Electronic Piracy

[repiV]

That's the same lame excuse Feendzy already tried. "Music is absolutely awful, so I should be allowed to shove my hands into those huge piles of shit."

Even assuming that "real talent" only comes from small companies, the smallest companies are the ones who are hurt the most by this nonsense.
For larger companies, the theft has the upside of acting as free advertisement in the same way FM radio is. That's most record companies support things like youtube, myspace and other free ways of accessing music. They're re-enforcing prexisting brand names.
When you're only selling a limited number of CDs in a small area, each one matters, and the limited scope of the sales makes the side-effect of international advertisement meaningless. It'd be like having a million-dollar ad for a Mom&Pop store during the superbowl.


Morality is, except in stupid cases, defined by legality: by and large, a negative emotional reaction to a situation is not a valid reason to destroy it.
Immorality comes from doing something that causes a real-world harm which exceeds the reason behind it.
It's defined in terms of logical thought.
All that bullshit about following your heart and fighting for what you believe in is utter nonsense. As solaris has proven, believing in a cause doesn't automatically make that cause the slightest bit intelligent or valid.
Microsoft is a rare case where, at least where OSes are concerned, they have massive demand and practically no competition.
But even then, it's fun to bemoan Microsoft when their poor beleaguered competition is a similarly massive corporation.
They should be taxed, obviously, but they aren't doing anything that provides a logical justification for this silly rebellion.


You aren't playing the same game. That's retarded. Microsoft and Sony aren't stealing from you. there is absolutely nothing stopping you from avoiding their products. You can't even legitimately claim to be fiercely profit-driven like they are because all you're stealing is luxury.
You're not Robin Hood either, so stop with the delusions of grandeur.
Why on Earth are you starting shit with these corporations?
The only result is that they are given more power, because, unlike them, you are blatantly in the wrong here. When people do legislate, they're going to legislate against you.
The end result of your "survival of the fittest" bullshit is that you aren't the fittest. You're picking a fight that you'll lose on the behalf all of us. Shut up and sit down.



I'm not asking you to be loyal to companies. **** that.
We're dealing with society as a whole. Your private war against Big Music is only hurting the rest of us.
You know what it's like to share a good thing, only to have it ruined because some asshole comes in and exploits it?
The asshole on his cellphone in the theatre, the asshole who takes a piss in the pool.
You're that asshole.

It's not all about you.

Legality is a terrible way to define morality...for reasons I hope are obvious.
Your arguments are reasonable and valid, but for one point. You think I should care about these companies. I don't care. They have to do something to stand out in order to make me care - like Relic's penchant for listening to the community, for example. The caring does not come automatically.
Digital Rights Management on iTunes I'd say is fairly immoral. Microsoft trying to patent hyperlinks is immoral too. Region encoding on DVDs provides no benefit whatsoever to the consumers and is nothing more than a tool to enable them to control the market.
And it's illegal to sell a region 1 DVD in a region 2 location - how is that right, in any way? It's all just about power. No morals there.
The simple fact is, whereas you are concerned about the fate of companies, I simply don't care (with some exceptions). They don't care about me either.
You will never find me paying for a Microsoft OS, that's for sure.

 

[Tagaziel]

First, don't triple-post, I'm wondering why the mods haven't cracked down on you yet.

Second, life without ideals and exploiting the world is bleak and empty, you being the example, arguing for a criminal activity punishable by law. That's degeneration, moral decay to the bone.

Third, Mechagodzilla is right and you're wrong, it's as simple as that. If it wasn't for you and people similar, the prices of CDs would fall down a bit, because the companies wouldn't need to invest in expensive protection systems for their CDs, because piracy would be a minor problem.

And if a paraphrased excerpt from the criminal law ("Prawo karne") codex is a weak argument for you, then you are really degenerated.

Here, here's a translated excerpt:

Article 267, paragraph 1:

"Who without authorization accesses information not intended for him, by opening a closed document, uplinking to a data transmission cable or breaking electronic, magnetic or it's other special protection is subject to fine, limiting freedom or incarceration up to 2 years"

Article 267, paragraph 3:

"The same punishment is to be applied to the person, who distributes information gained by means enumerated in paragraphs 1 and 2 to another person."

