beter than HL2s when you look at it properly

Go get the DOOM3 main trailer. The footage in that is nothing short of awe inspiring.

BUT I will allways love HL2 much much more.

 

[CreedoG]

waiting is all nice and good to say.. HOWEVER some of us receive christmas gifts. And my big gift *could* be a new video card, if my current gf4 w/ the rest of my system isn't running hl2 as pretty and fast as I would like. However, if the gf4 works just fine, i'd like to spend the $350 on some other big gift. I emailed gabe about this last month:

-----------------------------------------------------
Hi Gabe,

I'm sure I'm not the only one getting hardware upgrades for Christmas. And my wife and mom have both been requesting my Christmas list for a few weeks now. I think I want to upgrade video cards, but I wanted to wait until the Half-Life² Benchmark was released to see if the difference in quality/speed would be worth the upgrade. Now that Half-Life² has been officially delayed, does that mean the Benchmark has been pushed back as well? Is there any chance you could just release it anyway, so that your loyal fans can get their Christmas lists in on time? I assume you've got a pretty stable working version of the benchmark, if you've already let some hardware sites try it out.

So, for my question, can we please please please have the benchmark Sept 30th?

Thanks for your time, and good luck finishing Half-Life² !

--------------------------------------------------------

and he never replied.. just like he never replied to the other ones however the benchmark would be REALLY FvCKING USEFULL RIGHT NOW!

 

[staddydaddy]

Would you release any information if you were VALVe? I mean, release dates are just estimates of when the product _might_ be done. And if VALVe puts a little more work and time into the product and overshoots the updated release date, would you want a million half life kids moaning about more supposed "lies"? I for sure as hell wouldn't want to listen to all those panzies moan. So in conclusion, I don't think VALVe is going to release a lot more info.

 

[GhostValkyrie]

And, if you notice...Dev teams tend to get quieter, when they get closer to going GOLD. Because of the fact that they begin to really work at their hardest, at the very alst. Not to mention what recently happened to VALVe. I'd rather them release the game next month because they were working, rather then answering question about doors, and swinging bars. I ,very much, belive we'll be playing this game, next month. Oh Yeah!

-Ghost.

 

[jameth]

nvidias problem with HL2 isnt in their drivers, its their poor hardware support for DX9

drivers cant change a thing for that

 

[gantrithor_5]

Ohh man... If I ever see Valve type the words Half, Life, 2, Gold, I will [you don't want to know]

 

[gantrithor_5]

And I would certainly love to know if my meager system would run with all settings up. It was mid-range when I bought it for 550 bucks a year ago, and lets just hope it can stand up to the almighty HL2 without its knees buckling

 

[Frost]

I understand that some would rather wait for Half-Life 2 to come out before buying a card. I stated in previous posts that I am also curious to see how other hardware effects the performance of the game, Ram for instance can give an extra 10-15 FPS in some cases:

Home much ram to have?
What Speed ram to have?
Dual-Channel or single Channel?
What times for the Ram?
What brand Ram?

See what I mean, its just about making the most informed purchasing decision. The best way to see how Half-Life 2 will run on my SPECIFIC machine is to have a benchmark that I can use myself, not reading some hardware site's benchmark (Although they are a good starting point) As others have stated in previous posts, holiday's are upon us and it is buying season. I'm not even expecting a video card as a gift but I want to get the best performance for my money so I don't blow money I could be using for other holiday gifts for people. No one knows when the game is going to come out but a benchmark tool would still help alot of people to prepair their computers so they can run the game well when it does finally come out.

*Thanks for being mature in the posts in my topic as we need more of them at HL2.net, too much nit-picking and negative banter has been going on in the most recent month. I'd rather see civil debates such as this rather than blasting each other with mean comments.

 

[Asus]

What you ask for is somewhat impossible as they won't release the benchmark to you just yet.
When sites benchmark they use the same system setup and a number of graphics cards to compare.
If you are going to be upgrading and want to know what hardware to look for before it comes out you should:

1)note what hardware was used in the benchmarks
2)what is the fastest hardware out there
3)what that all costs and what other lower performance parts cost
4)know how much you are going to spend
5)figure what is the highest performing parts you can get with your budget

Those benchmarks for DX9 games will show what is the best card.
The benchmarks for CPUs show how each performs under different applications.

There is no new technology(RAM/Harddrives etc) out there in the near future except mainly CPUs and Gfx cards.
Plan those two main parts and ask for suggestions on the other parts but the rest is much closer in price(e.g. PC3200/PC2700/PC2100 DDR are close in price compared to different CPU models) so much easier to decide.