See? Illegal acquiring of information is prohibited by law, and, coincidentally, stealing music falls under this category.

Another one...

Article 278, paragraph 1:

"Who takes, with the aim of procurement, a mobile item not being in his possession is subject to incarceration, from three months to three years."

Article 278, paragraph 2:

"The same punishment is to be applied to the person, who without the owner's consent acquires a computer program not belonging to him with the intent of a financial benefit."

See? Acquiring music the illegal way is punishable. And before you start screaming "It's for own use, so it's not a financial benefit", it is, because you didn't have to spend money on a legitimate CD, so you essentially gained the information without paying for it, thus giving you a financial benefit.

Ergo, you are still a thieving moron.

 

[<RJMC>]

dam if electronic piracy should not be ilegal them grab something from a store and leaving whitout paying shouldnt be illegal too

 

[Sulkdodds]

First, don't triple-post, I'm wondering why the mods haven't cracked down on you yet.

He's using them to make serious arguments and not just spamming.

 

[repiV]

First, don't triple-post, I'm wondering why the mods haven't cracked down on you yet.

Sorry, since when were you the boss of me?
You are quite possibly the most arrogant and self-absorbed person on these forums. Your manner is vile.

Second, life without ideals and exploiting the world is bleak and empty, you being the example, arguing for a criminal activity punishable by law. That's degeneration, moral decay to the bone.

I'm not arguing for or against it. I'm just saying, that's the way it is whether you like it or not.
Life in capitalist society is about exploiting the world. The most successful people, according to Western success goals, are those who are most adept at exploiting the world.
Likewise, where did I say anything about "not having ideals"?
Business has one ideal - profit. Everything else is secondary.

Third, Mechagodzilla is right and you're wrong, it's as simple as that. If it wasn't for you and people similar, the prices of CDs would fall down a bit, because the companies wouldn't need to invest in expensive protection systems for their CDs, because piracy would be a minor problem.

"He's right and you're wrong" isn't an argument, it's a meaningless statement.
Those expensive protection systems are utterly useless. Hell, anti-piracy "solutions" have caused no end of trouble for me with legitimate copies of games but hasn't made it much more difficult to pirate software, which is usually a convinience issue and not a cost-saving one.
Valve got it right. They both made it virtually impossible to pirate their games AND made it desirable to purchase them - it's convenient. Good for them.
Yet, I can't play my legitimate copy of Ghost Recon 3 on my PC as it says the CD key is invalid. It works on every other PC in the house, and a month of back-and-forth with the technical support people did nothing to fix it.
Many people have this problem, but Ubisoft won't even acknowledge it exists. Which turns more people towards pirating the games.
I have similar problems with Rainbow Six: Lockdown.

And if a paraphrased excerpt from the criminal law ("Prawo karne") codex is a weak argument for you, then you are really degenerated.

Here, here's a translated excerpt:

Article 267, paragraph 1:

"Who without authorization accesses information not intended for him, by opening a closed document, uplinking to a data transmission cable or breaking electronic, magnetic or it's other special protection is subject to fine, limiting freedom or incarceration up to 2 years"

Article 267, paragraph 3:

"The same punishment is to be applied to the person, who distributes information gained by means enumerated in paragraphs 1 and 2 to another person."

See? Illegal acquiring of information is prohibited by law, and, coincidentally, stealing music falls under this category.

Another one...

Article 278, paragraph 1:

"Who takes, with the aim of procurement, a mobile item not being in his possession is subject to incarceration, from three months to three years."

Article 278, paragraph 2:

"The same punishment is to be applied to the person, who without the owner's consent acquires a computer program not belonging to him with the intent of a financial benefit."

See? Acquiring music the illegal way is punishable. And before you start screaming "It's for own use, so it's not a financial benefit", it is, because you didn't have to spend money on a legitimate CD, so you essentially gained the information without paying for it, thus giving you a financial benefit.

I would never buy a CD. They're not worth the money and never have been. Furthermore, they are ridiculously inconvinient and not worth the hassle.
I didn't listen to music before MP3s. I buy Radiohead CDs, and that's it.

Ergo, you are still a thieving moron.

You should be careful about throwing the word "moron" around just because people don't agree with you. It makes you look like a, well, moron.

 

[Tagaziel]

Granted, I'm not the most pleasant person when it comes to thieves and criminals. If you had your cellphone and ALL documents (including PADI certification cards, city transit card, school ID etc.) stolen from you, then you would treat such scum in a vile manner.

Granted, I hurl insults at you, but that's because you're a thief AND you're not ashamed because of it AND you try to excuse the fact, that you steal. It's like a thug with a crowbar taking your car while explaining that "it's the law of the city".

Next, heard of iTunes? They offer mp3's for a nominal fee, and you can download single tracks, without having to pay for whole CDs. But I guess 0.99 c is too rich for your blood.

Moreover, did you ever heard of a logic construction called implication?

People pirate games -> Companies make more ruthless security systems -> Decent users suffer

Granted, they aren't sentences in a logical sense, but the basing point is, if you pirate games, you force companies to introduce things life Starforce, which kills gaming ability with extremem prejudice. This, as you said, turns more people to pirated copies, which forces companies... etc.

It's simple logic, really. The situation to reserve itself needs only a bit of human decency and thought on both sides of the barricade.

Last, unless you prove that piracy is good for the industry, I won't call you moron anymore. See? Only one insult in this post, and that's because I decided to be nice to criminals today.

 

[repiV]

Granted, I'm not the most pleasant person when it comes to thieves and criminals. If you had your cellphone and ALL documents (including PADI certification cards, city transit card, school ID etc.) stolen from you, then you would treat such scum in a vile manner.

Granted, I hurl insults at you, but that's because you're a thief AND you're not ashamed because of it AND you try to excuse the fact, that you steal. It's like a thug with a crowbar taking your car while explaining that "it's the law of the city".

You hurl insults at me because you think you're better than you are. You're too big for your student boots. You haven't experienced the real world, yet you are still utterly convinced that your views of the world are the correct views. You're an arrogant sod and you have nothing to show for it.
For the love of God/Allah/Buddah/Flying Spaghetti Monster, stop making comparisons between software piracy and theft from the person. It's utterly inane and incorrect. Software piracy doesn't traumatise people or deprive them of something they once actually possessed.

Next, heard of iTunes? They offer mp3's for a nominal fee, and you can download single tracks, without having to pay for whole CDs. But I guess 0.99 c is too rich for your blood.

Yes, they sell shit that's restricted by DRM. The free downloads are superior, so why on earth would I pay for an inferior product? Only a real moron would willingly pay money for a product that's inferior to something they could get for free just as easily.

Moreover, did you ever heard of a logic construction called implication?

People pirate games -> Companies make more ruthless security systems -> Decent users suffer

Granted, they aren't sentences in a logical sense, but the basing point is, if you pirate games, you force companies to introduce things life Starforce, which kills gaming ability with extremem prejudice. This, as you said, turns more people to pirated copies, which forces companies... etc.

It's simple logic, really. The situation to reserve itself needs only a bit of human decency and thought on both sides of the barricade.

Last, unless you prove that piracy is good for the industry, I won't call you moron anymore. See? Only one insult in this post, and that's because I decided to be nice to criminals today.

Nobody "forces" companies to introduce things like Starforce. As you yourself admitted, forceful anti-piracy systems are counter-productive and do not help. That is foolishness on behalf of the company and nothing more. A lesson Ubisoft have evidently learned as they no longer use Starforce. It is actually Securom 7 causing the problem with Ghost Recon 3.

 

[Tagaziel]

You still don't get it, do you? Theft is theft, there is no buts. Law defines theft in a precise way, and software piracy is theft.

True, piracy does not traumatise people, it traumatizes BUSINESS. Each pirated copy is one copy less sold, x amount of money less and when it adds up, another developer studio bankrupt or sacked. Now THAT is traumatizing.

Next, you say that the "product" is inferior. The product is the same, regardless of the methods of acquisition. You make it as if illegal pirated software/music is a better product than legally sold versions. Newsflash: it isn't. It's just yourself trying to justify stealing.