Then just modify what you have in mind as new parts come out/prices drop/ or new performance figures shed new light. Of course make sure you don't buy it too soon (before your game comes out).
It isnt hard without an individual benchmark for just you on your PC
Infact when it comes out the sites will get it and they will do what? Run the fastest hardware with a few gfx cards and you said that doesnt help you right?
It will be a while before you get the benchmark to run on your individual machine.

Are you just uninformed? ASK. Research. Wait.

 

[staddydaddy]

I hope the system, I'm just about to put together, runs hl2 really smoothly (That's what I intended it to run like when I spent $991 on it)
CPU: P4 2.8ghz (H.T. support)
Ram: 1 Gig (2X512mb) of PC3200/DDR400 Hyper X Running on a Dual Channel setup
Mobo: Dual Channel Ram, 8X AGP, H.T. support.
FSB: 800mhz
GPU: Radeon 9800 Pro DRR-II 256mb

I expect to see performance slightly better than the E3 demo. (The computer that was running the E3 demo was a P4 2.8ghz, 1 gig of ram, 9800pro 128, and I _think_ 800mhz FSB correct me if I'm wrong).

Pro's-
I think my RAM is probably faster (possibly not) and I have more GPU ram.
DX9.1 is coming out and I think everyone will see performance gains.
I bet valve has further optimize the engine to get better performance since E3.

Con's against better performan than E3 computer-
GPU's ram has a slower clock speed.
Kinda- I'm not going to overclock anything. The $991 I put in was a major investment and I won't risk breaking/hurting any equipment. Pluss I don't see a huge reason to overclock.
Can't think of anything else.

What are y'all's opinions of my system?

 

[Asus]

You have bought that system and it is just not together or you have yet to order?
Great setup, will last you a long time.
Only comment I would make is on the Video card.
How much did you get it for?
9800Pro 256mb DDR2 is a bit overkill on price in my opinion but it does add performance over 9800pro (but not much).
9800XT or 9800Pro may have been a better choice.
I bet you'll have great FPS in hl2 and nice price for the total system

 

[NSPIRE]

Gawdamn staddydaddy! When HL2 finally decides to rear it's head into the world of us gamers (officially that is), remind me to ask you what your FPS runs at on average, lmao

 

[mbrithoms]

Originally posted by staddydaddy
I mean, release dates are just estimates of when the product _might_ be done.

erm no, release date is the DATE of the games RELEASE, dont let present situations cloud your thinking,
release dates USED to be met once upon a time, good job companys like remedy and rockstar actually KEEP there release dates these days, people keep banging on about the game being nowhere near finished and if thats the case Valve should have NEVER announced the sep 30th date if they knew fine well they couldnt make it, its advertising hype I for one could have done without

 

[Quotidian---]

guys all i know, is that i just played and beat max payne 2.. and not only did it look better than hl2 (based on this leak) but it even the physics seemed better, yes the ragdoll bumping over chairs phsyics kicked ass. everything from wooden boards to paintbuckets knocked over/bounced/rolled/splintered/set things on fire/shoot out the legs of a table to have the barrels on the table roll down kicked total and complete ass.

This is seriously hurting my impression of hl2, here they are all.. look at our physics wood splinters! ragdoll this! no scripted that! well i game that was just released, is already doing it better than what you claim valve. WTF.

 

[Letters]

Originally posted by marksmanHL2

DOOM3 graphics are not gay.

Huh? I'm pretty sure DOOM3 graphics are attracted to other graphics of the same gender...

 

[NSPIRE]

Originally posted by Letters
Huh? I'm pretty sure DOOM3 graphics are attracted to other graphics of the same gender...

LMFAO! Funniest thing I've read/heard all day, lmao. Thanks for tha' laugh

 

[staddydaddy]

I have all the parts with me right now, I just have to wait for my dad to look over some internet connections (he wants to just to make sure for some reason). I got my FIC 9800 pro 256 DDR-II for $392 (totaly brand new, still had plastic bands around it) through eBay, I obviously got a pretty good deal on it. I bought my GPU, CPU, and Mobo all around 2 weeks before the 30th. When I was buying the equipment, we were all still under the impression that hl2 was going to be released on the 30th so that's what I was planning on. I knew that the XT was going to be coming out, but 2 weeks after the supposed 30th release and I didn't want to wait 2 weeks to play it on a better card that would have been priced really high ($450-$500).