Furthermore, you clearly did not understand what I meant - it's people who pirate games that force companies to employ copy protection programs, not the other way round. In 1996, Command & Conquer was released. In 1997, Fallout was released, both are among my favourite games. That was a time when piracy wasn't that great of a problem, and these games didn't have any piracy countermeasures, because they didn't need one.

As the problem grew, created by greedy people like you (greed is good n small amounts, not ones you represent), companies were FORCED to protect their interests and income. The effects hit the regular user.

Comprehensive reading. It helps.

 

[Thadius Dean]

You still don't get it, do you? Theft is theft, there is no buts. Law defines theft in a precise way, and software piracy is theft.

True, piracy does not traumatise people, it traumatizes BUSINESS. Each pirated copy is one copy less sold, x amount of money less and when it adds up, another developer studio bankrupt or sacked. Now THAT is traumatizing.

Next, you say that the "product" is inferior. The product is the same, regardless of the methods of acquisition. You make it as if illegal pirated software/music is a better product than legally sold versions. Newsflash: it isn't. It's just yourself trying to justify stealing.

Furthermore, you clearly did not understand what I meant - it's people who pirate games that force companies to employ copy protection programs, not the other way round. In 1996, Command & Conquer was released. In 1997, Fallout was released, both are among my favourite games. That was a time when piracy wasn't that great of a problem, and these games didn't have any piracy countermeasures, because they didn't need one.

As the problem grew, created by greedy people like you (greed is good n small amounts, not ones you represent), companies were FORCED to protect their interests and income. The effects hit the regular user.

Comprehensive reading. It helps.

I wouldn't purchase music if I didn't download music though. No major harm done to the companies.

 

[Solaris]

Oh let me pirate in peace will you!!

 

[Raziaar]

Oh let me pirate in peace will you!!

You'd make for a horrible pirate.

 

[kirovman]

You'd make for a horrible pirate.

"Yarr, let's split this booty evenly with all the townsfolk!"

*Solaris gets stabbed.

 

[Solaris]

You still don't get it, do you? Theft is theft, there is no buts. Law defines theft in a precise way, and software piracy is theft.

I'm pretty sure it's not. I don't think you can get tried and found guilty of theft for downloading music, breach of copyright perhaps but not theft.

Plus just becuase you can both things theft, you still must recognize the distinction that when you download an MP3 that you are not prepared to buy, it makes absolutely no difference to everything. To say every downloaded mp3 is a loss in MP3 sales is silly, I download all sorts of crap music to see if I like it, most of the time I don't.

True, piracy does not traumatise people, it traumatizes BUSINESS

Boo hoo. Really, you want us to feel sorry for the buisiness's?

Each pirated copy is one copy less sold, x amount of money less and when it adds up, another developer studio bankrupt or sacked. Now THAT is traumatizing.

Well, I wouldn't go that far, but as a pointed out above every pirated copy is not one copy less sold. I do not have the money to buy as much music as I download so your statement is flawed right there.

Next, you say that the "product" is inferior. The product is the same, regardless of the methods of acquisition. You make it as if illegal pirated software/music is a better product than legally sold versions. Newsflash: it isn't. It's just yourself trying to justify stealing.

Well actually, it is. Itunes files are encoded at 64kb/s, the songs I download are at 192kb/s, so yes my pirated songs are better THREE TIMES better at that. Plus there is no copy protection unlike I-tunes which means I can easyilly transfer it amongst my computers, phone and MP3 player, thats far easier. So already we can see that it is easier. Pirated music is superior to legally downloaded music.

Furthermore, you clearly did not understand what I meant - it's people who pirate games that force companies to employ copy protection programs, not the other way round. In 1996, Command & Conquer was released. In 1997, Fallout was released, both are among my favourite games. That was a time when piracy wasn't that great of a problem

I think it was, it was so easy just to get a freind to come over install the game on your machine.

As the problem grew, created by greedy people like you (greed is good n small amounts, not ones you represent), companies were FORCED to protect their interests and income. The effects hit the regular user.

You're right, but irrellavant of who started it, for the average Joe it can be easier to pirate a game than it can to buy a legal one and faff around trying to get the CD-Key working.

And lol at kirkovman.

 

[repiV]

You still don't get it, do you? Theft is theft, there is no buts. Law defines theft in a precise way, and software piracy is theft.

True, piracy does not traumatise people, it traumatizes BUSINESS. Each pirated copy is one copy less sold, x amount of money less and when it adds up, another developer studio bankrupt or sacked. Now THAT is traumatizing.

Any businessman who is "traumatised" by a negative effect on their sales has absolutely no place being in business in the first place. Please, can the melodrama.

Next, you say that the "product" is inferior. The product is the same, regardless of the methods of acquisition. You make it as if illegal pirated software/music is a better product than legally sold versions. Newsflash: it isn't. It's just yourself trying to justify stealing.

No, it's not the same. As I already stated, iTunes shit is plagued with DRM. You do know what DRM is, don't you?
Also, if iTunes really is 64k/s that's utterly shite. I wouldn't listen to that even if it was free, not on the PC anyway. Plus, 99p per song really isn't good value at all.

Furthermore, you clearly did not understand what I meant - it's people who pirate games that force companies to employ copy protection programs, not the other way round. In 1996, Command & Conquer was released. In 1997, Fallout was released, both are among my favourite games. That was a time when piracy wasn't that great of a problem, and these games didn't have any piracy countermeasures, because they didn't need one.

As the problem grew, created by greedy people like you (greed is good n small amounts, not ones you represent), companies were FORCED to protect their interests and income. The effects hit the regular user.

Comprehensive reading. It helps.

Nobody "forces" companies to employ copy protection systems, they choose to do so of their own free will.

 

[Tagaziel]

Did you learn comprehensive reading in elementary school?

I wrote "traumatises industry", which means that piracy KILLS THE DAMN INDUSTRY! It's really that simple. Piracy leads to less copies sold. Less copies sold leads to smaller incomes. Smaller incomes lead to budget cuts. Budget cuts lead to a fall in the amount of new music/software released.

Second, nobody forces you to listen to music, you steal it of you own free will.

Last, you saying that "companies [...] free will" is stupid. All companies exist BECAUSE of the consumers and must take care not to hurt their market so deep, that it turns away. My example stands - ten years ago things like Starforce weren't needed, because the problem of piracy wasn't that big.

Now, things are different, with the advent of broadband and widespread usage of P2P technologies. Companies are forced to take measures to copy-protect their material BECAUSE piracy became a plague.

There is no doubt that if piracy wasn't such a widespread problem, things like Starforce or serial number authentication wouldn't be used or even exist, because there would be no need for them.

Simple version:

If they could, companies wouldn't use copy protection, because they rely on consumers to survive. It's not "Let's make life for gamers harder today, f**k yeah!", it's "We are projecting losses this quarter due to piracy. We have to use Starforce, or we risk bankruptcy.".

C'est tout.

 

[Thadius Dean]

Did you learn comprehensive reading in elementary school?

I wrote "traumatises industry", which means that piracy KILLS THE DAMN INDUSTRY! It's really that simple. Piracy leads to less copies sold. Less copies sold leads to smaller incomes. Smaller incomes lead to budget cuts. Budget cuts lead to a fall in the amount of new music/software released.

Second, nobody forces you to listen to music, you steal it of you own free will.

Last, you saying that "companies [...] free will" is stupid. All companies exist BECAUSE of the consumers and must take care not to hurt their market so deep, that it turns away. My example stands - ten years ago things like Starforce weren't needed, because the problem of piracy wasn't that big.

Now, things are different, with the advent of broadband and widespread usage of P2P technologies. Companies are forced to take measures to copy-protect their material BECAUSE piracy became a plague.

There is no doubt that if piracy wasn't such a widespread problem, things like Starforce or serial number authentication wouldn't be used or even exist, because there would be no need for them.

Simple version:

If they could, companies wouldn't use copy protection, because they rely on consumers to survive. It's not "Let's make life for gamers harder today, f**k yeah!", it's "We are projecting losses this quarter due to piracy. We have to use Starforce, or we risk bankruptcy.".

C'est tout.

First, I don't think it would lead to a loss of sales; I wouldn't buy the music if I didn't pirate it in the first place. I do so out of lack of money.

Also, I'm pretty sure companies aren't going to declare bankruptcy due to piracy--It might hurt the company a bit, but not that much.

 

[repiV]

Did you learn comprehensive reading in elementary school?