I'm not pissed that prices are going to drop, no one forced me to buy my hardware when I did and if I was really concerned with getting a low price on good hardware I should had waited. I get pissed at people who flame VALVe because they bought brand new part X for their comp and now hl2 is coming out later and prices are falling. Gabe wasn't the one that went to Compusa , took the money out of your wallet, and bought the equipment. You're the one who bought it.

I'm not really a huge gamer. I really enjoy HL and all of it's mods and some other games but not to many. I've never spent a penny on computer harware before and I wanted HL2 to run really smoothly so I thought I would get a nice system for it. I realize the performance gap between the 9800 128 and 256mb isn't going to be HUGE (in some resolutions the 128 beats the 256 due to ram clock speed). I think where the 256 is going to pull ahead is when high-res textures get released. I'm not sure on this but, I thought that the 256 would help me out with AA and AF get cranked up? Doesn't the card need more ram for it to work on the AA and AF? I think the 256 is really going to pull ahead in the extremes- textures, resolutions, AA and AF.

My current system has a P3 500mhz, 533mhz FSB, 4X AGP, 128mb ram (can't remember speed), and matrox g400 32mb graphics card (I actually have the 9800 in right now cause I couldn't wait to see how it ran). The system I had before that was a 486 with a pentium 1 overdrive processor at 83mhz, cant remember FSB, 32mb of ram (speed n/a), and 1mb graphics chip on mobo. Really big steps between systems, and it's really time to go to the new one.

 

[NSPIRE]

Originally posted by staddydaddy
... The system I had before that was a 486 with a pentium 1 overdrive processor at 83mhz, cant remember FSB, 32mb of ram (speed n/a), and 1mb graphics chip on mobo. ***Really big steps between systems, and it's really time to go to the new one.***

BIG STEPS?! That's like comparing Death Valley here in California to Mt. Everest... craziness.

I'd bet my left nut that you're pretty happy with your new system, riiiight??? *Nudges staddydaddy in the ribs* hehe

 

[staddydaddy]

Originally posted by mbrithoms
erm no, release date is the DATE of the games RELEASE, dont let present situations cloud your thinking,
release dates USED to be met once upon a time, good job companys like remedy and rockstar actually KEEP there release dates these days, people keep banging on about the game being nowhere near finished and if thats the case Valve should have NEVER announced the sep 30th date if they knew fine well they couldnt make it, its advertising hype I for one could have done without

In my opinion, I still think release dates are estimates. A company says ok we are getting X% accomplished per day and it's going to take Y amount of work to be PR ready and we can complete these goals in a certain amount of time unless something unexpected comes up.

I sympathize with VALVe. I put a lot of hard work into what I do and it often goes beyond the normal times other people finish it at. I mean you've said in your life, yes I will have report or homework X ready by monday but it wasn't ready. Things come up, work takes longer than you expected.

Waiting a couple of months to play hl2 isn't that big of a deal for me. I have the patience to focus on other things in my life while hl2 is being developed. Don't get my wrong though, I'm not saying give VALVe a 'Get out of jail' pass either. I think that the latest acceptable release date would be spring of 2004 (around March). Anything later than that would not be satifactory, and obviously something really |=ucked up if it's been delayed more than that.

All we can do is wait and see at this point. Any actions or ranting is just wasted energy and breath. Patience is the key.

 

[MultiVaC]

Originally posted by Quotidian---
guys all i know, is that i just played and beat max payne 2.. and not only did it look better than hl2 (based on this leak) but it even the physics seemed better, yes the ragdoll bumping over chairs phsyics kicked ass. everything from wooden boards to paintbuckets knocked over/bounced/rolled/splintered/set things on fire/shoot out the legs of a table to have the barrels on the table roll down kicked total and complete ass.

This is seriously hurting my impression of hl2, here they are all.. look at our physics wood splinters! ragdoll this! no scripted that! well i game that was just released, is already doing it better than what you claim valve. WTF.

This is exactly why companies don't want their work in progress out in public. The beta was never meant for you to play, people. Only a fraction of it was even meant to be seen, and that was the E3 videos. It's a BETA, it's old and incomplete. Of COURSE a final, polished, finished game is going to be better than a mess of ancient mis-matching beta stuff stolen from the developers, then compiled by a pathetic attention-craving hacker and distributed over illegal warez channels. Someone on these boards (sorry I can't remember the name) came up with a great analogy: "You don't steal a car halfway down the assembly line and say 'WTF where are the doors? They said there would be doors!'"