I wrote "traumatises industry", which means that piracy KILLS THE DAMN INDUSTRY! It's really that simple. Piracy leads to less copies sold. Less copies sold leads to smaller incomes. Smaller incomes lead to budget cuts. Budget cuts lead to a fall in the amount of new music/software released.

Kills the industry? Such drama.
Got any evidence that the industry is dying, despite the fact that practically everyone pirates music?
Surely this should be a doomsday scenario.

Second, nobody forces you to listen to music, you steal it of you own free will.

Err, point being?

Last, you saying that "companies [...] free will" is stupid. All companies exist BECAUSE of the consumers and must take care not to hurt their market so deep, that it turns away. My example stands - ten years ago things like Starforce weren't needed, because the problem of piracy wasn't that big.

No, claiming that companies have no free will is stupid.

Now, things are different, with the advent of broadband and widespread usage of P2P technologies. Companies are forced to take measures to copy-protect their material BECAUSE piracy became a plague.

There is no doubt that if piracy wasn't such a widespread problem, things like Starforce or serial number authentication wouldn't be used or even exist, because there would be no need for them.

Yet the more invasive of these copy protection measures are counter-productive, so what you say makes no sense. Only a fool is "forced" to employ Starforce.
XP's activation and the having to re-activate it when you change your gear, or buy a new copy if you change it too much? Like I would ever pay to be laden with shit like that.

Simple version:

If they could, companies wouldn't use copy protection, because they rely on consumers to survive. It's not "Let's make life for gamers harder today, f**k yeah!", it's "We are projecting losses this quarter due to piracy. We have to use Starforce, or we risk bankruptcy.".

C'est tout.

"We have to use Starforce, or we risk bankruptcy."

Jesus Christ, where do you get your fantasies from? Do you read The Onion and believe every word?
Do you know how utterly ridiculous that sounds?

 

[Solaris]

I love how he got totally owned when he said 'downloaded music is not superior to i-tunes music' and then instead of re-evaluating his beliefs when his reasoning crumbles, swicthes to an even more obscure line of reasoning.

 

[Tagaziel]

Being mistaken in one aspect does not make my reasoning in-valid. While this point was proven wrong, all others stand firm.

Kills the industry? Such drama.
Got any evidence that the industry is dying, despite the fact that practically everyone pirates music?
Surely this should be a doomsday scenario.

12,000,000,000 $ annually is surely a small, non-important amount of money the industry can throw away. [1]
Comprehensive reading again. Killing does not mean 'killed'. The industry is thriving, but is being poisoned by software thieves. It is a slowly killing poision, but a poison none the less.

Err, point being?

To show you the stupidity of your thinking by paroding the last line in your post.

No, claiming that companies have no free will is stupid.

Stupid is when you don't read comprehensively. I didn't have the time to look for that full sentence, so I included the beginning and the end of it so you could recall what I was referring to. Apparently, you can't even remember what you wrote.

Reposting for the slow children:

Last, you saying that "Nobody "forces" companies to employ copy protection systems, they choose to do so of their own free will." is stupid. All companies exist BECAUSE of the consumers and must take care not to hurt their market so deep, that it turns away. My example stands - ten years ago things like Starforce weren't needed, because the problem of piracy wasn't that big.

Now, things are different, with the advent of broadband and widespread usage of P2P technologies. Companies are forced to take measures to copy-protect their material BECAUSE piracy became a plague.

There is no doubt that if piracy wasn't such a widespread problem, things like Starforce or serial number authentication wouldn't be used or even exist, because there would be no need for them.

Reposting concluded. Slow children may start breathing now, repiV and Solaris included.

Yet the more invasive of these copy protection measures are counter-productive, so what you say makes no sense. Only a fool is "forced" to employ Starforce.
XP's activation and the having to re-activate it when you change your gear, or buy a new copy if you change it too much? Like I would ever pay to be laden with shit like that.

You know why they are invasive? Because pirates exist are more fierce than anything encountered before. This forces companies to make better, more invasive systems (believe it or not, Steam is an invasive protection system, just look at how much problems it caused in the initial stages (first two years) to gamers. Yet you do not complain about it), which in turn, as you wrote "turns more gamers to piracy", which forces companies... and so on, and so forth.

"We have to use Starforce, or we risk bankruptcy."

Jesus Christ, where do you get your fantasies from? Do you read The Onion and believe every word?
Do you know how utterly ridiculous that sounds?

Comprehensive reading, kid. The example was intended to be a very simple representation of what actually happens in the oh-so-evil companies you both villify.

Now, go to elementary school and gain some basic comprehensive reading skills.

 

[Solaris]

Stop telling people to learn how to read and be comprehensive, when the fault is you saying things and then pretending you didn't mean it literally.

 

[repiV]

Being mistaken in one aspect does not make my reasoning in-valid. While this point was proven wrong, all others stand firm.

You wanted to sweep it under the carpet though, didn't you?

12,000,000,000 $ annually is surely a small, non-important amount of money the industry can throw away. [1]
Comprehensive reading again. Killing does not mean 'killed'. The industry is thriving, but is being poisoned by software thieves. It is a slowly killing poision, but a poison none the less.

So, how exactly is it going to kill the industry again?

To show you the stupidity of your thinking by paroding the last line in your post.



Stupid is when you don't read comprehensively. I didn't have the time to look for that full sentence, so I included the beginning and the end of it so you could recall what I was referring to. Apparently, you can't even remember what you wrote.

Reposting for the slow children:

Last, you saying that "Nobody "forces" companies to employ copy protection systems, they choose to do so of their own free will." is stupid. All companies exist BECAUSE of the consumers and must take care not to hurt their market so deep, that it turns away. My example stands - ten years ago things like Starforce weren't needed, because the problem of piracy wasn't that big.

Now, things are different, with the advent of broadband and widespread usage of P2P technologies. Companies are forced to take measures to copy-protect their material BECAUSE piracy became a plague.

There is no doubt that if piracy wasn't such a widespread problem, things like Starforce or serial number authentication wouldn't be used or even exist, because there would be no need for them.

Reposting concluded. Slow children may start breathing now, repiV and Solaris included.

You've just reposted the exact same thing that was argued against. What the hell is your point?

You know why they are invasive? Because pirates exist are more fierce than anything encountered before. This forces companies to make better, more invasive systems (believe it or not, Steam is an invasive protection system, just look at how much problems it caused in the initial stages (first two years) to gamers. Yet you do not complain about it), which in turn, as you wrote "turns more gamers to piracy", which forces companies... and so on, and so forth.

I don't find Steam invasive.

Comprehensive reading, kid. The example was intended to be a very simple representation of what actually happens in the oh-so-evil companies you both villify.

Now, go to elementary school and gain some basic comprehensive reading skills.

Don't call me a kid, you arrogant turd. I work full-time (50 hours, at present) for a living and have been for over a year now. You're just some clueless, naive university student who dreams about what the world should be like and takes offence whenever someone smacks you round the face with the reality. Take a good dose of STFU.

 

[Tagaziel]

You wanted to sweep it under the carpet though, didn't you?

No, because I can admit to a mistake. A single mistake.

So, how exactly is it going to kill the industry again?

I wrote "kills", not "killed". The difference in tenses is very, very large.

You've just reposted the exact same thing that was argued against. What the hell is your point?

You tried to nitpick me on "companies have no free will" track. And you failed to provide arguments against the notion.

Don't call me a kid, you arrogant turd. I work full-time (50 hours, at present) for a living and have been for over a year now. You're just some clueless, naive university student who dreams about what the world should be like and takes offence whenever someone smacks you round the face with the reality. Take a good dose of STFU.

University student yes. Naive and clueless not by far. I was forced to endure enough in my short life, enough to know what a minority of the world has to offer.

And I don't give a damn about your work, your age and your "interpretation" of reality. By admitting theft and, worse, being PROUD of it, you are just a spineless scum, one of the most vile kind on the Earth.

And as a note, my father, a lawyer with twenty years of experience and more than enough life experience agrees with me and we share the same views. Would you call him naive and clueless?

 

[repiV]

No, because I can admit to a mistake. A single mistake.

But you didn't admit to it. You changed the subject.

I wrote "kills", not "killed". The difference in tenses is very, very large.