 

[NSPIRE]

I've got a new favorite quote after reading that car assembly line one... I'm gonna' put it in my sig now hehehe *steals and runs off into the night, with quote in hands*

 

[MultiVaC]

You might want to find who came up with it first. Although since I worded it differently it's technically original, so I guess it's ok.

 

[NSPIRE]

It's not like it's copyrighted or anything though... I hope... right?? O__o

I actually did think of asking permission first, but really, I didn't think it was necessary.

 

[mbrithoms]

Originally posted by Quotidian---
guys all i know, is that i just played and beat max payne 2.. and not only did it look better than hl2 (based on this leak) but it even the physics seemed better, yes the ragdoll bumping over chairs phsyics kicked ass. everything from wooden boards to paintbuckets knocked over/bounced/rolled/splintered/set things on fire/shoot out the legs of a table to have the barrels on the table roll down kicked total and complete ass.

This is seriously hurting my impression of hl2, here they are all.. look at our physics wood splinters! ragdoll this! no scripted that! well i game that was just released, is already doing it better than what you claim valve. WTF.

HERE HERE! I just have to say that Max2 is simply superb and runs smooth as silk, the ragdoll is flawless, enemys jolt when they are shot then smoothly go into the most realistic ragdolls I have EVER seen, sometimes the deaths look so real its scary, and sometime they even get back up after ragdoll, simply phenomenal!

this will be gettin my vote for GOTY definatly, its like playing the greatest jo woo action film ever made, simply fantastic

 

[Frost]

Asus - I AM informed but I'm always looking for more information, remember, you can always learn!

I have built a system very similar to the one staddydaddy built.

-Intel P4 2.8GHz, Canterwood, 800MHz FSB, Hyper Threading
-Intel PBZ Desktop Motherboard (I know, not for overclocking)
-2x 512MB DDR 400MHz Kingston HyperX in dual-channel mode
-GeForce 4 Ti 4400 128MB (This is my OLD card, this thread is about releasing a benchmark so I can see the performance of this vs. my new card either Radeon 9800Pro or Radeon 9800XT)
-Soundblaster Audigy 2
-160GB Western Digital SE 7200RPM 8MB cache
-80GB Western Digital SE 7200RPM 8MB cache
-Lite-On 52x32x52 CD-RW (Black)
-Creative I-Trigue 2.1 3300 Speakers (I don't have room for a 5.1)
-HP p1120 21" CRT monitor (LCD screens are still too slow/expensive)
-Antec Lifestyles Sonata Case (w/ Piano Black finish)- My desk is right next to my bed so this case is great because its VERY quite at night
-Logitec MX500 Optical mouse
-Logitec Keyboard

So all thats left is buying a new graphics card. I do know quite a bit about hardware and I know that anything from a 9600XT to a 9800XT will run Half-Life 2 screaming fast, I still like to know even MORE. The benchmark is also very important for people with low end systems and a limited budget as the upgrades they may need to make have to be very cost effect or even hardware effected such as getting a new graphics card... Does their PSU have enough power for it? Do they have a fast enough AGP slot or have an AGP slot at all? Alot of people play Half-Life 1 and its mods on very low end systems to todays standards, part of the reason Counter-Strike is so popular today is the fact that it is a great game with low system requirements. I understand the benchmark might not even come out, this thread is just about letting people know how I think it might help people (and hopefully Valve takes notice of this as well)

*Thanks for everyone's input, this is the first real thread I've started here and its doing quite well so far

*Edit* The soundcard, mouse, and monitor all come from my old computer as well. The monitor was given to me by my old boss for free Its the best gift I've ever gotten from someone at work thats for sure!

My old computer is for sale as well (Trying to come up with some money for the video card)

-AMD Athlon XP 2000+ @ 1.68GHz
-Asus A7A-266 Motherboard
-2x 256 PC2100 DDR Crucial
-GeForce 4 Ti 4400 (Coming out of my new system when I sell it, I can't be without a decent graphics card until I get a new one )
-Soundblaster PCI 128
-Western Digital 100GB 7200RPM drive
-Western Digital 20GB 7200RPM drive
-Lite-On 12x32x8x CD-RW
-3.5 Floppy
-Antec Case (Old white one... not too bad though)
-Altec Lansing 2.1 Speakers
-Microsoft Keyboard (Blue and White, really new)
-Logitec Optical mosue (Blue and light silver)

I'm trying to get at least $500 for it to cover the cost of my new gaphics card (Whole computer system to buy 1 graphics card! LOL)

Anyone who is looking for a pretty good system let me know, if you live somewhere in VA thats even better!)