But you are implying that it will eventually kill the industry. The industry is doing just fine right now.

You tried to nitpick me on "companies have no free will" track. And you failed to provide arguments against the notion.

It's not a nitpick, it's an extremely important point. Companies can make whatever decisions they like. Any businessman who is "forced" to do something on a regular basis obviously has no place in a shark's world.

University student yes. Naive and clueless not by far. I was forced to endure enough in my short life, enough to know what a minority of the world has to offer.

Don't even talk to me about "enduring". You couldn't even compare.
You are naive and clueless. Clearly insecure about the fact too, as you constantly feel the need to use insults to make your point.

And I don't give a damn about your work, your age and your "interpretation" of reality. By admitting theft and, worse, being PROUD of it, you are just a spineless scum, one of the most vile kind on the Earth.

Just don't call me a kid, kid.

Also, pretty much everyone downloads illegal MP3s. I guess everyone is just a spineless, vile scum. You must be a very hate-filled individual. I pity you.

And as a note, my father, a lawyer with twenty years of experience and more than enough life experience agrees with me and we share the same views. Would you call him naive and clueless?

No - because he would be much, much more adept at backing up his viewpoints than you are. It's not what you believe, it's why you believe it.

 

[Asknoone]

Take it easy. Quit flaming and settle down.

 

[repiV]

Take it easy. Quit flaming and settle down.

He's been flaming me since the very first post he made in response to me.
I also don't take kindly to being called a kid by a know-it-all student with a highly inflated opinion of himself who lives in a bubble of la la land.
I fear for the legal profession if he's going to become a lawyer. "Your honour, the opposition disagrees with me. Therefore, they are a moron and need to go back to elementary school."

 

[Angry Lawyer]

The moron defense is a perfectly valid defense.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[ríomhaire]

I wrote "kills", not "killed". The difference in tenses is very, very large.

Did you even read his post? He is asking how it it killing/will kill the industry. Although the answer is obvious you should reply to what he says not bloody well hide behind corrected a mistake he made 2 posts ago.

 

[Asknoone]

He's been flaming me since the very first post he made in response to me.
I also don't take kindly to being called a kid by a know-it-all student with a highly inflated opinion of himself who lives in a bubble of la la land.
I fear for the legal profession if he's going to become a lawyer. "Your honour, the opposition disagrees with me. Therefore, they are a moron and need to go back to elementary school."

I'm talking to everyone as a whole - take it down a gear.

 

[Tagaziel]

I didn't answer it PRECISELY because it's obvious.

And "la la land"? You've obviously haven't been to Poland.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Anyone who disses Poland needs a punch in the jądros.

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Tagaziel]

Yay! Jądras!

Generalnie uważam piratów za pożałowania godne istoty - jak można kraśc i jeszcze byc z tego dumnym?

On-topic.

 

[ríomhaire]

I guess everyone is just a spineless, vile scum.

Most people are vile scum but let's not get into that.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

I don't speak much Polish beyond "Dzien dobry!" My mother's Polish, but as I was born in England, I never learnt the language.

I do, however, inherit the immunity to cold and the ability to drink hard spirits easily

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Tagaziel]

Well, I have those traits, though the cold resistance gene seems to be corrupt... though the hard spirits do not talk to me, after three 50 ml shots in quick succession I was still sober...

And good to hear from a Polbrit

 

[Angry Lawyer]

<3

Send me some wisniowka in the post!

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Tagaziel]

Here's a guide to making wisniówka yourself, though in polish, I may find an English one tomorrow

And this is the bottle for you! Digital bon-apetitt!

 

[Angry Lawyer]

We have a family recipe, and I was going to make some this summer - but the moment I got the demijohns out of the attic and bought all of the vodka required, cherries went out of season. I've made star anise liqueur instead, and that should be ready for the 14th of January. \o/

* Angry Lawyer chugs virtual wisniowka

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Tagaziel]

Yay!

* Mikael joins in the celebration!

 

[Angry Lawyer]

I claim this political thread in the name of POLSKA!

*Angry Lawyer rides by on a horse, with prosthetic wings strapped to his back

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Tagaziel]

URAAA!

* Mike invades Bahamas to claim them in the name of POLSKA!